The Final Dialectic

[soulja1906]

Our world is changing. The change is occuring so subtley that most people do not notice our gradual transgression from the life that we were intended to live. From paradise to a police state, we are now witnessing the synthesis of a dialectic process that has been ushering mankind into destruction for centuries. This is not a conspiracy theory thread or a religious sermon to scare people into doctrine. This is what is real.

[plazul]

Who wouldn't want to talk about it? You are more than welcome to start a thread.

[soulja1906]

okay plazul. thanks. i am a newcomer and do appreciate the welcome. well, i see a pattern, a dialectic process if you will concerning our society and government. my theory is that capitalism has driven most of the people in our country to devote their lives to chasing dollars. this creates a problem because there arent enough dollars going around for everyone to be happy. empirically, capitalism is designed to have an extreme rich and an extreme poor. consequently, people are now willing to do anything to get it. we see law enforcement agencies (federally and locally) increasing their budgets regularly putting more cops on the street because the community is crying out for protection and order. the government readily provides us with this "order" by employing more police and taking away the natural rights of citizens (that we are willing to give up) in an effort to protect us. of course, there is much more to it than this and i'm looking forward to sharing ideas with you guys but here's my thesis: our society is evolving into a police state...look at the global effect of that and then do the math.
once again, thanks guys.
joshua

[Kelly Black]

I'll bite; however, I'm not sure I understand your premise. Just to start from a clear base:

Are you saying that crime exists because capitalism creates a poor segment of society, and this leads to a police state?

Is the drive of law enforcement agencies to gain more financial power driven by capitalism, or just the resulting crime?

Where does a free market system fit into your premise, if at all?

[plazul]

Originally Posted by soulja1906

okay plazul. thanks. i am a newcomer and do appreciate the welcome. well, i see a pattern, a dialectic process if you will concerning our society and government. my theory is that capitalism has driven most of the people in our country to devote their lives to chasing dollars. this creates a problem because there arent enough dollars going around for everyone to be happy. empirically, capitalism is designed to have an extreme rich and an extreme poor. consequently, people are now willing to do anything to get it. we see law enforcement agencies (federally and locally) increasing their budgets regularly putting more cops on the street because the community is crying out for protection and order. the government readily provides us with this "order" by employing more police and taking away the natural rights of citizens (that we are willing to give up) in an effort to protect us. of course, there is much more to it than this and i'm looking forward to sharing ideas with you guys but here's my thesis: our society is evolving into a police state...look at the global effect of that and then do the math.
once again, thanks guys.
joshua

I think that a more accurate way to put it is our society is evolving into a *secret police state.* We have regular police to address ordinary crime and an Orwellian "thought police" to keep track of the dissenters in our society.

[soulja1906]

hey kelly. i dont think that the police have an ulterior motive as far as increasing their budget to gain power over citizens. i think its just a natural response to crime in an effort to serve and protect the community. however, on the "elite" level, i think there is a possibility that the first could be true, who knows?

yes, i think that capitalism is resonsible for the crime in our country. not directly, but capitalism has cultivated a certain "money hungry mentality" in our country. now dont get me wrong, i dont even go to church but the bible says something about the love of money being the root of all evil. if you think about it, it makes sense. our country is morally decaying...very quickly. i would credit this decay to the "microwave mentality" that americans have and to the simple fact that americans have become so focused on making money that morality is no longer a priority. we now measure success by how much money a man has...thats a dangerous mentality if one could imagine where such a mentality could lead this country.

are you referring to laissez-faire economics? or however you spell it lol?

[soulja1906]

im not sure if you're being sarcastic or not plazul. im not big on conspiracy theories and stuff like that. however, i dont think that orwell's idea of a thought police was all that far fetched at all. just think of how much we know. then think about how much the best scientists, psychologists in the world know. if you weren't being sarcastic, i apologize.

[plazul]

Originally Posted by soulja1906

im not sure if you're being sarcastic or not plazul. im not big on conspiracy theories and stuff like that. however, i dont think that orwell's idea of a thought police was all that far fetched at all. just think of how much we know. then think about how much the best scientists, psychologists in the world know. if you weren't being sarcastic, i apologize.

If you read my other posts you'll see that I wasn't being sarcastic. We are witnessing the dawn of a total information awareness government and most of the population is just going to go along with it. Kind of like the slow boiling frog that doesn't realize it's being cooked to death.

Remember the short lived "Tips" program where Homeland Security and FBI wanted patriotic Americans to spy on their neighbors? They decided to scrap that idea and just spy on everybody.

[soulja1906]

you know, you're absolutely right. thats what scares me about the patriot act. all they have to do is "say" that we have something to do with terrorism and they have the right to wiretap our phones, put our homes under surviellance, and even see what kind of library books we're checking out. i dont understand how they could deceive so many people. i'm not the smartest man in the world, but damn i see whats happening to us. one of the most frightening things is to try to imagine everything that we DONT know.

[plazul]

Google Margie Burns on the web. She's a great source. I don't see how she does it as full time English Professor.

John Poindexter and his ilk believe that we must move , to borrow a phrase, beyond freedom and dignity in the brave new world of terrorism and stateless enemies. They believe that they are the ones who should protect the Republic and they're going to destroy our Constitution in order to save it.