Military Losses for the Past 20 Years

[Clint]

Military losses for 20 years

Since the start of the war on terror in Iraq and Afghanistan, the sacrifice has been enormous. As tragic as the loss of any member of the US Armed Forces is, consider the following statistics:

The annual fatalities of military members while activelyserving in the armed forces from 1980 through 2006:
>1980 .......... 2,392
>1981 ......... 2,380
>1984 .......... 1,999
>1988 .......... 1,819
>1989 .......... 1,636
>1990 ......... 1,508
>1991 ......... 1,787
>1992 .......... 1,293----------------------------------------------------
>1993 ......... 1,213
>1994 .......... 1,075
>1995 ..........2,465
>1996 ......... 2,318 Clinton years @ 13,417 deaths
>1997 .......... 817
>1998 ......... 2,252
>1999 .......... 1,984 -------------------------------------------------
>2000 .......... 1,983
>2001 .......... 890
>2002 .......... 1,007 7 BUSH years @ 9,016 deaths
>2003 ......... 1,410
>2004 .......... 1,887
>2005 ......... 919
>2006.......... 920
----------------------------------------------------------
The Mainstream Print and TV media, and many Politicians like to slant; that
these brave men and women, who are losing their lives in Iraq, are mostly
minorities. The latest census shows the following distribution of American citizens, by Race:

>European descent (White) ....... 69.12%
>Hispanic ................................... 12.5%
>Black......................................... 12.3%
>Asian ....................................... 3.7%
>Native American .................... . 1.0%
>Other ...................................... 2.6%

Now... here are the fatalities by Race; over the past three years in Iraqi Freedom:

>European descent (white) ..... 74 .31%
>Hispanic ................................. 10.74%
>Black ........................................ 9.67%
>Asian ................................ . .....1.81%
>Native American ...................... 1.09%
>Other ................................... ..... .33%

These statistics are published by Congressional Research Service, and they may be confirmed by anyone at:
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf

Do your own research and do not be swayed by what you see on TV or read in most newspapers.

[Bryn Mawr]

Sort of makes you wonder where American troops have been fighting don't it?

[drumbunny1]

Yes the media can be quite unreliable!!! Very biased....they like to just stir the S**t pot as I like to say!!!

[spot]

No, it just makes you wince at Clint's selectivity when it comes to discussing figures. The column headings he had available to discuss were Total Deaths, Accident, Hostile Action, Homicide, Illness, Pending, Self Inflicted, Terrorist Attack and Undetermined. Oh, and the actual size of the military that year which might seem relevant as well. You want to see what it looks like if you just focus on Hostile Action? Allow me...

The annual fatalities of military members while actively serving in the armed forces from 1980 through 2006 through hostile action...

>1980 ..........
>1981 .........
>1982 ..........
>1983 .......... 18
>1984 .......... 1
>1985 .........
>1986 ......... 2
>1987 ......... 37
>1988 .........
>1989 ......... 23
>1990 .........
>1991 ......... 147 (Bush-41's moment of glory before losing his re-election)
>1992 .......... ----------------------------------------------------
>1993 .........
>1994 ..........
>1995 ..........
>1996 ......... 1 Eight Clinton years @ 1 death
>1997 ..........
>1998 .........
>1999 .......... -------------------------------------------------
>2000 ..........
>2001 .......... 3
>2002 .......... 18 Seven Bush-43 years @ 2.596 deaths
>2003 ......... 344
>2004 .......... 739
>2005 ......... 739
>2006.......... 753
----------------------------------

Though even the "Hostile Action" figures are a bit weasely in that they exclude friendly fire incidents. Counting those as well you can credit Bush-43 with a dribble less than 4,000 once you add 2007 as well but that's neither here nor there.

Clint, what was your point exactly? That if you have a group of people counted in millions you'll have a steady background of deaths from natural causes? I think we knew that. That the number enlisted was higher in the Clinton years? I think we knew that too. Summarize what you think your post told us please.

[drumbunny1]

No, it just makes you wince at Scrat's selectivity when it comes to discussing figures. The column headings he had available to discuss were Total Deaths, Accident, Hostile Action, Homicide, Illness, Pending, Self Inflicted, Terrorist Attack and Undetermined. Oh, and the actual size of the military that year which might seem relevant as well. You want to see what it looks like if you just focus on Hostile Action? Allow me...

The annual fatalities of military members while actively serving in the armed forces from 1980 through 2006 through hostile action...

>1980 ..........
>1981 .........
>1982 ..........
>1983 .......... 18
>1984 .......... 1
>1985 .........
>1986 ......... 2
>1987 ......... 37
>1988 .........
>1989 ......... 23
>1990 .........
>1991 ......... 147 (Bush-41's moment of glory before losing his re-election)
>1992 .......... ----------------------------------------------------
>1993 .........
>1994 ..........
>1995 ..........
>1996 ......... 1 Eight Clinton years @ 1 death
>1997 ..........
>1998 .........
>1999 .......... -------------------------------------------------
>2000 ..........
>2001 .......... 3
>2002 .......... 18 Seven Bush-43 years @ 2.596 deaths
>2003 ......... 344
>2004 .......... 739
>2005 ......... 739
>2006.......... 753
----------------------------------

Though even the "Hostile Action" figures are a bit weasely in that they exclude friendly fire incidents. Counting those as well you can credit Bush-43 with a dribble less than 4,000 once you add 2007 as well but that's neither here nor there.

Scrat, what was your point exactly? That if you have a group of people counted in millions you'll have a steady background of deaths from natural causes? I think we knew that. That the number enlisted was higher in the Clinton years? I think we knew that too. Summarize what you think your post told us please.

I'm confused on the Clinton @ 1 death vs. Bush....you mean one death while Clinton was in office or what?

[spot]

I'm confused on the Clinton @ 1 death vs. Bush....you mean one death while Clinton was in office or what?

For goodness sake open the link and read the FAS report, it's all in there. Yes I do, that's what the report's table says, I copied it very accurately. What I listed was their column for the annual fatalities of military members while actively serving in the armed forces from 1980 through 2006 through hostile action. If you want to add the "Terrorist Attack" column it puts the Clinton figure to 60 and the Bush figure to 2,668.

[drumbunny1]

Oh for goodness sake I will then!!!! Jeez...just asking a question!

[spot]

My apologies, I thought you were trying to trip me up with that Black Hawk fiasco.

[drumbunny1]

I'm just curious on what Clint's perspective is.....

[spot]

These statistics are published by Congressional Research Service, and they may be confirmed by anyone at:
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf
http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/natsec/RL32492.pdf

Do your own research and do not be swayed by what you see on TV or read in most newspapers.

Clint, while you're there looking at the original tables, can you explain where your annual fatalities figures come from?

From 1980 to 1994 they're an exact copy of "Table 5. U.S. Active Duty Military Deaths, 1980 Through 2006, Part II, Cause of Death" column labelled "Total Deaths".

Then you start substituting Clinton's actual low totals with earlier higher ones:

For 1995 you use the 1983 total
For 1996 you use the 1982 total
For 1998 you use the 1985 total
For 1999 you use the 1986 total
For 2000 you use the 1987 total

giving you a total for the Clinton years of 13.417 deaths instead of the genuine published 8,035 in eight years.

Then you start inventing numbers from nowhere that I can see for the Bush-43 years, claiming the published total is 9,016 where in fact it's 9,550 in seven years in the original table.

These are overall deaths, nothing to do with casualties. I do the next calculations merely to show that your original conclusions were totally misleading, not because I offer any reason for them.

The Clinton armed forces averaged 1,519,646 members, the Bush-43 armed forces averaged 1,219,878 members.

The average death rate for all US armed forces in the Clinton years was 66 per 100,000 members annually.

The average death rate for all US armed forces in the Bush-43 years was 112 per 100,000 members annually.

Can you comment on the origin of the totals in your table?