~alcoholism~

[lady cop]

today it was reported that Joan Kennedy, former wife of senator ted ("a blonde in every pond") kennedy, was found laying unconcious in a Boston street, with a concussion and broken collarbone. she is hospitalized, and one of her sons has assumed her guardianship. this lady is ony 58 years old, and has a history of alcoholism. i felt sad for this lovely woman, and thought a discussion of the ravages of alcoholism might be in order, since it seems to affect so many lives. do you know an alcoholic? do you believe in 12-step programs? (AA) does it affect your life in some way? is it really a disease, or an excuse? it seems to be an affliction that touches the lives of many . what criteria defines "alcoholic" to you?

[Clint]

I have the twelve steps written in the back of my favorite Bible, along with their correlating Bible verses. The AA program is very spiritual. It used to be even more spiritual than it is now. In its beginning, unlike now, it resembled a home Bible study.

A very well researched book called, “The Good Book and the Big Book” (can’t remember the authors name) points out that in its early days AA had a 75% success rate. That has dropped drastically over the years as the program drifted from its original roots. The “higher power” thing has lead people down paths that are hopeless. I once saw a young man point to a box of tissues in the middle of the floor and declare that he had been taught and believed, that the box of tissues could be his higher power. I asked him what he was going to do when the box was empty and he didn’t have a reply.

The twelve steps are steps to peaceful, purposeful and content living. They are for anyone who has let something take over their life. Drugs and alcohol are the most common but they work for many things.

[lady cop]

hi Clint...i think the author of the original "big book" was simply called "bill"....my thought on the criteria for alcoholism is whether drinking has impacted a persons life, through family disruption, job problems, arrests, abuse of any kind, DUIs, "accidents", kids neglected; and if so, there is a problem having nothing to do with the number of drinks consumed, but rather their effect. ~~~~Clint, note, clear your PM box.

[Clint]

Originally Posted by lady cop

hi Clint...i think the author of the original "big book" was simply called "bill"....my thought on the criteria for alcoholism is whether drinking has impacted a persons life, through family disruption, job problems, arrests, abuse of any kind, DUIs, "accidents", kids neglected; and if so, there is a problem having nothing to do with the number of drinks consumed, but rather their effect. ~~~~Clint, note, clear your PM box.

You are correct. The author of the original Big Book was Bill. I was refering to the author of a book called "The Good Book and the Big Book".

The definition I have always thought fit well is, if drinking causes you serious life problems and you continue, you are an alcoholic. It doesn't matter if it's one beer or a gallon of whisky.

I rode with the PD of a city, who's name I won't mention, for two weeks in the early 70s. By midnight they were pulling people over and calling a cab for them becasue they didn't have the time or staff to book them. Is it any better now? That and an incident with a drunk and a gun, changed my mind about a career in law enforcement.

Thank you for the reminer on the PM box.

[Clint]

Originally Posted by Clint

You are correct. The author of the original Big Book was Bill. I was refering to the author of a book called "The Good Book and the Big Book".

The definition I have always thought fit well is, if drinking causes you serious life problems and you continue, you are an alcoholic. It doesn't matter if it's one beer or a gallon of whisky.

I rode with the PD of a city, who's name I won't mention, for two weeks in the early 70s. By midnight they were pulling people over and calling a cab for them becasue they didn't have the time or staff to book them. Is it any better now? That and an incident with a drunk and a gun, changed my mind about a career in law enforcement.

Thank you for the reminer on the PM box.

"reminer" Thank you for the reminder. It was a long day and I was tired but I couldn't sleep. I guess I could have downed a few, taken a few shots at the moon with my 4-10 and yelled at the neighbors, then I could have fallen asleep on the front yard. The only problem with that is that I'm between jobs, so I couldn't have gone to work and bragged to my buddies about how I told off the cop who trespassed to see if I was asleep or dead.

Originally Posted by lady cop

today it was reported that Joan Kennedy, former wife of senator ted ("a blonde in every pond") kennedy, was found laying unconcious in a Boston street, with a concussion and broken collarbone. she is hospitalized, and one of her sons has assumed her guardianship. this lady is ony 58 years old, and has a history of alcoholism. i felt sad for this lovely woman, and thought a discussion of the ravages of alcoholism might be in order, since it seems to affect so many lives. do you know an alcoholic? do you believe in 12-step programs? (AA) does it affect your life in some way? is it really a disease, or an excuse? it seems to be an affliction that touches the lives of many . what criteria defines "alcoholic" to you?

My Step-dad's a drunk. It does affect a person. He's been having problems with it since he was 15. He's 38 now and still drinking. He dosen't work he seems to always be mad. He can get violent but fortunitly he staggers and I get the upperhand. He's been to 7 different AA meetings and nothings helped. So basically yes it does affect a person and everyone around them.

[lady cop]

Jives, that is something that really appalls and angers me, drive-through liquor stores!! we have them where i live too, and i just want to park a cruiser right there 24/7. ........Skittles, are you saying you are being abused?? you can PM me if you want to talk about it.

Originally Posted by Jives

Yikes! Be safe, Skittles!

I will. Believe me. You really do get the upperhand if you can tell which way is up and down.

[BabyRider]

Kensloft, I'm not sure I understand where you're coming from. Are you saying that people need to "rethink" how much they drink, or how much they consume in a certain time period, or pace themselves, and if they can master that, then they should be able to drink? Is this for anyone who drinks? I'm not sure I can agree, if this is what you mean. If it's not what you mean, maybe you could elaborate for me?
Myself, I am one of those people who just can't drink alcohol. Of any kind. In any amount. Ever. I tried the "pacing myself" thing. I tried the "no hard stuff" thing. I tried the "beer only" thing. Didn't work. Alcohol changes me. It does something to me that I can't control and it almost cost me my life. Not that I almost died from it, but it really did come within a day or two of costing me everything that meant anything to me. I was faced with a choice: Have the person that you love and the life you could have together, or have booze.
There was no question for me which mattered more.
Now, I liked drinking. I liked it a LOT. Getting a buzz on and loosening up felt good. If only I could have stopped there. But I couldn't. And once I got past a certain point, I got stupid. And mean.
I thought I could control it. I really honestly believed that I could. But a true alcoholic can't. And we always think we can. There are rare days that I think how good a drink would taste. Just one. I can handle one. And then I think about the look on the face of the man I love that last time I drank. There isn't anything in the world that could intice me to drink again when I think of that.
I quit for myself. I quit because I don't want to be the person I am when I drink. Because I'm NOT the person I was when I drank. Nobody liked her, least of all me. I don't miss her. Good riddance.
So, LC...to answer your questions, yep, I know an alcoholic. I don't know if it's a disease or not. If my choices are disease or excuse, I'd have to go with excuse. Lots of people would disagree. That's just for myself, how I see me. I never went to AA, and don't know if I could. I quit January 15th this year, and I did it on my own, but with the support of the most wonderful man in the world.
And how does it affect my life? It doesn't. Anymore.

[lady cop]

BabyRider, you are very brave and honest. i admire and respect you. and you WILL succeed. each day.