Make these ads go away.
+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 14 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 12 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 135

Thread: Religious war

  1. #11
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    Cool
     

    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Posts
    9,500
    Local Date
    06-21-2018
    Local Time
    09:29 PM
    Points
    29,730
    Gifts Kitten

    Re: Religious war

    Who's got time for people to come around on their own in what leaders view as high stakes actions. Better to scare them into behaving and promise them they'll learn you were right in the end anyway.

    Of course, in the end nobody really gets to add up the pros and cons of a long drawn out confrontation. They're either dead; old; wounded; enslaved; or high on victory to care about what got them there. Their goal at that point is how to get out or move on. The ones who do focus on the past might become suicidal I suppose.

  2. #12
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    Cool
     

    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Posts
    9,500
    Local Date
    06-21-2018
    Local Time
    09:29 PM
    Points
    29,730
    Gifts Kitten

    Re: Religious war

    Quote Originally Posted by spot View Post
    Both succeeded only because their sphere of operation had been destabilized by external aggression.
    Perhaps even the ideas came about because of the effects of the prior outside aggression.

  3. #13
    gmc
    Currently Offline
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    ----
     

    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    13,188
    Local Date
    06-22-2018
    Local Time
    02:29 AM
    Points
    27,952
    Gifts Cocktail Car Beer

    Re: Religious war

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    I don't really see the parallel.
    Taiping folks adapted a foreign religion, new to the area, perpetrated by foreigners, to interfere with the establishment. The movement sought to replace the long standing established empire with some self-serving religious lunatics.

    The IS movement created itself from the ashes of the establishment, using a religion established well over a millennium ago.
    The common factors are destabilisation and religion to proivide an answer whether it came from outside or not isn't really germane.Religion/ populist leader both play on the discontent around them and once they get power they almost invariably demand blind obedience and use fear to shut up any opposition. have a look at what is happening in turkey you are watching a secular state turn in to a religious one as erdogan systematically removes any likely to oppose him. Look at who trump is going after he doesn't seem to accept that in a free country people can boo pooliticians if they feel like it or that maybe presidents can't just imprison who they like.

  4. #14
    Senior Member
    is searching for truth
     
    I am:
    Cool
     
    Mickiel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Warren, Michigan
    Posts
    4,104
    Local Date
    06-21-2018
    Local Time
    06:29 PM
    Points
    13,038

    Re: Religious war

    What has been interesting to me is the spread of " White Nationalism" in the world , and it has become its own religion. It invites a raw kind of racism and its government usually has a dictator at its head. From Europe to Russia , these governments it has spawned all have that "Whites are superior" attitude at their root consciousness. It infected Britain , it spread to America, and when it morphs with religion it gives birth to war.

  5. #15
    gmc
    Currently Offline
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    ----
     

    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    13,188
    Local Date
    06-22-2018
    Local Time
    02:29 AM
    Points
    27,952
    Gifts Cocktail Car Beer

    Re: Religious war

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickiel View Post
    What has been interesting to me is the spread of " White Nationalism" in the world , and it has become its own religion. It invites a raw kind of racism and its government usually has a dictator at its head. From Europe to Russia , these governments it has spawned all have that "Whites are superior" attitude at their root consciousness. It infected Britain , it spread to America, and when it morphs with religion it gives birth to war.
    That is hardly a new phenomenon what do you think manifest destiny and the white man's burden was as well as all the european empire building was all about. Not to mention the nazis althiough religious apologists try to pretend that 2,000 years of preaching the jews killed jesus had nothng whatsoever to do with anti-semitism.

    Racism is inherent in us all, fear of the other, but it takes religion to make racism in to a belief system that gets in to the core of some people without it familiarity helps get iover initial fear of the stranger. . You can trace the development of the notion that black people are inferior to white back to the need to have a justifacation for keeping them as slaves when enslaving fellow christians gradually made white slavery more socuially unacceptable (for europeans anyway) having black pople as inferior was a useful tactic. That all people are equal and entitled to the same human rights as everyone else is a secular concept by it's very nature the religious cannot view anyine else as their equal otherwise they have to reject the basic tenet of their religion that they are chosen to go to heaven and the rest are not.

    If you look at the early history of the chruistian church there were black saints, black crusaders even prester john was supposed to come alomg and save white christendom.

    Black / African Saints - Saints & Angels - Catholic Online

    Right wing christian fascists are not something new whether it willl succed like it has in the past we shall soon find out. Meself I am more woprried about what happens in turkey, likely they will turn on the j=[kurds not least because they are sitting on the oil reserves.

  6. #16
    Senior Member
    is searching for truth
     
    I am:
    Cool
     
    Mickiel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Warren, Michigan
    Posts
    4,104
    Local Date
    06-21-2018
    Local Time
    06:29 PM
    Points
    13,038

    Re: Religious war

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    That is hardly a new phenomenon what do you think manifest destiny and the white man's burden was as well as all the european empire building was all about. Not to mention the nazis althiough religious apologists try to pretend that 2,000 years of preaching the jews killed jesus had nothng whatsoever to do with anti-semitism.

    Racism is inherent in us all, fear of the other, but it takes religion to make racism in to a belief system that gets in to the core of some people without it familiarity helps get iover initial fear of the stranger. . You can trace the development of the notion that black people are inferior to white back to the need to have a justifacation for keeping them as slaves when enslaving fellow christians gradually made white slavery more socuially unacceptable (for europeans anyway) having black pople as inferior was a useful tactic. That all people are equal and entitled to the same human rights as everyone else is a secular concept by it's very nature the religious cannot view anyine else as their equal otherwise they have to reject the basic tenet of their religion that they are chosen to go to heaven and the rest are not.

    If you look at the early history of the chruistian church there were black saints, black crusaders even prester john was supposed to come alomg and save white christendom.

    Black / African Saints - Saints & Angels - Catholic Online

    Right wing christian fascists are not something new whether it willl succed like it has in the past we shall soon find out. Meself I am more woprried about what happens in turkey, likely they will turn on the j=[kurds not least because they are sitting on the oil reserves.


    Well racism , religion , war ; its all really about human nature. What happens in Turkey , the Middle East , even America is at its root , still human nature ; the things that we do. And why we do those things. Which is why the bible interest me , it goes directly into human nature like no other book I have read. It opens up why we humans tear this earth apart , why we kill each other , why humans behave as they do. But putting that aside, I expect humans in areas all over the globe to continue on a track of terror and just horrible behavior in high places.

    In just my life time I have seen humans do terrible things, hardly nothing shocks me any more. I think hate wars , or nationalism wars are the worse, far worse than religious wars. The Hitler purge in example. Humans thinking that killing other humans gives a sterilization to humanity. Political wars are horrible , religious wars are to be condemned. But when you kill me because you think my race deserves to be killed , and yours deserves to live, that is a serious thing.

    Again , Religious wars , Political wars and Nationalism wars will keep coming , but in my view , the worse of those wars , the most intense and hateful kind of war , is Nationalist wars. When a race kills to sterilize the earth.

  7. #17
    gmc
    Currently Offline
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    ----
     

    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    13,188
    Local Date
    06-22-2018
    Local Time
    02:29 AM
    Points
    27,952
    Gifts Cocktail Car Beer

    Re: Religious war

    Quote Originally Posted by Mickiel View Post
    Well racism , religion , war ; its all really about human nature. What happens in Turkey , the Middle East , even America is at its root , still human nature ; the things that we do. And why we do those things. Which is why the bible interest me , it goes directly into human nature like no other book I have read. It opens up why we humans tear this earth apart , why we kill each other , why humans behave as they do. But putting that aside, I expect humans in areas all over the globe to continue on a track of terror and just horrible behavior in high places.

    In just my life time I have seen humans do terrible things, hardly nothing shocks me any more. I think hate wars , or nationalism wars are the worse, far worse than religious wars. The Hitler purge in example. Humans thinking that killing other humans gives a sterilization to humanity. Political wars are horrible , religious wars are to be condemned. But when you kill me because you think my race deserves to be killed , and yours deserves to live, that is a serious thing.

    Again , Religious wars , Political wars and Nationalism wars will keep coming , but in my view , the worse of those wars , the most intense and hateful kind of war , is Nationalist wars. When a race kills to sterilize the earth.
    The bible is man made a coolection of stories to explain out origins that no one with half a brain should be taking literally and religion had been used to manipulate people since time began.

    In just my life time I have seen humans do terrible things, hardly nothing shocks me any more. I think hate wars , or nationalism wars are the worse, far worse than religious wars. The Hitler purge in example. Humans thinking that killing other humans gives a sterilization to humanity. Political wars are horrible , religious wars are to be condemned. But when you kill me because you think my race deserves to be killed , and yours deserves to live, that is a serious thing.
    Are you seriously suggesting that anti-semirtism and hitler has nothing to do with religion? Hitler thought he was doing god's work and he had the backing of the catoilic church to do it the pope ordered his priests to cease opposing him and to pray fpr him from their pulpits. Religious apologists simply ignore inconvenient facts as if bthey don't exist they taught goebbels, repeat a lie often enough and it becomes a truth. Come to that in what way was the vietnam war a war of nationalism? What did ameruica actually gain from it

    Totalitarianism come from religion - total and abject submission tio the ruling church or state with followers willing to sacrifuce themselves for the "greater good". Stalin modelled his political alternative on the chrisrtian church - he was after all training to be a priest at one point where vdom you think he got it from?

    What you see in the middle east is a very old story indeed it's not simple nationalism the yazidi are the same people as the muslims that slaughtered them. What's happening in turket is more serious IMO they have one of the most powerful militaries in the world except now minus their leadership.

    It is also human naturte to live in peace with your neighbour, to share and help each other to be curious about other people and to learn from them. Religion is simply a tool to get people to hate and join tiogether against those who are different or who have resources you need. Read your bible you'll see what I mean.

  8. #18
    Ted
    Currently Online Now
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    ----
     

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Gabriola Island BC
    Posts
    5,413
    Local Date
    06-21-2018
    Local Time
    06:29 PM
    Points
    6,240

    Re: Religious war

    Are you seriously suggesting that anti-semirtism and hitler has nothing to do with religion?

    That is exactly what I am saying. The use of religion for evil purposes has nothing to do with the religion itself. People use religion to justify many thin gs that are wrong.

    T

  9. #19
    gmc
    Currently Offline
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    ----
     

    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    13,188
    Local Date
    06-22-2018
    Local Time
    02:29 AM
    Points
    27,952
    Gifts Cocktail Car Beer

    Re: Religious war

    Quote Originally Posted by Ted View Post
    Are you seriously suggesting that anti-semirtism and hitler has nothing to do with religion?

    That is exactly what I am saying. The use of religion for evil purposes has nothing to do with the religion itself. People use religion to justify many thin gs that are wrong.

    T
    Let's see how about an analogy. A gun being used in a murder i.e being used for evil (leaving aside whether evil exists or not) purposes has nothing to do with the gun itself.

    The thing is religion isn't the simple tool it's more akin to the individual that incites the murderer to commit the act. without the incitement the murder might not actualyl take place. It may human nature to go to war but it is also human nature to live inpeace and to not want to kill your neighbour religion is the method to get people to do unspeakable things to others not like them the chosen have a god given right to do as they wish in god's name. For two thousand years the christian church has taught that the jews killed jesus and it too till the 1960's for the catholioc church to concede that not all jews are responsible for killing jesus just some of them.

    To say religion had nothing to do with the holocaust is to ignore the facts. It's unlikely it would have hap[pened without it.

    Totalitarianism takes it's inspiration from religion and it's demand for total subservience to an oprganisation. Christian, right wing, fascism the three go hand in hand. Islamic fundamentalisnm is a variation on the theme anyone not of their faith is going to hell and is less than human.

  10. #20
    Premium Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    ----
     
    tude dog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    North Central Kansas
    Posts
    3,625
    Local Date
    06-21-2018
    Local Time
    08:29 PM
    Points
    16,824
    Gifts Beer Beer

    Re: Religious war

    Register to remove this ad.
    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    Let's see how about an analogy. A gun being used in a murder i.e being used for evil (leaving aside whether evil exists or not) purposes has nothing to do with the gun itself.

    The thing is Marxism isn't the simple tool it's more akin to the individual that incites the murderer to commit the act. without the incitement the murder might not actualyl take place. It may human nature to go to war but it is also human nature to live inpeace and to not want to kill your neighbour Communism is the method to get people to do unspeakable things to others not like them the chosen have a god given right to do as they wish in Marx's name. For 168 years the communist has taught that the jews are capitalist money lenders for oppressing the proletariat, just some of them.

    To say SOCIALISM had nothing to do with the holocaust is to ignore the facts. It's unlikely it would have hap[pened without it.

    Totalitarianism takes it's inspiration from NIHIL SECULARISM and it's demand for total subservience to an oprganisation.
    COMMUNIST, right wing, fascism the three go hand in hand. Islamic fundamentalisnm is a variation on the theme anyone not of their faith is going to hell and is less than human.
    There.

    Fixed it for ya.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 2 of 14 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 12 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.5.2