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Thread: I see EU Morphing into a New US

  1. #21
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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Quote Originally Posted by TruthBringer View Post
    I hear you Jester.

    Everybody wanna be a balla, bot nobody wanna be a shot calla. lol. Go on pimp.
    Pimp?

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Quote Originally Posted by twizzel View Post
    You are not wrong this is exactly what the eu wants one major european state to rival ammerica and the chinnesse, This is serious bad news as the french and germans can't help themselves they have to go for world dommination. We must all work to stop this Britain must pull out of the eu and the commonwealth will follow us to form a stabalising block, america will never attack us as an independent soveriegn state they would however if we had been absorbed into a greater europe.
    I seriously have no idea where you are coming from

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Twizzle, I seriously don't think America is going to attack Britain or any other European state any day soon whether Britain remains in the EU or not. I also have to say if you think France and Germany are going to attempt world domination via the EU somehow, well erm, I think you may need to lie down in a dark room you are overtired. The last one about the Commonwealth nations becoming the world's latest global powerblock, that's probably the most delusional one of all, but it did give me a good laugh.

    I think basically what your saying is that you wish the Empire was back and jolly English fellows with mustaches and top hats were in charge, that all these horrible foreign chaps would realize it, and basically that it was 1869 again. Unfortunately if you look out your window you will find that time has moved on somewhat, and its now February 2008, Britain is still an important country, but not quite the centre of the universe it once was, also it is not actually at war with either France or Germany, in fact you are all allies now, and have been for about 50 years, China is now the workshop of the world, those damn colonials in America are now the global superpower, and unfortunately its not possible to make the fuzzy wuzzy's toe the line with gun boats and supercilious attitudes some of them even have guns, so it would be better to come up with a more realistic outlook of the world, Europe, and Britain's place in the grand scheme of things.
    "We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Quote Originally Posted by Galbally View Post
    Twizzle, I seriously don't think America is going to attack Britain or any other European state any day soon whether Britain remains in the EU or not. I also have to say if you think France and Germany are going to attempt world domination via the EU somehow, well erm, I think you may need to lie down in a dark room you are overtired. The last one about the Commonwealth nations becoming the world's latest global powerblock, that's probably the most delusional one of all, but it did give me a good laugh.

    I think basically what your saying is that you wish the Empire was back and jolly English fellows with mustaches and top hats were in charge, that all these horrible foreign chaps would realize it, and basically that it was 1869 again. Unfortunately if you look out your window you will find that time has moved on somewhat, and its now February 2008, Britain is still an important country, but not quite the centre of the universe it once was, also it is not actually at war with either France or Germany, in fact you are all allies now, and have been for about 50 years, China is now the workshop of the world, those damn colonials in America are now the global superpower, and unfortunately its not possible to make the fuzzy wuzzy's toe the line with gun boats and supercilious attitudes some of them even have guns, so it would be better to come up with a more realistic outlook of the world, Europe, and Britain's place in the grand scheme of things.
    Nicely said - I'm glad you could see the "thinking" behind the post.

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Quote Originally Posted by Jester View Post
    Interesting concept on being 'American'...

    I'm American mostly because its my birthright, I was born on my fathers land, and the same land has been in my families name and at one time fought over in range wars. The most recent wars have been legal ones over mineral/water rights.

    America is land to two concepts that are the basis for my personal beliefs, freedom of religion and my own freedom to secure my family. (which im sure one could argue I have anyway, anywhere I go) but here, for the most part my government supports those ideas.

    My particular problem with Government currently is that its doesnt do enough to punish the guilty and goes overboard to protect the rights of the guilty at the expense of the innocent/victim, but thats a lengthy explaination.
    I didn't interpret the question as meaning the legal definition of American citizen, but rather what 'being American' means as opposed to 'Un-American'.

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Quote Originally Posted by Accountable View Post
    I didn't interpret the question as meaning the legal definition of American citizen, but rather what 'being American' means as opposed to 'Un-American'.
    oh I was hitting it from the perspective of what I feel makes me an american!

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Is there a sense of pride or belonging in being a European? I'd understand if the UK would have less of one, since you aren't mainland, but is there a sense of kinship?

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Quote Originally Posted by Accountable View Post
    My pessimism stems from long history of human tendency to abuse power when they are remote, nothing more. So long as Europe keeps the EU in check as you have done with the UK gov't lately, you'll be okay.

    As for your analysis of the US, I really think it will do us a tremendous good, culturally, if other nations would stop allowing us to make them dependent. I'm baffled when I think of strong nations that allow a permanent US military presence, unless we are there as hired guns -- cheaper to spend our blood than their own. I don't like being thought of as mercenary, thug, or bouncer.
    I agree! As an American I feel it is a shame for people to depend, no demand, that their Government "take care of them" with socialist programs. What motivation to achieve and be productive does that provide?
    As I understand it, if you want anything but the basics of health care with socialized medicine you have to get in line OR fork over the big bucks for a privet doctor. I just spoke to a customer tonite who had returned to America just this week after six years in England just so she could have her gall bladder out. It was come back here, get on a waiting list, or hand over her savings.
    We, as a country, have struggled to keep our freedom to become money grubbing specialist in our trades and not kick back in mediocrity accepting our parents dictatorship so we can get or nappies changed regularly. Don't get me wrong, we have our welfare sucklings here too, kicking back and taking what they can get for free. Changes in our programs in the eighties were supposed to fix that system, though they didn't do much, and plans were supposed to be made to end welfare all together.

    Let me try to say it another way. If you don't have competition and every level of society you don't have growth and if you don't growth you have a stagnant society. Example, U.S.S.R. They once had everything. But when all the workers got treated the same, lived with the same expectations for every generation and no one had to try they stagnated.

    The U.S. needs to continue to push education here, keep lowering our taxes and
    do away with outsourcing productivity to lower revenue countries. We have excellent programs to help small business owners get started but tax them to death with social security and mandatory health provisions for any employee working 36 hours a week. Yet, I can name a dozen people who shop at WalMart where everything is made in sweatshops from China to Brazil, because it's a whole lot cheaper than Sac's.

    I don't know all the answers and like accountable, I'm no expert. I did have a strong work ethic instilled in me by my parents who had the same done to them by theirs. I see socialism seeping into our country more every year and as it does I see a corresponding slump in the work ethics of our youth. More and more immigrants are stepping up to take the jobs our kids feel are beneath them because they don't pay the big bucks. Sheesh.

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

    Quote Originally Posted by double helix View Post
    I agree! As an American I feel it is a shame for people to depend, no demand, that their Government "take care of them" with socialist programs. What motivation to achieve and be productive does that provide?

    <Snip>

    As a Brit I demand that the government ensure that no-one should die unnecessarily from a preventable health problem.

    Yes, non-emergency treatment can take a while if it's not life threatening and the cosmetic stuff you're on you own for.

    I have worked all of my life and always been motivated to be productive. That is totally independent of health care provision and is linked to pride and quality of life.

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    Re: I see EU Morphing into a New US

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    Quote Originally Posted by Accountable View Post
    I didn't interpret the question as meaning the legal definition of American citizen, but rather what 'being American' means as opposed to 'Un-American'.
    I suspect it's a bit like trying to define what being british is. The reality is so diverse and nebulous that in defining it you actually destroy what makes it special.

    If you don't mind an outsider expressing an opinion. Hippies are quintessentially american, so are hell's angels, fundamentalist christians and rock and roll. Anyone that believes they can define it is missing something crucial.IMO

    posted by accountable
    Is there a sense of pride or belonging in being a European? I'd understand if the UK would have less of one, since you aren't mainland, but is there a sense of kinship?
    Yes and no. It's like being british. I am british and there is a sense of pride in that but I am also scottish and there is equally a sense of pride in that. galbally is irish bryn mawr is english we come from similar but at the same time very different cultures. We're all europeans but also distinctly products of our own culture and each has taken from the other bits that work and make things better. Just like every other european. There's maybe a sense of kinship but if you ask a European where they come from they don't say europe.

    As a ship of state Europe is an amorphous blob going where the wind of change takes it with everybody trying to set their own course. every time someone tries to get their own way and impose their own course, sometimes by force, we set fire to it and rebuild it. Although it's a while since we did that. I am wary of those in the UK would want to set sail on their own in a rowing boat. Often times the one with the loudest opinion expressed forcefully is talking through their backside and may not have noticed the wind has changed caught up as they are in their own miasma.

    The US is different as people have tried to shape and define it from the word go what you have is very different but also very much the same. The americans on this forum obviously feel very american but argue about things. A hippy and a hell's angel probably both feel american, agree on the fundamental principles but argue a lot and probably eventually live let live. It's differences and constant change that keep a culture alive. Value the past and know where you come from but keep moving.

    posted by double helix
    I agree! As an American I feel it is a shame for people to depend, no demand, that their Government "take care of them" with socialist programs. What motivation to achieve and be productive does that provide?
    As I understand it, if you want anything but the basics of health care with socialized medicine you have to get in line OR fork over the big bucks for a privet doctor. I just spoke to a customer tonite who had returned to America just this week after six years in England just so she could have her gall bladder out. It was come back here, get on a waiting list, or hand over her savings.

    As a Britisher I find it odd that americans seem to be brainwashed in to believing that they should not tell their government what is expected of them, indeed that somehow it's unamerican. Debates on things like healthcare seem to revolve round whether you should be telling govt rather than what you expect it to do. Why bother having elections if you have no say in what they do?

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