Make these ads go away.
+ Reply to Thread
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 38

Thread: U.s.r.i.p.

  1. #21
    Banned
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    Crazy
     

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    WEST SUSSEX, ENGLAND
    Posts
    31,529
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    12:48 PM
    Points
    51,299
    Gifts Boxing Gloves Cocktail Boxing Gloves Balloons Puppy Gift Car Cocktail

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Excellent post Jones

  2. #22
    Mad Arse Face
    is relaxed
     
    I am:
    Happy
     
    Snooz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Square State, USA
    Posts
    4,625
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    06:48 AM
    Points
    11,337
    Gifts Kitten Balloons Kitten Beer

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    China has a very bad track record for shipping out poisonous goods. Children's toys and dog treats come to mind just off the top of my head. That certainly doesn't inspire buyer confidence. If their trade suffers, their economy suffers.

  3. #23
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    Cool
     

    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Posts
    9,070
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    08:48 AM
    Points
    27,750
    Gifts Kitten

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Thanks for the thought and effort you put into this post, JJ. You make a compelling case if your facts support your assertions. Do they? I haven't checked any of them yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by jones jones View Post
    Appearances can often be deceiving. I�m not an economist but I am intelligent and I can read, write and think. The economic downturn and political upheaval around the globe has seemingly made China appear to be a stable market. However in my opinion, even though at the moment economic growth there is high, it will not continue much longer.

    In reality the Chinese economy is now far more in debt than most other immerging market economies. Much of this debt has been made by state owned companies and local governments. But bad debts made by these borrowers are not recognized on the balance sheets of Chinese banks as they are ordered by the state to roll these loans over.

    These "hidden" bad debts are conservatively estimated to be about 15% of GDP which technically means that the Chinese banking system is probably insolvent.
    Wikipedia says China's Government dept to its GDP as of 2012 is 21.3% - if we add your 15% to that we have a total of of just under 37%. The U.S. is at just over 107%.

    List of countries by public debt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The question boils down to be whether or not this much debt can be toxic to a nation's economy.


    Quote Originally Posted by jones jones View Post
    So these firms who are only kept solvent by bank loans will have to be shut down sooner or later. China looks good right now but in the next two or three years their deficiencies will be exposed and growth will be very much slower. When ever risks are taken, a payback day has to eventually dawn.

    The People's Republic of China�s bubble will burst sooner rather than later.
    That's a bit of a bold statement, putting a time line on China's bubble bursting. But you might in fact be correct for all we know at this point. There's no question from what I can see in preliminary accounts such as this one...
    Cinda is one of four asset management companies that Beijing established in 1999 to absorb toxic assets held by the China's four biggest banks. It is the most profitable and the first of the four to seek a public listing, with company disclosures showing large and steady growth of its operations.
    Cinda IPO to test investor appetite for China's bad debt | Reuters

    ...Investors don't appear too worried about China's ability ,or, willingness to repay its debt - to itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by jones jones View Post
    As for India (love the name and I have used it in my latest novel as the name for one of the women characters), a la Nero, they fiddle while their country burns. They look to space, Mars at the moment, for whatever reason while they have a gazillion gazillion people who live in total squalor. India launched its first Mars-bound spacecraft at the cost of 45 million GBP while the UK taxpayers shipped out 280 million GBP to them in "aid" last year.

    The average wage in India varies from 118 rupees ($2.18) to 185 rupees ($3.40) per day. That is unless you an "Untouchable", (Dalit) then the caste system comes into play and you lucky if you earn even half as much as this..
    These sorts of figures always appear scary to westerners, but I think it worth pointing out that personal income is geographically relative. $3.40 per day seems outrageous if one is attempting to live on that in the US or UK. But India? I don't know.


    Quote Originally Posted by jones jones View Post
    Yeah right ...China and India are gonna like out do the USA soon.

    Maybe, but I'd rather spend the rest of my days in the good old US of A rather than in either China or India if I had the chance.
    I'm certain I would as well, but then again, that's where I was raised and the culture I'm most comfortable in.

    Perhaps Arena will offer to avail us of his case for his statement.

  4. #24
    Banned
    is New year ... Same Jj.
     
    I am:
    Happy
     

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    6,602
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    02:48 PM
    Points
    32,926
    Gifts Balloons Cocktail Heart Balloons Paintbrush Beer Gift

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Quote Originally Posted by oscar View Post
    Excellent post Jones
    Why thank you Oscar! I do try my best dear ...

  5. #25
    Banned
    is New year ... Same Jj.
     
    I am:
    Happy
     

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    6,602
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    02:48 PM
    Points
    32,926
    Gifts Balloons Cocktail Heart Balloons Paintbrush Beer Gift

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahso! View Post
    Thanks for the thought and effort you put into this post, JJ. You make a compelling case if your facts support your assertions. Do they? I haven't checked any of them yet.Wikipedia says China's Government dept to its GDP as of 2012 is 21.3% - if we add your 15% to that we have a total of of just under 37%. The U.S. is at just over 107%.

    List of countries by public debt - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The question boils down to be whether or not this much debt can be toxic to a nation's economy.


    That's a bit of a bold statement, putting a time line on China's bubble bursting. But you might in fact be correct for all we know at this point. There's no question from what I can see in preliminary accounts such as this one... Cinda IPO to test investor appetite for China's bad debt | Reuters

    ...Investors don't appear too worried about China's ability ,or, willingness to repay its debt - to itself.

    These sorts of figures always appear scary to westerners, but I think it worth pointing out that personal income is geographically relative. $3.40 per day seems outrageous if one is attempting to live on that in the US or UK. But India? I don't know.


    I'm certain I would as well, but then again, that's where I was raised and the culture I'm most comfortable in.

    Perhaps Arena will offer to avail us of his case for his statement.
    Like me you are obviously a thinking earthling Ahso ...

    Who knows what the future holds? Maybe China or India or North Korea or Viet Nam or Iran or even Kazakhstan could in the future spring a surprise and become the next Super Power. Me Jj I doubt it ...

  6. #26
    Senior Member
    This user has no status.
     
    I am:
    Cool
     

    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Northeast
    Posts
    9,070
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    08:48 AM
    Points
    27,750
    Gifts Kitten

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    What're your thoughts on the GDP difference issue between the US and China?

  7. #27
    Banned
    is New year ... Same Jj.
     
    I am:
    Happy
     

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    6,602
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    02:48 PM
    Points
    32,926
    Gifts Balloons Cocktail Heart Balloons Paintbrush Beer Gift

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahso! View Post
    What're your thoughts on the GDP difference issue between the US and China?
    Anyway before we get to GDP we have to take cognisance of the fact that the USA has an elected government which is totally legitimate with a separation of legislative, judicial, and executive powers.

    The peoples Republic of China is ruled by the Chinese Communist Party. There is no separation of powers. No checks and balances. No independent press. So any figures coming out are naturally suspect.

    Chinas gross domestic product (GDP) was estimated by the IMF at approximately $8.25 trillion in 2012, which is just over 50% of US GDP of approximately $16 trillion for the same year.

    While that is a significant gap that may take China many years to close, using another measure known as Purchasing Power Parity (PPP), China is allegedly forecast to race past the U.S. in just a few more years.

    Personally I don't think there's much chance of that happening.

  8. #28
    Proudly humble
    is Lost in the Ozone, again.
     
    I am:
    Cool
     
    LarsMac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    usually on the road to somewhere.
    Posts
    9,321
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    06:48 AM
    Points
    35,407
    Gifts Beer Balloons Gift Car Beer

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Did you know that the principle owner of the Banks in China, as well as many of the business ventures, is the PRA? (Peoples' Republic Army)
    "The trouble with people isn't that they don't know, but that they know so much that ain't so."
    - Anonymous

  9. #29
    Banned
    is New year ... Same Jj.
     
    I am:
    Happy
     

    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    6,602
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    02:48 PM
    Points
    32,926
    Gifts Balloons Cocktail Heart Balloons Paintbrush Beer Gift

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    Did you know that the principle owner of the Banks in China, as well as many of the business ventures, is the PRA? (Peoples' Republic Army)
    No I wasn't aware of this ... But was is the PRA? The Communist Party.

  10. #30
    Proudly humble
    is Lost in the Ozone, again.
     
    I am:
    Cool
     
    LarsMac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    usually on the road to somewhere.
    Posts
    9,321
    Local Date
    09-23-2017
    Local Time
    06:48 AM
    Points
    35,407
    Gifts Beer Balloons Gift Car Beer

    Re: U.s.r.i.p.

    Register to remove this ad.
    Quote Originally Posted by jones jones View Post
    No I wasn't aware of this ... But was is the PRA? The Communist Party.
    Sorry, it is actually, more correct to say PLA, Peoples Liberation Army.
    The Army is the principle investor and owner of most of the domestic commercial interests in China.

    edit: In theory, since the 90s the ventures have been "privatized" but the management is still the same. Predominantly current and former military leaders.
    "The trouble with people isn't that they don't know, but that they know so much that ain't so."
    - Anonymous

+ Reply to Thread
Page 3 of 4 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts

Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.5.2