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Thread: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    Quote Originally Posted by magentaflame View Post
    I believe though, if that missle had of gone over a very western white country it would be a very different crisis.
    I had thought the rule is that Japan's under US protection, and that the US would bring down any missile over Japan before the missile could detonate. I may be wrong. Is that not the agreement? That the US provides a defensive shield for Japan and South Korea?

    Has America tried continually for the last sixty years to bring an end to North Korea's political and military capability?

    I see nothing objectionable about North Korea's political leadership securing its future in the face of that unending external aggression. A deliverable nuclear capability would provide that long-term security while Korea works toward reunification.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...ised-peninsula is relevant, I think.
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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    I'll go further, I'll propose a possible solution.

    Reunification of the single nation, Korea, which was torn in two by the proxy war of the early 50s fought across the Korean peninsula, would bring an end to this international crisis.

    Firstly I suggest it is entirely an internal Korean matter and needs no other participants than North and South Koreans. It needs no advisers, no guarantors, just the political leadership of the two halves of Korea.

    Secondly, Korea before the 50s had a capital, Seoul. I don't see why the reunified country needs to change that, it's been the capital since 1392. On the other hand Pyongyang would be a lot more practical and has far more elegant government buildings.

    Thirdly, reunification cannot possibly be accomplished without removing all occupying forces from Korea. America cannot stand in the way by refusing to leave.

    Fourthly, the Truth and Reconciliation system which was prematurely closed down for political reasons needs to be reconvened with guarantees that it can complete its work.

    Fifthly, I suggest a general unqualified amnesty covering all political actors but excluding corrupt profiteering.

    I suggest the constitutional basis of the reunited Korea will need to reflect only the aspirations of the country. It cannot rely on the pre-war state which was under Japanese rule, it cannot look back to the 19th century and it cannot merely copy the constitution of either the North or the South.

    Nobody would want the social system of either the North or the South to be the model for the new country. The opportunity to design a new social compact should be an incentive for both parties.

    Finally, I see no reason why a reunified Korea should not be nuclear-armed to guarantee its unaligned independence if it chooses.
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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    I suppose if south korea wants to be annexed by china. Have you noticed that America is there purely as a barrier between China and the south pacific? What is happening in the China sea at the moment has a lot to do with nth korea's behaviour. They want a piece of the action.

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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    Quote Originally Posted by spot View Post
    I'll go further, I'll propose a possible solution.

    Reunification of the single nation, Korea, which was torn in two by the proxy war of the early 50s fought across the Korean peninsula, would bring an end to this international crisis.

    Firstly I suggest it is entirely an internal Korean matter and needs no other participants than North and South Koreans. It needs no advisers, no guarantors, just the political leadership of the two halves of Korea.

    Secondly, Korea before the 50s had a capital, Seoul. I don't see why the reunified country needs to change that, it's been the capital since 1392. On the other hand Pyongyang would be a lot more practical and has far more elegant government buildings.

    Thirdly, reunification cannot possibly be accomplished without removing all occupying forces from Korea. America cannot stand in the way by refusing to leave.

    Fourthly, the Truth and Reconciliation system which was prematurely closed down for political reasons needs to be reconvened with guarantees that it can complete its work.

    Fifthly, I suggest a general unqualified amnesty covering all political actors but excluding corrupt profiteering.

    I suggest the constitutional basis of the reunited Korea will need to reflect only the aspirations of the country. It cannot rely on the pre-war state which was under Japanese rule, it cannot look back to the 19th century and it cannot merely copy the constitution of either the North or the South.

    Nobody would want the social system of either the North or the South to be the model for the new country. The opportunity to design a new social compact should be an incentive for both parties.

    Finally, I see no reason why a reunified Korea should not be nuclear-armed to guarantee its unaligned independence if it chooses.
    Well, I can't really argue with any of that.
    Though the idea of Kim Jong Un in charge of Samsung, AND nukes would scare me a bit
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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    The Korean people voiced a strong opinion that Korea should be one country when the US unilaterally decided to split it in 1945. The UN wanted to re-unite the country in 1948 but the US had veto power. The problem now is that N.Korea has been under a dictatorship since 1948. The current dictator is 3rd generation - his grandfather was the first. How many times in recent history has a dictator voluntarily relinquished power to let a country govern itself?

    South Koreans would not want to be governed by Kim Jong Un and adopt that way of life. Thus, the reunification of Korea would not happen by a peaceful process.

    But I fully agree, in principle, with everything you said. The US should remove its occupation troops and weaponry. Even though the problem of the division of Korea was caused by external parties, it is a matter to be settled internally.

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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    I think you'll find the South Koreans have been attempting reunification talks for several years, quite earnestly.
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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    Quote Originally Posted by spot View Post
    I think you'll find the South Koreans have been attempting reunification talks for several years, quite earnestly.
    Then I fully agree with you. Let them work it out without outside military presence.

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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    I'll make two other observations while I'm at it.

    Guam is situated among the Marshall Islands, an independent nation-state in the Pacific. Guam itself is a US colony with no form of self-government and no vote in either House and no vote for the Presidency. It also has an indigenous movement pressing for Guam to be given its rightful independent place among the Marshall Islands. If Guam were handed to the Marshall Islands where it belongs, no US territory would be within range of North Korea's weapons. The US has no justifiable claim to retain sovereignty over Guam.

    My other observation is that before North Korea's enhanced missile could incrementally improve and target for example Los Angeles or San Francisco, London would already have come into range. The whole of Europe is closer to North Korea than the US West Coast is. So is Australia.
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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

    A Dictatorship is unlikely to yield to a Democratic form of Government. I imagine the preferred method of attack would be a single sniper. I don't think anyone really disagrees that the main threat to World Peace at the moment is the madness of Kim Jong Un. The obvious solution would seem to be to eliminate the problem.

    At the moment I don't think China are feeling too comfortable with his actions either. Much of their economy now relies on trade with the West. Apple, for instance, rely on their products being built by China's Child Labour Sweat Shops, as well as having them work in the open cast mines. Being drawn into a war would seriously affect their ability to continue with this.

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    Re: Pre-emptive nuclear first strike

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    Quote Originally Posted by FourPart View Post
    A Dictatorship is unlikely to yield to a Democratic form of Government.
    I refer the honorable gentleman to the former German Democratic Republic.

    I imagine the preferred method of attack would be a single sniper. I don't think anyone really disagrees that the main threat to World Peace at the moment is the madness of Kim Jong Un.
    A sniper would be illegal. The main threat to world peace for the last sixty years has been the USA and still is, especially in the context of Korea.

    You do know that if you were recommending a sniper as a solution to President Trump you'd become a documented threat as far as US agencies are concerned? In my opinion recommending it as a solution for any head of state you happen to dislike is equally unethical.

    Destroying the governments of Libya, Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria have all proved disastrous moves for the world at large as well as the citizens of the countries concerned. Doing the same to North Korea would be just as counter-productive.
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    The watch of your vision has become reasonable today.

    It’s normal. You must provoke. You must insult the belief of all monotheists. You must make fun of the belief of all monotheists.
    From the upper tier of the Leppings Lane End of the Hillsborough Stadium, I watched the events of that day unfold with horror.
    When the flowers want to oxygen and nutrition, or you’re a wedding or party planner, I will help you too much.
    Write that word in the blood

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