PETA wants military to stop using animals in medical training

[RedGlitter]

Here are some links detailing animals used in tests by the military and in bioterrorism research:


http://www.all-creatures.org/saen/articles-themost.html

http://www.mrmcmed.org/mar.html

http://www.hsus.org/animals_in_resea..._research.html

http://www.idausa.org/facts/military.html

http://www.all-creatures.org/saen/ar...-wargames.html

http://www.downbound.com/Animal_Testing_s/274.htm

[koochikoo]

I'm with you Red, we have fantastic technology in todays age that can produce things from bionic body parts to interplanetary spacecraft. Surely a technology must exist that will produce a suitable alternative to inflicting pain and suffering on a defenseless animal.

I rarely visit the PETA site, it makes me feel so sad and helpless. I've seen things on there that have given me nightmares for weeks.

[spot]

Originally Posted by RedGlitter

It's been a while but I will certainly try to find some for you.

I've checked the links and none have any "military and surgical simulators in the medical field" that would make an alternative to a live pig. Do they exist?

[Accountable]

Originally Posted by koochikoo

I'm with you Red, we have fantastic technology in todays age that can produce things from bionic body parts to interplanetary spacecraft. Surely a technology must exist that will produce a suitable alternative to inflicting pain and suffering on a defenseless animal.

I rarely visit the PETA site, it makes me feel so sad and helpless. I've seen things on there that have given me nightmares for weeks.

Then please, leave warfare to warriors.

I have wittnessed the animal practicals first hand and participated in the training, its an exceptional way to train the medics. After one or two goes at the simulators you have mastered everything that can go wrong and even guess as to what will system will crash next, with the pig or goat you have to assess the condition and treat it.

In the sims a sucking chest wound is just simulated, sorry but it isnt real, the victim doesnt react, it just lays there and allows the treatment. With a lung shot to a goat or pig it reacts, pigs react very similar to humans in terms of the signs and symptoms of trauma.

In the animal practicals the animal also reacts to the administration of the real drugs, give too much or too little and the animal responds. The trainig is extrtemely valuable to build the confidence of medics in battlefield treatment. The reality is that you must assess and treat rapidly, stabilize and often move them prior to stabilizing them... 'pack em and drag em'... in the heat of battle, those are very similar conditions with the animal and you have the element of adrenaline moving too with a live writhign and screamiong animal, its actually the main point of using live animals in the practicals.

Red I realize this may be cruel, and I agree it is. But an animal is not human and its a sacrifice that needs to be made for the betterment of my fellow soldiers. I'm willing to accept that.

Its no worse than killing an animal for food.

[spot]

And you still get to eat it afterwards.

Originally Posted by spot

And you still get to eat it afterwards.

I was trying not to say BBQ in the thread...

[RedGlitter]

I'm gonna leave you with your sentiment Jester because I feel it's irrefutably wrong.
I can't change your mind but no human is worth another living being's life. If you want a practice victim, see how many humans would be willing to "sacrifice" for their fellow man. Not ethical? Mmhmm.

Originally Posted by RedGlitter

I'm gonna leave you with your sentiment Jester because I feel it's irrefutably wrong.
I can't change your mind but no human is worth another living being's life. If you want a practice victim, see how many humans would be willing to "sacrifice" for their fellow man. Not ethical? Mmhmm.

I knew we were gonna disagree here Red. There are folks that do sacrifice themselves for thie fellow man, my lifes has been saved because of it before, its was a willing choice by a fellow soldier to draw fire away from this teamates and he paid for it with his life.

Animals are not equivalent to humans they are here for our enjoyment and pleasure and for our food. Obviously I love animals but I also know thier place in the food chain.

If I can train a young medic better by shooting a goat then I'll be glad to do it because it means one of my men wont die on the battlfield do to an inexperinced medic. If that soldeir chooses to sacrifice himself then thats the choice of a human to love another human all the way.

Animals are not equivalent to humans.

Sorry about the BBQ comment, that was uncalled for.

[Omni_Skittles]

Okay i officially want to start running tests on the members of PETA! sheesh