How To Get To Heaven When You Die

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xfrodobagginsx
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by xfrodobagginsx »

RedGlitter;1236709 wrote: Frodo,

See what I mean? "You should too." "God's way."

I do things God's way. Who are you to question my God or me or tell me what or who to believe in? That is presumptuous at worst and rude at best. Which is exactly my point about christians. Thank you.


We say that because the bible is God's word and God's word says that you MUST accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior to be forgiven. We didn't make that up, God did.
mikeinie
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by mikeinie »

xfrodobagginsx;1245120 wrote: We say that because the bible is God's word and God's word says that you MUST accept Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior to be forgiven. We didn't make that up, God did.


And who told you that? That is only what you were taught as a child. If you were born into another faith you would believe something completely different.
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Omni_Skittles
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by Omni_Skittles »

mikeinie;1245150 wrote: And who told you that? That is only what you were taught as a child. If you were born into another faith you would believe something completely different. But according to his faith, this is the only way... especially if you follow the Bible, There is only one way to God and that's through Christ, not your being a good person, or even if you're a bad person, works don't get you in and not even grace.... after that it's is really just all theology and mumble jumble. But that's the core of Christianity...
Smoke signals ftw!
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Bryn Mawr
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by Bryn Mawr »

Omni_Skittles;1245322 wrote: But according to his faith, this is the only way... especially if you follow the Bible, There is only one way to God and that's through Christ, not your being a good person, or even if you're a bad person, works don't get you in and not even grace.... after that it's is really just all theology and mumble jumble. But that's the core of Christianity...


It's called a self reinforcing belief - because it is believed you find the proof to show that it must be true - self referencing with no outside source of evidence.

As Mike says, if your childhood conditioning is to look for other proof then your belief will be otherwise.

Better to take the data and move to the theory that be given the theory and then search for the data.

Continuing a previous discussion I've had in the Garden. Do you see Christianity as all of the Bible or just the words of Jesus Christ? Does the New Testament supersede the Old or do they both say the same thing?
arobert
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by arobert »

But I don't believe in heaven
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Omni_Skittles
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by Omni_Skittles »

Bryn Mawr;1245344 wrote: It's called a self reinforcing belief - because it is believed you find the proof to show that it must be true - self referencing with no outside source of evidence.

As Mike says, if your childhood conditioning is to look for other proof then your belief will be otherwise.

Better to take the data and move to the theory that be given the theory and then search for the data.

Continuing a previous discussion I've had in the Garden. Do you see Christianity as all of the Bible or just the words of Jesus Christ? Does the New Testament supersede the Old or do they both say the same thing?
I have a lot of interesting questions myself... I believe in both the new and old... I think the new testament is like the fulfillment of the old testament... I wasn't actually raised to believe in anything... in fact if i was raised on something it would be the belief of praying to mother earth, a horn toad and so on... I started studying the bible finally when i turned 15... and ummm Ive read the bible and it really says no other way.... so unless you can refute that then i'm going to have to pwn you.
Smoke signals ftw!
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Bryn Mawr
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by Bryn Mawr »

Omni_Skittles;1245527 wrote: I have a lot of interesting questions myself... I believe in both the new and old... I think the new testament is like the fulfillment of the old testament... I wasn't actually raised to believe in anything... in fact if i was raised on something it would be the belief of praying to mother earth, a horn toad and so on... I started studying the bible finally when i turned 15... and ummm Ive read the bible and it really says no other way.... so unless you can refute that then i'm going to have to pwn you.


If you're going to do that to me :wah: we're going to have to discuss the degree to which external evidence backs up the truth of the Bible and how much you're taking the Bible as self validating :)

It is true because the Bible says it is true is not a closing gambit but a starting point for discussion.
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flopstock
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by flopstock »

The bible is mans out, written by man, for man. Because in spite of everything this Christ fella tried to teach them, they were, after all, human. And so they wrote the rules that got them where they wanted to go. Didn't matter what they were or what they did, they were safe because they knew Christ.



We run into this same concept every day in our lives. Folks who think they can get away with anything because of who they are or who they know. We are outraged and cry foul every time we hear of it.



Yet when it comes to the bible and heaven - it's an acceptable out. Of course it is ......because bottom line, everyone thinks they will need it and so they must believe in it.



I'd rather take my chances that anyone who is really superior, won't expect me to do anything other then try my best to be my best. I don't need anyone looking up to me, thinking I'm special. It's really hard for me to believe that anyone superior to me would be so shallow... nope, that's a mens club thing..:p
I expressly forbid the use of any of my posts anywhere outside of FG (with the exception of the incredibly witty 'get a room already' )posted recently.

Folks who'd like to copy my intellectual work should expect to pay me for it.:-6

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Bryn Mawr
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by Bryn Mawr »

flopstock;1245608 wrote: The bible is mans out, written by man, for man. Because in spite of everything this Christ fella tried to teach them, they were, after all, human. And so they wrote the rules that got them where they wanted to go. Didn't matter what they were or what they did, they were safe because they knew Christ.



We run into this same concept every day in our lives. Folks who think they can get away with anything because of who they are or who they know. We are outraged and cry foul every time we hear of it.



Yet when it comes to the bible and heaven - it's an acceptable out. Of course it is ......because bottom line, everyone thinks they will need it and so they must believe in it.



I'd rather take my chances that anyone who is really superior, won't expect me to do anything other then try my best to be my best. I don't need anyone looking up to me, thinking I'm special. It's really hard for me to believe that anyone superior to me would be so shallow... nope, that's a mens club thing..:p


Isn't that what I just said?

Just phrased one hell of a lot betterer :-6
xfrodobagginsx
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by xfrodobagginsx »

The bible was written by God through 40 men in 3 languages over a 1,500 year period. These men lived in different parts of the world, some were rich, some were poor, some were educated, some were not, most didn't know each other, nor did they have access to the other's writings and yet it fits together as if it were written by one person. It was written by God. It has no errors or contradictions. It is the Word of God. The bible is accurate in matters of Science, History, and all matters of life.

There are countless prophecies which have been predicted and fulfilled perfectly in scripture. Many of these prophecies were written hundreds or even thousands of years before they were fulfilled.

Old Testament Prophecies

Fulfilled by Jesus Christ, Messiah

ALL of these prophesies were made hundreds, sometimes

thousands, of years before Jesus Christ was born. Looking in the face of

how He literally fulfilled them all (plus hundreds more), it is an

impossibility that He is not Messiah, Saviour of the world. The ONLY

person...past, present or future...who could fulfill all these prophecies is

Jesus Christ. See His genealogy starting from faithful Abraham.

Fulfilled Prophecy Tenakh/Hebrew

Scripture New Testament

Micah 5:2 His pre-existence John 1:1, 14

Genesis 3:15 Born of the seed of a woman Matthew 1:18

Genesis 12:3 Of the seed of Abraham Matthew 1:1-16

Genesis 12:3 All nations blessed by Abraham's seed Matthew 8:5, 10

Genesis 22:8 God would provide Himself a Lamb as an offering John 1:29

Genesis 49:10 From the tribe of Judah Matthew 1:1-3

Isaiah 9:6-7 Heir to the throne of David Matthew 1:1

Isaiah 9:6 Called "The mighty God, The everlasting Father" Matthew 1:23

Micah 5:2 Born in Bethlehem Matthew 2:1

Isaiah 7:14 Born of a virgin Matthew 1:18

Isaiah 7:14 His name called Immanuel, "God with us" Matthew 1:23

Psalm 2:7 Declared to be the Son of God Matthew 3:17

Malachi 4:5-6 His messenger before Him in spirit of Elijah Luke 1:17

Malachi 3:1 Preceded by a messenger to prepare His way Matthew 11:7-11

Isaiah 40:3 Messenger crying "Prepare ye the way of the Lord" Matthew 3:3

Deuteronomy 18:15 Would be a Prophet of the children of Israel Matthew 2:15

Hosea 11:1 Called out of Egypt Matthew 2:15

Jeremiah 31:15 Slaughter of the children Matthew2:18

Judges 13:5;Amos 2:11;Lam. 4:7 Would be a Nazarene Matthew 2:23

Isaiah 9:1-2 Brought light to Zabulon & Nephthalm, Galilee of the Gentiles Matthew 4:15

Psalm 72:10 Presented with gifts Matthew 2:1, 11

Isaiah 53:3 Rejected by His own Matthew 21:42; Mark 8:31,12:10; Luke 9:22,17:25 Psalm 118:22-23;

Isaiah 28:16He is the stone which the builders rejected which became the headstone Matthew 21:42; IPeter 2:7

Isaiah 8:14-15 A stone of stumbling to Israel I Peter 2:8

Zechariah 9:9 He entered Jerusalem as a king riding on an ass Matthew 21:5

Psalms 41:9 Betrayed by a friend John 13:21

Zechariah 11:12 Sold for 30 pieces of silver Matthew 26:15; Luke 22:5

Zechariah 11:12 The 30 pieces of silver given for the potter's field Matthew 27:9-10

Zechariah 11:13 The 30 pieces of silver thrown in the temple Matthew 27:5

Zechariah 13:7 Forsaken by His disciples Matthew 26:56

Psalm 35:11 Accused by false witnesses Matthew 26:60

Isaiah 53:7 Silent to accusations Matthew 27:14

Isaiah 35:5-6 Isaiah 29:18 Heal blind/deaf/lame/dumb; Matthew 11:5

Isaiah 61:Preached to the poor/brokenhearted/captives 1 Matthew 11:5

Micah 7:6 Came to bring a sword, not peace Matthew 10:34-35

Isaiah 53:4 He bore our sickness Matthew 8:16-17

Isaiah 50:6, 53:5 Spat upon, smitten and scourged Matthew 27:26, 30

Micah 5:1 Smitten on the cheek Matthew 27:30

Psalm 35:19 Hated without a cause Matthew 27:23

Isaiah 53:5 The sacrificial lamb John 1:29

Isaiah 42:6;Jeremiah 31:31-34Given for a covenant Romans 11:27/Galatians 3:17, 4:24/Hebrews 8:6, 8, 10; 10:16, 29; 12:24; 13:20

Isaiah 42:2-3 Would not strive or cry Mark 7:36

Isaiah 6:9-10 People would hear not and see not Matthew 13:14-15

Isaiah 29:13 People trust in traditions of men Matthew 15:9

Isaiah 29:13 People give God lip service Matthew 15:8

Isaiah 42:1 God delights in Him Matthew 3:17, 17:5

Isaiah 53:5 Wounded for our sins John 6:51

Isaiah 53:10-12 He bore the sins of many Mark 10:45

Daniel 9:26 Messiah not killed for Himself Matthew 20:28

Isaiah 55:5, 60:3,65:1; Malachi1:11;II Samuel 22:44-45; Psalm 2:7-8Gentiles flock to Him

Matthew 8:10

Isaiah 53:12 Crucified with criminals Matthew 27:35

Zechariah 12:10; His body was pierced Ps. 22:16 John 20:25, 27

Psalm 22:16 Thirsty during execution John 19:28

Psalm 69:21 Given vinegar and gall for thirst Matthew 27:34

Psalm 22:18 Soldiers gambled for his garment Matthew 27:35

Psalm 22:7-8 People mocked, "He trusted in God, let Him deliver him!" Matthew 27:43

Psalm 22:17 People sat there looking at Him Matthew 27:36

Psalm 22:1 Cried, "My God, my God why hast thou forsaken me?" Matthew 27:46

Amos 8:9 Darkness over the land Matthew 27:45

Psalm 34:20, Numbers 9:12 No bones broken John 19:33-36

Zechariah 12:10 Side pierced John 19:34

Isaiah 53:9 Buried with the rich Matthew 27:57, 60

Psalm 16:10-11; 49:15 Resurrected from the dead Mark 16:6

Psalm 110:4 Priest after the order of Melchizedek Hebrews 5:5-6; 6:20; 7:15-17

Psalm 68:18 Ascended to right hand of God Luke 24:51

Psalm 110:1 The LORD said unto Him, "Sit thou at my right hand, until I make

thine enemies thy footstool Matt 22:44; Mark 12:36;, 16:19; Luke 20:42-43;

Acts 2:34-35; Hebrews 1:13

His coming glory Malachi 3:2-3 Luke 3:17

324 Messianic Prophecies

Gen. 3:15.....He will bruise Satan's head.....Heb. 2:14, 1 Jn. 3:18

Gen. 5:24....The bodily ascension to heaven illustrated....Mk. 6:19

Gen. 9:26,27...The God of Shem will be the Son of Shem...Lu.

3:36

Gen. 12:3...As Abraham's seed,will bless all nations...Acts.

3:25,26

Gen. 12:7...The Promise made to Abraham's Seed...Gal. 3:16

Gen. 14:18...A priest after Melchizedek...Heb. 6:20

Gen. 14:18........A King also........Heb. 7:2

Gen. 14:18...The Last Supper foreshadowed...Mt. 26:26-29

Gen. 17:19.......The Seed of Isaac.......Rom. 9:7

Gen. 22:8...The Lamb of God promised...Jn. 1:29

Gen. 22:18...As Isaac's seed, will bless all nations...Gal. 3:16

Gen.26:2-5..The Seed of Isaac promised as the

Redeemer..Heb.11:18

Gen. 49:10...The time of His coming...Lu. 2:1-7; Gal. 4:4

Gen. 49:10.......The Seed of Judah.......Lu. 3:33

Gen. 49:10......Called Shiloh or One Sent......Jn. 17:3

Gen. 49:10...To come before Judah lost identity...Jn. 11:47-52

Gen. 49:10...To Him shall the obedience of the people be...Jn.

10:16

Ex. 3:13,14........The Great "I Am".......Jn. 4:26

Ex. 12:5...A Lamb without blemish...1 Pet. 1:19

Ex. 12:13...The blood of the Lamb saves from wrath...Rom. 5:8

Ex. 12:21-27...Christ is our Passover...1 Cor. 5;7

Ex. 12:46...Not a bone of the Lamb to be broken...Jn. 19:31-36

Ex. 15:2...His exaltation predicted as Yeshua...Acts 7:55,56

Ex. 15:11...His Character-Holiness...Luke 1:35; Acts 4:27

Ex. 17:6...The Spiritual Rock of Israel...1 Cor. 10;4

Ex. 33:19...His Character-Merciful...Lu. 1:72

Lev.14:11..The leper cleansed-Sign to priesthood..Lu.5:12-14;

Acts 6:7

Lev.16:15-17...Prefigures Christ's once-for-all death...Heb. 9:7-14

Lev.16:27...Suffering outside the Camp...Mt. 27:33; Heb. 13:11,

12

Lev.17:11...The Blood-the life of the flesh...Mt. 26;28; Mk. 10:45

Lev.17:11...It is the blood that makes atonement...1 Jn. 3:14-18

Lev.23:36-37...The Drink-offering: "If any man thirst." ..Jn.

19:31-36

Num. 9:12...Not a bone of Him broken...John 19:31-36

Num. 21:9...The serpent on a pole-Christ lifted up...Jn. 3:14-18

Num. 24:17...Time: "I shall see him, but not now."...Gal. 4:4

Deut. 18:15..."This is of a truth that prophet."...Jn. 6:14

Deut. 18:15-16..."Had ye believed Moses, ye would believe

me."...Jn. 5:45-47

Deut. 18:18...Sent by the Father to speak His word...Jn. 8:28, 29

Deut. 18:19...Whoever will not hear must bear his sin...Jn. 12:15,

Deut. 21:23...Cursed is he that hangs on a tree...Gal. 3:10-13

Ruth 4:4-9...Christ, our kinsman, has redeemed us...Eph. 1:3-7

1 Sam. 2:10...Shall be an anointed King to the Lord...Mt. 28:18;

Jn. 12:15

2 Sam. 7:12...David's Seed...Mt. 1:1

2 Sam. 7:14a...The Son of God... Lu. 1:32

2 Sam. 7:16...David's house established forever...Lu. 3:31; Rev.

22:16

2 Ki. 2:11...The bodily ascension to heaven illustrated...Lu. 24:51

1 Chr. 17:11...David's Seed...Mt. 1:1; 9:27

1 Chr. 17:12, 13a...To reign on David's throne forever...Lu. 1:32,

33

1 Chr. 17:13a..."I will be His Father, He...my Son."...Heb. 1:5

Job 19:23-27...The Resurrection predicted...Jn. 5:24-29

Psa. 2:1-3...The enmity of kings foreordained...Acts 4:25-28

Psa. 2:2...To own the title, Anointed (Christ)...Acts 2:36

Ps. 2:6...His Character-Holiness...Jn. 8:46; Rev. 3:7

Ps. 2:6...To own the title King...Mt. 2:2

Ps. 2:7...Declared the Beloved Son...Mt. 3;17

Psa. 2:7, 8...The Crucifixion and Resurrection intimated...Acts

13:29-33

Psa. 2:12...Life comes through faith in Him...Jn. 20:31

Psa. 8:2...The mouths of babes perfect His praise...Mt. 21:16

Psa. 8:5, 6...His humiliation and exaltation...Lu. 24:50-53; 1 Cor.

15:27

Psa. 16:10...Was not to see corruption...Acts 2:31

Psa. 16:9-11...Was to arise from the dead...Jn. 20:9

Psa. 17;15...The resurrection predicted...Lu. 24:6

Psa. 22:1...Forsaken because of sins of others...2 Cor. 5:21

Psa. 22:1...Words spoken from Calvary, "My God..." Mk.

15:34

Psa. 22:2...Darkness upon Calvary...Mt. 27:45

Psa. 22:7...They shoot out the lip and shake the head...Mt.

27:39

Psa. 22:8.."He trusted in God, let Him deliver Him"...Mt.

27:43

Psa. 22:9......Born the Saviour......Lu. 2:7

Psa. 22:14...Died of a broken (ruptured)heart...Jn. 19:34

Psa. 22:14,15...Suffered agony on Calvary...Mk. 15:34-37

Psa. 22:15........He thirsted........Jn. 19:28

Psa. 22:16...They pierced His hands and His feet....Jn.

19:34,37;20:27

Psa. 22:17,18...Stripped Him before the stares of men...Lu.

23:34,35

Psa. 22:18.....They parted His garments.....Jn. 19:23,24

Psa. 22:20,21...He committed Himself to God...Lu.23:46

Psa. 22:20,21..Satanic power bruising the Redeemer's

heel..Heb. 2:14

Psa. 22:22.....His Resurrection declared.....Jn. 20:17

Psa. 22:27...He shall be the governor of the nations...Col 1:16

Psa. 22:31......"It is finished"......Jn. 19:30

Psa. 23:1...."I am the Good Shephard"....Jn. 10:11

Psa. 24:3......His exaltation predicted......Acts 1:11; Phil. 2:9

Psa. 30:3......His resurrection predicted......Acts 2:32

Psa. 31:5..."Into thy hands I commit my spirit"...Lu. 23:46

Psa. 31:11...His acquaintances fled from Him...Mk. 14:50

Psa. 31:13...They took counsel to put Him to death...Jn. 11:53

Psa. 31:14,15..." He trusted in God, let Him deliver him"...Mt.

27:43

Psa. 34:20.....Not a bone of Him broken.....Jn 19:31-36

Psa. 35:11....False witnesses rose up against Him....Mt. 26:59

Psa. 35:19...He was hated without a cause...Jn. 15:25

Psa. 38:11.....His friends stood afar off.....Lu. 23:49

Psa. 40:2-5...The joy of His resurrection predicted...Jn. 20:20

Psa. 40:6-8....His delight-the will of the Father....Jn. 4:34

Psa. 40:9....He was to preach the Righteousness in Israel....Mt.

4:17

Psa. 40:14...Confronted by adversaries in the Garden...Jn. 18:4-6

Psa. 41:9.....Betrayed by a familiar friend.....Jn. 13:18

Psa. 45:2...Words of Grace come from His lips...Lu. 4:22

Psa. 45:6...To own the title, God or Elohim...Heb. 1:8

Psa. 45:7...A special anointing by the Holy Spirit...Mt.3:16;

Heb.1:9

Psa. 45:7,8...Called the Christ (Messiah or Anointed)...Lu. 2:11

Psa. 55:12-14...Betrayed by a friend, not an enemy...Jn. 13:18

Psa. 55:15...Unrepentant death of the Betrayer...Mt. 27:3-5; Acts

1:16-19

Psa. 68:18...To give gifts to men...Eph. 4:7-16

Psa. 68:18...Ascended into Heaven...Lu. 24:51

Psa. 69:4...Hated without a cause...Jn. 15:25

Psa. 69:8...A stranger to own brethren...Lu. 8;20,21

Psa. 69:9...Zealous for the Lord's House...Jn. 2:17

Psa. 69:14-20...Messiah's anguish of soul before crucifixion...Mt.

26:36-45

Psa. 69:20..."My soul is exceeding sorrowful."...Mt. 26:38

Psa. 69:21...Given vinegar in thirst...Mt. 27:34

Psa. 69:26...The Saviour given and smitten by God...Jn. 17:4;

18:11

Psa. 72:10,11...Great persons were to visit Him...Mt. 2:1-11

Psa. 72:16...The corn of wheat to fall into the Ground...Jn. 12:24

Psa. 72:17...His name, Yinon, will produce offspring...Jn. 1:12,13

Psa. 72:17...All nations shall be blessed by Him...Acts 2:11,12,41

Psa. 78:1.2...He would teach in parables...Mt. 13:34-35

Psa. 78:2b...To speak the Wisdom of God with authority...Mt.

7:29

Psa. 88:8...They stood afar off and watched...Lu. 23:49

Psa. 89:27...Emmanuel to be higher than earthly kings...Lu.

1:32,33

Psa. 89:35-37...David's Seed, throne, kingdom endure

forever...Lu. 1:32,33

Psa. 89:36-37...His character-Faithfulness...Rev. 1:5

Psa. 90:2...He is from everlasting (Micah 5:2)...Jn. 1:1

Psa. 91:11,12...Identified as Messianic; used to tempt Christ...Lu.

4;10,11

Psa. 97:9...His exaltation predicted...Acts 1:11;Eph. 1:20

Psa. 100:5...His character-Goodness...Mt. 19:16,17

Psa. 102:1-11...The Suffering and Reproach of Calvary...Jn.

21:16-30

Psa. 102:25-27...Messiah is the Preexistent Son...Heb. 1:10-12

Psa. 109:25...Ridiculed...Mt. 27:39

Psa. 110:1...Son of David...Mt. 22:43

Psa. 110:1...To ascend to the right-hand of the Father...Mk.16:19

Psa. 110:1...David's son called Lord...Mt. 22:44,45

Psa. 110:4...A priest after Melchizedek's order...Heb. 6:20

Psa. 112:4...His character-Compassionate, Gracious, et al... Mt.

9;36

Psa. 118:17,18...Messiah's Resurrection assured...Lu. 24:5-7;1

Cor. 15:20

Psa. 118:22,23...The rejected stone is Head of the corner...Mt.

21:42,43

Psa. 118:26a...The Blessed One presented to Israel...Mt. 21:9

Psa. 118:26b...To come while Temple standing...Mt. 21;12-15

Psa. 132:11...The Seed of David(the fruit of His Body)...Lu. 1:32

Psa. 138:1-6...The supremacy of David's Seed amazes kings... Mt.

2:2-6

Psa. 147:3,6...The earthly ministry of Christ described...Lu. 4:18

Psa. 1:23...He will send the Spirit of God... Jn. 16;7

Song. 5;16...The altogether lovely One...Jn. 1:17

Isa. 6:1...When Isaiah saw His glory... Jn. 12:40-41

Isa. 6:9-10...Parables fall on deaf ears...Mt. 13:13-15

Isa. 6:9-12...Blinded to Christ and deaf to His words...Acts. 28:23-

29

Isa. 7:14...To be born of a virgin...Lu. 1:35

Isa. 7:14...To be Emmanuel-God with us... Mt. 1:18-23

Isa. 8:8...Called Emmanuel...Mt. 28:20

Isa. 8:14...A stone of stumbling, a Rock of offense... 1 Pet. 2:8

Isa. 9:1,2...His ministry to begin in Galilee...Mt. 4:12-17

Isa. 9:6...A child born-Humanity...Lu. 1:31

Isa. 9:6...A Son given-Deity...Lu. 1:32; Jn. 1;14; 1 Tim. 3:16

Isa. 9:6...Declared to be the Son of God with power... Rom. 1:3,4

Isa. 9:6...The Wonderful One, Peleh...Lu. 4:22

Isa. 9:6...The Counsellor, Yaatz...Mt. 13:54

Isa. 9:6...The Mighty God, El Gibor...Mt. 11:20

Isa. 9:6...The Everlasting Father, Avi Adth...Jn. 8:58

Isa. 9:6...The Prince of Peace, Sar Shalom...Jn . 16:33

Isa. 9:7...To establish an everlasting kingdom...Lu. 1:32-33

Isa. 9:7...His Character-Just...Jn. 5:30

Isa. 9:7...No end to his Government, Throne, and Peace...Lu.

1:32-33

Isa. 11:1...Called a Nazarene-the Branch, Netzer...Mt. 2:23

Isa. 11:1...A rod out of Jesse-Son of Jesse...Lu. 3:23,32

Isa. 11:2...The anointed One by the Spirit...Mt. 3;16,17

Isa. 11:2...His Character-Wisdom, Understanding, et al....Jn. 4:4-

26

Isa. 11:4...His Character-Truth...Jn. 14:6

Isa. 11:10...The Gentiles seek Him...Jn. 12:18-21

Isa. 12:2...Called Jesus-Yeshua...Mt. 1:21

Isa. 25:8...The Resurrection predicted...I Cor. 15:54

Isa. 26:19...His power of Resurrection predicted...Jn. 11:43,44

Isa. 28:16...The Messiah is the precious corner stone...Acts

4:11,12

Isa. 29:13...He indicated hypocritical obedience to His Word...Mt.

15:7-9

Isa. 29:14...The wise are confounded by the Word...I Cor. 1:18-31

Isa. 32:2...A Refuge-A man shall be a hiding place...Mt. 23:37

Isa. 35:4...He will come and save you...Mt. 1:21

Isa. 35:5...To have a ministry of miracles...Mt. 11:4-6

Isa. 40:3,4...Preceded by forerunner...Jn. 1:23

Isa. 40:9..."Behold your God."...Jn. 1:36;19:14

Isa. 40:11...A shepherd-compassionatelife-giver...Jn. 10:10-18

Isa. 42:1-4...The Servant-as a faithful, patient redeemer...

Mt.12:18-21

Isa. 42:2...Meek and lowly... Mt. 11:28-30

Isa. 42:3...He brings hope for the hopeless... Jn. 4

Isa. 42:4...The nations shall wait on His teachings... Jn. 12:20-26

Isa. 42:6...The Light (salvation) of the Gentiles...Lu. 2:32

Isa. 42:1,6...His is a Worldwide compassion... Mt. 28:19,20

Isa. 42:7...Blind eyes opened... Jn. 9:25-38

Isa. 43:11...He is the only Saviour... Acts. 4:12

Isa. 44:3...He will send the Spirit of God... Jn. 16:7,13

Isa. 45:23...He will be the Judge... Jn. 5:22;Rom. 14:11

Isa. 48:12...The First and the Last...Jn. 1:30;Rev. 1:8,17

Isa. 48:17...He came as a Teacher...Jn. 3:2

Isa. 49:1...Called from the womb-His humanity...Mt. 1:18

Isa. 49:5...A Servant from the womb...Lu. 1:31;Phil. 2:7

Isa. 49:6...He is Salvation for Israel...Lu. 2:29-32

Isa. 49:6...He is the Light of the Gentiles...Acts 13:47

Isa. 49:6...He is Salvation unto the ends of the earth... Acts 15:7-

18

Isa. 49:7...He is despised of the Nation... Jn. 8:48-49

Isa. 50:3...Heaven is clothed in black at His humiliation... Lu.

23:44,45

Isa. 50:4...He is a learned counsellor for the weary... Mt. 11:28,29

Isa. 50:5...The Servant bound willingly to obedience... Mt. 26:39

Isa. 50:6a..."I gave my back to the smiters."... Mt. 27:26

Isa. 50:6b...He was smitten on the cheeks... Mt. 26:67

Isa. 50:6c...He was spat upon... Mt. 27:30

Isa. 52:7...To publish good tidings of peace... Lu. 4:14,15

Isa. 52:13...The Servant exalted...Acts 1:8-11; Eph. 1:19-22

Isa. 52:13...Behold, My Servant... Mt. 17:5; Phil. 2:5-8

Isa. 52:14...The Servant shockingly abused... Lu. 18:31-34; Mt.

26:67,68

Isa. 52:15...Nations startled by message of the Servant... Rom.

15:18-21

Isa. 52:15...His blood shed to make atonement for all... Rev. 1:5

Isa. 53:1...His people would not believe Him... Jn. 12:37-38

Isa. 53:2a...He would grow up in a poor family.... Lu. 2:7

Isa. 53:2b...Appearance of an ordinary man... Phil. 2:7-8

Isa. 53:3a...Despised.... Lu. 4:28-29

Isa. 53:3b...Rejected... Mt. 27:21-23

Isa. 53:3c...Great sorrow and grief... Lu. 19:41-42

Isa. 53:3d...Men hide from being associated with Him... Mk.

14:50-52

Isa. 53:4a...He would have a healing ministry... Lu. 6:17-19

Isa. 53:4b...He would bear the sins of the world... 1 Pet. 2:24

Isa. 53:4c...Thought to be cursed by God... Mt. 27:41-43

Isa. 53:5a...Bears penalty for mankind's transgressions... Lu. 23:33

Isa. 53:5b...His sacrifice would provide peace between man and

God... Col. 1:20

Isa. 53:5c...His back would be whipped... Mt. 27:26

Isa. 53:6a...He would be the sin-bearer for all mankind...Gal. 1:4

Isa. 53:6b...God's will that He bear sin for all mankind... 1 Jn.

4:10

Isa. 53:7a...Oppressed and afflicted... Mt. 27:27-31

Isa. 53:7b...Silent before his accusers... Mt. 27:12-14

Isa. 53:7c...Sacrificial lamb... Jn. 1:29

Isa. 53:8a...Confined and persecuted... Mt. 26:47-27:31

Isa. 53:8b...He would be judged... Jn. 18:13-22

Isa. 53:8c...Killed.... Mt. 27:35

Isa. 53:8d...Dies for the sins of the world... 1 Jn. 2:2

Isa. 53:9a...Buried in a rich man's grave... Mt. 27:57

Isa. 53:9b...Innocent and had done no violence... Mk. 15:3

Isa. 53:9c...No deceit in his mouth... Jn. 18:38

Isa. 53:10a...God's will that He die for mankind... Jn. 18:11

Isa. 53:10b...An offering for sin... Mt. 20:28

Isa. 53:10c...Resurrected and live forever.... Mk. 16:16

Isa. 53:10d...He would prosper... Jn. 17:1-5

Isa. 53:11a...God fully satisfied with His suffering... Jn. 12:27

Isa. 53:11b...God's servant... Rom. 5:18-19

Isa. 53:11c...He would justify man before God... Rom. 5:8-9

Isa. 53:11d...The sin-bearer for all mankind... Heb. 9:28

Isa. 53:12a...Exalted by God because of his sacrifice... Mt. 28:18

Isa. 53:12b...He would give up his life to save mankind... Lu.

23:46

Isa. 53:12c...Grouped with criminals... Lu. 23:32

Isa. 53:12d...Sin-bearer for all mankind... 2 Cor. 5:21

Isa. 53:12e...Intercede to God in behalf of mankind... Lu. 23:34

Isa. 55:3...Resurrected by God... Acts 13:34

Isa. 55:4...A witness... Jn. 18:37

Isa. 59:15-16a...He would come to provide salvation... Jn. 6:40

Isa. 59:15-16b...Intercessor between man and God... Mt. 10:32

Isa. 59:20...He would come to Zion as their Redeemer... Lu. 2:38

Isa. 61:1-2a...The Spirit of God upon him... Mt. 3:16-17

Isa. 61:1-2b...The Messiah would preach the good news... Lu.

4:17-21

Isa. 61:1-2c...Provide freedom from the bondage of sin and

death... Jn. 8:31-32

Isa. 61:1-2...Proclaim a period of grace... Jn. 5:24

Jer.23:5-6a...Descendant of David...Lu. 3:23-31

Jer. 23:5-6b...The Messiah would be God... Jn. 13:13

Jer. 23:5-6c...The Messiah would be both God and Man... 1 Tim.

3:16

Jer. 31:22...Born of a virgin... Mt. 1:18-20

Jer. 31:31...The Messiah would be the new covenant... Mt. 26:28

Jer. 33:14-15...Descendant of David... Lu. 3:23-31

Eze.17:22-24...Descendant of David... Lk. 3:23-31

Eze.34:23-24...Descendant of David... Mt. 1:1

Dan. 7:13-14a...He would ascend into heaven... Acts 1:9-11

Dan. 7:13-14b...Highly exalted... Eph. 1:20-22

Dan. 7:13-14c...His dominion would be everlasting... Lu. 1:31-33

Dan. 9:24a...To make an end to sins... Gal. 1:3-5

Dan. 9:24b...He would be holy... Lu. 1:35

Dan. 9:25...Announced to his people 483 years, to the exact day,

after the decree to rebuild the city of Jerusalem... Jn. 12:12-13

Dan. 9:26a...Killed... Mt. 27:35

Dan. 9:26b...Die for the sins of the world... Heb. 2:9

Dan. 9:26c...Killed before the destruction of the temple... Mt.

27:50-51

Dan. 10:5-6...Messiah in a glorified state... Rev. 1:13-16

Hos. 13:14...He would defeat death... 1 Cor. 15:55-57

Joel 2:32...Offer salvation to all mankind... Rom. 10:12-13

Mic. 5:2a...Born in Bethlehem... Mt. 2:1-2

Mic. 5:2b...God's servant... Jn. 15:10

Mic. 5:2c...From everlasting... Jn. 8:58

Hag. 2:6-9...He would visit the second Temple... Lu. 2:27-32

Hag. 2:23...Descendant of Zerubbabel... Lu. 3:23-27

Zech. 3:8...God's servant... Jn. 17:4

Zech. 6:12-13...Priest and King... Heb. 8:1

Zech. 9:9a...Greeted with rejoicing in Jerusalem... Mt. 21:8-10

Zech. 9:9b...Beheld as King... Jn. 12:12-13

Zech. 9:9c...The Messiah would be just... Jn. 5:30

Zech. 9:9d...The Messiah would bring salvation... Luke 19:10

Zech. 9:9e...The Messiah would be humble... Mt. 11:29

Zech. 9:9f...Presented to Jerusalem riding on a donkey... Mt. 21:6-

9

Zech. 10:4...The cornerstone... Eph. 2:20

Zech. 11:4-6a...At His coming, Israel to have unfit leaders... Mt.

23:1-4

Zech. 11:4-6b...Rejection causes God to remove His protection..

Lu. 19:41-44

Zech. 11:4-6c...Rejected in favor of another king... Jn. 19:13-15

Zech. 11:7...Ministry to "poor," the believing remnant... Mt. 9:35-

36

Zech. 11:8a...Unbelief forces Messiah to reject them... Mt. 23:33

Zech. 11:8b...Despised... Mt. 27:20

Zech. 11:9...Stops ministering to the those who rejected Him...

Mt. 13:10-11

Zech. 11:10-11a...Rejection causes God to remove protection...

Lu. 19:41-44

Zech. 11:10-11b...The Messiah would be God... Jn. 14:7

Zech. 11:12-13a...Betrayed for thirty pieces of silver... Mt. 26:14-

15

Zech. 11:12-13b...Rejected... Mt. 26:14-15

Zech. 11:12-13c...Thirty pieces of silver thrown into the house of

the Lord... Mt. 27:3-5

Zech. 11:12-13d...The Messiah would be God... Jn. 12:45

Zech. 12:10a...The Messiah's body would be pierced... Jn. 19:34-

37

Zech. 12:10b...The Messiah would be both God and man... Jn.

10:30

Zech. 12:10c...The Messiah would be rejected... Jn. 1:11

Zech. 13:7a...God's will He die for mankind... Jn. 18:11

Zech. 13:7b...A violent death... Mt. 27:35

Zech. 13:7c...Both God and man.. Jn. 14:9

Zech. 13:7d...Israel scattered as a result of rejecting Him... Mt.

26:31-56

Mal. 3:1a...Messenger to prepare the way for Messiah... Mt. 11:10

Mal. 3:1b...Sudden appearance at the temple... Mk. 11:15-16

Mal. 3:1c...Messenger of the new covenant... Lu. 4:43

Mal. 4:5...Forerunner in the spirit of Elijah... Mt. 3:1-2

Mal. 4:6...Forerunner would turn many to righteousness... Lu.1:16-17
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

THIS VIDEO WILL EXPLAIN HOW THE NEW TESTIMENT OF THE BIBLE WAS CONONIZED (CAME TO BE):

WHOLE VIDEO:

Video - Video Details and Comments - tangle.com
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Post by Bryn Mawr »

xfrodobagginsx;1246268 wrote: The bible was written by God through 40 men in 3 languages over a 1,500 year period. These men lived in different parts of the world, some were rich, some were poor, some were educated, some were not, most didn't know each other, nor did they have access to the other's writings and yet it fits together as if it were written by one person. It was written by God. It has no errors or contradictions. It is the Word of God. The bible is accurate in matters of Science, History, and all matters of life.

There are countless prophecies which have been predicted and fulfilled perfectly in scripture. Many of these prophecies were written hundreds or even thousands of years before they were fulfilled.




That is your reading of the text - a very uncritical one from my point of view.

As I read the text given it appears to be in at least three "voices" and contradicts itself quite frequently.
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Post by Omni_Skittles »

Bryn Mawr;1245551 wrote: If you're going to do that to me :wah: we're going to have to discuss the degree to which external evidence backs up the truth of the Bible and how much you're taking the Bible as self validating :)

It is true because the Bible says it is true is not a closing gambit but a starting point for discussion.Well, that's the thing. I have thoughts in my mind but it's hard for me to get them to sound coherent. but i'll try.... I think you are valid in saying that... I would expect the same from anyone else, so not why myself as well. Here's the thing, I've accepted Christ into my life, that's what makes me a Christian. After that, I've then decided to accept the canon as God's word, I believe the bible is the inspired word of God written by men with the help of God's holy spirit. which i guess is funny but i just know that God is real. I can't exactly expect you to understand that, but I'm still young and i'm still learning and studying and one day i guess when i'm dead we'll know for sure who was right or wrong... :confused:
Smoke signals ftw!
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Post by Bryn Mawr »

Omni_Skittles;1246423 wrote: Well, that's the thing. I have thoughts in my mind but it's hard for me to get them to sound coherent. but i'll try.... I think you are valid in saying that... I would expect the same from anyone else, so not why myself as well. Here's the thing, I've accepted Christ into my life, that's what makes me a Christian. After that, I've then decided to accept the canon as God's word, I believe the bible is the inspired word of God written by men with the help of God's holy spirit. which i guess is funny but i just know that God is real. I can't exactly expect you to understand that, but I'm still young and i'm still learning and studying and one day i guess when i'm dead we'll know for sure who was right or wrong... :confused:


No problem at all with that - you recognise that your belief is justified by faith alone which is a matter between you and your God rather than a universal truth.

I have a problem with those who insist that their truth must also be my truth and try to dictate my behaviour by their reading of the Bible - but that is a totally different subject.
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Post by Omni_Skittles »

Bryn Mawr;1246443 wrote: No problem at all with that - you recognise that your belief is justified by faith alone which is a matter between you and your God rather than a universal truth.

I have a problem with those who insist that their truth must also be my truth and try to dictate my behaviour by their reading of the Bible - but that is a totally different subject.Yea, see that's something i learned at my school. I can't expect non-christians to live up to the standards of the Bible or demand them to accept it as truth let alone follow it's words... I do and i live as the Bible says because i have accepted the Bible as truth. Someday maybe you will or won't... I just have to accept that...
Smoke signals ftw!
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Post by Bryn Mawr »

Omni_Skittles;1246594 wrote: Yea, see that's something i learned at my school. I can't expect non-christians to live up to the standards of the Bible or demand them to accept it as truth let alone follow it's words... I do and i live as the Bible says because i have accepted the Bible as truth. Someday maybe you will or won't... I just have to accept that...


Don't get me wrong, I try my very best to live my life by the teachings of Christ as given in the New Testament - I just do not accept that anyone has the right to tell me how to believe or how to behave based on their reading of their scripture whether that be the Bible or any other.
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

THIS VIDEO WILL EXPLAIN HOW THE NEW TESTIMENT OF THE BIBLE WAS CANONIZED (CAME TO BE):

WHOLE VIDEO:

Video - Video Details and Comments - tangle.com
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

What happened to the soul winners?
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

.................................................
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

Please read this first post.
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

Why is your heart so hardened against God?
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Post by Nomad »



This all began with the story of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden. God created them perfect, there was no death or sorrow. God told them not to eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. They disobeyed God and as a result, sin entered into the world. The pain which this world sees is the result of sin.




This is the part where it starts going down hill for me.
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

Do you believe the bible is God's word?
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Post by Liling »

Heaven and hell looks so different between different religions. I don't know which one I will be end up with.
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

The bible is God's word. Why not believe the bible?
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

Isn't this a place for Seniors?
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Post by oanadoledo »

Only if i will meet my grandmother there
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

If your grandmother accepted Jesus Christ in her heart, she will be there.
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

Please read this first post.
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

:-6



:driving: HIGHWAY TO HEAVEN :driving:

:D
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Post by guppy »

i live in the world of technology when my first thought was....garmin, gps....:yh_rotfl
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Post by Ahso! »

xfrodobagginsx;1268859 wrote: The bible is God's word. Why not believe the bible?I'll believe the bible when God shows itself. Deal?
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



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Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

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Post by Nomad »

My wifes cat isnt going to heaven. Not a chance. Shes going straight to kitty hell. :mad:
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Post by hoppy »

Ahso!;1286582 wrote: I'll believe the bible when God shows itself. Deal?


Might be too late then.:)
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Post by Ahso! »

hoppy;1287952 wrote: Might be too late then.:)Some years ago I contacted an old friend from my ultra religious daze. We got to talking about God and stuff because he was still very religious. I told him I no longer believed in God and of course he said that was too bad because "why not?, if I'm, meaning he, is wrong what does he lose?, but if I'm wrong I lose eternity." I informed him I saw it as if he is wrong he has wasted an entire life on a lie, chasing after a ghost.

But lately I've been thinking: what part of the life we live isn't a lie?
“Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities,”

Voltaire



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Be the wave that I am and then

Sink back into the ocean

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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

I know God and I know that He exists. There is no doubt in my mind. You need that relationship with Him that all born again believers know. You can have that by simply asking God for it and believing and trusting in Jesus Christ for salvation.
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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

:guitarist:-6:
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Post by beowulf »

Ahso!;1286582 wrote: I'll believe the bible when God shows itself. Deal?


:rolleyes:

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(/)

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Post by xfrodobagginsx »

Please read this first post if you haven't yet and pray that prayer at the bottom of it to God from your heart
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Post by beowulf »

xfrodobagginsx;1305010 wrote: Please read this first post if you haven't yet and pray that prayer at the bottom of it to God from your heart


ffs!.....god does not exist.....i can not believe in him till he appears in front of me and says 'hello.....im God......how you doing?'

i have had so much **** in the last few years i can not believe some non existant entity cares about me.....ive gone thro serious illness, ive seen those i hold most precious die in my arms or end up in hospital on expecting to die.........ive experienced extreme hard ship and suffered deprssion becouse of it

if God cares about us he has a pretty shitty way of showing it to me!

so please do not try and tell me that he does care or that you know what is best for me

if you want to believe then fine,.............go and believe but do not preach to me or try and tell me that i need to believe.

i dont care

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Post by fuzzywuzzy »

with all other opinions aside I think you hit the nail on the head , spot

We've just been fly-posted by the Taliban of Christianity.

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Post by G#Gill »

I do not tolerate being preached at, at my front door. I certainly do not tolerate being preached at on the internet. Yes I did read a couple of lines of the OP, and that was enough. Mr. Spot has presented a long list of posts and websites by this person, and I would consider this person as a spammer!
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Post by YZGI »

Ahso!;1286582 wrote: I'll believe the bible when God shows itself. Deal?


beowulf;1305045 wrote: ffs!.....god does not exist.....i can not believe in him till he appears in front of me and says 'hello.....im God......how you doing?'



i have had so much **** in the last few years i can not believe some non existant entity cares about me.....ive gone thro serious illness, ive seen those i hold most precious die in my arms or end up in hospital on expecting to die.........ive experienced extreme hard ship and suffered deprssion becouse of it



if God cares about us he has a pretty shitty way of showing it to me!



so please do not try and tell me that he does care or that you know what is best for me



if you want to believe then fine,.............go and believe but do not preach to me or try and tell me that i need to believe.



i dont care


Done..

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Post by G#Gill »

YZGI;1305233 wrote: Done..




:yh_rotfl
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Post by AussiePam »

I prefer Alanis.

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Post by beowulf »

i prefer Alanis too

one of the funniest films ever made :wah:.......im a big kevin smith fan :-6
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Post by beowulf »

YZGI;1305233 wrote: Done..




could have been worse i guess :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl

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Post by AussiePam »

beowulf;1305269 wrote: i prefer Alanis too

one of the funniest films ever made :wah:.......im a big kevin smith fan :-6


Ain't that the truth!
"Life is too short to ski with ugly men"

K.Snyder
Posts: 10253
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 2:05 pm

How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by K.Snyder »

I'd had a discussion with a friend of mine yesterday and it involved her son going to a local church for free breakfast. What followed was my asking why she didn't go and she informed me that the church didn't serve females. Perhaps this was something similar to fasting so as to prove one's faith? Perhaps just a bunch of loonies that have entered a level of thought they'd not been previously used to hence the obvious spasmodic error.

The moral of the story is that religion is indefinitely not necessary in order to become complacent. If one wishes to define "heaven" as the only true state of complacency then what I must say is to get over the fact "you" die. Just get over it.
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AussiePam
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How To Get To Heaven When You Die

Post by AussiePam »

K.Snyder;1307495 wrote:

The moral of the story is that religion is indefinitely not necessary in order to become complacent.


I shall carry this amazing thought with me onto the thin ice of this third day of the merry month of May in the year of our Lord 2010. Thanks Kev!!!
"Life is too short to ski with ugly men"

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