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Thread: How low do you go? How high is too high?

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    Senior Member Lon's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bryn Mawr View Post
    That is where we disagree. Atkins was a disaster, the general diet is way too high in fat - carbs are the least of our worries.
    Ah----you're a tough one Bryn------the majority, not all, of those diagnosed with Diabetes 2 are overweight, and many obese.
    Endocronologists/Dieticians have encouraged reducing carbs to not only reduce and improve blood sugar levels, but to loose weight as well.Those within my family sphere that are grossly overweight consume huge amounts of carbs via
    breads/pasta/potatoes/rice---- fats are a lesser concern. BTW. I am not a Atkins fan or supporter
    http://www.sciencenews.org/view/gene...sity_and_Worse

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    Proudly humble LarsMac's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

    I have lost 60+ lb in the last 3 years.
    I cut my carb intake at evening meal to near 0. In the morning, I eat my carbs. Usually cereal, yogurt and fruit. 60-80% of my daily carb intake is breakfast.
    Lunch is more protein and fat, but some pasta or potatoes often accompany.
    For dinner, I avoid any cheap carbs, usually eating Veggies with good nutrition rating.
    My one cession to carbs late: I have a glass of milk and a few cookies or graham crackers before bedtime. That keeps my blood sugar from dipping.

    I was around 320 lb when I started this a few years back. Now I am below 230.
    "The trouble with people isn't that they don't know, but that they know so much that ain't so." - Will Rogers
    "Truth isn't Truth" - Rudy Giuliani

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    Senior Member Lon's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    I have lost 60+ lb in the last 3 years.
    I cut my carb intake at evening meal to near 0. In the morning, I eat my carbs. Usually cereal, yogurt and fruit. 60-80% of my daily carb intake is breakfast.
    Lunch is more protein and fat, but some pasta or potatoes often accompany.
    For dinner, I avoid any cheap carbs, usually eating Veggies with good nutrition rating.
    My one cession to carbs late: I have a glass of milk and a few cookies or graham crackers before bedtime. That keeps my blood sugar from dipping.



    I was around 320 lb when I started this a few years back. Now I am below 230.

    Good going Lars----and here's to added longevity.

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    Senior Member Wandrin's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

    My doctor sounded the alarm when a routine blood test showed a rather high glucose level. She knows me well and emailed me a reading list and gave me a prescription for a glucose meter so I could monitor and look for patterns. She got my attention.

    I've made some incremental changes in diet that have helped. Just being aware has helped, in many ways. I managed to get most readings down to the mid to low 80s. The disturbing part, though, is that my pattern shows that the highest reading of the day is the first thing in the morning - before I have had anything to eat or drink. This indicates that my pancreas is doing bad things while I sleep. I was able to reduce this some by having a light snack just before bed.

    The changes to diet haven't been painful at all. Mostly portion control and little things like substituting brown rice for white, sweet potatoes for white, etc. Oh, and more walking of course.

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    Proudly humble LarsMac's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

    BG is typically higher in the morning.
    It is also typically low in the wee hours while you are asleep.
    You system will detect the low, and your liver will crank out some extra glucose to adjust, then as part of the waking process.

    he Dawn Phenomenon and the Somogyi effect are the terms used to define this.
    Here is webMD comments on it.

    Having a light snack around an hour before bed time will keep your BG from going too low while sleeping, and actually reduce the morning high, because the liver is not trying to recover from the extreme low.

    operative word here is "light" snack.
    "The trouble with people isn't that they don't know, but that they know so much that ain't so." - Will Rogers
    "Truth isn't Truth" - Rudy Giuliani

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    Senior Member Bryn Mawr's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lon View Post
    Ah----you're a tough one Bryn------the majority, not all, of those diagnosed with Diabetes 2 are overweight, and many obese.
    Endocronologists/Dieticians have encouraged reducing carbs to not only reduce and improve blood sugar levels, but to loose weight as well.Those within my family sphere that are grossly overweight consume huge amounts of carbs via
    breads/pasta/potatoes/rice---- fats are a lesser concern. BTW. I am not a Atkins fan or supporter
    Fattening Carbs—Some Promote Obesity And Worse - Science News
    Grossly overweight = grossly overeating.

    Regardless of the amount of carbs in your diet, if you eat too much then you will put on weight.

    I agree with the article you linked (apart from showing fries as an example of carbs, they're mostly fat), simple sugars are empty calories that rapidly lead to weight gain but complex carbohydrates are a form of slow release energy that will keep you going from one meal to the next. It's what I was trying to say in post #44.

    Cutting carbs is a bad headline - if you cut your carbs then you are increasing you intake of fats and proteins in proportion. Cut sugars but keep you carb ratio up by replacing them with complex carbohydrates - brown rice instead of white, wholemeal bread instead of white etc. to give a balanced diet.

    The main aim, however, must always be to balance the energy equation - calories eaten must balance to calories expended, less if you want to loose weight (but not too much less or you'll put your body into starvation mode which is why crash diets never work).

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    Proudly humble LarsMac's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bryn Mawr View Post
    Grossly overweight = grossly overeating.

    That is not always true. There are a number of hormonal "defects" that can cause obesity in spite of diet control.
    My mother had a couple of issues that caused here to be severely obese.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bryn Mawr View Post
    Regardless of the amount of carbs in your diet, if you eat too much then you will put on weight.
    I agree with the article you linked (apart from showing fries as an example of carbs, they're mostly fat), simple sugars are empty calories that rapidly lead to weight gain but complex carbohydrates are a form of slow release energy that will keep you going from one meal to the next. It's what I was trying to say in post #44.

    Cutting carbs is a bad headline - if you cut your carbs then you are increasing you intake of fats and proteins in proportion. Cut sugars but keep you carb ratio up by replacing them with complex carbohydrates - brown rice instead of white, wholemeal bread instead of white etc. to give a balanced diet.
    IF you simply cut carbs, and increase consumption of fat and protein, perhaps. A good balance of all three, and minding one's total calorie intake will make the difference. However, for most of us, just cutting the carbs will help, because most of use consume way too many in our daily diet.
    Carbs are cheap, and people who are in tight budgets look for cheap food.


    Quote Originally Posted by Bryn Mawr View Post
    The main aim, however, must always be to balance the energy equation - calories eaten must balance to calories expended, less if you want to loose weight (but not too much less or you'll put your body into starvation mode which is why crash diets never work).
    True. The term 'diet' has bee corrupted. From a zoologic perspective, all creatures have a diet. Humans' diets are rather flexible.
    We all have a diet. some folks' diets are killing them, and the only way to remain healthy is to have a healthy diet.

    If you are diabetic, you must manage a diet that is low in carbohydrates, but you still need to include them in your diet.
    Managing your diet is a must.

    One of the most effective tools I have found is the glycemic index. It list foods by how they effect blood sugar. keeping blood sugar under control helps reduce body weight.



    I have an additional problem that complicates my diet.
    I have an over-active thyroid.
    I take medicine to slow it down. balancing that medication is a chore.
    too much, the thyroid slows down so much that I can gain 20 lb a few days while eating very little food.
    Too little, my metabolism cranks up so high that I cannot eat enough food to prevent muscular deterioration.

    after 3 years, I think I have finally found a sustainable balance point.
    "The trouble with people isn't that they don't know, but that they know so much that ain't so." - Will Rogers
    "Truth isn't Truth" - Rudy Giuliani

  8. #58
    Senior Member Bryn Mawr's Avatar
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    Re: How low do you go? How high is too high?

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    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    That is not always true. There are a number of hormonal "defects" that can cause obesity in spite of diet control.
    My mother had a couple of issues that caused here to be severely obese.
    Agreed, there are a few medical conditions that can so slow your metabolic rate that even a normal calorie intake is too much but the underlying energy equation still applies - if you are putting on weight then you are eating too much. The body does not invent energy from the aether and if the food is not eaten then the weight does not go on.

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    IF you simply cut carbs, and increase consumption of fat and protein, perhaps. A good balance of all three, and minding one's total calorie intake will make the difference. However, for most of us, just cutting the carbs will help, because most of use consume way too many in our daily diet.
    Carbs are cheap, and people who are in tight budgets look for cheap food.
    Exactly what I am saying. As to the rest, I guess diet is different between our two countries - here the poor diet is usually crammed with fat and sugar, cut those out and the results are dramatic. I have yet to see someone whose consumption of complex carbohydrates is causing them to become fat on its own.


    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    True. The term 'diet' has bee corrupted. From a zoologic perspective, all creatures have a diet. Humans' diets are rather flexible.
    We all have a diet. some folks' diets are killing them, and the only way to remain healthy is to have a healthy diet.

    If you are diabetic, you must manage a diet that is low in carbohydrates, but you still need to include them in your diet.
    Managing your diet is a must.

    One of the most effective tools I have found is the glycemic index. It list foods by how they effect blood sugar. keeping blood sugar under control helps reduce body weight.
    My father is diabetic, the dietary instruction he's been given (and keeps fairly strictly) is to avoid sugars (apart, oddly enough, from fructose) like the plague. No problems with complex carbohydrates, just sugars.

    If you look at the definition of the glycemic index you'll find it is a measure of the rate at which a carbohydrate is broken down into glycogen (blood sugar) by the body, hence, a measure of the complexity of the carbohydrate. Stick to low GI foods and you'll cut out the sugars whilst increasing the proportion of complex carbohydrates.

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    I have an additional problem that complicates my diet.
    I have an over-active thyroid.
    I take medicine to slow it down. balancing that medication is a chore.
    too much, the thyroid slows down so much that I can gain 20 lb a few days while eating very little food.
    Too little, my metabolism cranks up so high that I cannot eat enough food to prevent muscular deterioration.

    after 3 years, I think I have finally found a sustainable balance point.
    Not a pleasant condition - if the thyroid activity is sporadic then it has been known for the doctors to completely suppress natural thyroid activity to even the amount of medication required by the body. Hopefully, now you've found your balance point you're beyond that.

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