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Thread: Science Disproves Evolution

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    Post Re: Science Proves Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    I grew up in a very mixed family. There were 7th day Adventists, Christian scientists, Baptists, Southern Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians, Jehovah Witnesses, Episcopalians, Lutherans, Catholics, Jews, Masons, and Engineers.
    Family dinners were always rather interesting.

    Holy ****! Forgive me, Lord. I mean, Holy cow! No, that's not good either. Forget about it.


    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    I figure God doesn't care which religion you want to follow, He just expects you to be honest and caring, and take care of those who are in need. If you cannot do that, he probably has little need for your "religion"
    My journey began when I decided to make an effort to find out what was meant by “Jesus is a Jew”. It didn't take me long to realize that Christianity is just a cult based around a handful of Jews who didn't have the patience and fortitude of faith to wait for the “Messiah” so they decide to create a false god with mystic, superstitious, hocus-pocus cockamamy and to distinguish themselves from real Jews by doing the opposite of most of the Jewish Seder and customs. Rather than putting on a kippah when entering their place of worship they demanded you remove your head covering instead. Rather than meet on the Friday/Saturday Sabbath they demanded to meet on a Sunday instead. Rather than refraining from eating pork they demanded you not eat meat on Friday. It was just a frantic dash to make themselves different from Jews yet following rules that were directly related to Judaism.

    Anyway, so I wondered if it wasn't best to become a Jew and at least follow Biblical scripture in the original rather than the blasphemous doctrine of the Christian upstarts. So I began learning what I could about Judaism until I realized that it too was too superstitious.

    Agnosticism makes sense and although Judaism is far more righteous than Christianity in its' tolerance ….... neither of the two are worth my time on this wonderful earth.

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    Senior Member FourPart's Avatar
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    Re: Science Disproves Revolution

    Quote Originally Posted by xfrodobagginsx View Post
    Under your definition of science, evolutionary 'Science' isn't science because it does begin with the supposition that evolution is true and it works back from there. It also makes vast assumptions not based on evidence, but rather, ones that require more faith than a belief in creationism would. Admittedly, Creation Science does much the same thing. The difference I would argue is that creation science IS supported by the evidence, whereas, evolutionary science is not. Evolution is at odds with Creationism, but that's ok, because the actual evidence doesn't support Darwinian Evolution any way. Creationists admit that there are variations and mutations within the species/animal kinds, but what they reject is that these changes ever produce an animal outside of it's original species/kind. Dogs always produce dogs, cats always produce cats, horses always produce horses, ect.

    Evolution wants to AVOID how a universe could create it's self in violation of the laws of thermodynamics and conservation of energy. It wants to avoid explaining how life sprang out of non life. The evolution of two sexes would be next to impossible, and many more things. You say there is no evidence for God, well, the violation of the laws of science to produce just the things I just listed would prove that there must be a God.
    Evolution is Fact. It has been observed through fossil records. It has repeatedly been tested by way of prediction, both in the lab as well as from predicting what sort of remains would be expected to be found at specific locations, which then went on to be found, matching precisely what was predicted and at the locations predicted.

    Evolution has also been observed in humans over the past few hundred years. Body sizes have increased as have proportionate brain sizes.

    Your coming up with the age old Creationist dogma of Dogs producing Dogs & Cats producing Cats demonstrates that you don't have any idea of how Evolution works, despite having it explained to you time & time again. You keep thinking of Evolution as a Linear process, when it more like a tree. A mutation is born. If that mutation benefits its survival it lives to pass on the genes of that mutation to future generations. If it doesn't benefit it, it dies off. The non-mutated line also continues in its own way, branching of in an entirely different direction, where other mutations occur totally independently of its earlier cousin. In time, one branch, and many subsequent branches may result in a Cat species, whilst the other might result in the Dog line. Take the Sabre Tooth Tiger, for instance. Not surprisingly, for decades it was classified as being a Cat. It wasn't until more recent DNA testing that it was found that the Sabre Tooth Tiger was actually a Dog. A Chihuaha has the same ancestor as a Great Dane in the form of the Wolf, as does the Fox, Coyote, Dingo, etc. However, none are viable matches with the Wolf any more. They have aspeciated.

    Furthermore, Evolution doesn't want to avoid anything. That implies it has some kind of conciousness. Evolution is a matter of a species adapting to an ever changing environment. If it doesn't Evolve it becomes extinct.

    Another indisputable piece of evidence for Evolution is in the number of species that have vestigial organs - such as whales having fingers, humans having tail bones, birds having claws on their wings which serve absolutely no purpose, etc.

  3. #4463
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    Re: Science Disproves Revolution

    Quote Originally Posted by FourPart View Post
    Evolution is Fact. It has been observed through fossil records. It has repeatedly been tested by way of prediction, both in the lab as well as from predicting what sort of remains would be expected to be found at specific locations, which then went on to be found, matching precisely what was predicted and at the locations predicted.

    Evolution has also been observed in humans over the past few hundred years. Body sizes have increased as have proportionate brain sizes.

    Your coming up with the age old Creationist dogma of Dogs producing Dogs & Cats producing Cats demonstrates that you don't have any idea of how Evolution works, despite having it explained to you time & time again. You keep thinking of Evolution as a Linear process, when it more like a tree. A mutation is born. If that mutation benefits its survival it lives to pass on the genes of that mutation to future generations. If it doesn't benefit it, it dies off. The non-mutated line also continues in its own way, branching of in an entirely different direction, where other mutations occur totally independently of its earlier cousin. In time, one branch, and many subsequent branches may result in a Cat species, whilst the other might result in the Dog line. Take the Sabre Tooth Tiger, for instance. Not surprisingly, for decades it was classified as being a Cat. It wasn't until more recent DNA testing that it was found that the Sabre Tooth Tiger was actually a Dog. A Chihuaha has the same ancestor as a Great Dane in the form of the Wolf, as does the Fox, Coyote, Dingo, etc. However, none are viable matches with the Wolf any more. They have aspeciated.

    Furthermore, Evolution doesn't want to avoid anything. That implies it has some kind of conciousness. Evolution is a matter of a species adapting to an ever changing environment. If it doesn't Evolve it becomes extinct.

    Another indisputable piece of evidence for Evolution is in the number of species that have vestigial organs - such as whales having fingers, humans having tail bones, birds having claws on their wings which serve absolutely no purpose, etc.
    Wrong. Evolution is NOT fact, it is a belief, a religion and a theory, nothing more. It has many gaps that cannot be explained (other than that it is wrong and Creationism is right). These gaps require faith. The missing links between all of the animal kinds is a big issue for evolutionists. Abiogenesis is another huge issue that requires faith for them. Can't be reproduced in a lab because it never happened that way.

    The only form of evolution that actually happens is Lateral Adaptation, (Within the species). Creationists admit that this happens, it's obvious. The problem is that evolutionsists take examples of Lateral Adaptation (Within the species) and try to use them to prove that one animal kind evolved into another. The problem is that the actual fossil record doesn't show this to be the case. So, then they come up with the excuse that the animals must have had an unknown 'comon ancestor' and they have faith that it will some day be found. Not based on actual evidence. Faith based belief system, religion.

    The way you explained evolution is exactly my understanding of the way they think, but I just don't agree with it.

    As far as vestigial organs/parts, just because they don't understand the use of an organ doesn't make it vestigial left over parts. The appendix was claimed for years to be a vestigial part by evolutionists, until fairly recently it was discovered that it was part of the immune system. Lots of parts formerly thought to be vestiges are now known to be useful.

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    Re: Science Proves Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by xfrodobagginsx View Post
    Wrong. Evolution is NOT fact, it is a belief, a religion and a theory, nothing more. It has many gaps that cannot be explained (other than that it is wrong and Creationism is right). These gaps require faith. The missing links between all of the animal kinds is a big issue for evolutionists. Abiogenesis is another huge issue that requires faith for them. Can't be reproduced in a lab because it never happened that way.

    The only form of evolution that actually happens is Lateral Adaptation, (Within the species). Creationists admit that this happens, it's obvious. The problem is that evolutionsists take examples of Lateral Adaptation (Within the species) and try to use them to prove that one animal kind evolved into another. The problem is that the actual fossil record doesn't show this to be the case. So, then they come up with the excuse that the animals must have had an unknown 'comon ancestor' and they have faith that it will some day be found. Not based on actual evidence. Faith based belief system, religion.

    The way you explained evolution is exactly my understanding of the way they think, but I just don't agree with it.

    As far as vestigial organs/parts, just because they don't understand the use of an organ doesn't make it vestigial left over parts. The appendix was claimed for years to be a vestigial part by evolutionists, until fairly recently it was discovered that it was part of the immune system. Lots of parts formerly thought to be vestiges are now known to be useful.
    Evolution is just a word to describe the changes that many species go through as they adapt to changing conditions in their environment.

    Darwin gets a lot of credit for defining some of the processes, and for suggesting that Evolution could quite conceivably explain some of the interesting variations that scientists had discovered and defined relating to certain species, both living and extinct.

    Obviously, some of those notions were later proved incorrect (You can read about them in scientific documentation at your local library.) Some of those notions have gained much support in the scientific community, and much evidence has been found to support those ideas. (You can read about THOSE in your library, as well.)

    Science works.
    "Learn from the mistakes of others---you can never live long enough to make them all yourself."
    - Anon

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    Senior Member FourPart's Avatar
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    Re: Science Disproves Revolution

    Quote Originally Posted by xfrodobagginsx View Post
    Wrong. Evolution is NOT fact, it is a belief, a religion and a theory, nothing more. It has many gaps that cannot be explained (other than that it is wrong and Creationism is right). These gaps require faith. The missing links between all of the animal kinds is a big issue for evolutionists. Abiogenesis is another huge issue that requires faith for them. Can't be reproduced in a lab because it never happened that way.

    The only form of evolution that actually happens is Lateral Adaptation, (Within the species). Creationists admit that this happens, it's obvious. The problem is that evolutionsists take examples of Lateral Adaptation (Within the species) and try to use them to prove that one animal kind evolved into another. The problem is that the actual fossil record doesn't show this to be the case. So, then they come up with the excuse that the animals must have had an unknown 'comon ancestor' and they have faith that it will some day be found. Not based on actual evidence. Faith based belief system, religion.

    The way you explained evolution is exactly my understanding of the way they think, but I just don't agree with it.

    As far as vestigial organs/parts, just because they don't understand the use of an organ doesn't make it vestigial left over parts. The appendix was claimed for years to be a vestigial part by evolutionists, until fairly recently it was discovered that it was part of the immune system. Lots of parts formerly thought to be vestiges are now known to be useful.
    "Lateral Adapttaion". Now there's a new phrase. I guess that's a new one to replace the other Creationist's invented phrase, "Macro Evolution". They are one & the same thing. The fact that you accept that anything changes at all proves that you accept Evolution as an undeniable fact. The thing is that Evolution is a very slow process. Obviously it is only observable within species in the short term, but the plethora of fossil records clearly demonstrate how it exists over the longer period. The Geological Ladder also shows how the Evolution of species progresses over millions of years by the absence of more advanced species among previous eras. You & your type claim that Humans & Dinosaurs lived alongside each other. If that were the case, you would expect to find Human Fossil Remains alongside Dinosaur Fossil Remains. Guess what. You don't. Nor do you find any other type of Mammalian Fossil Remains.

    You refer to vestigial organs having a different purpose. Spot on. That is exactly how the existence of Evolution is demonstrated. As you say, the Appendix is understood to have some role to do with the Immune System. However, it used to be part of another stomach, as found in other Primates. Does that explain what other use a whale has for fingers, including an opposable thumb?

    DNA shows that Crabs & Spiders are related. You can clearly see the similarities, but it's a far cry to say that they are the same species. You should also check out the definition of a species. It refers to a particular branch of being that is not viable with any other, despite having had a common ancestor, such as Cats & Dogs, for instance. At one time they may have been so close so as to been interbreedable, but once the differences increase, they no longer become viable.

    How would you define a 'species'. One might say that they have to have the same number of Chromosomes. For instance, humans have 23. But what about someone with Down Syndrome? They have 24, as they have grown an additional copy of Chromosome 21. Does that mean they are not Human any more? They are certainly distinct from regular Humans. Only have 23 Chromosomes, as oppsed to our Chimpanzee Cousins 24 because Chromosome 2 has become fused. It is a mutation as small as a single Chromosome that can create an entirely new species. If that mutation is advantageous to its environment, then it survives to pass on those genes to the next generation. If not, it dies & the mutation stops there. If they do survive, then a new species variation is born, which later goes on in subsequent generations to mutate further, until they are indistinguishable from their ancestors.

  6. #4466
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    Re: Science Disproves Revolution

    Quote Originally Posted by FourPart View Post
    "Lateral Adapttaion". Now there's a new phrase. I guess that's a new one to replace the other Creationist's invented phrase, "Macro Evolution". They are one & the same thing. The fact that you accept that anything changes at all proves that you accept Evolution as an undeniable fact. The thing is that Evolution is a very slow process. Obviously it is only observable within species in the short term, but the plethora of fossil records clearly demonstrate how it exists over the longer period. The Geological Ladder also shows how the Evolution of species progresses over millions of years by the absence of more advanced species among previous eras. You & your type claim that Humans & Dinosaurs lived alongside each other. If that were the case, you would expect to find Human Fossil Remains alongside Dinosaur Fossil Remains. Guess what. You don't. Nor do you find any other type of Mammalian Fossil Remains.

    You refer to vestigial organs having a different purpose. Spot on. That is exactly how the existence of Evolution is demonstrated. As you say, the Appendix is understood to have some role to do with the Immune System. However, it used to be part of another stomach, as found in other Primates. Does that explain what other use a whale has for fingers, including an opposable thumb?

    DNA shows that Crabs & Spiders are related. You can clearly see the similarities, but it's a far cry to say that they are the same species. You should also check out the definition of a species. It refers to a particular branch of being that is not viable with any other, despite having had a common ancestor, such as Cats & Dogs, for instance. At one time they may have been so close so as to been interbreedable, but once the differences increase, they no longer become viable.

    How would you define a 'species'. One might say that they have to have the same number of Chromosomes. For instance, humans have 23. But what about someone with Down Syndrome? They have 24, as they have grown an additional copy of Chromosome 21. Does that mean they are not Human any more? They are certainly distinct from regular Humans. Only have 23 Chromosomes, as oppsed to our Chimpanzee Cousins 24 because Chromosome 2 has become fused. It is a mutation as small as a single Chromosome that can create an entirely new species. If that mutation is advantageous to its environment, then it survives to pass on those genes to the next generation. If not, it dies & the mutation stops there. If they do survive, then a new species variation is born, which later goes on in subsequent generations to mutate further, until they are indistinguishable from their ancestors.
    Lateral Adaptation is Micro Evolution, not Macro Evolution. Macro Evolution is fictional and it's one animal kind evolving into a different animal kind. Proof of this occuring is completely void from the fossil record, yet evolutionsts use examples of Micro Evolution to prove Macro Evolution. The evidence is overwhelming that Dinosaurs lived with men. There are ancient writings about them by Marco Polo, Alexander the Great and many others. There are ancient cave drawings of them that exactly match known dinosaurs. There are sculptures of them as well. And Kent Hovind does a great job of proving it, giving over 100 examples of how they lived with men, which destroys evolutionary theory as well.

    I don't believe that the appendix used to be another stomach. Interesting you should bring up the whale having fingers. It makes me think of the snake in the garden of Eden where it had legs and Scientists have confirmed that they have legs or did at one time, but God cursed them to crawl on their belly.

    FACT: 999 our of 1000 mutations are negative, yet it would take thousands of positive mutations in a row for evolution to be true. Even if 1 out of 2 mutations were positive, and they aren't, just to get 200 positive mutations in a row would be a number larger than the number of atoms in the Universe.

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    Re: Science Disproves Evolution

    Micro and macro evolution are more "made-up phrases" from the Ass-backwards creationists.

    Charles Darwin never used the word, Evolution. at least not until something like the 7th edition of his work, after it had been used to refute his findings.
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    Post Re: Science Disproves Revolution

    Creationism = Spontaneous Generation. Equally substantiated by way of scientific fact.

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    Re: Science Disproves Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    Micro and macro evolution are more "made-up phrases" from the Ass-backwards creationists.

    Charles Darwin never used the word, Evolution. at least not until something like the 7th edition of his work, after it had been used to refute his findings.
    Think what you want. They don't have the transitional fossils. The evidence doesn't support it.

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    Re: Science Proves Evolution

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    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    Evolution is just a word to describe the changes that many species go through as they adapt to changing conditions in their environment.

    Darwin gets a lot of credit for defining some of the processes, and for suggesting that Evolution could quite conceivably explain some of the interesting variations that scientists had discovered and defined relating to certain species, both living and extinct.

    Obviously, some of those notions were later proved incorrect (You can read about them in scientific documentation at your local library.) Some of those notions have gained much support in the scientific community, and much evidence has been found to support those ideas. (You can read about THOSE in your library, as well.)

    Science works.

    That's what it Literally means, however, it's not the brand that is being pushed in the Schools. Darwinian Evolution is and that's the brand where one species/animal kind evolves into another.

    Yes, the notion that one animal kind can evolve into a completely different one is incorrect. The evidence doesn't support it. The only thing Darwin was correct on was that evolution does occur, but it's on a micro scale, not a macro one. Science does work.

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