Make these ads go away.
+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 48

Thread: The Independent Scotland

  1. #1
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    WEST SUSSEX, ENGLAND
    Posts
    31,529
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    02:54 AM

    The Independent Scotland

    Apologies to gmc because I know this has been posted before.

    Should Salmond's dream be achieved, how would Scotland fund such an enormous change?

    Scotland would need their own:

    Border control
    Passports
    Parliament
    Defence
    Airports
    Immigration control
    Currency

    Would Scotland be part of the EU ?
    What would be Scotland's GDP ?

    In 2010 the estimated population of Scotland was a mere 52,22,100 ... The figure for the unemployed In Scotland Is 216,000.... 10,000 up on the previous quarter and rising..

    How would Scotland fund this change because the only way possible to me, Is tax every working man and woman to the hilt?

  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    13,441
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    03:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Scotland generates more in taxation than it actually receives back. Scotlland's share of the GDP is about 11.5% we receive back 805%. We keep all the revenue generated. Then there is also the income from the crown estates. take that off the crown since they stole it in the first place. We will stay in the EU since we've always been more in favour of it than the rest of the country anyway and the bulk of our trade is with them. Scare stories about border controls, currency ( you don't accept scottish bank notes as it is) etc are spread about by those english tory MP's that realise they need scotlands wealth to hide the mess they have made of the economy and supported by labouir MP's who realise that without scottish MP's in westminster voting on english matters they would never be able to form a government. At the end of the day if there is a referendum and scots vote in favour the discussion is over - all that will remain will be the detail.

  3. #3
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    WEST SUSSEX, ENGLAND
    Posts
    31,529
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    02:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    Scotland generates more in taxation than it actually receives back. Scotlland's share of the GDP is about 11.5% we receive back 805%. We keep all the revenue generated. Then there is also the income from the crown estates. take that off the crown since they stole it in the first place. We will stay in the EU since we've always been more in favour of it than the rest of the country anyway and the bulk of our trade is with them. Scare stories about border controls, currency ( you don't accept scottish bank notes as it is) etc are spread about by those english tory MP's that realise they need scotlands wealth to hide the mess they have made of the economy and supported by labouir MP's who realise that without scottish MP's in westminster voting on english matters they would never be able to form a government. At the end of the day if there is a referendum and scots vote in favour the discussion is over - all that will remain will be the detail.
    Hang on.. Didn't Salmond fail to get an overall majority and finally only at the end of last year, he announced that a referendum bill would not be laid before MSP's ? Was that because recent academic research has shown, public support for independence has, at best, flatlined over the past three years at about 30% ?

    Separation would mean up to a 12p rise in income tax, pushing the rate up to 32p. Leader Annabel Goldie has also criticised SNP plans for a local income tax, saying this would add another 4.6p. Taking into account the 12p national insurance for basic rate taxpayers, the Tories say the average Scot could be paying 48.6p in every pound in tax while higher rate taxpayers could pay as much as 68.6p.

    Alex Salmond would turn Scotland into the highest taxed part of Britain. Ordinary Scots face paying nearly half their earnings in taxes

  4. #4
    Senior Member Bryn Mawr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    London
    Posts
    15,448
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    03:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by oscar View Post
    Hang on.. Didn't Salmond fail to get an overall majority and finally only at the end of last year, he announced that a referendum bill would not be laid before MSP's ? Was that because recent academic research has shown, public support for independence has, at best, flatlined over the past three years at about 30% ?

    Separation would mean up to a 12p rise in income tax, pushing the rate up to 32p. Leader Annabel Goldie has also criticised SNP plans for a local income tax, saying this would add another 4.6p. Taking into account the 12p national insurance for basic rate taxpayers, the Tories say the average Scot could be paying 48.6p in every pound in tax while higher rate taxpayers could pay as much as 68.6p.

    Alex Salmond would turn Scotland into the highest taxed part of Britain. Ordinary Scots face paying nearly half their earnings in taxes
    Is that "up to 12%" as in "that's the highest estimate we've managed to find and that was by a rabid anti-independence campaigner with no data to back it up"?

    As gmc says, neither of the main UK parties want to let go - that being so you need to examine their statements with the finest of toothcombs.

    The utter bull that came out during the recent referendum on AV was a prime example.

  5. #5
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    WEST SUSSEX, ENGLAND
    Posts
    31,529
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    02:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by Bryn Mawr View Post
    Is that "up to 12%" as in "that's the highest estimate we've managed to find and that was by a rabid anti-independence campaigner with no data to back it up"?

    As gmc says, neither of the main UK parties want to let go - that being so you need to examine their statements with the finest of toothcombs.

    The utter bull that came out during the recent referendum on AV was a prime example.
    I took those stats from the Conservative Party.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Bryn Mawr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    London
    Posts
    15,448
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    03:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by oscar View Post
    I took those stats from the Conservative Party.
    Exactly, a body which is actively campaigning against Scottish independence and which has a history of manipulating the "facts" presented before a referendum.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    13,441
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    03:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by oscar View Post
    Hang on.. Didn't Salmond fail to get an overall majority and finally only at the end of last year, he announced that a referendum bill would not be laid before MSP's ? Was that because recent academic research has shown, public support for independence has, at best, flatlined over the past three years at about 30% ?

    Separation would mean up to a 12p rise in income tax, pushing the rate up to 32p. Leader Annabel Goldie has also criticised SNP plans for a local income tax, saying this would add another 4.6p. Taking into account the 12p national insurance for basic rate taxpayers, the Tories say the average Scot could be paying 48.6p in every pound in tax while higher rate taxpayers could pay as much as 68.6p.

    Alex Salmond would turn Scotland into the highest taxed part of Britain. Ordinary Scots face paying nearly half their earnings in taxes
    They were a minority government and attempts to have a referendum were blocked by the other parties. Have you been sleeping? They won a landslide victory in this years election with an overall majority, previously he had stated they would only have a referendum towards the end of the parliamentary tern if they won once they had had a chance to show the electorate what they could do in government. The calls for an immediate referendum were a feeble attempt to grandstand from people who are on record stating the Scottish people don't have a right to one. Annabel Goldie only has a seat at all because of the proportional representation that her party is so opposed to. Tory support is not just flat lined in Scotland it has ceased to exist as if it never was. Labour support is flatlining as well. You are correct support for full independence is between 25 - 30%. But then look who is running the country and what they are doing and ask yourself what will the inheritor of thatcher's legacy be able to achieve in raising that percentage. . The lib dems have had it it's between labour and the SNP

    Ordinary scots already do pay half their earnings in tax, as indeed do the english, tot up income tax, NI contributions then factor in the fact that indirect taxation hits low earners far more than they do high earners and the reality is the lower to middle income earners are worse off under new labour and the tories. VAT at 20% and fuel duty mean most families are spending 50 - 100 a month more on fuel than before. How much do you spend on petrol? What most london politicians can't grasp is that a car, up here or in rural areas in england, is not a luxury but a necessity. Thank Thatcher all the profits from British gas are going to germany and france. Art a time when demand is at an all time high and oio is beginning to run out they are taken in by oil companies bleating that high taxes mean they will sulk and not extract the oil. That is a load of bollocks. Norway levies higher taxes than we do, the difference they invest the revenues not waste it in tax cuts and pointless wars.

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    WEST SUSSEX, ENGLAND
    Posts
    31,529
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    02:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    They were a minority government and attempts to have a referendum were blocked by the other parties. Have you been sleeping? They won a landslide victory in this years election with an overall majority, previously he had stated they would only have a referendum towards the end of the parliamentary tern if they won once they had had a chance to show the electorate what they could do in government. The calls for an immediate referendum were a feeble attempt to grandstand from people who are on record stating the Scottish people don't have a right to one. Annabel Goldie only has a seat at all because of the proportional representation that her party is so opposed to. Tory support is not just flat lined in Scotland it has ceased to exist as if it never was. Labour support is flatlining as well. You are correct support for full independence is between 25 - 30%. But then look who is running the country and what they are doing and ask yourself what will the inheritor of thatcher's legacy be able to achieve in raising that percentage. . The lib dems have had it it's between labour and the SNP

    Ordinary scots already do pay half their earnings in tax, as indeed do the english, tot up income tax, NI contributions then factor in the fact that indirect taxation hits low earners far more than they do high earners and the reality is the lower to middle income earners are worse off under new labour and the tories. VAT at 20% and fuel duty mean most families are spending 50 - 100 a month more on fuel than before. How much do you spend on petrol? What most london politicians can't grasp is that a car, up here or in rural areas in england, is not a luxury but a necessity. Thank Thatcher all the profits from British gas are going to germany and france. Art a time when demand is at an all time high and oio is beginning to run out they are taken in by oil companies bleating that high taxes mean they will sulk and not extract the oil. That is a load of bollocks. Norway levies higher taxes than we do, the difference they invest the revenues not waste it in tax cuts and pointless wars.
    According to the SNP's own figures, an Independent Scotland would already be 14 billion In the red.

    Independent Scotland would have been £14 billlion in the red last year, governments figures show - The Daily Record

    What would be your main revenue? Oil ? How much of the oil revenues would go to Edinburgh. How much public debt would Westminster dump on Holyrood; even what currency would you adopt over the long run.

    Would you try re-claiming UK sea-beds that the Crown Estate rents out ?

  9. #9
    Senior Member Bryn Mawr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    London
    Posts
    15,448
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    03:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Quote Originally Posted by oscar View Post
    According to the SNP's own figures, an Independent Scotland would already be 14 billion In the red.

    Independent Scotland would have been £14 billlion in the red last year, governments figures show - The Daily Record

    What would be your main revenue? Oil ? How much of the oil revenues would go to Edinburgh. How much public debt would Westminster dump on Holyrood; even what currency would you adopt over the long run.

    Would you try re-claiming UK sea-beds that the Crown Estate rents out ?
    I've just looked and I must say I'm surprised.

    Whilst there is a concentration of gas fields around the Wash, all of the North Sea Oil is in Scottish waters - under international law all of the oil revenue would go to Edinburgh =8^o

    It is not even as though the ownership of the sea beds would be in dispute, if Scotland ceased to be part of the UK then ownership would revert to them.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Chookie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Ermmmmmmmmmm.......
    Posts
    1,833
    Local Date
    09-17-2019
    Local Time
    03:54 AM

    Re: The Independent Scotland

    Register to remove this ad.
    Quote Originally Posted by oscar View Post
    Hang on.. Didn't Salmond fail to get an overall majority and finally only at the end of last year, he announced that a referendum bill would not be laid before MSP's ?
    No, he didn't. In the last election he got not only an overall majority but an absolute majority - in a system which was designed by the Unionist parties to prevent just such an eventuality. The referendum bill will be presented to Parliament on schedule in the latter half of this term.

    On your OP, viz:-

    Border control - We have only ONE border
    Passports - Yes please
    Parliament - We've already got that (and it works)
    Defence - What defence? The present government have just closed two of the three airbases we had. (Leuchars and Kinloss)
    Airports - We have airports
    Immigration control - We have no problem with immigrants - the "subsidy junkies" are concentrated around London.....
    Currency - Ours is better looking - none of our banknotes have a sour-faced old bat* on them

    * with the possible exception of the Mary Slessor fivers issued by the Clydesdale some years ago....
    An ye harm none, do what ye will....

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. You Can Support Independent Artists
    By RedGlitter in forum General Chit Chat
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 04-13-2008, 06:08 AM
  2. A bit of independent learning
    By Diuretic in forum General Chit Chat
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 01-21-2007, 07:47 AM
  3. Anyone here from Scotland?
    By Spinner in forum Introductions
    Replies: 49
    Last Post: 10-26-2006, 06:01 PM
  4. Independent Mind
    By coberst in forum Philosophy
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-18-2006, 01:52 AM
  5. Are Independent films dominating Hollywood?
    By netmankt in forum General Chit Chat
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-29-2006, 07:32 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts