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Thread: America's failing education

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    Senior Member K.Snyder's Avatar
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    America's failing education

    I must admit that I exaggerate a bit when I say our public schools are merely an over-hyped day care center but I'd like to stress that my point is that parents shouldn't rely solely on any school be it private or public. The importance of parents being involved in their child's education cannot be emphasized enough. No one said it'd be easy.

    The video documentary "Waiting for Superman", which I'm sure most of everyone has already seen, is a brief insight into America's education system and while I'd agree that this video alone cannot save our children I'd like to add that I doubt very much it was ever meant to work without the help of those who view it.

    The video can be seen at Cuevana and may involve downloading a plugin. To get rid of the Spanish captioning you can just hover your mouse over the tool bar within the video at the bottom and click on "ES"...

    Here's the link... Cuevana | Inicio Waiting for Superman website Waiting for "Superman" | Official Site | Take Action

    I think it's synonymous of our failing education system to see that Washington DC, or our nation's capital, is among the lowest proficiency scores across the country.

    Perhaps anyone would like to comment on the video...Or simply express their concerns or their suggestions for America's failing education system...

  2. #2
    Zero mod strikes. HAH!!! YZGI's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    If Somalia had the same education system would it be considered failing?

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    Senior Member K.Snyder's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    Quote Originally Posted by YZGI View Post
    If Somalia had the same education system would it be considered failing?
    When all children have the potential of being successful then those that are not have been failed by any system foreign or domestic.

    Perhaps you could tell me why you disagree with that statement and we can go from there

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    Premium Member flopstock's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    The problem with our education system is proficiency testing.

    Teachers used to teach in order to educate. We were taught
    to understand what we were learning, learned how to ask questions and to dig for the answers. We had the basics drilled into us as a foundation.

    Now the children are taught what will be appearing on the fall and spring proficiency tests.
    I expressly forbid the use of any of my posts anywhere outside of FG (with the exception of the incredibly witty 'get a room already' )posted recently.
    Folks who'd like to copy my intellectual work should expect to pay me for it.

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    Senior Member K.Snyder's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    Quote Originally Posted by flopstock View Post
    The problem with our education system is proficiency testing.

    Teachers used to teach in order to educate. We were taught
    to understand what we were learning, learned how to ask questions and to dig for the answers. We had the basics drilled into us as a foundation.

    Now the children are taught what will be appearing on the fall and spring proficiency tests.
    Each state creates their own standards for passing each proficiency test and perhaps these standards are meant to coincide with what these kids know on a state by state basis. Meaning there seems to be no overall standard rather one big mess of school districts attempting to save their own asses...

    Perhaps even to a greater extent is a trickle down effect to each teacher(Not all of course) who are protected by concrete teacher union laws...

    Anyone feel teachers union's are hurting or helping our schools?

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    Senior Member K.Snyder's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    ScienceDaily (June 1, 2009) — Many children who are retained in kindergarten, first or third grade for academic reasons do not subsequently receive a document outlining the individualized special education services they should receive, according to a new report.

    [...]

    "Although debates about the value of grade retention abound, the practice, in and of itself, has never been demonstrated to be an effective intervention relative to subsequent academic achievement or socioemotional adjustment," the authors write. "Therefore, some experts in the field believe that retention should be accompanied by focused individualized assessments of children's special education needs. Although our results do not definitely demonstrate that retained children have been denied their rights to such assessments, they raise the question of whether the potential special education needs of retained children, particularly those who demonstrate persistent academic difficulties, are being addressed consistently."Elementary Students Held Back In Early Grades Often Do Not Get Special Education Plan
    A report worth reading I think...

    I honestly think that no child should be retained no matter the circumstance. If it's suspected a child is not on the level of the other children in their grade then the parents should step in(Which should have happened to begin with to avoid such a situation) and the student should receive the necessary attention in order to bring that student to an acceptable level. Holding children back is probably, if not "the", worst thing you can do to the child.

    There needs to be a change in the attitudes of this society if America is expected to progress. America is most certainly failing it's obligation and it's been quite some time since anyone hadn't realized it!

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    Re: America's failing education

    Quote Originally Posted by K.Snyder View Post
    I must admit that I exaggerate a bit when I say our public schools are merely an over-hyped day care center but I'd like to stress that my point is that parents shouldn't rely solely on any school be it private or public. The importance of parents being involved in their child's education cannot be emphasized enough. No one said it'd be easy.

    The video documentary "Waiting for Superman", which I'm sure most of everyone has already seen, is a brief insight into America's education system and while I'd agree that this video alone cannot save our children I'd like to add that I doubt very much it was ever meant to work without the help of those who view it.

    The video can be seen at Cuevana and may involve downloading a plugin. To get rid of the Spanish captioning you can just hover your mouse over the tool bar within the video at the bottom and click on "ES"...

    Here's the link... Cuevana | Inicio Waiting for Superman website Waiting for "Superman" | Official Site | Take Action

    I think it's synonymous of our failing education system to see that Washington DC, or our nation's capital, is among the lowest proficiency scores across the country.

    Perhaps anyone would like to comment on the video...Or simply express their concerns or their suggestions for America's failing education system...
    Okay i know how dumb your children are under your education system ...and it's not a critisism .... it's because during the last 20 years they have tried your system here ..and now our kids don't know what's happening around the world ..... they used to, we had test on it . Total overhaul of the education system, teachers have no powers anymore..you suddenly have to pay and get nothing for it.

    My grandchildren are doomed unless we offer home education. I never thought that would happen here outside of a religious curriculum..... but alas if you want to educate your children properly private or system ...that's just how it has to be done.

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    Senior Member K.Snyder's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    Quote Originally Posted by fuzzywuzzy View Post
    Okay i know how dumb your children are under your education system ...and it's not a critisism .... it's because during the last 20 years they have tried your system here ..and now our kids don't know what's happening around the world ..... they used to, we had test on it . Total overhaul of the education system, teachers have no powers anymore..you suddenly have to pay and get nothing for it.

    My grandchildren are doomed unless we offer home education. I never thought that would happen here outside of a religious curriculum..... but alas if you want to educate your children properly private or system ...that's just how it has to be done.
    We need another age of enlightenment. I'm quite sure you know what it is it's just that I think it's nice to read on occasion.
    The Age of Enlightenment (or simply the Enlightenment or Age of Reason) was a cultural movement of intellectuals in 18th century Europe and America, whose purpose was to reform society and advance knowledge. It promoted science and intellectual interchange and opposed superstition, intolerance and abuses in church and state.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Age_of_Enlightenment

  9. #9
    Senior Member K.Snyder's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    Quote Originally Posted by K.Snyder View Post
    A report worth reading I think...

    I honestly think that no child should be retained no matter the circumstance. If it's suspected a child is not on the level of the other children in their grade then the parents should step in(Which should have happened to begin with to avoid such a situation) and the student should receive the necessary attention in order to bring that student to an acceptable level. Holding children back is probably, if not "the", worst thing you can do to the child.

    There needs to be a change in the attitudes of this society if America is expected to progress. America is most certainly failing it's obligation and it's been quite some time since anyone hadn't realized it!
    On the same note, I feel that holding a child back is most damaging to their inherent need to understand themselves within the framework of society. It's atrocious that we'd hold a child back based off of the basic skills that our culture currently deems to be the standard by which we define intelligence.

    It's absolutely a crime against humanity. And all of it is at the expense of these kids' integrity and understandings of what a human being should be in life.

    Elie Maynard Adams is worth a read by anyone and in it is a certain bit that I find to be very relevant.

    Pre-school and elementary education is concerned largely with laying foundations. Much of it has to be training in basic skills. It should be for the cultural development of the children's innate powers in accordance with the inherent normative constitution[This is what Adams defines earlier in the book as the human inherent nature to seek knowledge and understanding of themselves and their world] of the human self and in ways that can be justified to them later. Early training should be guided and controlled by the objective of preparing children for responsible self-direction and learning in their more mature years.
    Sorry, I do not have a link but the referenced quote is in his book "A Society Fit for Human Beings"

    The quote and reality of our education system extends far greater than just a few glitches in a system thought of as separate from our culture and to a very large extent to our every day lives. In the book Adams speaks of the dominance of our strive to control and manipulate our environment for monetary gain and power. This no doubt leads to our priorities becoming those that help us to achieve this at whatever the cost. We also redefine our understanding of our culture and define it in terms of the language we use to achieve these goals. This has lead to our need to define everything in what Adams calls the "scientific conceptual system". This is marked by our need to think of ourselves and the world in terms of it's scientific nature and our desire to relate our scientific based assumptions with our deteriorating need for meaning in our lives.

    Other reads would be Adam Smith "Of the Division of Labor" and Karl Marx's "Economic and Philosophic Manuscripts of 1844"

    So long as we as a society define our existence by the scientific conceptual system and ways that control and manipulate our environment for self interest maximization then we will forever impede the inherent right of our children to grow up in a free culture that can only exist with ongoing criticism and reconstruction.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Bryn Mawr's Avatar
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    Re: America's failing education

    Register to remove this ad.
    This is one of my pet rants - if a country cannot or will not invest in its children then it will sink without trace.

    BTW - Hello stranger, welcome back

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