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Thread: The Armenian Genocide

  1. #21
    Senior Member High Threshold's Avatar
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    Dotto. I will make allowances since I know english is a second language for you.
    In that case I'll return your gift of tolerance and reciprocate in kind, though I must say that until now I really did think English was your mother tongue. My mistook.


    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    Come of it the whole religion is based on the notion of inherited guilt. Original sin is the doctrine at the heart of christian theology - even a newborn baby is a sinner doomed to limbo unless it's baptised and eternal hellfire unless it follows the right path to god.
    Yes, true enough. We are all to blame for that taste of apple. Damn the French.


    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    Although believe the vatican recently babies that die befire they are baptised no longer go to limbo.
    Recently, you say? Perhaps yes. But I am 68 and I do remember being told (Catholic school, you know) that the new born would go straight to hiven.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    Why don't you read the new testament for yourself and look for the anti-semitic bits or even have a look t the various congreeses where it was decided what was to be included in the bible and what was or was not the true belief. Biggest shock might be that it romans who were making all the decisions. It's a made up story written well after the events any gospels that contradicted the official version were sytematically removed and destroyed.
    Me? Read the whole thing? You're talking to the wrong guy. I'd rather watch TV re-runs of “Green Acres” all week long.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    What is it with religiouis people that they never seem to read the bible for themselves or look in to who actually wrote it and just beleve any ninsense they are told.
    The Lord works in strange ways, my son. But to answer your question … it be called “faith”. Maybe that's the heart of the problem. You don't really need to know anything to "know the truth" and shive it up everyone's nose.

  2. #22
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    The Turkish President has addressed the world:
    Mr Erdogan said on Tuesday that when political or religious leaders played the role of historians, what resulted was "delirium, not fact".

    "Hereby, I want to repeat our call to establish a joint commission of historians and stress we are ready to open our archives. I want to warn the Pope to not repeat this mistake and condemn him."

    Turkey's Erdogan condemns Pope over Armenia 'genocide' - BBC News

    You warn the Pope, Mr Erdogan? You condemn the Pope?

    I seem to remember the last person to shoot a Pope was Turkish. Perhaps, Mr Erdogan, you could be construed as uttering a threat.
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  3. #23
    Senior Member High Threshold's Avatar
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    Now, if the west were not so damned islamophobic then something positive might be accomplished.

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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    posted by high threshold
    In that case I'll return your gift of tolerance and reciprocate in kind, though I must say that until now I really did think English was your mother tongue. My mistook.
    I can spell I can type it's the two together I occasionally get wrfong, well more than occasionally actually.

    Recently, you say? Perhaps yes. But I am 68 and I do remember being told (Catholic school, you know) that the new born would go straight to hiven.

    2007 it was

    The Pope ends state of limbo after 800 years - Telegraph

    By Nick Pisa in Rome

    12:01AM BST 23 Apr 2007

    Babies who die before being baptised will no longer be trapped in limbo following a decision by the Pope to abolish the concept from Roman Catholic teaching.
    Me? Read the whole thing? You're talking to the wrong guy. I'd rather watch TV re-runs of “Green Acres” all week long.
    tsk tsk and there's me an atheist who sat down as a teenager to read the whole thing. (I won't pretend I read it from end to end in it's entireity) Brought up a protestant you see it was rather required reading since you were supposed to find your own way to god. Personally it should be required reading by all, in my exerience most christians and especially of the nuttier kind are rather selective in which bots they choose to believe in. Read bits of the koran as well but found it highly derivative and got sidetracked by the writings of Richard Francis Burton.

    The Lord works in strange ways, my son. But to answer your question … it be called “faith”. Maybe that's the heart of the problem. You don't really need to know anything to "know the truth" and shive it up everyone's nose.
    Maybe faith plus a reluctance to think too deeply.

    What I was trying to get at (possibly in a rather obtuise way) is the sheer hypocrisy of the pope to criticise the turks for the armenian genocide while pretending his organisation had nothing to do with the holocaust and actively re-writing history to make hitler an atheist and that was the reason for what he did.

    “My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was his fight against the Jewish poison. Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross.”
    ― Adolf Hitler

    “The receptivity of the masses is very limited, their intelligence is small, but their power of forgetting is enormous. In consequence of these facts, all effective propaganda must be limited to a very few points and must harp on these in slogans until the last member of the public understands what you want him to understand by your slogan.”
    ― Adolf Hitler

  5. #25
    Senior Member High Threshold's Avatar
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    I can spell I can type it's the two together I occasionally get wrfong, well more than occasionally actually.
    Tweren't your spelling but the redundancies, actually. As far as spelling goes it's the coordination between the “middle” and “ring” fingers of your right hand that's giving you trouble, so that the “o” becomes “i”.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    2007 it was
    I must have been sleep-walking all through 1957-61. In addition to that detail I distinctly remember (being a Catholic mind) that eating meat on a Friday was a “MORTAL SIN” back then, but no one else seems to recall it that way.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    The Pope ends state of limbo after 800 years - Telegraph (The Pope ends state of limbo after 800 years - Telegraph)

    Babies who die before being baptised will no longer be trapped in limbo following a decision by the Pope to abolish the concept from Roman Catholic teaching.
    You see now, our disagreement on the time-line not withstanding, this is the sort of thing (along with the eating of meat on Friday) that make people like me trot down to the bishop and formally denounce the church. I did so in 1978. I mean REALLY ….. who is it who decides these things - heaven or hell???

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    tsk tsk and there's me an atheist who sat down as a teenager to read the whole thing. (I won't pretend I read it from end to end in it's entireity) Brought up a protestant you see it was rather required reading since you were supposed to find your own way to god. Personally it should be required reading by all, in my exerience�* most christians and especially of the nuttier kind are rather selective in which bots they choose to believe in.
    I read the first chapter on a couple of occasions … and gave up. I don't really care who begot whom. I just wanted to know about the fire and brimstone, whatever was meant by Jesus being a “Jew”, and how a gun-totting self-inflated Charlton Heston could get the part of Moses. I finally decided that NOBODY knows anything more than I do.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    What I was trying to get at (possibly in a rather obtuise way) is the sheer hypocrisy of the pope to criticise the turks for the armenian genocide while pretending his organisation had nothing to do with the holocaust and actively re-writing history to make hitler an atheist and that was the reason for what he did.
    Hear, hear.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    “My feeling as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded only by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was his fight against the Jewish poison. Today, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed his blood upon the Cross.”
    ― Adolf Hitler
    THIS is the very first time that I have EVER seen any reference to Hitler proclaiming Christian conciousness. I could never sympathise with him (an understatement) but my loathing has just trebled.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    “The receptivity of the masses is very limited, their intelligence is small, but their power of forgetting is enormous. In consequence of these facts, all effective propaganda must be limited to a very few points and must harp on these in slogans until the last member of the public understands what you want him to understand by your slogan.”
    ― Adolf Hitler
    Is that a quote by the CIA did you say? I think there might have been a fair bit of political psychology (a la J. Göbbels) tucked between the pages of chemical formulae aboard the U-234. Could that be the reason why the Whine House isn't gloating about the incident you think?

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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    posted by high threshold
    Tweren't your spelling but the redundancies, actually. As far as spelling goes it's the coordination between the “middle” and “ring” fingers of your right hand that's giving you trouble, so that the “o” becomes “i”.
    I tried teaching myself touch typing I just ended up making mistakes at a faster rate.

    THIS is the very first time that I have EVER seen any reference to Hitler proclaiming Christian conciousness. I could never sympathise with him (an understatement) but my loathing has just trebled.
    Don't take my word for it have a read of mein kampf. He wasn't simply a ranting lunatic othrwise he would not have had so many follow him.

    Mein Kampf PDF Version | The Mein Kampf Project at Christogenea.org

    And so I believe to-day that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator. In standing guard against the Jew I am defending the handiwork of the Lord." (p.46
    Bear in mind it was once a best seller and an awful lot of people all over the world agreed with him about race - scratch the surface many still do they just don't phrase it quite so openly. It's within living memory that Anti-miscegenation laws were in force in america thatcher and reagan supported apartheid and nelson mandela was a terrorist. Have a look at some of the opposition to barack obama they can barely contain their hatred for his racial background. He had it in for bankers and big business as well not to mention the communists and socialists - marx was jewish.

    A conflict that set fire to the whole world and affects the way we live today I think people need to be aware of the past and why so many people died if only so that we don't all fall for it again. Sometimes I think we are.

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    Senior Member High Threshold's Avatar
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    I tried teaching myself touch typing I just ended up making mistakes at a faster rate.
    It's the law of averages.
    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    mein kampf …... Bear in mind it was once a best seller
    So was the Bible, Mao's “Red Book”, and Kaddafi's “Green Book”. Copies printed and sold mean nothing.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    Have a look at some of the opposition to barack obama they can barely contain their hatred for his racial background.
    I know. The racial tone is palpable.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    A conflict that set fire to the whole world and affects the way we live today I think people need to be aware of the past and why so many people died …..
    I agree with that, but the grand problem is that 1984 has arrived and “being aware of the past” is being spun and packaged so that our “awareness” differs from someone's else's.

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    ….. if only so that we don't all fall for it again. Sometimes I think we are.
    Only “sometimes”? It's all round us. Every day.

  8. #28
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    Only “sometimes”? It's all round us. Every day.
    I try and be optimistic. Big brother works both ways people are watching and posting online what is happening in the world. Theoretically was can vote for change and a better world. My parents were born just after ww1, imagine growing up expecting to go to war at some point and knowing what ww1 was like for the ordinary soldier. At least nowadays a full scale world war would last minutes and we would be all really in the **** or dead.

  9. #29
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

    Quote Originally Posted by gmc View Post
    ............................ At least nowadays a full scale world war would last minutes and we would be all really in the **** or dead.
    Seems to me we've already had several World Wars since the Second one. The difference is that we now call them “conflicts”, “civil wars” (in which half the world participates), “leadership changes”, “war (without the caps) on Terrorism”, and any number of clandestine operations, black flag movements and coups implemented by governments abroad. If the doughboys of WW I felt like cannon fodder then the lads today are simple satchels of explosives, not very unlike the suicide bomber …........ except for who gets to pull the pin.

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    Senior Member FourPart's Avatar
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    Re: The Armenian Genocide

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    Quote Originally Posted by High Threshold View Post
    Seems to me we've already had several World Wars since the Second one. The difference is that we now call them “conflicts”, “civil wars” (in which half the world participates), “leadership changes”, “war (without the caps) on Terrorism”, and any number of clandestine operations, black flag movements and coups implemented by governments abroad. If the doughboys of WW I felt like cannon fodder then the lads today are simple satchels of explosives, not very unlike the suicide bomber …........ except for who gets to pull the pin.
    You could even say that the Japanese part wasn't even really anything to do with WW2, as it was totally unrelated to Nazism. Mind you, we should be grateful to the Japanese. They brought the US out of sitting on the sidelines of Neutrality. WW2 officially ended after VE Day. WW3 continued with the Japanese - they just overlapped.

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