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Thread: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

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    "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    Anyone interested in explaining what this means to them?

    Was Jesus the first new age preacher, or was he claiming to be God? Maybe it was, and still is, just gibberish?

    One christian interpretation is that Jesus was simply stating to those he was speaking with that the kingdom of heaven was among them, him being alive and in their presence.

    A more secular interpretation of what's meant by the phrase is similar to Dorothy becoming conscious that there's no place like home.

    I'm thinking that as knowledge is derived the notion of an external God is challenged, and so God is given an internal place to abide for those who insist on hanging onto the notion of God(s). Yes? No?

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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    It would help if you give the source of the quoted phrase. I think you've misquoted it.

    Taking the phrases as equivalent, I expect the first thing you'd need to distinguish between is "God", on the one hand, and "the kingdom of Heaven (or God)" on the other.
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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    Yes, I did misquote. It's "the kingdom of God is within you."

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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    Quote Originally Posted by spot View Post
    It would help if you give the source of the quoted phrase. I think you've misquoted it.

    Taking the phrases as equivalent, I expect the first thing you'd need to distinguish between is "God", on the one hand, and "the kingdom of Heaven (or God)" on the other.
    I think they're the same, one being the external and the other internal due to enlightenment?

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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    It's generally reckoned that "The Kingdom of Heaven" is a euphemism used by the fastidious Matthew but meaning exactly the same as "The Kingdom of God".

    It's also generally reckoned that "The Kingdom of God" is what's often referred to as The End Time.

    Quite how The End Time is meant to be within a bunch of Pharisees is hard to work out. Maybe the words got garbled.

    I really don't think Jesus was trying to suggest that God didn't exist, though.
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    The watch of your vision has become reasonable today.

    It’s normal. You must provoke. You must insult the belief of all monotheists. You must make fun of the belief of all monotheists.
    From the upper tier of the Leppings Lane End of the Hillsborough Stadium, I watched the events of that day unfold with horror.
    When the flowers want to oxygen and nutrition, or you’re a wedding or party planner, I will help you too much.
    Write that word in the blood

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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    I don't know that Jesus was the FIRST new age preacher. Much of what he said was new to the folks he was preaching to, and they never seemed to really figure it all out.

    Nothing he said was really new to the Eastern philosophies of the day. He always sounded pretty close to the ideas that Gautama Siddhartha preached, and what many of the old Hindu Gurus have been teaching for centuries, as well.

    OR as Ram Dass said, "We re all just walking each other home."
    If we are in God, and God is in us, then we are all pretty much the same, and all part of the Universe. Can the Universe contain consciousness?
    If so, I would guess that is where God can be found. Then we and God and the Universe are all there is.

    And that isn't really a bad notion to hang on to, I reckon.
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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    Quote Originally Posted by spot View Post
    It's generally reckoned that "The Kingdom of Heaven" is a euphemism used by the fastidious Matthew but meaning exactly the same as "The Kingdom of God".

    It's also generally reckoned that "The Kingdom of God" is what's often referred to as The End Time.

    Quite how The End Time is meant to be within a bunch of Pharisees is hard to work out. Maybe the words got garbled.

    I really don't think Jesus was trying to suggest that God didn't exist, though.
    Perhaps the end times within is meant as a condemnation? Jesus did say he was sent to divide. Perhaps Jesus was saying the Pharisees were representative of older tradition which was now over (end times). Jesus was a rather accusatory figure and not really the loving, gentle soul many would like to represent him as. It seems to me Jesus preached that it's best to love the God he's presenting or else.

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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    I don't know that Jesus was the FIRST new age preacher. Much of what he said was new to the folks he was preaching to, and they never seemed to really figure it all out.

    Nothing he said was really new to the Eastern philosophies of the day. He always sounded pretty close to the ideas that Gautama Siddhartha preached, and what many of the old Hindu Gurus have been teaching for centuries, as well.
    I'm sure you're right, though that means Jesus wasn't saying anything new and that the God he represented was behind the times and just catching up.

    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    OR as Ram Dass said, "We re all just walking each other home."
    What does that mean?
    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    If we are in God, and God is in us, then we are all pretty much the same, and all part of the Universe.
    You're belief in God is about equality?
    Quote Originally Posted by LarsMac View Post
    Can the Universe contain consciousness?
    If so, I would guess that is where God can be found. Then we and God and the Universe are all there is.

    And that isn't really a bad notion to hang on to, I reckon.
    What? Are you asking that since humans are self aware and are within the Universe that that gives consciousness to the Universe? Can you clarify this?

    I guess defining "consciousness" would be a good start.

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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahso! View Post
    Perhaps the end times within is meant as a condemnation? Jesus did say he was sent to divide. Perhaps Jesus was saying the Pharisees were representative of older tradition which was now over (end times). Jesus was a rather accusatory figure and not really the loving, gentle soul many would like to represent him as. It seems to me Jesus preached that it's best to love the God he's presenting or else.
    The Jesus of the Gospels is above all a magician, he's red the spell-book and worked out how to force God to do what has been promised - the End of the World.

    God, in the Old Testament, has stood back and let the world go to rack and ruin since the exile in Babylon, having left warnings in the books of the Major Prophets and Psalms and Daniel of what would happen. You just wait and see, says God, when a chap arrives who does this and this and this then it's game over, I'm coming down and it won't be a pretty sight.

    So Jesus walks the minefield, knowing that if he can keep each foot off the booby-traps he can get to the far side as the acknowledged Son of God with as many power-lasers and archangels at his command as any crazed magician could ever hope for.

    That's what The End Times were about. That's what all the early followers were waiting to see in their lifetimes, being vengeful sods.

    It's also why all these lunatic born-again fundamentalist Neo-Cons are getting the world's armed forces centred as close to Megiddo as they can get. It's a place near the Golan Heights, the Greeks called the area Armageddon. The magicians are still trying as best they can to bring on Divine Intervention, believing they're fulfilling God's Plan.
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    Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game!

    The watch of your vision has become reasonable today.

    It’s normal. You must provoke. You must insult the belief of all monotheists. You must make fun of the belief of all monotheists.
    From the upper tier of the Leppings Lane End of the Hillsborough Stadium, I watched the events of that day unfold with horror.
    When the flowers want to oxygen and nutrition, or you’re a wedding or party planner, I will help you too much.
    Write that word in the blood

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    Re: "The Kingdom of Heaven is within"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahso! View Post
    I'm sure you're right, though that means Jesus wasn't saying anything new and that the God he represented was behind the times and just catching up.

    What does that mean?
    You're belief in God is about equality?What? Are you asking that since humans are self aware and are within the Universe that that gives consciousness to the Universe? Can you clarify this?

    I guess defining "consciousness" would be a good start.
    Defining Consciousness.
    That has been going on for a long time. The Buddha defines consciousness as simply that part of one that is aware of self.
    most humans are barely conscious. They have some awareness of their surroundings and of how they are affected by them.

    From a more western perspective, I have been reading an interesting book: Consciousness and the Brain: Deciphering How the Brain Codes Our Thoughts by Stanislas Dehaene

    Clinically, consciousness is simply what we turn our attention to, it seems. Not really unlike the Buddhists' definition, really.

    But how far does that take us? Are we all simply squirming little animals with some awareness of our surroundings, or do we have something more to offer the universe as a whole?
    "The trouble with people isn't that they don't know, but that they know so much that ain't so." - Will Rogers
    "Truth isn't Truth" - Rudy Giuliani

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