Jester;1150695 wrote: You made me think of a good point, Oscar- This thread sais military, not which country-
Do we have any Non US military on the board?
You can put yer Grampa's service time and rank dawn!
Our viw of the military is a bit different from what you will get in the united states perhaps to do with our history of warfare.
Oscar's family history is interesting but hardly exceptional. (No offence intended Oscar but there are an awful lot of unsung heroes from ww2 around, flying a sipitfire was dangerous but so was being bombed by stukas, sticking a bayonet in to someone before they got you or going up against a tank you know was better than the one you were in. The germans called sherman tanks tommy cookers imagine how reassuring that was) You would be hard pushed to find anyone around her age that did not have relatives involved in ww2 or further back ww1 they truly were people's wars from our perspective they actually affected everybody's family. My father fought in ww2 ( I have had the surreal experience of visiting a museum in my brother in laws home town and realising that his father was at one of the same battles as mine but on different sides) -in fact I had only one surviving male relative that was not in the armed forces and that was because he was in a reserved occupation. I had female relatives in the wrens, wraf and the like or just stayed at home and got bombed out their houses. Most people had relatives killed somewhere in all corners of the globe and sometimes just at the end of the road. The vestiges of war are all around-there are old airfields everywhere. beaches with old ww2 blockhouses and tank traps concrete building in the middle of nowhere that you realise are the visible part of underground complexes.
Most combat soldiers don't talk much when they come home and the effects of war were so pervasive and so many were involved it wasn't really the done thing to talk about it in the UK and that has become part of our culture. It was only in later life that parents and the like started talking about their more extreme experiences. The there are dozens of autobiographies being published now as many get to the point they can tell their stories. I see the same phenomenon in america, a few are are by servicemen that served in the RAF and the like-they make fascinating reading. You can hardly turn on UK TV without seeing some programme about warfare (you tend to become very conscious of it when you have a german friend visiting-I had to explain why the phrase don't mention the war has her work colleagues in stitches. ). Doesn't mean we are not proud of our military it is just expressed differently. It's not just WW" it's korea, malaysis, kenya, aden, oman the falklands, ireland. Most scots at least are within two or three steps of knowing someone who has served in the military at some time or another or have a relative that did or does. I know plenty of ex-serviceman but you tend to find out in casual conversation rather than them introducing themselves as a veteran, it's just not the done thing.
The overt nationalism of the US jars with many in europe for historical reasons. We know too well where such blind my country right or wrong attitudes can lead. Same with militarism-without an actual war why do you need a large army. Doesn't mean we are any less patriotic but it does mean that insults to the flag etc are not taken very seriously and don't cause the same kind of umbrage that seems to have americans prickling at any perceived insult. Having said that you will find the average Briton knows a great deal about our history we're just a lot more cynical and jaundiced. We have a long military tradition with father following son or in some cases grandfather in to the same regiment-in basra there are monuments to the british dead that go back over a hundred years-the same in Afghanistan as it happens, the names on the tombstones are the same-sometimes it's even a distant relative. Recruitment in Scotland is down 70%-one of the things tony blair did was disband all the scottish regiments in the teeth of mass protest and despite the fears it would mean a fall in recruitment. As a military man i am sure you appreciate the meaning of tradition to a soldier. Apart from that this war is just not popular.
You would find it almost impossible in the UK to find anyone that didn't have relatives involved or killed in ww1 or 2 somewhere. Quite a few have lost relatives since then one way or another. You would find most Europeans exactly the same perhaps the russians and germans most of all. It's a common heritage of warfare that americans just do not share. I think that background and culture is one of the reasons why you tend to see little response from british poster on these kinds of threads and a lot less overt feting of our military although they are very much appreciated by ordinary people despite what spot says:sneaky:
posted by oscar
I'd love to see National Service brought back in. Some many kids were forced into it, but ended up staying in the military. It can give them pride in some-thing that alot of the kids nowadays don't seem to have. God forbid if we ever had a world war 111. British teenagers would be queuing up for the lawyers to sue under a breach of their human rights here.
I knew it, you're a closet fascist:sneaky:
