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BabyRider
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Post by BabyRider »

I've had a request to start a new thread for asking Biker questions, so here goes!

A couple things before I get to the first question:

Some stuff is not discussed in public such as any Club business. It's a private matter only for Brothers in the MC with the business. Some questions won't be answered because in some way it may intrude on Club business, or for other reasons. When it's allowed I will try and explain why it can't be answered. If the answer to your question is simply "I can't get into that" don't take offense, it's just how some things go. What I do answer is what I know, not neccessarily the rule for all Clubs.



OK, RedGlitter had a question about patches. We women wear a patch very different from what the Brothers wear. Sometimes it's called a "property" patch. It is generally smaller, and doesn't always show the territory of the MC. Some are very difficult to earn, but most patches put on a woman's back are a serious matter. Brothers don't want a patch from their MC on the back of someone who is going to make them look foolish or embarass them.

Another difference is the shape in lots of cases. Shapes of patches mean things in my world and the woomen's patches don't generally look like the men's at all. I was VERY glad to have my patch at Pig Fest. A huge gathering in my state every year that gets really insane. The guys saw that on my back along with my "Bullet's ol' lady Smooth" patch on my front and steered clear.

Does that cover it Red?
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Post by Marie5656 »

OK, here is one. You have mentioned "colors" several times. Now, when I hear that term used, it is in reference to street gangs..wearing colors to signify thier gang membership..but I know there is a HUGE difference from a biker group and a gang...and I do not infer they are alike. So...what are "colors" as related to bikers?
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Post by BabyRider »

Marie5656;499382 wrote: OK, here is one. You have mentioned "colors" several times. Now, when I hear that term used, it is in reference to street gangs..wearing colors to signify thier colors..but I know there is a HUGE difference from a biker group and a gang...and I do not infer they are alike. So...what are "colors" as related to bikers?
Good question and an IMPORTANT distinction betwen gangs and Bikers. Bikers despise being referred to as "gang" in any context.

The colors (sometimes rags) on a Biker's back are the patch that signify which MC or RC he belongs to and usually the territory ruled by the chapter of that club.
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RedGlitter
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Post by RedGlitter »

I'm so glad you made this thread BabyRider!

Ok, I understand you can't tell us some things so I might be out of line here on this one:

Could you tell us a little about what the shapes of the patches mean to you guys? And can you tell us how you get them? If not, I understand.



:)
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Post by BabyRider »

RedGlitter;499441 wrote: I'm so glad you made this thread BabyRider!

Ok, I understand you can't tell us some things so I might be out of line here on this one:

Could you tell us a little about what the shapes of the patches mean to you guys? And can you tell us how you get them? If not, I understand.



:)
That I can tell you about. To a point.



One type is called a "tombstone" patch or just a one-piece patch. This is shaped like that tombstone it's named for. Another is a 3-piece patch. Smaller and it's in 3 separate pieces. The Clubs that wear the different shapes run very different Clubs and have different men than the others, usually. The specifics of what each patch can signify will be answered if I can get the "ok" from someone I trust from one of my Biker forums.



Folks, don't be concerned about asking something you think might not get answered, as long as you understand that there are very good reasons that I can't answer. There are many rules in my lifestyle, all of which exist for good reasons.
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Post by 911 »

How do most biker clubs feel about the influx and the magnitude of law enforcement biker clubs?
When choosing between two evils, I always like to take the one I've never tried before.

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Post by dixie_angel_26 »

I have a question I support my ol mans colors but have been asked to join a w m/c , how do most m/c feel about that? I am reluctant to join bc they souuprt a diffrent m/c. Can you give my any input Dixie
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Post by cars »

So. . . . . . ok BR here goes, several questions for starters. :-2



At what age did you start to ride?



And how did you get the feeling that you to wanted to start to ride?



When did you get your first bike, & what kind was it?



Did you ever race other bikers on a race strip?



What's the fastet you ever went on a bike, & where?
Cars :)
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Post by BabyRider »

RedGlitter;499441 wrote: I'm so glad you made this thread BabyRider!

Ok, I understand you can't tell us some things so I might be out of line here on this one:

Could you tell us a little about what the shapes of the patches mean to you guys? And can you tell us how you get them? If not, I understand.



:)
Red I missed the 2nd part of this question.

Each Club has different ways to earn a patch both for the men and the women. Brothers in MOST Clubs have a probationary period where they have to prove their dedication, heart and committment to the Club. There is a lot to being a probie. Some of that I can't get into. Some MC's make the women probie for their patch. Some are just given when the Brother asks for it. But if a woman wears her man's Club's patch, she has earned it either through the Club or thrugh her ol' man.
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Post by BabyRider »

911;499780 wrote: How do most biker clubs feel about the influx and the magnitude of law enforcement biker clubs?
Most don't like them. The LEO clubs in my area wear territory patches and other things that truly pi$$ off the other Clubs, especially the dominant Club.
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Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


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Post by BabyRider »

dixie_angel_26;499785 wrote: I have a question I support my ol mans colors but have been asked to join a w m/c , how do most m/c feel about that? I am reluctant to join bc they souuprt a diffrent m/c. Can you give my any input Dixie
Any women's MC that did not support my husbands would not be given the time of day by me. I know nothing about the MC your husband belongs to, but in my experience, the Brothers of that Club would look poorly at a Brother's woman supporting them.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
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Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


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Post by BabyRider »

cars;499798 wrote: At what age did you start to ride?



And how did you get the feeling that you to wanted to start to ride?



When did you get your first bike, & what kind was it?



Did you ever race other bikers on a race strip?



What's the fastet you ever went on a bike, & where?
I started riding behind Bullet at 33. I started on my own ride at 34.



After being behind Bullet for so long, I wanted to see how operating my own machine felt. 2 days into my lessons, I was hooked.



I got my first ride just before my lessons 2 years ago, and it was a Suzuki 450GS, a 1980.



Never raced on a strip, but Bullet and I raced many times on the slabs.

The fastest I ever had my scoot was on several of those races, and my needle was buried. Clocked by Bullet, I had mine up to 105 mph. The locations varied but usually were on 8 Mile, in Detroit.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
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Post by dixie_angel_26 »

Thanks for the oppnion I was in the same frame of mind, but didn't know how others felt.
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Post by Marie5656 »

This is an interesting thread BR. Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us.

Do you think you will ever be able to get back to riding? Or will that be a problem because of your vision? It will be sad if you cannot, since you obviously love biking so much.
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Post by BabyRider »

dixie_angel_26;499817 wrote: Thanks for the oppnion I was in the same frame of mind, but didn't know how others felt.
The very best answer to this will come from the Brothers in your husband's MC.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
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Post by BabyRider »

Marie5656;499818 wrote: This is an interesting thread BR. Thanks for sharing your knowledge with us.

Do you think you will ever be able to get back to riding? Or will that be a problem because of your vision? It will be sad if you cannot, since you obviously love biking so much.
I'm glad to see the interest. I love my lifestyle and the Bikers in it, and the more people learn the safer we will all be.



I will ride again. I won't ever ride 2 wheels, because I don't trust cagers enough to be on the slab with them on 2. I will ride a trike, which Bullet wants to build for me. If I can't ride, I might as well just check out. Riding finds it's way into you and makes a home.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
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Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


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Post by Spike101 »

911;499780 wrote: How do most biker clubs feel about the influx and the magnitude of law enforcement biker clubs?


LEO clubs are generally not well thought of in the M/C community. The subculture has its own code...its own traditions, customs, and protocols that spans decades. It is what it is and wont change. If a group wants to earn respect from the "community of clubs" it will follow these unwritten rules and earn its right to form a club, fly its patch, and have a respected place in the community. This is called being sanctioned. This is a matter of respect shown to the culture and the clubs (especially the dominant clubs) that have already earned their place though blood, sweat, and tears. LEO clubs do not follow this path. They slap a patch on with "MC" on it, with no sanction by "those that matter", and basically give the culture a slap across its face. Thats fine, theyre cops and will do as they please. The downside is that they are often treated as lepers and get the exact amount of respect that they deserve. M/C's also shy away from those who want to ride with them and party with them on the weekends and then arrest them during the week...cops are cops, 24/7/365...the arrangement just doesnt work well...
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Post by Spike101 »

Marie5656;499382 wrote: OK, here is one. You have mentioned "colors" several times. Now, when I hear that term used, it is in reference to street gangs..wearing colors to signify thier gang membership..but I know there is a HUGE difference from a biker group and a gang...and I do not infer they are alike. So...what are "colors" as related to bikers?


Never call a M/C a "gang" in front of a patchholder. You wont like the reaction. LEO's and reporters like to use the term....it makes for better copy and has more drama and shock value...
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Post by Spike101 »

dixie_angel_26;499785 wrote: I have a question I support my ol mans colors but have been asked to join a w m/c , how do most m/c feel about that? I am reluctant to join bc they souuprt a diffrent m/c. Can you give my any input Dixie


Depends on the M/C your OM belongs to and how they, and him, feel about a members OL being in a WMC. If you support a different M/C than the one your OM is in, you will most likely have issues going around your OM's club. This could make him look bad in his club's eyes as well...
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Post by BabyRider »

Spike I was seriously hoping you'd see this and chime in. Thanks for your input and if I start rambling about something I need to close my yap about I know you'll let me know.

Appreciate your time.
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Post by Spike101 »

From BR:

"But if a woman wears her man's Club's patch, she has earned it either through the Club or thrugh her ol' man."

Normally from her OM, who is responsible for her education on what it means and what is expected when she wears it. He will also answer for her behavior while wearing it. Some clubs require that the OM get approval before his OL can sew it on, but many leave it up to the PH and he will make sure she does not make the club look bad.
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Post by Spike101 »

BabyRider;499843 wrote: Spike I was seriously hoping you'd see this and chime in. Thanks for your input and if I start rambling about something I need to close my yap about I know you'll let me know.

Appreciate your time.


No problem...while I no longer fly rags, as you know, I was a member of a 3 Patch Traditional M/C and have some general knowledge and a basic understanding of some of these things of which I can share as long as I stay out of any Club's biz. I dont pretend to be the "burning bush" on this stuff though. There are many, many, clubs out there and things can vary greatly from one to another. I speak only in general terms.
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Post by BabyRider »

Spike101;499849 wrote: No problem...while I no longer fly rags, as you know, I was a member of a 3 Patch Traditional M/C and have some general knowledge and a basic understanding of some of these things of which I can share as long as I stay out of any Club's biz. I dont pretend to be the "burning bush" on this stuff though. There are many, many, clubs out there and things can vary greatly from one to another. I speak only in general terms.
Well let's get the next thing out of the way then:

There has been a question about the specifics of the different shaped patches between a one piece and a 3 piece. That information is not for public view, is that correct?
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
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Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


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Post by Kynky »

I know nothing about Motorcycle Clubs, and I don't think I even know anyone who rides with one, but reading this it seems like it's a sexist society. Like, do the "old men" feel like they own "their old ladies" and how do the women feel about that?

Are there any other bikers on this forum? And I know there are police officers here - how do you officers view all of this?
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Post by lady cop »

Kynky;499859 wrote:



And I know there are police officers here - how do you officers view all of this?hello Kynky....there is a big difference between clubs and gangs. most bikers and cops get along fine, and i've had a lot of experience with them in florida because of bike weeks. .. in fact, BR and i have been close friends for a long time, it takes understanding and mutual respect. :cool:
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Post by BabyRider »

Kynky;499859 wrote: I know nothing about Motorcycle Clubs, and I don't think I even know anyone who rides with one, but reading this it seems like it's a sexist society. Like, do the "old men" feel like they own "their old ladies" and how do the women feel about that?



Are there any other bikers on this forum? And I know there are police officers here - how do you officers view all of this?
If you don't "think" you know anyone who rides with a Club, you don't. One thing we don't do is hide our lifestyle to anyone, for any reason.



Are you assuming sexism simply because of 2 phrases?

I am a very strong independent woman who loves her husband more than I like breathing. If he treated me chauvanistically, we would not have lasted a day, much less the years we have.

As with ANY GROUP of people, there are sexist ones. In Clubs, other groups, men AND women. How anyone else is treated is between the woman and the man.

There are several Bikers here. They will make themselves known if they choose to, and a couple are here answering things now. All you have to do is read.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
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Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


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Post by Spike101 »

BabyRider;499855 wrote: Well let's get the next thing out of the way then:

There has been a question about the specifics of the different shaped patches between a one piece and a 3 piece. That information is not for public view, is that correct?


This isnt really a question that deals with club biz. Alot of this stuff is generally known and isnt really a secret to many. There are generally accepted outlines for patch configurations and the significance of certain setups (one patch, 2 patch, 3 patch, mc cubes, rockers, 1% diamonds, territoriality denoted by certain setups, ect) but it is not set in stone. As with anything in the subculture, these things vary from club to club, region by region.

I took this off of another website. It gives a general description of what they mean. This isnt the RULE though as there is much more to this, and these are not my words:

"Conventional wisdom regarding motorcycle club patches:

• A one-piece patch signifies a family club, riding club, AMA-sanctioned motorcycle club or political action/biker rights organization. Some require little more than filling out an application (which is actually a release of liability) and mailing a check.

• A two-piece patch signifies a motorcycle club in transition, awaiting approval from the dominant club(s) to become a three-piece patch. These clubs are sometimes, not always, in the process of becoming an associate or support club. The heirachy and traditions in the MC community are complex but not without purpose. They are valuable for maintaining order and avoiding trouble.

• A three-piece patch signifies that the club is an "outlaw club," but not necessarily a 1% club. With very few exceptions, the club has been approved by the dominant club in the state or area. The three-piece patch is awarded in three parts as a prospective member earns the privilege to wear the full patch. A "hangaround" is someone who is eligible for membership and has been invited to attend club events and runs, but wears no part of the patch. If he is sponsored by a full member and approved by the club members he may wear the bottom rocker and is considered a “prospect” or "probate". If he sucessfully completes the training period and is approved by 100% of the members, he is allowed to have the top rocker and the "center patch" or club insignia. His colors are then complete and he is considered to be a full member or "patch holder." The traditional, or "old school," three-piece patch MC is one that adheres to established protocols, traditions and a code of conduct. "

Here is a good place to see some examples of Club Colors, including the one's I used to fly:

M/C Colors

Here is a good site to learn more about the culture and the differences between different kinds of clubs:

Biker Education
Spike101
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Post by Spike101 »

Kynky;499859 wrote: I know nothing about Motorcycle Clubs, and I don't think I even know anyone who rides with one, but reading this it seems like it's a sexist society. Like, do the "old men" feel like they own "their old ladies" and how do the women feel about that?


Yes it is i suppose...The M/C "world", by and large, is a male dominated culture. It is the way it is, like it or not, and it will always be this way. There are women's M/C's of course, but these are the exception and not the rule. Rarely will they achieve the status in the "community of clubs" that men do simply because the culture doesnt allow for women to get a free pass based on their gender. Gender equity does not exist. If they want to exist in a man's world, they must earn it just like the men do. There are no shortcuts. They must measure up. The rules of the society you live in dont apply here and it doesnt care. It neither asks for nor requires anyones ok.

While all this is true, one must take into account that women are not forced to participate in this. If they are there, its by their own choice. They are not prisoners. They are not victims. They are free to leave at any time. Most of the members OL's are proud and happy to represent their OM and his Club and are highly thought of in Club circles.

BTW, "Old Lady" is not considered a derogatory term in this culture. It may be in other cultures though. No one owns anyone either. I posted a biker education link in a previous post in this thread. Read it.
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Post by Kynky »

BabyRider;499864 wrote: If you don't "think" you know anyone who rides with a Club, you don't. One thing we don't do is hide our lifestyle to anyone, for any reason.



Are you assuming sexism simply because of 2 phrases?

I am a very strong independent woman who loves her husband more than I like breathing. If he treated me chauvanistically, we would not have lasted a day, much less the years we have.

As with ANY GROUP of people, there are sexist ones. In Clubs, other groups, men AND women. How anyone else is treated is between the woman and the man.

There are several Bikers here. They will make themselves known if they choose to, and a couple are here answering things now. All you have to do is read.


I had to go back and see what two phrases you were referring to. I guess the "property patch" WAS one indicator to me, and other threads I've read sort of make me think this way. I would have to go back for specific phrases. You obviously feel strongly about this. I meant no offense. And I have been reading.
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Post by BabyRider »

Kynky;499898 wrote: I had to go back and see what two phrases you were referring to. I guess the "property patch" WAS one indicator to me, and other threads I've read sort of make me think this way. I would have to go back for specific phrases. You obviously feel strongly about this. I meant no offense. And I have been reading.
I am well-read in the prejudices and closed mindedness that Bikers face. My goal is to educate the uneducated and you have said yourself that you don't "know" anyone in our life. To assume anything about it is prejudicial.

The 2 phrases I refer to are "ol' lady" and "ol' man". Being that BOTH are commonly used, it's not sexist, it's just a term about how Bikers refer to themselves and their significant others. As Spike has so eloquently pointed out, permission is not required by anyone, nor is it asked for. We just don't care enough about it to be concerned what civilians think. It hasn't changed since the inception of Bikers, why would anyone get smarter now?

The only thing in my life I feel more adamant about is my blood family.

There should never be any "sort of" thinking if you do not know anything about our culture. Learn, or don't. Just don't assume.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
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Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.




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Post by Marie5656 »

Spike101;499838 wrote: Never call a M/C a "gang" in front of a patchholder. You wont like the reaction. LEO's and reporters like to use the term....it makes for better copy and has more drama and shock value...


Spike, once you get to know me, you will find that I, personally, would never do that. I have too much respect for bikers and thier beliefs.
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Post by Lulu2 »

I've a question for bikers...this is about helmets. Realizing that opinions vary on the MANDATORY laws about using them....what do you think about wearing a helmet? Do you feel safer? Is it the idea that the government is MANDATING a helmet which makes it unpleasant for a lot of people?

Oh..and sometimes I see bikers wearing just a vest--aren't you afraid you'll take off every inch of your skin, if you have to lay down the bike? (Gives me the SHIVERS for all of you!)

(You probably don't realize that sometimes, I see you riding your bikes without long sleeves and I TURN IMMEDIATELY INTO YOUR MOTHER! AND I WANT TO TELL YOU TO PUT ON PROTECTIVE CLOTHING!.) :wah: :wah:
My candle's burning at both ends, it will not last the night. But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends--It gives a lovely light!--Edna St. Vincent Millay
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Post by lady cop »

Spike...re: LEOs...did you read my post (#25)? NO generalization is 100% accurate.
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Post by BabyRider »

Lulu2;499956 wrote: I've a question for bikers...this is about helmets. Realizing that opinions on the MANDATORY laws about using them....what do you think about wearing a helmet? Do you feel safer? Is it the idea that the government is MANDATING a helmet which makes it unpleasant for a lot of people?



Oh..and sometimes I see bikers wearing just a vest--aren't you afraid you'll take off every inch of your skin, if you have to lay down the bike? (Gives me the SHIVERS for all of you!)



(You probably don't realize that sometimes, I see you riding your bikes without long sleeves and I TURN IMMEDIATELY INTO YOUR MOTHER! AND I WANT TO TELL YOU TO PUT ON PROTECTIVE CLOTHING!.) :wah: :wah:
Most Bikers I know hate ANY mandatory anything. I am and remain a "rider's choice" advocate. Most helmets do make the rider safer, but this life is fraught with danger. So is any life. You can be killed in your car or walking down the street as easily as getting wiped out on your scoot.

My helmet is why I am still above ground. I will always wear mine, even in States that do not require it. But i will also always believe that it should be rider's choice.

No amount of any kind of protective gear will keep you from road rash, injury or death. Leather shreds rather quickly when you're riding the pavement on your ass. And fear is not what dominates riders. The enemy is death, not fear.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]










Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.




Kynky
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Post by Kynky »

BabyRider;499937 wrote: I am well-read in the prejudices and closed mindedness that Bikers face. My goal is to educate the uneducated and you have said yourself that you don't "know" anyone in our life. To assume anything about it is prejudicial.

The 2 phrases I refer to are "ol' lady" and "ol' man". Being that BOTH are commonly used, it's not sexist, it's just a term about how Bikers refer to themselves and their significant others. As Spike has so eloquently pointed out, permission is not required by anyone, nor is it asked for. We just don't care enough about it to be concerned what civilians think. It hasn't changed since the inception of Bikers, why would anyone get smarter now?

The only thing in my life I feel more adamant about is my blood family.

There should never be any "sort of" thinking if you do not know anything about our culture. Learn, or don't. Just don't assume.


My mistake entirely. I was under the impression this was a public forum and I, along with you and everyone else, would be entitled to post without being attacked or insulted. I did say I intended no offense. If that makes me ignorant so be it. I intend to keep reading and keep learning. Maybe I like Spike's answers better. He doesn't seem to have a chip on his shoulder.
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Post by Lulu2 »

So--it's the PRINCIPLE of the thing, isn't it? I'd have guessed that, BabyR! Did you laugh, knowing I TURN INTO YOUR MOTHER when I see you all risking your skin? :wah:
My candle's burning at both ends, it will not last the night. But ah, my foes, and oh, my friends--It gives a lovely light!--Edna St. Vincent Millay
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Post by BabyRider »

Kynky;499970 wrote: My mistake entirely. I was under the impression this was a public forum and I, along with you and everyone else, would be entitled to post without being attacked or insulted. I did say I intended no offense. If that makes me ignorant so be it. I intend to keep reading and keep learning. Maybe I like Spike's answers better. He doesn't seem to have a chip on his shoulder.
You haven't even been introduced to the glass edge of my tongue, so lighten up and learn about something YOU showed interest in. If you don't like how I speak....well, you don't like it. I am who and what I am. No excuses, no apologies.
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]










Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.




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Post by Spike101 »

BabyRider;499937 wrote: We just don't care enough about it to be concerned what civilians think.


The proper term is "citizen", as opposed to "civilian". A patch holder's OL is still a citizen as well. She has not earned a patch in an M/C. She cannot vote, she cannot be in meetings, and her OM isnt supposed to discuss club biz with her. Only PH's of that Club can do these things. If someone cannot, its because they are a citizen. There is no in between.
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Post by buttercup »

Hi, can i just say that being a member of a MC is different wherever you go & patches mean different things in different countries & different clubs.

Its great that BR can share with us her experiences of her group & their ways & what the patch system to them means, thanks ;)

Here in Scotland for example - some groups property patch has a twofold meaning, you can be (a) property of 1 member or (b) property of the group - meaning all can have you, just thought i would clarify that.
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Post by Marie5656 »

BabyRider;499974 wrote: You haven't even been introduced to the glass edge of my tongue, so lighten up and learn about something YOU showed interest in. If you don't like how I speak....well, you don't like it. I am who and what I am. No excuses, no apologies.


You take some getting used to, girlfriend, but I have learned to read and respect what you have to say.
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Post by Spike101 »

wrote: Maybe I like Spike's answers better. He doesn't seem to have a chip on his shoulder.


Im not here to bust anyones b@ll$...What Im giving out is what I know of on this subject through living it and being aware of my surroundings. Its purely informational stuff. Some might take offense at some of the things Im saying concerning M/C culture and how things roll in it, but its not meant to offend, just to tell it how it is. Dont shoot the messenger. Its not a lifestyle for everyone and people who try to change it do not succeed nor do they last long in it...it is what it is...its certainly not a hobby.
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Post by BabyRider »

Spike101;499992 wrote: The proper term is "citizen", as opposed to "civilian". A patch holder's OL is still a citizen as well. She has not earned a patch in an M/C. She cannot vote, she cannot be in meetings, and her OM isnt supposed to discuss club biz with her. Only PH's of that Club can do these things. If someone cannot, its because they are a citizen. There is no in between.
Hell, that's the first time I have been told that. It makes sense now that I think about it, and I won't use that reference again. Thanks for the continued educating, Spike!
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]










Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????


We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.




Spike101
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Post by Spike101 »

buttercup;499993 wrote: Hi, can i just say that being a member of a MC is different wherever you go & patches mean different things in different countries & different clubs.

Its great that BR can share with us her experiences of her group & their ways & what the patch system to them means, thanks ;)

Here in Scotland for example - some groups property patch has a twofold meaning, you can be (a) property of 1 member or (b) property of the group - meaning all can have you, just thought i would clarify that.


Here in the States it "can" have that meaning as well, but that is pretty rare and hardly the norm...normally it means what I alluded to in a prior post...like I also said, its the woman's choice. No one is holding her prisoner.
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Post by Spike101 »

BabyRider;500003 wrote: Hell, that's the first time I have been told that. It makes sense now that I think about it, and I won't use that reference again. Thanks for the continued educating, Spike!


I should have included that there is a "in between" of a sort. A Prospect or Probate, while not a PH yet (and may never be) wouldnt be reguarded as a "citizen" in the traditional sense. While they normally cant attend meetings and club biz is very limited to them, they fall in that gray area between citizen and full patch. They do hold an official status in that club.
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Post by buttercup »

Spike101;500004 wrote: Here in the States it "can" have that meaning as well, but that is pretty rare and hardly the norm...normally it means what I alluded to in a prior post...like I also said, its the woman's choice. No one is holding her prisoner.


Im well aware of that & for those that dont know these women enter into this 'property of all' quite happily.

I lived next door to the president of one of our local MC's, we enjoyed many good debates, one of which was the whole property issue. He looked at me astonished & said - are you insinuating that because ive been with them i dont love my wife?

This guy was deadly serious, for me - how the hell could i continue that conversation :rolleyes: we agreed to disagree & enjoyed many debates on many occasions afterwards, takes all kinds :-6
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Post by Spike101 »

buttercup;500009 wrote: Im well aware of that & for those that dont know these women enter into this 'property of all' quite happily.

I lived next door to the president of one of our local MC's, we enjoyed many good debates, one of which was the whole property issue. He looked at me astonished & said - are you insinuating that because ive been with them i dont love my wife?

This guy was deadly serious, for me - how the hell could i continue that conversation :rolleyes: we agreed to disagree & enjoyed many debates on many occasions afterwards, takes all kinds :-6


Im surprised he debated that issue or any other with you. What they do is pretty much their biz...around here public scrutiny of such things would be greeted by "mind your own business", and if you didnt, they would find your old man and take it out on him till you did...LOL
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Post by buttercup »

That would be because you dont know me Spike ;)
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Post by Spike101 »

buttercup;500048 wrote: That would be because you dont know me Spike ;)


...and also perhaps because the customs in your neck of the woods may be a bit different than here...that wouldnt fly very far in these parts...that isnt speculation...
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Post by buttercup »

Well i believe that was the point i was making earlier when i said - patches mean different things in different countries & clubs. How disappointing that your club does not respect or debate others points of views.

You do not know my history & therefore should not presume you do ;)
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Post by Spike101 »

lady cop;499964 wrote: Spike...re: LEOs...did you read my post (#25)? NO generalization is 100% accurate.


I disagree with your post. Most M/C's and cops do not get along. Most clubhouses are private clubs and the PO PO are not welcome. Cop clubs (the slap a patch ones that dont follow time honored traditions) try to mix with other "real" M/C's (ones that followed the rules in establishing their club) at open biker events and find that the other clubs "turn their backs" to them (the ultimate sign of disrespect). Either that, or they just scatter rather than have to speak with them. What you are speaking of is the exception rather than the norm...there are many reasons why this occurs...

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