Could Obama be the next Roosevelt?

[DrJ]

Obama has left the republican party dumb founded,, he has exposed the republican agenda in such a way,, it's impossible for them to defend it..

It has exposed the weakness of what happens to a country that takes care of the rich,, and leaves the rest of its people to fend for itself...

The argument that he will raise taxes on the rich,, won't keep him from being elected...



Mid wrote:

So Dr. J. you are taking shortcuts.... did you understand my point about Obama's lack of understanding how the tax levers work in real life?.... you are losing your touch in arguing against my thesis....




I understand what you believe,,, I'm just not arguing

I take it for what its worth,,, as far as leverage and gravity,, I understand those concepts... I believe the attitude of big business needs to change as well..

I believe you are wrong to think all these American companies will turn-tail and run,,, and any who would,, need to be thrown out from under the blanket of freedom provided by the "PEOPLE" of this great country...

I say we take these anti- American companies you speak of and put them on the boat I refered to in a previous post.

Let China protect them...Right now we give them tax breaks to ship their jobs over there,, Just kicking them out will fix a lot of things,,, get people back to buying American,, and giving their tax breaks to the more deserving Americans who want to fight for a successful America that includes everyone...

I have respect for you Marcel,,, because you are taking an unpopular side of an issue and sticking by it,, I felt that way when I first realized how wrong it was to just agree with the people in the media that were piling on the Rev Wright,, and seeing the uninformed agreeing with the truth spinners,, which I see as one reason how we got ourselves in the mess I like to refer as the "BUSH YEARS"..

The truth of the matter is,, the right wing is on its death bed,, but in the media their still calling it close,, I have a feeling this isn't true,, They are talking now about canceling the republican convention,, they're saying it because of the weather,, but I think they know they cannot top Denver,, and they fear the sign of how few people show up at their convention will show how unpopular they're conservative message has become,,,and hasn't connected to the American people...

They're talking points have all but been reduced to,, attacking the messenger,, instead of talking to the message...

The con of the republican party is over,, and now all they can do is give excuses why they have failed,, they have nothing but negativity left to offer the American people...

My question,, is why don't they care about the American people?

BC wrote:

Our nation is in trouble on two fronts: The American Dream is under siege at home, and America’s leadership in the world has been weakened.

Middle class and low-income Americans are hurting, with incomes declining; job losses, poverty and inequality rising; mortgage foreclosures and credit card debt increasing; health care coverage disappearing; and a big spike in the cost of food, utilities, and gasoline.

Our position in the world has been weakened by too much unilateralism and too little cooperation; a perilous dependence on imported oil; a refusal to lead on global warming; a growing indebtedness and a dependence on foreign lenders; a severely burdened military; a backsliding on global non-proliferation and arms control agreements; and a failure to consistently use the power of diplomacy, from the Middle East to Africa to Latin America to Central and Eastern Europe.

Clearly, the job of the next President is to rebuild the American Dream and restore America’s standing in the world.

Everything I learned in my eight years as President and in the work I’ve done since, in America and across the globe, has convinced me that Barack Obama is the man for this job.

He has a remarkable ability to inspire people, to raise our hopes and rally us to high purpose. He has the intelligence and curiosity every successful President needs. His policies on the economy, taxes, health care and energy are far superior to the Republican alternatives. He has shown a clear grasp of our foreign policy and national security challenges, and a firm commitment to repair our badly strained military. His family heritage and life experiences have given him a unique capacity to lead our increasingly diverse nation and to restore our leadership in an ever more interdependent world. The long, hard primary tested and strengthened him. And in his first presidential decision, the selection of a running mate, he hit it out of the park.

With Joe Biden’s experience and wisdom, supporting Barack Obama’s proven understanding, insight, and good instincts, America will have the national security leadership we need.

Barack Obama is ready to lead America and restore American leadership in the world. Ready to preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States. Barack Obama is ready to be President of the United States.

He will work for an America with more partners and fewer adversaries. He will rebuild our frayed alliances and revitalize the international institutions which help to share the costs of the world’s problems and to leverage our power and influence. He will put us back in the forefront of the world’s fight to reduce nuclear, chemical, and biological weapons and to stop global warming. He will continue and enhance our nation’s global leadership in an area in which I am deeply involved, the fight against AIDS, TB and malaria, including a renewal of the battle against HIV/AIDS here at home. He will choose diplomacy first and military force as a last resort. But in a world troubled by terror; by trafficking in weapons, drugs and people; by human rights abuses; by other threats to our security, our interests, and our values, when he cannot convert adversaries into partners, he will stand up to them.

Barack Obama also will not allow the world’s problems to obscure its opportunities. Everywhere, in rich and poor countries alike, hardworking people need good jobs; secure, affordable healthcare, food, and energy; quality education for their children; and economically beneficial ways to fight global warming. These challenges cry out for American ideas and American innovation. When Barack Obama unleashes them, America will save lives, win new allies, open new markets, and create new jobs for our people.

Most important, Barack Obama knows that America cannot be strong abroad unless we are strong at home. People the world over have always been more impressed by the power of our example than by the example of our power.

Look at the example the Republicans have set: American workers have given us consistently rising productivity. They’ve worked harder and produced more. What did they get in return? Declining wages, less than ¼ as many new jobs as in the previous eight years, smaller health care and pension benefits, rising poverty and the biggest increase in income inequality since the 1920s. American families by the millions are struggling with soaring health care costs and declining coverage. I will never forget the parents of children with autism and other severe conditions who told me on the campaign trail that they couldn’t afford health care and couldn’t qualify their kids for Medicaid unless they quit work or got a divorce. Are these the family values the Republicans are so proud of? What about the military families pushed to the breaking point by unprecedented multiple deployments? What about the assault on science and the defense of torture? What about the war on unions and the unlimited favors for the well connected? What about Katrina and cronyism?

America can do better than that. And Barack Obama will. But first we have to elect him.

The choice is clear. The Republicans will nominate a good man who served our country heroically and suffered terribly in Vietnam. He loves our country every bit as much as we all do. As a Senator, he has shown his independence on several issues. But on the two great questions of this election, how to rebuild the American Dream and how to restore America’s leadership in the world, he still embraces the extreme philosophy which has defined his party for more than 25 years, a philosophy we never had a real chance to see in action until 2001, when the Republicans finally gained control of both the White House and Congress. Then we saw what would happen to America if the policies they had talked about for decades were implemented.

They took us from record surpluses to an exploding national debt; from over 22 million new jobs down to 5 million; from an increase in working family incomes of $7,500 to a decline of more than $2,000; from almost 8 million Americans moving out of poverty to more than 5 and a half million falling into poverty – and millions more losing their health insurance.

Now, in spite of all the evidence, their candidate is promising more of the same: More tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans that will swell the deficit, increase inequality, and weaken the economy. More band-aids for health care that will enrich insurance companies, impoverish families and increase the number of uninsured. More going it alone in the world, instead of building the shared responsibilities and shared opportunities necessary to advance our security and restore our influence.

They actually want us to reward them for the last eight years by giving them four more. Let’s send them a message that will echo from the Rockies all across America: Thanks, but no thanks. In this case, the third time is not the charm.

My fellow Democrats, sixteen years ago, you gave me the profound honor to lead our party to victory and to lead our nation to a new era of peace and broadly shared prosperity.

Together, we prevailed in a campaign in which the Republicans said I was too young and too inexperienced to be Commander-in-Chief. Sound familiar? It didn’t work in 1992, because we were on the right side of history. And it won’t work in 2008, because Barack Obama is on the right side of history.

His life is a 21st Century incarnation of the American Dream. His achievements are proof of our continuing progress toward the “more perfect union” of our founders’ dreams. The values of freedom and equal opportunity which have given him his historic chance will drive him as president to give all Americans, regardless of race, religion, gender, sexual orientation or disability, their chance to build a decent life, and to show our humanity, as well as our strength, to the world.

We see that humanity, that strength, and our future in Barack and Michelle Obama and their beautiful children. We see them reinforced by the partnership with Joe Biden, his wife Jill, a dedicated teacher, and their family.

Barack Obama will lead us away from division and fear of the last eight years back to unity and hope.


Without the middle class,,, there is no America!

The idea of changing America into a country like China with no middle class will cost Republicans an existance inside the Govt. of America...

Is this what the Christian Right wants for America?

Backing a party that has destroyed parts of the Constitution,, using fear as a reason to deny the freedoms it provides,,,, as well as taking care of those that need it the least,,, and fighting against anything that helps those in need.... I have always wondered about Christians who believe in the trickle down....

DrJ

[Accountable]

DrJ;966655 wrote: Is this what the [fill in the blank] wants for America?

Backing a party that has destroyed parts of the Constitution,, using fear as a reason to deny the freedoms it provides,,,, as well as taking care of those that need it the least,,, and fighting against anything that helps those in need....
This bit of your post applies to both Dems and Repubs. Do you really believe the Democrats are the good guys? Both faces of this single controlling party have disregarded our founding documents - the Declaration of Independent and Constitution - mentioning them only to strum patriotic heartstrings. BOTH want to limit freedom of speech, religion, privacy, etc. Both have the same goal, they just disagree on strategy and tactics.



To answer the question, Yes, Obama could be the next Roosevelt, God help us.

[DrJ]

Accountable;966683 wrote: This bit of your post applies to both Dems and Repubs. Do you really believe the Democrats are the good guys? Both faces of this single controlling party have disregarded our founding documents - the Declaration of Independent and Constitution - mentioning them only to strum patriotic heartstrings. BOTH want to limit freedom of speech, religion, privacy, etc. Both have the same goal, they just disagree on strategy and tactics.



To answer the question, Yes, Obama could be the next Roosevelt, God help us.


I just don't know what to say,,,you agree!:-5

Don't you think we need another,,"BUDDY" in the White House?:-2

I say that because he is connecting,,, to the people,, the little people...

I can see the fire-side chats every Sunday night,, his sincerity brings a whole new aspect to the politician,, much like Reagen,, and Roosevelt,, who come off as real people.... McCain comes off as this phoney,,,"My friend " kind of guy,, who feels while you have a right to an opinion, mine is far more superior,,my friend.....

The rigid conservative,, your with me or against me attitude will be challenged in this election.. This,, if you don't believe exactly as I do,, your somehow inferior conservative message has been cracked,, putting the conservative Karl Roves in a box,,, making them more predictable,, which gives Obama more room to maneuver,

in a more positive way,, which will effect McCain in a negative fashion without the baggage of a negative campaign...

Look at their choice of VP,,, shows how desperate they had become..

The positive of Sarah,, is more of an immediate surface,, one night stand kind of thing,, A mom,,, A Governor,, wife of a Union Man,, and of couse,, her smile..

The question will be,, what they do with her after the convention..

If they hide her,, keep her under wraps until Nov. it will send a message,, after all she needs to study,, the debates will tell a lot of who she is...

If they don't keep her hid,,, her sincerity will show in her face,, and the conservative message,, tax breaks for the rich,, is going to be the toughest sell in this election,,.,I can't wait to see her with her hair down,, I think it would be a good idea to save that for the first debate....

I'm more interested in how the Party bosses will limit her,, its going to be a bit more difficult to shape her,, the way they have McCain...

I'm glad they did it,, believe it or not,, its the only choice that prevents the immediate Landslide of public opinion in the American Media...

We'll see! It's very interesting,,, they had to go into Canada to find her...

Alaska is in Canada ,,,aint it?:sneaky:

You don't like Roosevelt,,, didn't he start social security?

[southern yankee]

OMG!! no way. I was going to vote For McCain, just to vote. but his choice of running mates is very pro life. i have NEVER voted for a republican before. the ONLY way i would have voted for Obama. if Hillary was his running mate. this is a very sad race on either side. i am very bewildered by the whole Thing!!:( i may vote for Donald Duck. :wah: this election is not a laughing matter. I am back to ??????

[DrJ]

southern yankee;967089 wrote: OMG!! no way. I was going to vote For McCain, just to vote. but his choice of running mates is very pro life. i have NEVER voted for a republican before. the ONLY way i would have voted for Obama. if Hillary was his running mate. this is a very sad race on either side. i am very bewildered by the whole Thing!!:( i may vote for Donald Duck. :wah: this election is not a laughing matter. I am back to ??????




The wedge is alive and well,, if I was pro life,, I still wouldn't vote Republican,,

Tax breaks for the middle class,,, is where it should be,, not the rich..

I can't for the life of me,, understand how anybody can see the tricke down as a Christian way of thinking!

It's the money,,,its the money,,,its the money

Republicans know that,,,,the politicians anyway,,,

Is she pro life?

I guess she's done having babies,, that's the only kind of woman that goes for the save the seed religious con...

[southern yankee]

DrJ;967107 wrote: The wedge is alive and well,, if I was pro life,, I still wouldn't vote Republican,,

Tax breaks for the middle class,,, is where it should be,, not the rich..

I can't for the life of me,, understand how anybody can see the tricke down as a Christian way of thinking!

It's the money,,,its the money,,,its the money

Republicans know that,,,,the politicians anyway,,,

Is she pro life?

I guess she's done having babies,, that's the only kind of woman that goes for the save the seed religious con...
no she has a very young child. who was born with some sort of defects?? she is 44 gov. of Alaska. knew how the child would be born. so she feels no excuses. very pro life.

[southern yankee]

Hoss;967293 wrote: I read that, she just had a son in April, born with down syndrome and she knew and gave life to the child anyway. What a grand lady. She not only believes what she says she lives it too. I think that’s rare for someone in politics. I'm excited to be able to vote for her.that is why now i can't vote for her. i know she will try to that right away from me. to choose.

[Accountable]

DrJ;967080 wrote: I just don't know what to say,,,you agree!:-5

except that it's a huge negative in my mind.

DrJ wrote: You don't like Roosevelt,,, didn't he start social security?Yup, and lots of other crap in violation of the Constitution. Prolonged the depression in the US far longer than it lasted in Europe, if I understand right.

[Accountable]

DrJ;967107 wrote: Is she pro life?

I guess she's done having babies,, that's the only kind of woman that goes for the save the seed religious con...
Careful, your bigotry's showing.

[Accountable]

southern yankee;967311 wrote: that is why now i can't vote for her. i know she will try to that right away from me. to choose.
Nearing the mid-forties, I would expect the wisest choice would be prevention, either with a tie or a snip so to speak, if one doesn't want children.

[DrJ]

Hoss;967293 wrote: I read that, she just had a son in April, born with down syndrome and she knew and gave life to the child anyway. What a grand lady. She not only believes what she says she lives it too. I think that’s rare for someone in politics. I'm excited to be able to vote for her.


I was what you would call pro life,, when it come to the point when my wife told me she was pregnant... I mean come on man,,its my seed,, I have got to see what it looks like...

Then life went on,, we round up with four of them there seeds...

I was 16 for the first one,,a girl, I was 19,, for DrJ Jr.,,, 22 for my third,,

another girl,,,, I was 24 when my youngest come... I lived the life...

I come home from work one day,,, my wife informs me my oldest seed is pregnant,

She was 14.... All of a sudden I am pro choice,,, wow,,, who knew!!!

I think you can guess which way I was leaning in her choice...

You don't have the first clue,,, the relief I felt when the 16 yr old boy denied the planting,,,,Bwahahahahahahazha!!!!!

I remember storming thru pro-life people trying to stop this dasterdly deed I was about to pay for,, thinking to myself,,who lived "The Life" knowing full well what it was going to mean for her,, these people need to go home and pray,,, that their judgements don't come home to them in this life..

I am pro choice,, and I know why I am pro choice,,, I am a man,, I can have sex,, I can deliver the half seed,, to a 100 different women a year,,, heck maybe more,,

but I am never going to have to choose,, what right do I have to take the choice away from a woman?

God says?

There isn't a person on this planet that truly knows who or what God is...

We have faith there is a God,, and anyone that can use that faith and think they understand any judgement of said God,,is a liar....

Judge not,, lest ye be judged,,, do the Math!

I believe if our government really wanted to stop abortions,,it would have already happened,,

the only way that would even come close to working,, is some kind of incentive for the women,, a program like "Social security" Mr Roosevelt!

Lets pay them to have the children,, this will work 100 times better than killin'

Roe v Wade,,, all that will do is open up the black market,,,

If your a poor person,, abortions give you time and save the government money,, the government don't mind saving money,,, a program that puts cash in hand will end abortion...

Come on Christians,,, who needs a tax hike? For the kids! Put your money where your mouth is....

I'm dead serious,,, it's only money,,, and money is a false God,, we can afford it!

The wedge issue was invented to make voters think of something other than their wallets,,purses,, bank accounts,,, and what it is their paid to work,,, what benefits they are getting or not getting....

I believe this alone guarantees protection of Roe v Wade,,, the rich who need the wedge will not have it destroyed,,,Tax breaks for the rich.. Vote Republican!!

TY Roe v Wade,,,,,TY gay marriage,,,TY God and Guns...

Now after all that,,, if by chance I meet her,, buy her dinner,,, see a movie,,. go back to my place/her place bumpity bump bump bumpity,, and she tells me she's pregnant,,will I be Pro life again? I dont fink so,, but I will be heart broke if she's not and chooses to do what my daughter did...

I don't understand how you can legislate such a personal issue.....

The Ten Commandments were written long before abortion was even possible..

Thou shalt not kill,,, definitely needs an amendment!

I like Sarah,, but I am voting with the workin' mans wallet..

I heard today on Foxnews,, someone said this Vp Choice made Dan Quale feel like Thomas Jefferson!

Catchin holes in the sky,, Union Ironworkers build America!

The conservative philosophy is turning America into China,, time to try something new..

Obama/Biden,,,, well I like Nader,,, as well,, but,,,well,,, For Senate,, might be there for him..

[DrJ]

Accountable;967419 wrote: Nearing the mid-forties, I would expect the wisest choice would be prevention, either with a tie or a snip so to speak, if one doesn't want children.


I believe the gamble is all part of the excitement!:driving:

The Gambler,, knows when to hold em,,

How did Roosevelt hurt this country again?

[DrJ]

Here's initial responses to the Govenor of Alaska,,,

facts wrote:

McCain's Palin pick is the epitome of tokenism

Suddenly all anyone needs to qualify as a potential commander in chief is to be a religious ideologue with female gender characteristics?

By Joe Conason

Aug. 30, 2008 | It is hard to think of a more cynical and contemptuous political act this year than John McCain's selection of Sarah Palin as his vice-presidential running mate. Having served as governor of Alaska for less than two years -- and as mayor of a small town before that -- her qualifications for national office are minimal.

Palin is the epitome of tokenism, exactly what conservative Republicans have always claimed to scorn, until today, as the politics of quotas and political correctness. Even Rush Limbaugh is a feminazi now (at least until Election Day).

But if Palin's résumé is limited, to put it politely, she possesses the only two qualities that McCain now seems to consider essential: She is a right-wing religious ideologue with female gender characteristics. Suddenly that is all anyone needs to qualify as a potential commander in chief of the world's most powerful military. We probably won't hear so much from now on about "experience" and "judgment," McCain's vaunted standard for the presidency until ... today. We certainly won't hear again about the "person most prepared to take my place," the phrase he has used more than once to describe his main criterion for a running mate.

When CNN political correspondent Dana Bash interviewed McCain last April, she mentioned his joke that one of the two main tasks of the vice president is to check on the president's health every day, a job of particular importance in his case. What did he mean by that? It was just a humorous remark, he said. But when she pressed him further, McCain said: "I think about whether that person who I select would be most prepared to take my place. And that would be the key criteria [sic]."

Sometime between then and now, a focus group must have told McCain and his handlers that the experience argument wasn't cutting against Barack Obama, that the nomination of Joe Biden as Obama's running mate had eviscerated it completely -- and that instead he and his consultants had better find a way to corral disgruntled Hillary Clinton supporters, or forget about winning come November.

Clearly nobody in the Republican camp is concerned that Palin would be clueless in a national security crisis, should a 72-year-old or older President McCain abruptly die or become disabled. Perhaps the GOP will have to mothball all those "Country First" banners along with the experience meme, because no candidate who puts the security of the nation above politics would ever contemplate this maneuver.

Even as a political tactic, choosing Palin may well backfire. Presumably the same Clinton voters who were willing to vote for McCain mostly to vote against Obama -- despite the Arizona senator's right-wing record on reproductive rights and pay equity -- will be pleased by the choice of Palin. But by definition those voters were already attracted to the Republican side. The calculation is that millions of undecided Hillary backers will cross partisan lines because a woman is on McCain's ticket. But will they believe that Palin is comparable to Clinton just because both happen to be female? Or will they regard that comparison as an insult to their heroine?

The Palin nomination will be celebrated as a measure of social progress by optimists like my friend Joan Walsh. At the very least, let us hope that the Republicans will no longer complain so bitterly about affirmative action, since they have taken that policy to its absurd conclusion in what may be the most fateful decision of this campaign.

Back when the first woman was nominated by a major party to be vice president, conservatives didn't react quite so positively as today. In August 1984, an editorial in the National Review mocked Democrats for choosing Geraldine Ferraro to run with former Vice President Walter Mondale. "The Democrats will attempt to project the issue as 'whether a woman can be Vice President,' a point the Republicans can cheerfully concede, returning to the question of whether this woman in particular should be the Vice-President ... Mrs. Ferraro is manifestly an affirmative-action nominee. She has been in the House only since 1979 and cannot be said, on the record, to be as qualified to be President, if necessary, as, say John Glenn, Fritz Hollings, Mo Udall, or -- George Bush."

Looking back on the Ferraro nomination, another well-known conservative wrote: "I believe that someday we are going to have a woman president, possibly during my life, and I've often thought the best way to pave the way for this was to first nominate and elect a woman as vice-president. But I think Mondale made a serious mistake when he picked Geraldine Ferraro as his running mate. In my view, he guessed wrong in deciding to take a congresswoman that almost nobody had ever heard of and try to put her in line for the presidency ... I don't know who among the Democrats might have been a better choice, but it was obvious Mondale picked Geraldine Ferraro simply because he believed there was a 'gender gap' where I was concerned and she was a woman."

Those are the words of Ronald Reagan in his 1991 memoir, "An American Life," pouring scorn on the nomination of a woman who had served six years in Congress working on foreign policy issues. In retrospect, he had a point. Only this Palin gambit could make the Ferraro mistake look responsible and wise.




Here's another that challenges women,,, Do they fully understand what McCain thinks of them with this pick....

facts wrote:

Who is Sarah Palin? Here's a quick rundown of her resume: she's the former point guard and captain of the Wasilla (Alaska) High School Warriors who wsent on to become Miss Wasilla 1984 before working as a local news sports reporter who then served as city councilwoman and mayor of the town of about 9,000 before being elected governor of her home state just two years ago. Here, a look back at the womanh who failed to become Miss Alaska, but could be a heartbeat away from being President of the United States of America.

I could separate out each element in that paragraph, with my own comments [sarcastic and otherwise... it's just so rich with possibilities], but why bother...



Here are some more comments from another article, the timelines being in reverse order [upon which I'll resist making comments on, as well... one references what you already have, anyway]:



Pain, 44, is a self-styled hockey mom and political reformer who has been governor of her state less than two years.

. . .

At 44, she is a generation younger than Sen. Joseph Biden of Delaware, who is Barack Obama's running mate on the Democratic ticket.

She is three years Obama's junior, as well_ and McCain has made much in recent weeks of Obama's relative lack of experience in foreign policy and defense matters.

. . .

She is a former mayor of Wasilla who became governor of her state in 2006 after ousting a governor of her own party in a primary and then disptaching a former governor in the general.

. . .

"Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin, a self-styled 'hockey mom' who has only been governor for a little over a year, is GOP Presidential candidate John McCain's choice for Vice President, CNBS has learned," he reports.

. . .

"But now Palin is also caught in a probe of her official conduct that likely nixes whatever chance she had to be on the McCain ticket. She's only been a governor for two years, but that's about four times as long as someone else mentioned as GOP VP pick, Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal.

However, questions have now arisen over whether Palin used her office to try and fire her ex-brother-in-law from a state trooper's position. Palin asserts the charge is untrue, but the Alaska Senate this week approved the hiring of an independent investigator to look into the allegation.

* * *

"Sarah Palin is a great choice," said Grover Norquist, a REpublican activist best known for his economic conservatism.

"She's got it all, and is a remarkable leader who brings a number of good qualities to the table," said Wendy Wright, president of Concerned Women for America.

***************



Ey yi yi... this makes me want to watch every late-night comedy show, the world over. I'll have a bank account filled with laughter that will last me for years to come.



She and Biden will be debating at some point in Missouri. My only reductio ad absurdum comments on that are that I'll be interested to hear her comments on foreign policy. She's been to Paris once on a shopping extravaganza and thinks we oughta be nicer to the French so she can get better deals next time?

She'll be stockpiling cans of hair spray and hair dryers... for possible chemical and heat warfare in future military conflicts? That she won't worry about gun powder when she's got face powder?

This is the one who foreign leaders will be looking to have possible conversations with? OR ~ happy happy women here ~ would Palin simply be relegated to the back burner, so typical of historical VP positions?



Not only has he pandered to women, but he's been condescending to them, as well. Has it not occurred to him that women have fought so long and hard so as to be taken seriously for their accomplishments and achievements... NOT simply because they're a woman with a pretty face and body??



If the Independents and Undecideds and thinking women don't see this as a clear message that they need to declare for Barack Obama... and, IF he someone swung this absurd parody, I may just move to Canada. She's in the pockets of the OIL rich... and she shares McCain's views on Roe v Wade.

This would set back both the United States and women in general by decades... and decades. He'd have done better to convince Hillary to cross over the line, or [gee... maybe a bit less 'pretty' but] to have chosen one of many other, actually 'qualified' women.

I can't wait to see the debate between she and Biden in Missouri.

I can't wait to see Keith Olbermann and Jon Stewart.



Talk about undermining your own, supposed 'message' about what it takes to be President of the United States... you sure did it this time, McCain.



~ Lizzy

*************************

As you wrote that, I was writing the above. SO TRUE. I keep thinking that, too... that I oughta be glad... yet, I'm still ticked [p..... is the better word] that NOT only has McCain been willing to risk our country's safety and welfare by running HIMSELF... but NOW, he's really sealed that deal! Obama could just have that portion of his comments deleted, where he says that McCain cares about our country, too. There would go everything if that whole mess ever came to pass. I'm angry that he would have the audacity to play with MY future with such cavalier irresponsibility! NOT that it wasn't already that way... but this... !!!




I know republicans have a different type of dna,, when it comes to voting,, but I'd have to say that even this has got to have at least half of them scratching their heads............. You all will let these figure heads,, and that's all they are in the system on the right,,, the corporations have full control of these people,,,

they don't need to know anything,,, you christian right will let the corporations run our country into the ground,,,

they will come in the name of Christ,, they are the mark of the Beast,,

corporations are the beast,, and who voted for these people?

How long is it gonna take,, and what else do you all need to see,, to convince you,,, the Republican party,,, has sold America down the road,,

[DrJ]

Hoss;967922 wrote: Some republicans are younger, like me. I can't speak for everyone my age, but Barak Obama is the young democrat on their side, Sarah Palin is the young republican on our side. We want to be represented to, and my generation will welcome a woman or black leader, we're less caring of those kinds of things than your generation. Why is it OK for the democrats to do the same thing in Barak Obama, yet the republicans can't without it being called a political ploy?

I think you got beat at your own game and you’re jealous. And we did it in sincerity and its just got you mad.


Look,, I agree with you,, but she was picked just for the women that voted for Hillary,,, think about it.

What is the message being sent to all Hillary voters?

The RNC is buying into a media spin that tells them these women,, pro choice voting women will vote for McCain,,, don't you see?

He wasted it,,for an empty prize!

I feel for the Republican base,, they have been dealt a terrible hand,,

Nobody's mad,, There's no argument here for the move,, I just can't believe their truly that stupid...

I think it's the hail mary,, and McCain and the RNC have all but given up!

[Accountable]

DrJ;967759 wrote: How did Roosevelt hurt this country again?
His New Deal initiated programs that eroded or destroyed our culture of interdependence and self-sufficiency. Many were unconstitutional. Some got by court challenges, others did not.

Certain New Deal laws were declared unconstitutional by the U.S. Supreme Court on the grounds that neither the commerce nor the taxing provisions of the Constitution granted the federal government authority to regulate industry or to undertake social and economic reform. Roosevelt, confident of the legality of all the measures, proposed early in 1937 a reorganization of the court. This proposal met with vehement opposition and ultimate defeat, but the court meanwhile ruled in favour of the remaining contested legislation. Despite resistance from business and other segments of the community to “socialistic” tendencies of the New Deal, many of its reforms gradually achieved national acceptance.

(From Encyclopedia Britanica)

The most damaging program was Social Security, which has destroyed the American tradition (which immigrated with the families from abroad) of a family's children taking care of their parents. It also continues to give people a false sense that their retirement is securie, despite the fact that SS was never meant as a retirement plan. The two results together leave many of the elderly with not enough to live and nowhere to turn.



Then to compound the idiocy, people actually expect the federal gov't to fix the problems they created in the first place by getting into areas they were never meant to invade. :-5

[DrJ]

Hoss;967934 wrote: I disagree; I think he used his choice very wisely. She appeals to me on many levels.

She's a fighter of corruption in her home state. She stayed in her home state, raised her kids there, participated in the community and tried her best to improve it everyway she could. Her tenacity to improve things led her to higher levels of government. She's a dream candidate. She is qualified on every level, and she is appealing because she is a woman. It's win-win all around. Barak Obama chose Joe Biden for all the same reasons that met what his parties needs were. It's not a Hail Mary pass of hope and prayer, it’s a perfect Joe Montana- come from behind drive 70 yards to score and win the game. (Sorry for the analogy but my gramma was a huge 49er fan).


WoW,, I'M a Bengal fan,,who knew?

Your optimistic, that's good,, but it's going to play out,, and don't feel bad if it turns out I'm right,,, so far I'm battin' 1000,,, I've been lucky,, I'll admit,, plus I didn't start writing till I forgive myself for beatin' up on the Dixie Chicks,,

Tell Putin how qualified she is,,, Biden will be nice to her in the debates,,you'll see..

I think ol McCain might be in a lil trouble,,tho!

The Bengals should have won that last one,,,

[DrJ]

Accountable;967942 wrote: His New Deal initiated programs that eroded or destroyed our culture of interdependence and self-sufficiency. Many were unconstitutional. Some got by court challenges, others did not.

Certain New Deal laws were declared unconstitutional by the U.S. Supreme Court on the grounds that neither the commerce nor the taxing provisions of the Constitution granted the federal government authority to regulate industry or to undertake social and economic reform. Roosevelt, confident of the legality of all the measures, proposed early in 1937 a reorganization of the court. This proposal met with vehement opposition and ultimate defeat, but the court meanwhile ruled in favour of the remaining contested legislation. Despite resistance from business and other segments of the community to “socialistic” tendencies of the New Deal, many of its reforms gradually achieved national acceptance.

(From Encyclopedia Britanica)

The most damaging program was Social Security, which has destroyed the American tradition (which immigrated with the families from abroad) of a family's children taking care of their parents. It also continues to give people a false sense that their retirement is securie, despite the fact that SS was never meant as a retirement plan. The two results together leave many of the elderly with not enough to live and nowhere to turn.



Then to compound the idiocy, people actually expect the federal gov't to fix the problems they created in the first place by getting into areas they were never meant to invade. :-5


It was a different time,, people were suffering,, much like today,, without words like "World War",, Depression,, food lines,, joblessness,, that reached all the way up the chain,, he probably felt like anything was better than doing nothing..

Walk in a mans shoes,, the people are the life blood of a nation,, take care of them

was his thought,, I think the lessons of that time will help guide the new generation that inherit the problems left over for the next President,,

Let's hope so,,eh?:guitarist

About Miss Sarah,, tho

The conservative base is "fired up",,,

what other choice do they have,,,really?

They are stuck with this move,, they will live and die with it,,, this isn't an appointment to the supreme court,, this isn't another "Harriet Myers",,,, there is no chance for a do over,, they live with the judgement of John McCain.....

I've heard and read many things but the best one was the response to the "hail mary" of a team on the ropes,, and that it was more like the 70 yard 2 min drive of a Joe Montana,,, I like that one..

The truth is they have completely been befuddled by the success of the Democratic Convention,,, there are people who plan for years on the creation of a political convention,,, and now they are thanking God for another natural disaster,,

when's the last time you ever heard of one being canceled? It has never happened,, this shows where the state the right find themselves. They are sooooooo lost..



My underdog lovin' feelings,, are kickin it,, I can't help it!! I find myself feeling sorry for the sadly misguided right wing base,, for counting on these leaders,, who are consistently more and more incompetent...

Now they got their right wing pundits working their hearts out,, trying to shine light on what little there is to shine on,, and I guarantee they are earning every un-Godly penny they get for it,, you see,, conning the American people,, is a job that has become very much more difficult after the performance,, of not only a Bush/Cheney administration,, but the many,, many right wing conservative republican Senators and Congressmen and women,, caring more for corporations than people...

If anybody caught Larry King,,, and his show with the conservative counter message to the DNC,, you would have witnessed the difficulty that is being felt by these conservative,, trickle down,, take care of those well off,, tax breaks for the Rich and powerful,, are having in their message.. The best sign was how slowwwwwwwwwwww they were talking,, trying their best to get thru the hour given to the right,, by Mr suspender man.... You could see it in their faces,, it must have felt like an eternity,, this one hour of counter message to Obama's message of change,, bottom up,, change..

Which is the most powerful type of change,, because it is out of the tops hands,, earth quakes don't care what'[s on top,, it's coming down,, moving,,,shifting,, it has no choice,, it's like a pregnancy,, this baby's coming, deny it if you will, it's coming,, its coming,, its coming!!!.

The truth is,, this generation of right wing conservative,, has destroyed too many hopes of a majority of the American population,, hence of the popularity of the buzz word of this election,,,,"HOPE"!!!!!!

I am not surprised by the resistance to it,, but I have to think that the more intelligent of the right wing conservative,, would get in game now,, if they truly believed how bad things could get for the rich,, because their only hope of any type of input is to join it,, not fight it.... The earlier your in the more people will listen to what it is your so worried about...

I am sure that there are those that knew all along the "trickle down" con wasn't going to play forever,, you notice the re-entry of the Cold cold war,,, The Dems have been handed the case to take over,,, corporations,, realize the power of the mob,,, the people,, they know the only thing that weakens the people,, is their education,, of the big picture that is this world,, the unawareness of the non-mechanic taking their car into the garage,, who merely "HOPE" there are good,, descent,, honest mechanics in there,, that won't take them for the ride,, that many do... Just my personnel opinion.

The gravity of this situation will not be realized till long after the election,, the belief in the die hards,, the right wing,,,one or two bad apples don't spoil the bunch,,, girl,, crowd,, not mentioning any names,, Are the saddest of the bunch in my mind,, because the gravy train they have enjoyed in this,,trickle down con,, has matured,, has evolved into a gravy rope,, it's getting slippery,,.

you can hear it in their words,, see it in their faces,, the desperation in their crying eyes,,, the "mob" is aware!!!!

As far as the media goes,,,Cnn and Msnbc are honestly projecting what is taking place in this country,, in the Democratic party,, finding it more difficult to buy into the far right message,, Foxnews is still fighting it,, tooth and nail,, but the left wing pundits are finding the words,, that are being hushed on a more obvious level,, Hannity and OOOOREALLY,, are hurting the foxnews channel,, commercially,, which speaks volumes as to their destiny!

As far as the "Sarah" situation is concerned,, I believe this will play out into a sad understanding of how people get sucked in to a belief in this "Right wing" rigid belief that the people don't matter,, that it is some how more important to take care of Big oil,,,Big money,, than human beings,,, the American family,, those with no voice,, being taken advantage of by these high priced voices that don't care nothing about regular everyday Americans,, handing them minimum wage,, minimum benefits and expecting more from them, for the good of the American Corporation.



The American Unions have been hardest hit by this trickle down economy,, convincing union members to give up certain progress,, fought for by prior generations,, making concessions on benefits and wages,, not to mention conditions for the American worker,, making union members split loyalties,, not trusting the union to fight for them,, giving in to corporations demands of less for them.



Unions set the bar for how all American workers are treated,, it effects everyone whether your union or not..

The strength of a country is in its work force,, that's why ending this Top/Down trickle down conservative philosophy,, is not only imperative,, but mandatory in the recovery of this downward spiraling American economy..



The good thing that will take place in a strengthening of unions in America,, will be for workers and companies alike,, a more balanced America between worker and employer will strengthen the country,, ending this need for un-documented workers,, and going along way to curing America's immigration problems,, and the people resisting this are the people that only care for the present,, and don't care about America's future,, and those will be out ed as non-Patriots,, even enemy combatants making it very unpopular for these companies to operate here in America,,, a country that cares about its people..



The right wing strangle hold is Ending,, we are taking it back,,, the people own America,, not the corporations.

Fear mongers will be exploited for who or what they are,,, Freedom will become stronger..

BELIEVE!!!

DrJ





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It's only a deal if it's where you want to go. Find your travel deal here.

[Accountable]

DrJ;968665 wrote: It was a different time,, people were suffering,, much like today,, without words like "World War",, Depression,, food lines,, joblessness,, that reached all the way up the chain,, he probably felt like anything was better than doing nothing..



Walk in a mans shoes,, the people are the life blood of a nation,, take care of them

was his thought,, I think the lessons of that time will help guide the new generation that inherit the problems left over for the next President,,

Let's hope so,,eh?:guitaristI don't deny he probably had good intentions, but the ends do not ever justify the means. Laws have a way taking on a life of their own. If laws had a time limit, it might be a different thing.

[DrJ]

Accountable;968833 wrote: I don't deny he probably had good intentions, but the ends do not ever justify the means. Laws have a way taking on a life of their own. If laws had a time limit, it might be a different thing.


hoss wrote:

I wish all laws had a time limit on them, so when they become outdated it can't be used for another issue.




The most damaging program was Social Security?

Now my experience with social security,, is from observing those receiving,, and they had been saved by it,, My grandmother retired from a grocery chain,, called Krogers,, back before it had developed any significant retirement program,, and her SS check saved her as it added to a almost non existing retirement program..

My uncle who suffered from a learning disability,, back before they even had a clue

there were so many in humans,, at different levels,, his SS,, made it possible for him to contribute to his own self care,, a God send to someone with nothing..

Another one of her sons lived a life without the benefit of a retirement program,, in his last years,,,again a God send for an old alcoholic dry wall hanger,,, It's like workin' for Walmart your whole life,, and getting a cup a coffee after they mark your name off the employee list,, his own fault,, for being satisfied with so little and not worrying about retirement,, SS saved him...Ty Roosy :thinking



SS

which has destroyed the American tradition (which immigrated with the families from abroad) of a family's children taking care of their parents. Acc thought..

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Well I think it has some of the same thinking,, only it includes help with those families who were burdened by the responsibility,, by taxing one generation to help those that came before them,,, a reward like thing....

I believe you must ,, or should need to be a US citizen to receive it,,

``````````````````````````````````````````````````````

It also continues to give people a false sense that their retirement is securie, despite the fact that SS was never meant as a retirement plan. The two results together leave many of the elderly with not enough to live and nowhere to turn.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

This is where I agree but think we could do better,,, any who survive past the age of 70 in America,, deserves free food,, water,, and all prices of every other thing needed discounted,,gas/elect/housing,, and medicaid on steroids... I believe these should be imposed on every that does business in America,, I mean right off the top,, included in bids,, discounted prices for the necessities..

I believe it should be excluded from those with retirement packages over and above a minimum wage job... and that should be raised to meet the needs of the day,,year,, with inflation,, people first,,, families first

````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````

Then to compound the idiocy, people actually expect the federal gov't to fix the problems they created in the first place by getting into areas they were never meant to invade.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

explain that,, an example,, maybe,, or have I mentioned it?

Do you think these ideas would break America,,, destroy all profit margins,,

or hurt more than it would help,,,People first,,profit second?

[Accountable]

DrJ;968896 wrote: The most damaging program was Social Security?

Now my experience with social security,, is from observing those receiving,, and they had been saved by it,, My grandmother retired from a grocery chain,, called Krogers,, back before it had developed any significant retirement program,, and her SS check saved her as it added to a almost non existing retirement program..



My uncle who suffered from a learning disability,, back before they even had a clue

there were so many in humans,, at different levels,, his SS,, made it possible for him to contribute to his own self care,, a God send to someone with nothing..



Another one of her sons lived a life without the benefit of a retirement program,, in his last years,,,again a God send for an old alcoholic dry wall hanger,,, It's like workin' for Walmart your whole life,, and getting a cup a coffee after they mark your name off the employee list,, his own fault,, for being satisfied with so little and not worrying about retirement,, SS saved him...Ty Roosy :thinking

Please don't take my response personally. I am only using the examples you provided.



Each of these people had family to help. Your first story implies that no one in her family were willing to take her in. If that's true I think it's shameful. If it's a dignity thing, meaning that SS allowed her the dignity of living on her own without depending on others, SS is depending on others, it is depending on complete strangers to provide something her family should have been champing at the bit to provide.



The uncle likewise should have been helped by his family. Even without that, SS is not the only safety net. There is always welfare. State and local programs are also available that are more flexible than a federal program could ever be.



For the last, yes it was his own fault for not thinking about retirement and saving for it. Another example of SS destroying the family network.

[Accountable]

DrJ;968896 wrote: SS

which has destroyed the American tradition (which immigrated with the families from abroad) of a family's children taking care of their parents. Acc thought..

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

Well I think it has some of the same thinking,, only it includes help with those families who were burdened by the responsibility,, by taxing one generation to help those that came before them,,, a reward like thing....



I believe you must ,, or should need to be a US citizen to receive it,,My wife's not a US citizen. She's eligible.

DrJ wrote: ````````````````````````````````````````````````````

It also continues to give people a false sense that their retirement is securie, despite the fact that SS was never meant as a retirement plan. The two results together leave many of the elderly with not enough to live and nowhere to turn.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

This is where I agree but think we could do better,,, any who survive past the age of 70 in America,, deserves free food,, water,, and all prices of every other thing needed discounted,,gas/elect/housing,, and medicaid on steroids... I believe these should be imposed on every that does business in America,, I mean right off the top,, included in bids,, discounted prices for the necessities..

I believe it should be excluded from those with retirement packages over and above a minimum wage job... and that should be raised to meet the needs of the day,,year,, with inflation,, people first,,, families first That's a great idea! It shows the gratitude and respect for our elderly they deserve. But a federal program is neither necessary nor constitutional. That's the purview of state governments. By leaving it with them, they can benchmark of each other's programs and improve on your idea far surpassing a blanket one-size-fits-all federal program.

DrJ wrote: ````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````



Then to compound the idiocy, people actually expect the federal gov't to fix the problems they created in the first place by getting into areas they were never meant to invade.

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

explain that,, an example,, maybe,, or have I mentioned it?

I was referring to SS, but the housing bubble is another example. The gov't pushed for more home ownership, ignoring the minor detail that if more people could afford homes they would buy them. They stirred up a buying frenzy that tempted people to make bad decisions and over-extend themselves. Then they sat there shocked that the people couldn't pay up when the bills came due. :yh_doh

DrJ wrote: Do you think these ideas would break America,,, destroy all profit margins,,

or hurt more than it would help,,,People first,,profit second?
I don't get your obsession with profit, or do you assume I'm the one obsessed?



But for the rest: YES!! Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. The US federal government's job is to protect us from those outside forces that would prevent us from chasing our own dreams ... on our own. It's job is not to pick up the tab for the consequences if we should fail. That's our responsibility.

[DrJ]

Accountable;969073 wrote: My wife's not a US citizen. She's eligible.




NOT FOR MY PROGRAMacc wrote:

That's a great idea! It shows the gratitude and respect for our elderly they deserve. But a federal program is neither necessary nor constitutional. That's the purview of state governments. By leaving it with them, they can benchmark of each other's programs and improve on your idea far surpassing a blanket one-size-fits-all federal program.


Plus it would slow these predatory companies who target the elderly,,

The passing of a law is about all the government would need to do,, and like SS,,

it wouldn't be considered welfare,, and the elderly would be in a more deserving position,, but I imagine their would be some companies that would start dodging the elderly,,, I can see the lawsuits now,, you turn 70,, and the business community all of a sudden doesn't want to know your name,, much less talk to ya!

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

acc wrote:

I was referring to SS, but the housing bubble is another example. The gov't pushed for more home ownership, ignoring the minor detail that if more people could afford homes they would buy them. They stirred up a buying frenzy that tempted people to make bad decisions and over-extend themselves. Then they sat there shocked that the people couldn't pay up when the bills came due. :yh_doh

I don't get your obsession with profit, or do you assume I'm the one obsessed?




:yh_rotfl

I see the problem now!

I see your attitude as leaning conservative in your belief in,, personal gain,," go get your own piece",, I am refering to,, I agree with that,, but I can't make that a broad brush belief on the many,, because of education,, and opportunities, are not equal for everyone,, I guess it's the luck of the draw from birth,, some have a different journey is all I'm saying,, and I understand how when people stick together,, they become a force,, Unions helped the American economy,, and strengthen the middle class,, we buy the goods,, because of conditions and wages fought for.. Weakening that shrinks the middle..

Let's just say the buying power of Americans is effected..

You offer someone a home,, that doesn't have one,, you tell me how they say no..

You offer to pay off all their bills--refinancing,, tell me how they say no...

The Government let this go on,,and on,, now it blows up,,

whose held Accountable?

The loan givers made their money,, and are out,, wait a sec,,

A couple have to go to a hearing and explain why they made so much money..

It's an arguement for regulation,, Govt. involvement..



acc wrote:

But for the rest: YES!! Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness. The US federal government's job is to protect us from those outside forces that would prevent us from chasing our own dreams ... on our own. It's job is not to pick up the tab for the consequences if we should fail. That's our responsibility.


Tell that to the bailed out corporations...

The problem is,, the Govt. likes your opinion,, until it involves some idiots running a company,, that falls apart,, much like the loan receivers who are foreclosed on..

Who in their right mind,, would vote someone to represent them in office that wouldn't consider them in the same viens as they consider the people who are on the board of directors of some failed company?

I've been reading excerpts of this book about Nixon,, it was about the birthplace of red and blue,, how it began with Nixon,, the vietnam war,, I was going to paste it,, but lost it,,will find again..

The people either loved Nixon,, or wanted to kill him,, no inbetween..

Did you hear of the three arrested for a conspiracy to assassinate Obama in denver,, something about the three being tied to Abramoff and someone else..?

Crooksandliars.com,, I couldn't get to it,, I got blocked for some reason..

Some other thing where there are some ,,snatch and grabs,, going on in St paul.

their going in houses and arresting people for unknown reasons..

Can you imagine an America where your opinion could be considered against the law?

The easy part you give the Govt.. protecting us from outside forces,, I find it fasinating that more people don't worry just as much or more from inside forces as well!

Freedom is dying,,conspiracy man,,, or maybe I have had the wrong impression of what freedom truly is,,,,I know I've always tied it to money...:guitarist:sneaky:

[DrJ]

nixonbook wrote:

After Chicago I changed from being a pacifist to the realization that we had to defend ourselves. A nonviolent revolution was impossible. I desperately wish it was possible."

And, several months after that, an ordinary Chicago ad salesman would be telling Time magazine, "I'm getting to feel like I'd actually enjoy going out and shooting some of these people. I'm just so goddamned mad. They're trying to destroy everything I've worked for -- for myself, my wife, and my children."

This American story is told in four sections, corresponding to four elections: in 1966, 1968, 1970, and 1972. Politicians, always reading the cultural winds, make their life's work convincing 50 percent plus one of their constituency that they understand their fears and hopes, can honor and redeem them, can make them safe and lead them toward their dreams. Studying the process by which a notably successful politician achieves that task, again and again, across changing cultural conditions, is a deep way into an understanding of those fears and dreams -- and especially, how those fears and dreams change.

The crucial figure in common to all these elections was Richard Nixon -- the brilliant and tormented man struggling to forge a public language that promised mastery of the strange new angers, anxieties, and resentments wracking the nation in the 1960s. His story is the engine of this narrative. Nixon's character -- his own overwhelming angers, anxieties, and resentments in the face of the 1960s chaos -- sparks the combustion. But there was nothing natural or inevitable about how he did it -- nothing inevitable in the idea that a president could come to power by using the angers, anxieties, and resentments produced by the cultural chaos of the 1960s. Indeed, he was slow to the realization. He reached it, through the 1966 election, studying others: notably, Ronald Reagan, who won the governorship of California by providing a political outlet for the outrages that, until he came along to articulate them, hadn't seemed like voting issues at all. If it hadn't been for the shocking defeats of a passel of LBJ liberals blindsided in 1966 by a conservative politics of "law and order," things might have turned out differently: Nixon might have run on a platform not too different from that of the LBJ liberals instead of one that cast them as American villains.

Nixon's win in 1968 was agonizingly close: he began his first term as a minority president. But the way he achieved that narrow victory seemed to point the way toward an entire new political alignment from the one that had been stable since FDR and the Depression. Next, Nixon bet his presidency, in the 1970 congressional elections, on the idea that an "emerging Republican majority" -- rooted in the conservative South and Southwest, seething with rage over the destabilizing movements challenging the Vietnam War, white political power, and virtually every traditional cultural norm -- could give him a governing majority in Congress. But when Republican candidates suffered humiliating defeats in 1970, Nixon blamed the chicanery of his enemies: America's enemies, he had learned to think of them. He grew yet more determined to destroy them, because of what he was convinced was their determination to destroy him.

Millions of Americans recognized the balance of forces in the exact same way -- that America was engulfed in a pitched battle between the forces of darkness and the forces of light. The only thing was: Americans disagreed radically over which side was which. By 1972, defining that order of battle as one between "people who identified with what Richard Nixon stood for" and "people who despised what Richard Nixon stood for" was as good a description as any other.

Richard Nixon, now, is long dead. But these sides have hardly changed. We now call them "red" or "blue" America, and whether one or the other wins the temporary allegiances of 50 percent plus one of the electorate -- or 40 percent of the electorate, or 60 percent of the electorate -- has been the narrative of every election since. It promises to be thus for another generation. But the size of the constituencies that sort into one or the other of the coalitions will always be temporary.

The main character in Nixonland is not Richard Nixon. Its protagonist, in fact, has no name -- but lives on every page. It is the voter who, in 1964, pulled the lever for the Democrat for president because to do anything else, at least that particular Tuesday in November, seemed to court civilizational chaos, and who, eight years later, pulled the lever for the Republican for exactly the same reason.

Copyright © 2008 by Rick Perlstein




Knowing your history could tell you a lot of what may happen in your future,,

The divided America refered to,, is a black mark in history if you ask me,, but unavoidable because of the diverse nature of the American population...

People say the democrats can't even agree with each other how can trust them with the wheel,,

I agree and think its because I believe the dems are a diverse bunch,, and there is no one belief that they all cling to,, exactly the same,, the republicans on the other hand seem more together,, more the same..

I have to believe from that they are detached from the true America because of that,, We are a diverse people and need the most diverse party to represent us,, in my mind,, I hope I don't get arrested for thinking that way,, hehehehe {kidding} I believe that has a lot to do with why the trickle down has failed...

Painting with the broad brush isn't nothing like America,, we're not Red,,,we're not blue,, and we're not white.

We are as a nation Red white and blue black brown red and don't doubt some are green...

I mean there are some people out there that got human traits but their eyes,,ALIENS I TELL YA!

But seriously folks,,

I mean its a wonder the color of our eyes weren't considered a possible division in the eyes of power,,, I believe the Blonde ,,,blue eyed,, were once considered superior by certain leaders,, imagine how I felt being the blonde hair blue eyed boy,,, I could have bought into it....:guitarist:sneaky::-5

How ignorant does that sound?

How many have the same thought of skin color,, that you know?

How ignorant does that sound?

[librtyhead]

Both parties are bad choices, but to make a decision before any real unbiased debate is accomplished would be a completly ignorant decision. They are both left or right liberal and I would like to see how they stack up to each other under pressure. No teleprompters for either one and a totally neutral moderator. (If that is even possible) As an Independant I am leaning towards the Republican side as less Government intervention is appealing to me. But I will not make any choices until I am in that voting box and us three are alone. People should be more concerned with local elections and research them with as much scrutiny as the Presidential race as those decisions will affect them almost certainly with direct consequence.

[DrJ]

librtyhead;969364 wrote: Both parties are bad choices, but to make a decision before any real unbiased debate is accomplished would be a completly ignorant decision. They are both left or right liberal and I would like to see how they stack up to each other under pressure. No teleprompters for either one and a totally neutral moderator. (If that is even possible) As an Independant I am leaning towards the Republican side as less Government intervention is appealing to me. But I will not make any choices until I am in that voting box and us three are alone. People should be more concerned with local elections and research them with as much scrutiny as the Presidential race as those decisions will affect them almost certainly with direct consequence.


Now that is definitely very intelligent.. your right,, lets have them, head 2 head,,

it's hard for me to vote against my wallet,,either way.. I'm a union man..

Well for some, what you say is true but if you don't stand for something,, you could possibly fall for either,,, My decision has been being developed over a 30 year span,, I'm 48,, and until around the first gulf war,, I never even cared what happen... I can see now how it effects my wallet,,retirement and such.

Less govt. that's a positive for the right,, I don't always believe it,, I believe when they say less govt,, they are saying,, have at it people,,, buyer beware,, Business can do anything it wants and the public is at its mercy,, the home owner crisis is an example,, I also have this thing about accountability,, saying less govt gives the govt an out in things like Katrina,, you all take care of it..

I mean,, I agree,, I don't want the govt in my home,, on my phone,, or even in my bood-waa,, i guess its a trade off,, I'm not sure about that..

I hate martial-law,, I mean I'd like to get away with speeding every now and then.

I don't trust anyone who trys to put fear in the hearts of voters,, it just doesn't sound right coming from a so-called leader of a free land,,

Home of the Brave,, I thought,, an intelligent American leader shouldn't be tellin' people to be afraid ,,,,period.. Gives off a bad smell to me..

I vote with my wallet,, and I'm not rich,, I'm not voting for anyone right, left,, middle who would rather take better care of those easier to care of,, the well off,, with tax breaks for people who want to ship my job over seas,, and then ship the same product back to America,,and sell me the very same at the same price..

Gotta cuzz in the auto workers union..

The China deals,, I heard the best one today,, they catch white samon along with the shrimp,, or something and call 'em garbage,, so they seperate them,, ship them to China,, who filets 'em,,packages them,, and ships them back to America..

Unbelievable,, these trade deals are killing families,, dropping them into an unnessasary poverty,, in my mind,, i think we have got to fix this,,right/left/middle,,throw em out,,get new people...

I guess the trickle down is easier because the rich are a minority,, the lets take care of the few,, and let them take care of the rest,, is the con of the century,, if you ask me.. I don't understand why anyone would vote that way,, unless they were RICH! The win win situations set for these people are un-godly..

Christ walks with the poor! Republicans avoid them,, like the plague!



To me,, there is no other reason to vote but your wallet,, all the wedges in the world don't mean a thing to me,, Pro choice/pro life,, the gay issue,, the gun ownerships,, are all a load of krap,, when it comes to picking a president or any other politician,, just items on their resume',, for a job that pays thru influence,,

and they could go either way on any of those issues..

How do you feel about ,,,Nader?

Tell me something,, are the wedge issue a factor in your voting decision?

[DrJ]

Accountable;969067 wrote: Please don't take my response personally. I am only using the examples you provided.



Each of these people had family to help. Your first story implies that no one in her family were willing to take her in. If that's true I think it's shameful. If it's a dignity thing, meaning that SS allowed her the dignity of living on her own without depending on others, SS is depending on others, it is depending on complete strangers to provide something her family should have been champing at the bit to provide.



The uncle likewise should have been helped by his family. Even without that, SS is not the only safety net. There is always welfare. State and local programs are also available that are more flexible than a federal program could ever be.



For the last, yes it was his own fault for not thinking about retirement and saving for it. Another example of SS destroying the family network.


Teach,, I have learned on the internet to never take anything personal,, my story is your story,, your story is like any story,, we are born,,she-it happens,, and we die.. We all have that in common,, we learn,,we do,,and we teach,,

The inbetween,, I have to think isn't all that different,, for anyone,, we're good here,, bad there,,, we have different tools,, to do the same thing,, We are born,, we learn gravity and leverage,, and we die,, all of us humans,, all of us with opinions,, all of us with memories,,good and not so good,, none of us are any different,, when it all comes down..

The song remains the same,,

My grandmother was the leader of a family,, with that SS,, she took care of her kids,, who had kids,, who had mo kids,, all the way up till she was almost blind from a stigmatism.. and then we finally got her to quit,, she is the strongest woman I've ever known,, she wouldn't let anyone take care of nothing for her..Amazing really,, her job on the farm,,kill dinner,, Walking thru fire was gravy,,

or it looked that way,, seeing her stand in the front yard of her home,, our home,, shakin her fist at the heavens,, when the storms came,,, daring God to take it..,

I was 36 yrs old,,when she went on,, we talk from time2time,,,, still.

Don't worry teach,, she understands you,,too..

It was a different time!

During ww2,, she got to work on the bombers,, till the boys come home,,, during that time she bought a house which is still in the family today.. 9000.00 she paid,, she had 4 children,, and a husband who got caught married in two other states with more children,, he was a traveling,, shoe saleman with a three state route.. The feds told her,, and she never even considered dating another man the rest of her life,, and I hadn't been born yet...

She lived the life..

3 of the 4 kids ,, including my mother,, left,, had kids and moved back.

We all grew up together,, in that same house,, the best God had to offer the human race,,,,, poor people,,, :guitarist:-6:sneaky::wah:

My lesson,, from it was,,

while alive,, we haven't the first clue,, of who we walk this earth with everyday..

The best of the best,, aren't from any school,, any job,, any war,, they are the secrets of the shadows revealed thru the experiences of everyone..

A collective perspective- you only realize in the smile of the dying..

I was married with 4,, my oldest was 19 when she finally got out,,, it was a good day..

[Accountable]

DrJ;969233 wrote: NOT FOR MY PROGRAMNo.

DrJ wrote: Plus it would slow these predatory companies who target the elderly,,

The passing of a law is about all the government would need to do,, and like SS,,

it wouldn't be considered welfare,, and the elderly would be in a more deserving position,, but I imagine their would be some companies that would start dodging the elderly,,, I can see the lawsuits now,, you turn 70,, and the business community all of a sudden doesn't want to know your name,, much less talk to ya!

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,As long as it's a state government that's passing the law, I don't have a problem with it.DrJ wrote: :yh_rotfl

I see the problem now!

I see your attitude as leaning conservative in your belief in,, personal gain,," go get your own piece",, I am refering to,, I agree with that,, but I can't make that a broad brush belief on the many,, because of education,, and opportunities, are not equal for everyone,, Intelligence and motivation are not equal for everyone, either.

DrJ wrote: Tell that to the bailed out corporations... I don't agree with corporate bail-outs any more than you do.

[Accountable]

librtyhead;969364 wrote: both Parties Are Bad Choices, But To Make A Decision Before Any Real Unbiased Debate Is Accomplished Would Be A Completly Ignorant Decision. They Are Both Left Or Right Liberal And I Would Like To See How They Stack Up To Each Other Under Pressure. No Teleprompters For Either One And A Totally Neutral Moderator. (if That Is Even Possible) As An Independant I Am Leaning Towards The Republican Side As Less Government Intervention Is Appealing To Me. But I Will Not Make Any Choices Until I Am In That Voting Box And Us Three Are Alone. People Should Be More Concerned With Local Elections And Research Them With As Much Scrutiny As The Presidential Race As Those Decisions Will Affect Them Almost Certainly With Direct Consequence.
Amen!

[DrJ]

Accountable;969597 wrote: Amen!


Deny it all you want,, America is pregnant,,, and this baby's coming,, no matter where you fall,,

It is soooooooo over,, watch there eyes,, when they talk,, the right wing messengers,, they even know.. I enjoy watching them squirm,,,:sneaky:

Liz wrote:

(1) Having read the tea leaves and seen the Masterpiece Historical Speech last night, he's doing what he can to steal Obama's thunder when he wins the election... as though it were no accomplishment, at all.


My favorite is the RNC understanding the gravity of the situation,, and finding it hard to sell the job to possible running mates, Sarah being the only one willing to risk her political reputation in the jungle of a country not gravitating to the conservative message as it should be by now..

Lizz wrote:

(2) Knowing that it's a throwaway nomination, he's banking on people thinking it's going to be a landslide for Obama, anyway, and so their own vote isn't really needed... hence, they stay home, instead; and then the morning count shows how foolish it was for Obama supporters to do that... and then McCain wins by default.


and i thought the 04 election was incredible,,,

I was in shock for a month,,, when Bush got re-elected,, in my mind,, and to this day I do believe #3 had to of happened because the only alternative was to believe the headlines of a British newspaper that stated ,,,,

How in the world could 50 million Americans be sooooo stupid?

I mean how could after 4 yrs of Bush/Cheney's experiment with the idea of an imperial president would sane Americans go into a voting booth and pull levers for King George,,, it had to be fixed,, the ruling class wasn't taking any chances,, they had to have 4 more........The oil contracts hadn't been signed yet!

lizzy wrote:

(3) He is setting the stage for a Diebold Coup... providing the 'rationale' for the 'outcome' that obviously women wanted a woman... so, many voted for him due to there being one on his ticket. And, that the Independent and Undecided "good ol' boys" couldn't resist a pretty woman, after all. And that the Evangelicals lost all ability to reason, in favor of the strong agreement with McCain on the pro-life stance of Palin.


The ruling class have accepted Mr Obama,, I'm guessing,, but anything could still happen, even something un-true, but made to look real as the stars in the sky... I have to believe even die-bold couldn't fake this election...

I have thoughts on why the polls are being called as they are,, but even with that,, I can't believe the American people would accept such a decision as obviously wrong as it would be,, to elect any who are not at least up to the intelligence level as Obama clearly is,,, in his understanding of the things needed for the good of a country tainted with so much dishonesty,, that the rest of the world,, no longer trusts America to think of anything other than its own gain,, in any endeavor we go into from now on... America needs honest change to fix the ills created by the Bush/Cheney/Rove/Addiston experiment of an imperialist president,, with no accountability,, with no one to answer to,, like a China,, or a Pakistan,, or even a Saddam led Iraq... It's a sad thing what has been done in our name,, but this is just the first time it has been realized while the person or administration is still in office... A fact most find more comfortable to deny....

I hope and pray the ruling class in America,, the intelligent people in power have to realize a line has been crossed that can only be fixed if the right thing happens in Nov. I know how this sounds to some,, but have a little faith, that those intelligent people in power know who Obama is,, and what he represents to a lot of good Americans who just believe America can do better,, and that's all they are asking..

[Accountable]

DrJ;969695 wrote: Deny it all you want,, America is pregnant,,, and this baby's coming,, no matter where you fall,,



It is soooooooo over,, watch there eyes,, when they talk,, the right wing messengers,, they even know.. I enjoy watching them squirm,,,:sneaky:
Despite the fact that I have yet to get a straight answer from you for a straight question, exactly what in Librtyhead's post shows denial?



librtyhead wrote: Both parties are bad choices, but to make a decision before any real unbiased debate is accomplished would be a completly ignorant decision. They are both left or right liberal and I would like to see how they stack up to each other under pressure. No teleprompters for either one and a totally neutral moderator. (If that is even possible) As an Independant I am leaning towards the Republican side as less Government intervention is appealing to me. But I will not make any choices until I am in that voting box and us three are alone. People should be more concerned with local elections and research them with as much scrutiny as the Presidential race as those decisions will affect them almost certainly with direct consequence.

[Accountable]

Who is Liz?

[DrJ]

Accountable;969805 wrote: Who is Liz?


Liz is another,,, searcher of the truth....

An internet chatter,,, Jennifer Anistin,,:sneaky:

Believe it or not,,,

Denial?,, I wasn't refering to his post,, just to the "land of the undecided"...

My family decided eight yr;s ago,, vote republican,, wait a sec,, ever since reagan.

The undecided,, aren't bad people,, they just haven't been paying attention..

hopefully it's because they are so successful,, they haven't the time,, or they are under 35,, and are still developing a political belief,, which is fine..

and,, lets face it,, it's not just me you and liberty reading this,, now is it?

Acc,, are you in the land of confusion as well,, looking for the revolution,,

the republicans have been split,, by independents,, the dems as well,,

interesting numbers appear,,,

sometimes that means republicans are favored in the split electorate,, but maybe not this time,, we shall see,, you have what I think is coming,,

Obama being the most intelligent by far,, by far,,,, by scary far..

here's some definitions,, for those undecided,,,:guitarist



choices wrote:

There’s no doubt that George W. Bush’s administration has been a catastrophe, and that historians will one day rank him as one of our nation’s very worst presidents. We’ve got to take back America—now—before solutions to national and global problems slip away into the distant future.

Because Bush and his allies have failed, our fellow citizens are ready to consider the progressive message. But what is it? In simple terms that all Americans understand, what do we stand for?

It’s crucial for us to have a simple, compelling answer. Yes, we’re for change…and prosperity, and peace. But these generalities aren’t persuasive enough. As U.S. Senator Byron Dorgan told a reporter for the New York Times:

I can describe, and I’ve always been able to describe, what Republicans stand for in eight words, and the eight words are lower taxes, less government, strong defense and family values. . . . We Democrats, if you ask us about one piece of that, we can meander for 5 or 10 minutes in order to describe who we are and what we stand for. And frankly, it just doesn’t compete very well.

The generic conservative message is pretty much taken for granted. Paul Waldman calls “low taxes, small government, strong defense, and traditional values” the “Four Pillars of Conservatism.” In Don’t Think of an Elephant!, George Lakoff listed the conservative message in ten words: strong defense, free markets, lower taxes, smaller government, family values.”

So what’s our philosophy? Fair wages, fair markets, health security, retirement security, equal justice…for all. Let me describe each in turn.

Fair wages means that we recognize and will address the problem of income inequality. Everyone wants, and deserves, a fair wage for their work. We’ll push toward this goal by increasing the minimum wage, promoting unions, and adopting a progressive strategy toward globalization.

Fair markets is the progressive response to free markets. Progressives need to employ this term to defend our economic ideology. There’s simply no such thing as a “free” market. If we continue to let the term go unchallenged without a proactive alternative, we may never overcome conservative economic framing.

Health security is a no-brainer. Quality, affordable health care for all is both an essential policy and a wildly popular one.

Retirement security may be the next healthcare. Baby Boomers are retiring, Social Security needs repairing, and current jobs generally don’t include any reasonable provisions for retirement pensions.

Equal justice encompasses many other values. This phrase is not only about justice in courts; we mean something broader—economic and social justice. After all, that’s what government is for. As James Madison wrote in The Federalist, “Justice is the end of government.”

Finally, for all represents the key distinction between progressive and conservative. Conservatives seek rights and opportunities for a select few. Progressives seek them for all.

You may look at this short description of progressivism and say there’s so much missing. What about environmentalism? Energy independence? Or national security? We can still talk about those. But the point of this exercise is to create a list that’s short enough to remember and repeat, while emphasizing the strengths of our progressive philosophy. We’re a multi-dimensional movement, but our strong suit is economic policy.

These twelve words are entirely consistent with the Democratic National Platform, which says in its very first paragraph:

We believe that each American, whatever their background or station in life, should have the chance to get a good education, to work at a good job with good wages, to raise and provide for a family, to live in safe surrounding, and to retire with dignity and security. We believe that quality and affordable health care is a basic right. We believe that each succeeding generation should have the opportunity, though hard work, service and sacrifice, to enjoy a brighter future than the last.

This is our time. The supreme challenge for progressives in 2008 is to focus our message so that all Americans understand who we are and what we stand for. If we succeed, we can change the future…for all.


Sometimes it's hard for me to understand undecided,,, but I'm trying!

[DrJ]

The right thinks the left hates them,, not true,, but saying that does shine a bad light on any who disagree..

I don't hate,, I don't agree,, can any on the right see the difference,, why are the disagreements considered acts of war to the right wing conservative,, your with or against,, and no in between,, I see the end of this election so clearly,, I feel sorry for those on the right,, in other ways,,(not you Md},, you are limited in the numbers,, taxes for the rich,, mostly,,

but for my right wing sister in florida,, who have seen,, observed,, and heard people,, that they know,, put the right spin about Palin,, in their ear,, and its as if it doesn't really have to be a good thing over all,, just in an area or two,, and it's justified by ignoring the many negatives it says..positives out weigh!!!! Even if the positives aren't even about governing,,

Hey,,, she's a soccer mom,,for Christs sake,, she has children, she luvs her hubby.. she wears glasses,, thats good enuff...

Democracy,,, it's so exciting now,, watching how they find a way thru this maze,, The intelligence to complete the journey,,

If your a right leaning voter,, you have got to play the cards your dealt,, and in Sarah's case,, sarah being McCains choice for Vice president for those undecideds,, you will take anything positive,, to help justify it in your mind,, so you can still feel you've done the right thing in supporting the right,,still,, to the best of your knowledge,, when you vote for a McCain/Palin,,, they have justified your choice just enough,, My own mother was the same,, not understanding everything,, but getting enough to justify her vote,, in her mind,, with Bush00,, he was a regular guy,, and Clinton had sex,, gore didn't even matter to her,,,, the second Bush 04,, he was more fun,, i seen him laughing,, he seemed a happier person than kerry.. That's good enough for my mom,,, Personality!!!

What does that say about the American voter? The American right wing base? Is the left any different?

You'd be surprised how many truly dont know,, and don't feel good/bad or indifferent about it,,

I know it sounds presumptive,, but the election,,, is an interesting journey to watch,, an intelligence in action,, seeing how Barrack Obama deals with voters who haven't got a clue the difference between a republican and a democrat..

People falling for the interpretations of the very unimaginitive Christian Right,, and the right wing politicians who take full advantage of these falling people,, is the reason I feel more people ought to pay more attention to the politics of the country they're from,,, Undecided? In todays times,, america's undecideds are compared to the passengers on the titanic,, who never had a clue what an ice-berg was before they run into one..

Palin will be fine when her lil adventure is over,, she's a nice woman trying to make a living,, the first woman used by the right in a presidential election,, I feel for her.. they will take over sarah's mind and she'll be saying a lot of things that will hurt her more than they hurt anyone,, she will mistakenly buy into the right's campaign killing machine,, it will effect her...

The negative divide and conquer,, will meet it's doom,, about time I think,, I'll enjoy watching it..

The problem with the right wing politician is it doesn't have a mind of its own,, or if it does,, it must hide it,, because to show their own mind is to dangerous to their message..

Family values,,, remember Dan Quale talking down to single moms,, they hid dan quayle,, Mind and message didn't mesh..

I see a lot of their message of negativity becoming obvious,,, to many,, fear of created enemies,, coming into focus,,

Forgiveness of self is the hardest lesson when realizing the hidden obvious.. for us all..

republican wrote:

OBAMA is a SOCIALIST..... that is UN-AMERICAN if not anti-American..... the Lefties in here keep ignoring the proof I posted the other day. What did OBAMA answer to the (liberal) ABC NEWS question (Charlie Gibson) .... in view of the fact that history shows that reducing corporate taxes actually increases the windfall of tax dollars for the federal treasury, why would you propose tax increases???..... without thinking, Obama simply stated: "well, I'm interested in fairness"...... meaning that he is interested in PUNISHING corporations for making so much money by INCREASING the rates....and dampening corporate investments within the US..... without realizing that the end result is actually negative, against the taxpayers..... THAT IS PURE SOCIALISM.....and that is PLENTY reason for not voting for this clown! He either is a committed socialist or he fails to understand basic economic behavior...


The spinning truths in an election is so far above the heads of undecided voters,, they could fall either way,,, and the right needs a new generation of people,, to energize itself,,changing the message wouldn't hurt either..

I believe companies will be glad to invest in America's future,, and a deal shall be worked out,, fearnot Mid,,we hear you!!! and we know what a clown does,,,

republican wrote:

BIDEN is another old-time socialist, like Ted Kennedy.... punish corporations and pretend to work for the common man... yet during the CLINTON years the rich got richer and the poor got poorer.... hmmmm, so much for "love of the masses".... OBAMA will do no differently!

WE LOVE CHANGE, if we understand what change OBAMA plans .... besides raising taxes and spending even more money than Bush 43 has been spending (with the approval of a Democrat-led Congress!!!) Let Obama change the Democrats in Congress who have bad habits of spending beyond their means....


We have more republicans to get out first,,, lets try it all dems and independs,, republicans who want to start caring a little more about those family values ,,redefined values,, might have a chance,, values,,college for the kids,, dr's for mom and dad,, healthcare,, people who want to work together for the people,,are welcome,,everyone else go on back to Alaska,,and Arizona,,,

Yea i remember the Clintons,, Hi I'm your buddy,,, Bill,, and the "Now be my slave" walmart hilary,,

That's why I never believed her,,, it's sad because it would have been a great story,,Barrack/Hillary,,

They did leave the poor out of a lot of equations,,, Obama/Bidon,, will be the people's story..







The right wing is too at ease with,,fearmongers,,,and the truth separated from reality,,

The republican party is dead,,these people are imposters,

some will no longer be considered worth speaking to or about,,,much less believing anything they say..

Very aggressive speech by Sarah Palin. Perhaps because it was written for her by the McCain campaign before she was even chosen (or vetted, for that matter.)

speechwriting wrote:

Putting Words in Palin’s Mouth

There was a flutter of attention when McCain campaign manager Rick Davis told a group of Post reporters and editors yesterday that his team was having to rework the vice presidential acceptance speech because the original draft, prepared before Gov. Sarah Palin was chosen, was too “masculine.” While we all wondered to ourselves what might make a speech masculine or feminine, no one batted an eye at the underlying revelation: that the campaign was writing the nominee’s speech before knowing who the nominee would be.

Interesting choice on her part to repeat rank falsehoods that have already been debunked ten times over. A sample:

I suspended the state fuel tax, and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. Strike One.

I told the Congress “thanks, but no thanks,” for that Bridge to Nowhere. Strike Two.



If our state wanted a bridge, we’d build it ourselves. When oil and gas prices went up dramatically, and filled up the state treasury, I sent a large share of that revenue back where it belonged - directly to the people of Alaska. Strike Three.

Obama Campaign Spokesman Bill Burton responds:

“The speech that Governor Palin was well delivered, but it was written by George Bush’s speechwriter and sounds exactly like the same divisive, partisan attacks we’ve heard from George Bush for the last eight years. If Governor Palin and John McCain want to define ‘change’ as voting with George Bush 90% of the time, that’s their choice, but we don’t think the American people are ready to take a 10% chance on change.”[


The spins are well hidden,, and those that don't pay attention might as well not vote,, to keep from committing political suicide,, voting against their own interest

and not even knowing it..

[Accountable]

Is this entire post as full of condescension as the few lines I read were? I ask because I don't want to waste any more of my time.

[DrJ]

Accountable;973090 wrote: Is this entire post as full of condescension as the few lines I read were? I ask because I don't want to waste any more of my time.


Well i dont know,,teach,, explain your definition,, of condescension?

Your not being honest with yourself,, if that's all you have to say...

They are being read all over the world,, teach,,

It would be nice to hear from anyone with an opinion,, I don't care how condesending it is,,, this site is full of condesending opinions,,

it just takes someone that's been paying attention long enough,, to have developed an opinion to write in here,,



You don't want to read,, it, much less have any kind of sensable dialogue,, sillyville is your specialty,, wedge issues fall in this category,,I'm sure your an expert,,

you used to have fire in ya,,Teach.

What happen to you?

Your alright,, I write for no man/woman,, I will discuss anything,, but it doesn't matter if people write in here,, I do this because writing it keeps me from going crazy in a world of people that don't care how many ice bergs they meet in a lifetime..

Wake up America.................iTS TIME!!!!

[DrJ]

Educating the American voter is easy,, all that you need to do,, is make them think...

Pay attention Gods creatures,, it's time!!



Living thru an election isn't any good when you don't understand the many ways the truth can be spun,, and how some truths can lead to a deceiving future,, so you not only have to check all facts quoted by candidates,, you also must understand what proven facts truly lead to,, what is their result,, it can be easy on the eyes and still rob you blind down the road..

The most interesting spin going in the current administration is 7 and a half years has gone by and no success has occurred in the hunt for Bin Ladan,, yet they still defend Pakistans right to do the searching...

I can only hope there are some behingd the scene type moves happening,, my only problem with this administration,, sadly is with the trust issues.. They need to find him..

Also the need to drill con being laid on the people,,, so far I only see selfish greed,, but that's just me..

Here's a conversation that adds focus by using an example,,, of the soap opera,, the best in show,,, the American democracy at work..

mdid wrote:

Dr. J.... you comment on the trivial stuff and ignore the substance of my post: is this or is this not SOCIALISM? (Ref Obama's answer to ABC's question about Obama's plan to increase corporate taxes:

"mid

OBAMA is a SOCIALIST..... that is UN-AMERICAN if not anti-American..... the Lefties in here keep ignoring the proof I posted the other day. What did OBAMA answer to the (liberal) ABC NEWS question (Charlie Gibson) .... in view of the fact that history shows that reducing corporate taxes actually increases the windfall of tax dollars for the federal treasury, why would you propose tax increases???..... without thinking, Obama simply stated: "well, I'm interested in fairness"...... meaning that he is interested in PUNISHING corporations for making so much money by INCREASING the rates....and dampening corporate investments within the US..... without realizing that the end result is actually negative, against the taxpayers..... THAT IS PURE SOCIALISM.....and that is PLENTY reason for not voting for this clown! He either is a committed socialist or he fails to understand basic economic behavior..."






trivial stuff??? How dare you? It's the rights bread and butter,, personality over the issues,, c'mon,,

Me and you both know how the republicans have conned their way into leadership roles,, by keeping it simple,,,

Lower taxes,, is what they say,, so they cut huge sums out of the corporate collection,, and that results in a cut on money for the states,, raising your state taxes,, poor and middle class making up the difference,, it's unfair,, but not obvious,, so they can keep saying,,we lower your taxes,, it's true,, they do,, and the least of American families have to kick it back in,, leaving the corporations to pay their ceo's,, higher profit margins,,, at the peoples expense,,

I am cutting you a break,, your side of the issue,, is weakened by the the result of a trickle down,, maturing to an obvious advantage,, an un fair advantage,, for the well off,, gravy train,, I think you called it,,

I'm not here to hurt your conversation,, but I just hope you know that it's all BS,, or your going to feel foolish,, down the road,, this elections over i believe,, but I like this conversation,,, there's good people here,, that care about this country..

they understand that we,, the voters have to kick it up a level,, in their understanding of how the political system works,,,personality,,, and not the issues,, isn't good enuff anymo,,, in fact it is the reason for electing clowns like,,GWB,, and letting cheney destroy our constitution,, because of a philosophy of fear and a sad belief that money buys integrity,, and the poor don't need civil liberties,, and should sit back and let the neo cons take them,, the saddest part of America is its representatives who believe if you have no money,, your voice doesnt count..

You can't pin Obama down,, you'd like to,, but I dont accept it,, as a sane argument against him,, socialist ideas are in every party,, and in everyone of us,, who work for a living,,

Tell me the truth,, How you really feel about Obama?

facts wrote:

Social democracy is a political ideology that emerged in the late 19th century out of the socialist movement.[1] Modern social democracy advocates the formation of a democratic welfare state that incorporates both capitalist and socialist practices.[2] This is unlike socialism in the traditional sense, which aims to end the predominance of the capitalist system, or in the Marxist sense which aims to replace it entirely. Instead, social democrats aim to reform capitalism democratically through state regulation and the creation of programs and organizations which work to ameliorate or remove injustices they see in the capitalist market system. "Social democracy" is also used to refer to the particular kind of society that social democrats advocate. While some consider social democracy a moderate type of socialism, others, defining socialism in the traditional or Marxist sense, reject that designation.

Social democratic parties initially advocated socialism in the strict sense, achieved by class struggle as defined by the Orthodox Marxists within or affiliated with the Social Democratic Party of Germany: August Bebel, Eduard Bernstein, Friedrich Engels, Karl Kautsky and Wilhelm Liebknecht.[1] Schisms within the party during the early 20th century led to the desertion of the revolutionary socialists, and the primacy of Bernstein's evolutionary or reformist democratic path for social progress within the social democratic movement.[1] Throughout Europe, a number of other socialist parties simultaneously rejected revolutionary socialism, and the followers of these movements ultimately came to identify themselves as social democrats or democratic socialists. Consequently, while social democrats share many views with the democratic socialists, they often differ on specific policy issues. The two movements sometimes share political parties, such as the British Labour Party in the 1980s, and the Brazilian Workers' Party today.[3]

One way to delineate between social democratic parties (or movements) and democratic socialist ones, would be to think of social democracy as moving left from capitalism and democratic socialism as moving right from Marxism: in other words, a mainstream leftist party in a state with a market economy and a mostly middle class voting base might be described as a social democratic party, while a party with a more radical agenda and an intellectual or working class voting base that has a history of involvement with further left movements might be described as a democratic socialist party[4]. However, this is not always the case. The British Labour Party charter identifies the party as a "democratic socialist party,"[5] even though the current and former leader, Gordon Brown[6] and Tony Blair[7], identify themselves as social democrats.

The Socialist International (SI), a worldwide organization of social democratic, and labour parties, defines the socialist option as one in which it is "the people of the world who should exercise control by means of a more advanced democracy in all aspects of life: political, social, and economic." The SI emphasizes the following principles: first, freedom—not only individual liberties, but also freedom from discrimination and freedom from dependence on either the owners of the means of production or the holders of abusive political power; second, equality and social justice—not only before the law but also economic and socio-cultural equality as well, and equal opportunities for all including those with physical, mental, or social disabilities; and, third, solidarity—unity and a sense of compassion for the victims of injustice and inequality. These ideals are described in further detail in the SI's Declaration of Principles[8].

Social democratic parties originally included both democratic socialists and revolutionary socialists. Indeed, the split with the revolutionary socialists, including Rosa Luxemburg and Vladimir Lenin, was spectacularly hostile. After World War I and the Russian Revolution, many leading social democrats, including Eduard Bernstein, were explicitly non-revolutionary. In reaction to this, many Bolsheviks and other Marxist-Leninist parties adopted a strategy of publicly denouncing social democrats as "social fascists






The people rule,, they elect representatives who give control to someone else,, the representatives,, need a good hangin' if you ask me,, we elect people to do our bidding,, not Exxon's,,, not shell's,, ours,,, the people own America,, wow,,what an Idea!!!



Who has been teaching you?

Check your facts!!

Do the Math!



DrJ



I realize,,"keeping it real", has its downside in the media,, especially when you have all the big money pundit pay,, which is slowly becoming a joke,, as far as appearances go,, with the idiotic nature of the political spin,, needed to point out a literal "needle in a haystack" of pro-people points in some agendas,, the realness of how an "Obama rally" effects the human psyche is in the eyes of everybody,, every reporter,, even those in the Foxnews are having trouble with spinning it all back to the right,, just as it had trouble with a Bush/Cheney administration after the attacks on 9/11,,, because we are all human,, the only question this viewer has about it all,, is maybe the lessons learned in the media during those tough times,, will help them still do their jobs of informing the people,,, objectively and truthfully.....



Keith Oberman's newscasts were the only quality information in the media after the political right took advantage of a softened media,,

and started selling fear to the people of America,, and now the right wing pundit world is trying desperately to grow new balls,, down the stretch of the election,, the only safety net America has against the emotional and patriotic blackmail of the far right's far spin lies,, and new fabrications of truths,, are media types not afraid to take them on...



The media in America was saved,, hey KO,, I'm curious,, how many of your colleagues realize this,, and how many resent it?



History will remember,,

Tony







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