Red Squirrels

Post by **Betty Boop** » Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:04 am

Clodhopper's mention of squirrels on another thread reminded me of this story in our local paper last week.

Prince Charles backs return of red squirrel into Cornish woodlands after cull of greys

It will be amazing to have the reds back, but not sure I agree with the cull of the grey. I can understand why it has to be done though. :-1

theia · Post by **theia** » Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:17 am

Betty Boop;1315616 wrote: Clodhopper's mention of squirrels on another thread reminded me of this story in our local paper last week.

Prince Charles backs return of red squirrel into Cornish woodlands after cull of greys

It will be amazing to have the reds back, but not sure I agree with the cull of the grey. I can understand why it has to be done though. :-1

No, I can't quite go along with the culling of the grey either. It's a little like the "weeds" and "cultivated flowers" debate. It seems that all these issues depend on one's point of view. I suppose if I'd had a problem with squirrels, grey or red, or badgers, or foxes, or rats, I'd be all for having them culled. As it is, I haven't and so any form of culling sounds very harsh.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:14 am

I can. I've seen them almost disappear from this part of scotland being replaced by grey squirrels. They're culling the local nature reserve of greys to try and give the reds a chance. Not altogether convinced you can entirely blame competition from grey squirrels.

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:33 am

Never seen a red squirrel. And unless they cull all greys and keep culling, they'll spread again. I understand that greys eat a more varied diet than reds, so colonise areas that reds can't. These areas would have to be completely culled as well.

I suspect it's futile.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:39 am

I've never seen a red one either, we have brown, black and grays here.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:46 am

Glenmore Shop

click on squirrelcam if the link doesn't work

Squirrel Cam

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 11:51 am

chuckle. There's a little grey blighter snacking on my roses at this very moment!

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 1:43 pm

theia;1315627 wrote: No, I can't quite go along with the culling of the grey either. It's a little like the "weeds" and "cultivated flowers"

I hate that debate!

I hope we dont have to hop on that merry go round again.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 1:50 pm

I'm a great believer in nature taking it's course.

I'm in a similar situation myself of late as being a seasoned barbel hunter, there's much a to do over the reintroduction of otters by well meaning conservationlists. The otters being put onto our river banks are asian otter who are decimating barbel stocks in our rivers. It's coming down to man choosing one species over another and it seems at times these choices are made on what's most cute.

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 2:03 pm

Betty Boop;1315616 wrote:

Prince Charles backs return of red squirrel into Cornish woodlands after cull of greys

It will be amazing to have the reds back, but not sure I agree with the cull of the grey. I can understand why it has to be done though. : -1

This is an extremely interesting development. AFAIK, the idea is to maintain a "no-man's land" in a stripe across The Lizard, having exterminated greys on the southern side, and re-introduce red squirrels to the protected area, and continuing to exterminate greys migrating into the "no-man's land". I really, really hope it works. Efforts are also being made "up North" where Red squirrels survive, which seem to be working. I would guess that 99% of us have never seen a red squirrel in the wild. I don't know what's disagreeable with controlling grey squirrels to preserve reds, except perhaps cost.

Snowfire · Post by **Snowfire** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 2:18 pm

I've never seen a red but years ago I did see a white one, I assume was an albino

Post by **Peter Lake** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 2:27 pm

Snowfire;1315914 wrote: I've never seen a red but years ago I did see a white one, I assume was an albino Only albino if the eyes are pink.

Snowfire · Post by **Snowfire** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 2:29 pm

Peter Lake;1315917 wrote: Only albino if the eyes are pink.

I never got that close. They tend to do that you know, run away from us big galloots

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon Jun 14, 2010 2:55 pm

Snowfire;1315914 wrote: I've never seen a red but years ago I did see a white one, I assume was an albino

an albino? We have never even heard of those ones here.

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:23 am

Odie;1315931 wrote: an albino? We have never even heard of those ones here.

Google (or whatever) "albino squirrel" to find a picture. There are lots of albinos out there - squirrels, gorillas, deer, crocodiles, bats, cats - you name it - even people.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:15 am

Bill Sikes;1315997 wrote: Google (or whatever) "albino squirrel" to find a picture. There are lots of albinos out there - squirrels, gorillas, deer, crocodiles, bats, cats - you name it - even people.

I've heard those cros bites can be nasty, even peoples can.

hoppy · Post by **hoppy** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:45 am

Usta love those bushy tailed lil' critters. Especially in a baking dish surrounded by cream of mushroom soup. Yummy.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:50 am

hoppy;1316010 wrote: Usta love those bushy tailed lil' critters. Especially in a baking dish surrounded by cream of mushroom soup. Yummy.

ewwwwwwwwwwwwwww!:yh_rotfl

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:59 am

I heard there's a butcher in Cornwall selling squirrel pasties. Apparently they just jump off the shelves!

hoppy · Post by **hoppy** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 5:20 am

Clodhopper;1316016 wrote: I heard there's a butcher in Cornwall selling squirrel pasties. Apparently they just jump off the shelves!

:yh_rotfl

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 7:22 am

Snowfire;1315914 wrote: I've never seen a red but years ago I did see a white one, I assume was an albino
Red squirrels are everywhere here. Are they the same as your red squirrels?

Raven · Post by **Raven** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 8:57 am

No. The reds they refer to are like the squirrel nutkin type. With the furry tufty bits at the end of their ears. And they are smaller.

American reds are more hardy as is the greys. The British reds are a bit fragile. And the British government is convinced the greys are bullying the little ickle reds out of existence. Personally I think it has more to do with British property developers than grey squirrels, but there you are. Everyone is going around killing off all the greys.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:12 am

Clodhopper;1316016 wrote: I heard there's a butcher in Cornwall selling squirrel pasties. Apparently they just jump off the shelves!

Groan...

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:16 am

Raven;1316042 wrote: the British government is convinced the greys are bullying the little ickle reds out of existence

Thai isn't actually true. The grey is a carrier of a virus ("squirrel pox"), which while it doesn't kill the greys, does kill reds.

Cute and cuddly but Scots prefer their squirrels to be red - Herald Scotland | News | Transport & Environment

The Grey Squirrel in Britain

This is latterly thought to be the most important factor in the decline of reds.

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:32 am

Raven;1316042 wrote: No. The reds they refer to are like the squirrel nutkin type. With the furry tufty bits at the end of their ears. And they are smaller.

American reds are more hardy as is the greys. The British reds are a bit fragile. And the British government is convinced the greys are bullying the little ickle reds out of existence. Personally I think it has more to do with British property developers than grey squirrels, but there you are. Everyone is going around killing off all the greys.
I thought they might have a little more of a cockney chirp to them.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 10:34 am

Raven;1316042 wrote: No. The reds they refer to are like the squirrel nutkin type. With the furry tufty bits at the end of their ears. And they are smaller.

American reds are more hardy as is the greys. The British reds are a bit fragile. And the British government is convinced the greys are bullying the little ickle reds out of existence. Personally I think it has more to do with British property developers than grey squirrels, but there you are. Everyone is going around killing off all the greys.

Possibly where you are but they are dying out in country areas as well - as bill says there's a bit more to it.

We have mink in the river near us, a recent arrival but you can already see the impact on the waterfowl locally.

My dog got a grey squirrel this morning.At least I think it might have, one jumped off a fence right in front of him and he went after it. When he came back there was blood on his muzzle so he either killed it or took a chunk off it.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 11:10 am

gmc;1316056 wrote:

We have mink in the river near us, a recent arrival but you can already see the impact on the waterfowl locally.

.
Blame the fur trade and the animal rights activists. Out of interest, how do you feel about the reintroduction of asian otters on our rivers?

Post by **spot** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:21 pm

You know, I'd rather have lots of squirrels rather than just a few rare sightings of the native red. If that means they're all bigger and greyer then fine. There are plenty of areas in Europe where the Red has no problem, there'll always be a few in the UK regardless of the threat the greys pose - that's how populations work. Whichever variant they are, they're still tree-climbing rats. Stop culling things.

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:16 pm

spot;1316067 wrote: You know, I'd rather have lots of squirrels rather than just a few rare sightings of the native red.

If there were no greys, there'd be reds all over the place.

spot;1316067 wrote: there'll always be a few in the UK regardless of the threat the greys pose

Whatever makes you think that?

Post by **spot** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:42 pm

Bill Sikes;1316073 wrote: [quote=spot]there'll always be a few in the UK regardless of the threat the greys poseWhatever makes you think that?[/QUOTE]The Irish experience. Things stabilized there and each predominates in its region. Maybe there's no such natural enclave in Great Britain, it seems reasonable to think there might be.

Yes, if there were no greys, there'd be reds all over the place. If there were no reds there'd be greys all over the place. I don't like mass extermination and I like it even less when euphemisms like "cull" are employed.

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Tue Jun 15, 2010 3:16 pm

spot;1316080 wrote: The Irish experience. Things stabilized there and each predominates in its region.

Can you provide any references to back up your statement? A brief search seems to indicate that this is not the case, unless for some reason there's an absence of greys in an area.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Thu Jun 17, 2010 1:48 am

Peter Lake;1316061 wrote: Blame the fur trade and the animal rights activists. Out of interest, how do you feel about the reintroduction of asian otters on our rivers?

That should get the anglers thoroughly worked up at least. There are allegedly others in the river near me but I've never seen one just footprints. I have seen mink though and that has had a catastrophic effect on the wildlife.

I would tell you what I think about the idiots that want to reintroduce wolves to scotland but just imagine a load of expletives instead.

Clodhopper · Post by **Clodhopper** » Thu Jun 17, 2010 2:59 am

While we're on the subject, people having been letting some variety of turtle loose in the East Midland waterways, and they are devastating wildlife too.

Post by **spot** » Thu Jun 17, 2010 5:56 am

Bill Sikes;1316100 wrote: [quote=spot]The Irish experience. Things stabilized there and each predominates in its region.Can you provide any references to back up your statement? A brief search seems to indicate that this is not the case, unless for some reason there's an absence of greys in an area.

How about this? There's mention of the Pine Marten as preferentially reducing grey populations, and the stability of reds even in areas with grey encroachment is mentioned.

Red squirrels may still be found in isolation, or with grey squirrels in several conifer-dominated areas such as the Sperrins, the Mournes and in west Fermanagh. Reds may still be considered locally common in the western counties of Northern Ireland, though a significant number of returns from these areas indicate that they are often found in woodlands with grey squirrel populations also. It is notable that red and grey squirrels have been found in the same areas in Fermanagh for several decades, as the habitat associations of the two species appear to differ (Tangney and Montgomery 1995); no apparent decline in red squirrel distribution in the past 10 years in this region has been documented by this survey.

http://www.coford.ie/iopen24/pub/irishs ... evised.pdf