An E Mail I received today...

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 10:11 am

Fwd:Letter to Mr. Cameron - Genius!!

The right Hon Prime Minister

Dear Mr Cameron

Please find below our suggestion for fixing the ****UK**** 's economy.

Instead of giving billions of pounds to banks that will squander the money on lavish parties and unearned bonuses, use the following plan.

You can call it the Patriotic Retirement Plan:

There are about 10 million people over 50 in the work force.

Pay them £1 million each severance for early retirement with the following

stipulations:

1) They MUST retire.

Ten million job openings - unemployment fixed

2) They MUST buy a new British car.

Ten million cars ordered - Car Industry fixed

3) They MUST either buy a house or pay off their mortgage - Housing Crisis fixed

4) They MUST send their kids to school/college/university - Crime rate fixed

5) They MUST buy £100 WORTH of alcohol/tobacco a week .....

And there's your money back in duty/tax etc

It can't get any easier than that!

P.S. If more money is needed, have all members of parliament pay back their falsely claimed expenses and second home allowances

If you think this would work, please forward to everyone you know.

Also.....

Let's put the pensioners in jail and the criminals in a nursing home.

This way the pensioners would have access to showers, hobbies and walks.

They'd receive unlimited free prescriptions, dental and medical treatment, wheel chairs etc and they'd receive money instead of paying it out.

They would have constant video monitoring, so they could be helped instantly, if they fell, or needed assistance.

Bedding would be washed twice a week, and all clothing would be ironed and returned to them.

A guard would check on them every 20 minutes and bring their meals and snacks to their cell.

They would have family visits in a suite built for that purpose.

They would have access to a library, weight room, spiritual counselling, pool and education.

Simple clothing, shoes, slippers, PJ's and legal aid would be free, on request.

Private, secure rooms for all, with an exercise outdoor yard, with gardens.

Each senior could have a PC a TV radio and daily phone calls.

There would be a board of directors to hear complaints, and the guards would have a code of conduct that would be strictly adhered to.

The criminals would get cold food, be left all alone and unsupervised.

Lights off at 8pm, and showers once a week. Live in a tiny room and pay £600.00 per week and have no hope of ever getting out.

Think about this (more points of contention):

COWS

Is it just me, or does anyone else find it amazing that during the mad cow epidemic our government could track a single cow, born in Appleby almost three years ago, right to the stall where she slept in the county of Cumbria?

And, they even tracked her calves to their stalls. But they are unable to locate 125,000 illegal immigrants wandering around our country. Maybe we should give each of them a cow.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also;

Think about this ... If you don't want to forward this for fear of offending someone -- YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM! It is time for us grumpy old folk of

****Britain**** to speak up! ****

****

****

** **

----

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Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 12:43 pm

Considering this has been posted in 'current events' as opposed to 'just for the fun of it' should we assume this is being taken seriously?

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 12:54 pm

Ahso!;1365966 wrote: Considering this has been posted in 'current events' as opposed to 'just for the fun of it' should we assume this is being taken seriously?

Given the nature of the E mail and given recent current events In the UK, one can take It In whichever context they wish. Some may choose to take It seriously whilst some may choose to laugh at It. Some may wish to even post their agreement of the appalling state of our elderly care homes In the UK, however as you are not the spokesperson for all other members, It Is up to the reader as to how they view It. Us British usually find this the democratic Issue of 'Choice'. You should try Iy. It can make life so more rewarding.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 12:59 pm

So you don't hold any position on this? As the copy and paste author of the thread it's only natural for others to think you have, as an adult, an opinion on the thread subject along with a reasonably logical defense of it. No?

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:06 pm

oscar;1365970 wrote: Given the nature of the E mail and given recent current events In the UK, one can take It In whichever context they wish. Some may choose to take It seriously whilst some may choose to laugh at It. Some may wish to even post their agreement of the appalling state of our elderly care homes In the UK, however as you are not the spokesperson for all other members, It Is up to the reader as to how they view It. Us British usually find this the democratic Issue of 'Choice'. You should try Iy. It can make life so more rewarding.

I agree with you completely on elderly care. It is a crime that prisoners have better benefits than pensioners.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:09 pm

Ahso!;1365973 wrote: So you don't hold any position on this? As the copy and paste author of the thread it's only natural for others to think you have, as an adult, an opinion on the thread subject along with a reasonably logical defense of it. No?

The purpose of a thread Is to evoke comment and debate from other members. It bears no difference to you or anyone else cutting and pasting a relevant news Item from the tabloids. That Is the way forums generally tend to work. Most members choose to concentrate on the content of an opening post rather than the pedantic's of a mod wannabe. Why not try posting a thread yourself that may generate members Interest? You never know, someone may actually be Interested In what you have to say !!

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:40 pm

I'm doing exactly that. I'm raising the subject of the audacity to: first, author; second, copy and paste; third, take seriously such insulting and patronizing trash. But I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

Have fun!

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:41 pm

Ahso!;1365983 wrote: I'm doing exactly that. I'm raising the subject of the audacity to: first, author; second, copy and paste; third, take seriously such insulting and patronizing trash. But I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

Have fun!Baloney or should I say 'Balamy' wink wink

The problem with self Imposed superiority Is that Invariably, others do not follow.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:43 pm

flopstock;1365976 wrote: I agree with you completely on elderly care. It is a crime that prisoners have better benefits than pensioners. This country has shocking examples. Something most British are thoroughly ashamed of and something our Government do nothing about.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:55 pm

flopstock;1365976 wrote: I agree with you completely on elderly care. It is a crime that prisoners have better benefits than pensioners.I'm wondering which you think should change, the treatment of prisoners, or the assistance to the elderly?

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:56 pm

Ahso!;1365986 wrote: I'm wondering which you think should change, the treatment of prisoners, or the assistance to the elderly? Both

There you go.... Debate... what did I tell you ?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 1:58 pm

oscar;1365985 wrote: This country has shocking examples. Something most British are thoroughly ashamed of and something our Government do nothing about.I thought you had national health care. Your pensioners are not able to shower, walk or enjoy hobbies?

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:07 pm

Ahso!;1365988 wrote: I thought you had national health care. Your pensioners are not able to shower, walk or enjoy hobbies? Elderly care homes here can be local council owned or private. The fee paid to either the local council or private owner for their stay Is funded by the National Health Service.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:09 pm

Debate whatoscar;1365987 wrote: Both

There you go.... Debate... what did I tell you ?Debate what? The ludicrous assertion that all your elderly do not or cannot;

shower

take walks

enjoy hobbies

are deprived of;

medical care

dental care

medicine

do not have access to;

shoes

slippers

Televisions

computers?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:10 pm

oscar;1365989 wrote: Elderly care homes here can be local council owned or private. The fee paid to either the local council or private owner for their stay Is funded by the National Health Service.So whats wrong with that? Your prisons are most likely funded through taxes as well.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:13 pm

Ahso!;1365990 wrote: Debate whatDebate what? The ludicrous assertion that all your elderly do not or cannot;

shower

take walks

enjoy hobbies

are deprived of;

medical care

dental care

medicine

do not have access to;

shoes

slippers

Televisions

computers?

And you observe all of this from another continent do you?

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:14 pm

Ahso!;1365991 wrote: So whats wrong with that? Your prisons are most likely funded through taxes as well. And your point Is ?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:20 pm

oscar;1365992 wrote: And you observe all of this from another continent do you?That's exactly what your OP states. Your prisoners have everything listed above and your pensioners don't. I told you it sounded silly from the outset.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:21 pm

oscar;1365993 wrote: And your point Is ?I don't know because I'm apparently talking to myself. I'm trying to follow your lead.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:35 pm

Ahso!;1365997 wrote: I don't know because I'm apparently talking to myself. I'm trying to follow your lead. Should you actually be British, you may have some Insight Into the conditions of our care homes just as much as If I was American, I may have an Insight Into yours. You are applying pedantic's when you are Ignorant of the subject.

Having said that, many care homes In Britain do not fall Into the same category as the original author Implies. This may be because he Is applying some 'Irony', a characteristic usually limited to those Inhabitants of the British Isles. Irony falls Into the same category as a sense of humour and banter, again limited to the British and Yzgi.

theia · Post by **theia** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:45 pm

Elder care which, in my opinion is already in crisis, will get worse when us "baby boomers" reach our 70s and 80s.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 2:53 pm

theia;1366003 wrote: Elder care which, in my opinion is already in crisis, will get worse when us "baby boomers" reach our 70s and 80s. Ah at last, a sensible and knowledgeable post.

Yes, I quite agree. It can only get worse unless governments get their priorities right.

theia · Post by **theia** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 3:21 pm

I work on an elder care ward, Oscar, and there are massive delays in discharges because not only are there few care/nursing home places available, but also because the care agencies who provide care at home have limited capacity. And of course there are care homes which have excellent reputations but these are always full. I'm glad that the CQC carry our regular inspections but whether they will be able to keep on top of those homes that are less than ideal, I don't know. It's a huge problem and, in my opinion, will get worse.

Good elder care is one of my passions (possibly because I'm getting closer to it myself) but I wonder how the overall problems can be resolved

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:19 pm

oscar;1366006 wrote: Ah at last, a sensible and knowledgeable post.

Yes, I quite agree. It can only get worse unless governments get their priorities right.Theia's observations may be 100% accurate, and I take her at her word. That, however, does not even come close to lending credibility to the OP of this thread.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Thu Aug 18, 2011 7:54 pm

Ahso!;1366056 wrote: Theia's observations may be 100% accurate, and I take her at her word. That, however, does not even come close to lending credibility to the OP of this thread. Let me put this In a way you can understand.

The opening post ie the E Mail was a chain E mail Intended to raise a chuckle and provoke some thought with like minded people. Refer back to my earlier post where I explained

to you that members here will either laugh at It or enter Into debate.

Theia's posts actually confirm the opening post. She does not discount It.

I can not expect you to understand the concept of Irony In the E mail however, most people this side of the Atlantic do.

How can you speak with any authority on the credibility of the opening post when I suspect you have never been Inside a British care home nor know exactly what Is going on In this country.?

It seems apparent to anyone reading this thread that you are not posting on It to contribute to the subject but to pick the OP apart when you have absolutely no more Idea of what happens In British care homes as I do In American care homes. A little rich coming from some-one who whined only recently that his words were being picked apart.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 3:00 am

Ahso!;1365990 wrote: Debate whatDebate what? The ludicrous assertion that all your elderly do not or cannot;

shower

take walks

enjoy hobbies

are deprived of;

medical care

dental care

medicine

do not have access to;

shoes

slippers

Televisions

computers?

The elderly in the UK can go in to a residential home which can be funded by their family, or if it is funded by the NHS - they can initially receive care at home but if they go in to a residential home or what we term long term care it is because they cannot, wash themselves, go to the toilet get about unaided in short they need 24 hour care. Colloquially they are known as granny farms. Since there are not enough council owned homes they will pay private homes the govt doing so to avoid the expense of building new homes and thereby enriching private companies instead. Recently several chains of residential care homes have been the subject of scandal for abusing their inmates(?) and two have gone in to receivership and it looks like the state will have to take them over. Not being the US with a private medical service we don;t just chuck the elderly out on the streets because they are poor or have no insurance.

It is becoming a political issue because while some of the elderly cannot afford to pay for themselves there are equally some who have assets that can be sold off to pay for their care - so at what level of wealth do people have to pay? The current crop in the homes are the survivors of the generation that defeated Hitler and came back from ww2 determined to change things for the better. They succeeded, people now live longer, infant death rates dropped and the baby boom generation came along who are now living in to their 80's and fir the first time there are more people over 65 than there are under it - or soon will be - that need expensive care in old age. Tough **** you should have planned for it and we're not paying for you may be the American approach but the one thing that will cost a political party an election is pissing about with the NHS to it's detriment and especially trying to privatise it. From each according to their means to each according to their needs may sound trite and you consider ridiculous and a dangerous socialist notion most in the UK would simply ask what's wrong with that notion. It's not single parents and the unemployed that destroy societies it's greed. Even those who are nominally against the NHS if given the choice to opt out entirely would not do so fior the simple reason that with private medical care in the UK, as with the states if your condition is too expensive and they can't make money you get turfed out and would have to go cap in hand back to the NHS.

No one is denied access to dental care, medical care or medicines for reasons of poverty such denial is regarded as being morally wrong by most in the UK. That's why we have an NHS and look at the states and wonder why you put up with such a crap system where people are allowed to die if they can't pay for medical care.

The money used to bail out the banks was not the governments it was ours. In the UK most people would have voted no to the bailout. I suspect most in the US would have done so as well. The trillions you spend on warfare could be used for the benefit of ordinary people you seem to have been brainwashed in to believing such opinions are somehow dangerous. That's your problem. In the UK, however, we can say what we like and do indeed use sarcasm, satire and all forms of humour to take the **** out of government. It's a form or release, if we don't take the **** we become violent and kick the hit out of them instead. Oscars post should be seen in that light. If, however, you hold to the reasoning that not taxing the wealthy mean more jobs will be created by them spending their wealth and starting new businesses how starling would the effect be if you gave £million to everybody - and just stand back and watch the economy take of? If you were given a million dollars what would you do with it?

Personally I would get rid of every MP that fiddled his expenses and would have sacked the boards of all the banks that had to be nationalised and sequestrated all their assets to boot. Fred the shred had to move house for fear of being lynched, he probably wouldn't have been but oh the temptation.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 8:51 am

Great post gmc.

Really rushed today, out again but will hopefully get back to It later tonight.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 2:41 pm

some mod, again, deleted a few posts without telling us and that''s just wrong, unless the two threads are now split but I cannot see it.

I am agreeing with oscar first on drama queens.....they say they are leaving..just so others will say, awwwwwwwww please don't leave.....then a day or two days later and others have also done that here with names I do not care to reveal as everyone already knows who they are......return months and months later....I'm back, I needed some 'me' time from here.........well, if you didn't some 'me' time......step back from the computer..relax....and come back later when you are relaxed,, but this time come back caring about others and not just yourself for once then slowly explain in just a few sentences rather than ramble on and on with long long paragraphs so others feel like they have to keep reading back, reading back and then type in everything that they can remember....if they can...and I know myself if I have done that and I have, afterward say I'm so sorry for rambling on in your ear when you really have no time or give a damn what I am saying and I have also heard just a few more say the same.

one person whom I used to be friends with until she deleted me from her friends list which I am so glad she did now, as she used to and still does on FB, will type the longest story allowed, then click comment after comment after comment and add more long paragraphs over and over again.......and pleas this time...mods, do not delete this post like you just did.....as everyone who does know know her needs to know exactly what she is really like in the real world.

thank you mods so much.:yh_party

and thank you oscar in allowing me once again to write this and again it took me over and hour just to re-write this again.

thank you oscar:-6

and, if I come back to seeing this post gone, it will make me sick:yh_sick

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 2:45 pm

Odie;1366143 wrote: some mod, again, deleted a few posts without telling us and that''s just wrong, unless the two threads are now split but I cannot see it.

I am agreeing with oscar first on drama queens.....they say they are leaving..just so others will say, awwwwwwwww please don't leave.....then a day or two days later and others have also done that here with names I do not care to reveal as everyone already knows who they are......return months and months later....I'm back, I needed some 'me' time from here.........well, if you didn't some 'me' time......step back from the computer..relax....and come back later when you are relaxed,, but this time come back caring about others and not just yourself for once then slowly explain in just a few sentences rather than ramble on and on with long long paragraphs so others feel like they have to keep reading back, reading back and then type in everything that they can remember....if they can...and I know myself if I have done that and I have, afterward say I'm so sorry for rambling on in your ear when you really have no time or give a damn what I am saying and I have also heard just a few more say the same.

one person whom I used to be friends with until she deleted me from her friends list which I am so glad she did now, as she used to and still does on FB, will type the longest story allowed, then click comment after comment after comment and add more long paragraphs over and over again.......and pleas this time...mods, do not delete this post like you just did.....as everyone who does know know her needs to know exactly what she is really like in the real world.

thank you mods so much.:yh_party

and thank you oscar in allowing me once again to write this and again it took me over and hour just to re-write this again.

thank you oscar:-6

and, if I come back to seeing this post gone, it will make me sick:yh_sickYou've posted in the wrong thread again, Odie.

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 2:45 pm

Odie;1366143 wrote: some mod, again, deleted a few posts without telling us and that''s just wrong, unless the two threads are now split but I cannot see it.

I am agreeing with oscar first on drama queens.....they say they are leaving..just so others will say, awwwwwwwww please don't leave.....then a day or two days later and others have also done that here with names I do not care to reveal as everyone already knows who they are......return months and months later....I'm back, I needed some 'me' time from here.........well, if you didn't some 'me' time......step back from the computer..relax....and come back later when you are relaxed,, but this time come back caring about others and not just yourself for once then slowly explain in just a few sentences rather than ramble on and on with long long paragraphs so others feel like they have to keep reading back, reading back and then type in everything that they can remember....if they can...and I know myself if I have done that and I have, afterward say I'm so sorry for rambling on in your ear when you really have no time or give a damn what I am saying and I have also heard just a few more say the same.

one person whom I used to be friends with until she deleted me from her friends list which I am so glad she did now, as she used to and still does on FB, will type the longest story allowed, then click comment after comment after comment and add more long paragraphs over and over again.......and pleas this time...mods, do not delete this post like you just did.....as everyone who does know know her needs to know exactly what she is really like in the real world.

thank you mods so much.:yh_party

and thank you oscar in allowing me once again to write this and again it took me over and hour just to re-write this again.

thank you oscar:-6

and, if I come back to seeing this post gone, it will make me sick:yh_sick

There are no deleted posts on this thread. Perhaps you are looking at the wrong thread?

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 2:46 pm

gmc;1366065 wrote: The elderly in the UK can go in to a residential home which can be funded by their family, or if it is funded by the NHS - they can initially receive care at home but if they go in to a residential home or what we term long term care it is because they cannot, wash themselves, go to the toilet get about unaided in short they need 24 hour care. Colloquially they are known as granny farms. Since there are not enough council owned homes they will pay private homes the govt doing so to avoid the expense of building new homes and thereby enriching private companies instead. Recently several chains of residential care homes have been the subject of scandal for abusing their inmates(?) and two have gone in to receivership and it looks like the state will have to take them over. Not being the US with a private medical service we don;t just chuck the elderly out on the streets because they are poor or have no insurance.

It is becoming a political issue because while some of the elderly cannot afford to pay for themselves there are equally some who have assets that can be sold off to pay for their care - so at what level of wealth do people have to pay? The current crop in the homes are the survivors of the generation that defeated Hitler and came back from ww2 determined to change things for the better. They succeeded, people now live longer, infant death rates dropped and the baby boom generation came along who are now living in to their 80's and fir the first time there are more people over 65 than there are under it - or soon will be - that need expensive care in old age. Tough **** you should have planned for it and we're not paying for you may be the American approach but the one thing that will cost a political party an election is pissing about with the NHS to it's detriment and especially trying to privatise it. From each according to their means to each according to their needs may sound trite and you consider ridiculous and a dangerous socialist notion most in the UK would simply ask what's wrong with that notion. It's not single parents and the unemployed that destroy societies it's greed. Even those who are nominally against the NHS if given the choice to opt out entirely would not do so fior the simple reason that with private medical care in the UK, as with the states if your condition is too expensive and they can't make money you get turfed out and would have to go cap in hand back to the NHS.

No one is denied access to dental care, medical care or medicines for reasons of poverty such denial is regarded as being morally wrong by most in the UK. That's why we have an NHS and look at the states and wonder why you put up with such a crap system where people are allowed to die if they can't pay for medical care.

The money used to bail out the banks was not the governments it was ours. In the UK most people would have voted no to the bailout. I suspect most in the US would have done so as well. The trillions you spend on warfare could be used for the benefit of ordinary people you seem to have been brainwashed in to believing such opinions are somehow dangerous. That's your problem. In the UK, however, we can say what we like and do indeed use sarcasm, satire and all forms of humour to take the **** out of government. It's a form or release, if we don't take the **** we become violent and kick the hit out of them instead. Oscars post should be seen in that light. If, however, you hold to the reasoning that not taxing the wealthy mean more jobs will be created by them spending their wealth and starting new businesses how starling would the effect be if you gave £million to everybody - and just stand back and watch the economy take of? If you were given a million dollars what would you do with it?

Personally I would get rid of every MP that fiddled his expenses and would have sacked the boards of all the banks that had to be nationalised and sequestrated all their assets to boot. Fred the shred had to move house for fear of being lynched, he probably wouldn't have been but oh the temptation.

As a student, I worked for an agency In care homes mostly nights to earn some money. Things were pretty grim back then. The sheer workload put upon us meant that the one's who cared enough had no time to do the little extra's that we wanted to do such as sit with a lonely old soul who had no visitors for a few minutes.

What I witnessed made me vow I would never put my parents Into such a place. Over the years, various elderly relatives went Into homes and although there were some Improvements, not much seemed to change.

My Mother had a massive stroke which left her paralysed and unable to speak. Her treatment In a NHS hospital was appalling and put the family under pressure to put her In a home because they needed the bed which was fair enough.

The family split Into two groups and we viewed over 20 homes before making our choice. It was Impossible for any of us to have our Mother with us with her being paralysed and brain damaged with all of us In full time jobs.

We felt we had chosen the best private home for her but the promises of speech therepy, physio and entertainment never materialised. She was put In a room on the top floor where we had no lift to even get her down Into the garden for some fresh air. She spent up to 20 hours a day. Asking for a TV for her, we were told she was so brain damaged, what was the point. They also decided to have the visiting GP fill her up with anti-depressants which I am sure would have been against her wishes.

She had only been In there a week when the home started piling on the pressure for one of us to seek Power of Attorney over her finances, sell her home and provide them with a full list of her assets. We decided to become as obstructive and truculent as possible.

Then something happened In the home that I won't go Into details of but It resulted In my Mother suffering severe Injury to her face through negligence. Meanwhile we persued this through a solicitor and lodged formal complaints to social services and the home for neglect. We were all at the time In discussions to have our Mother removed to live with one of us.

A week or so after her Injury, she died and I have no qualms In saying that It was a relief that she was out of the silent hell she had been In. Whilst we were arranging her funeral, my brother recieved a letter from the home stating that legal action would be taken If we did not settle the bill for her few weeks stay within 28 days. My brother wrote just two words back to them.... Sue me...

Our complaints took two years and final outcome was a positive result for my family but boy, did we have to fight !

Now a good friend of mine has had to go as far as bringing In her local MP to get the proper care her elderly Father should have.

theia · Post by **theia** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 3:40 pm

I think the basic problem is that Social Services and the NHS have so few resources to fund the care of older people...it's a constant juggling act. It's tragic and I agree with gmc that taxpayers' money has been wasted on useless causes instead of being spent in the areas where it's needed.

And you're right, Oscar...clinical and care staff are so busy that they have little time to sit with patients who are feeling anxious and lonely. They try their best but are always saying that the compassion they feel, which was often the very reason they chose their vocation, is almost impossible to impart as they rush from patient to patient, usually in a very understaffed environment. Volunteers could help resolve this situation but it is currently a nightmare trying to recruit them because of all the paperwork and health and safety restrictions.

It really is pointless for medical science to lengthen our life spans when there is little quality of care available in the latter years of life.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Fri Aug 19, 2011 5:11 pm

theia;1366186 wrote: I think the basic problem is that Social Services and the NHS have so few resources to fund the care of older people...it's a constant juggling act. It's tragic and I agree with gmc that taxpayers' money has been wasted on useless causes instead of being spent in the areas where it's needed.

And you're right, Oscar...clinical and care staff are so busy that they have little time to sit with patients who are feeling anxious and lonely. They try their best but are always saying that the compassion they feel, which was often the very reason they chose their vocation, is almost impossible to impart as they rush from patient to patient, usually in a very understaffed environment. Volunteers could help resolve this situation but it is currently a nightmare trying to recruit them because of all the paperwork and health and safety restrictions.

It really is pointless for medical science to lengthen our life spans when there is little quality of care available in the latter years of life. I totally agree Theia, Medical science prolongs the life but denies them the quality of life at the end of It.

One of the biggest problems I had In what I experienced was the lack of dignity shown to elderly people.

I have relatives who are nursing staff In hospitals and they report the lack of dignity also especially In mixed sex wards which hopefully, we will see the back of soon.

The lack of mental stimulation I believe contributes to an earlier demise once In care. I have gone off a shift before at 8 In the morning only to come back at 6 pm to see the same people sat staring at a TV In a communal lounge. That has Improved In some ways but It used to be awful.

One home I worked In many years ago employed the services of what was then seen as a revolutionary therapist. Using smell alone, he reached the most senile of the elderly. He was quite wonderful but these days, as you say, It Is the cost that restricts therapy.

There needs to be a huge Investment Into the care of the elderly and less human rights for prisoners.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 1:48 am

oscar;1366209 wrote: I totally agree Theia, Medical science prolongs the life but denies them the quality of life at the end of It.

One of the biggest problems I had In what I experienced was the lack of dignity shown to elderly people.

I have relatives who are nursing staff In hospitals and they report the lack of dignity also especially In mixed sex wards which hopefully, we will see the back of soon.

The lack of mental stimulation I believe contributes to an earlier demise once In care. I have gone off a shift before at 8 In the morning only to come back at 6 pm to see the same people sat staring at a TV In a communal lounge. That has Improved In some ways but It used to be awful.

One home I worked In many years ago employed the services of what was then seen as a revolutionary therapist. Using smell alone, he reached the most senile of the elderly. He was quite wonderful but these days, as you say, It Is the cost that restricts therapy.

There needs to be a huge Investment Into the care of the elderly and less human rights for prisoners.

The problem is not the human rights of prisoners the problem is how much funding and care do we wish to give for the car of our elderly. Why do you always bring up your own particular hobby horses in to things and conflate separate issues? You come out with stock phrases like a parrot saying whose a pretty boy then.

The Universal declaration of human rights was promulgated in 1948 when the consequences of allowing some people to be categorised as less deserving than others was made clear in the smoke stacks of the nazi concentration camps and the medical experimentation camps in china run by the japanese. Human Rights matter, one of those being the right to free speech and tanother the right to a fair trial. You use the former to call for the latter to be thrown in the bin for people you have decided are not with the bother. In doing so you are no better than hitler, stalin, or any religious fundamentalists be they christian or muslim that believes someone of a different religion or has the wrong kind of lifestyle is not as worthy as they themselves. Somehow sub human although they avoid using the term. Both religions are incredibly misogynistic respecting religion doesn't mean yo have to humour it's followers or do nothing when they ride roughshod over the rights of others. Were it not for respect for human rights and a burgeoning belief in the right to equality belief in equality on earth not just in heaven and steps taken to curb the power of the church, you would not be standing for any political office for the simple reason that as a woman, you would not have the right to do so. People like you never seem to understand that they too might one day be the victim of an injustice - even when you have personal experience of one you seem to forget it's your human rights at stake every time you call for them to be overridden for some tinpot political end. There's a lot wrong perhaps with the way we implement human rights legislation but personally I don't want to live in a country where politicians put the case that it should be ignored or that some categories of people are not worthy of consideration. Do you really want to see armed police on the streets gunning down protesters - this time they were basically rioting and pillaging the next time it might be a protest against the cuts where they decide to disperse crowds by force. All laws are designed to protect the weak from the strong and especially from a government abusing it's power.

Don't mean to rant but I detest the BNP and everything they can lead to. Hatred and bigotry are very appealing they just don't work. Why not save your ire for things we really waste money on like MP's expenses and bailing out banks that reward the taxpayer by ever increasing bank charges and repossessing homes at the drop of a hat or utility companies that now make vast profits for foreign shareholders when once they were owned by the customers. Our problems are not caused by human rights legislation, single mothers or people living on benefits.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Sun Aug 21, 2011 10:51 am

gmc;1366406 wrote:

Don't mean to rant but I detest the BNP and everything they can lead to. Hatred and bigotry are very appealing they just don't work. Why not save your ire for things we really waste money on like MP's expenses and bailing out banks that reward the taxpayer by ever increasing bank charges and repossessing homes at the drop of a hat or utility companies that now make vast profits for foreign shareholders when once they were owned by the customers. Our problems are not caused by human rights legislation, single mothers or people living on benefits. As I would suggest to anyone. Try reading the BNP manifesto, go to Nick's website and Andrew Brons website before making unjustifiable comments built on a salacious desire to believe the warblings of a rancid journalist for TNOTW. That's the two democratically elected members of The European parliament In case you didn't know. It is hypocritical In the extreme to revel In the downfall of Murdock, TNOTW and the Involvement of Met Police Officers In the entire sordid affair yet believe the deliberate libel posted In such a vile and corrupt organisation.

Your entire post confuses the Ill Informed Misconception of the BNP with what I myself believe In. What I think Is not a benchmark for most BNP figures.

When I said that massive Investment Is needed In care homes, I was talking about Investment so staffing levels can be Increased which would In turn Increase the level of care.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Mon Aug 22, 2011 3:20 am

oscar;1366442 wrote: As I would suggest to anyone. Try reading the BNP manifesto, go to Nick's website and Andrew Brons website before making unjustifiable comments built on a salacious desire to believe the warblings of a rancid journalist for TNOTW. That's the two democratically elected members of The European parliament In case you didn't know. It is hypocritical In the extreme to revel In the downfall of Murdock, TNOTW and the Involvement of Met Police Officers In the entire sordid affair yet believe the deliberate libel posted In such a vile and corrupt organisation.

Your entire post confuses the Ill Informed Misconception of the BNP with what I myself believe In. What I think Is not a benchmark for most BNP figures.

When I said that massive Investment Is needed In care homes, I was talking about Investment so staffing levels can be Increased which would In turn Increase the level of care.

If it is not typical then why do you want to stand for them? I have actually read the BNP manifesto and i never used to read the TNOTW even when it existed. How did that come in to the thread? You conflated the spending on care homes with that of human rights for prisoners, that is what I was responding to. I found the comment bizarre to say the least.

Post by **Oscar Namechange** » Mon Aug 22, 2011 9:05 am

gmc;1366641 wrote: If it is not typical then why do you want to stand for them? I have actually read the BNP manifesto and i never used to read the TNOTW even when it existed. How did that come in to the thread? You conflated the spending on care homes with that of human rights for prisoners, that is what I was responding to. I found the comment bizarre to say the least. Want ? Wrong use of word gmc.

30 years Is not long In politics. The BNP Is still a relatively young party and Is still evolving. The Consititution changes and Is not a totalitarian organisation as It was some years ago.

In relation to the opening post, I simply do not agree with the treatment of some elderly in care homes and the luxury that prisoners find on entering the system. It Is nothing at all to do with what you wrote earlier about a criminal having a right of appeal or representation. It Is the the money spent Inside prisons keeping them happy that needs to be prioritised.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Mon Aug 22, 2011 12:25 pm

oscar;1366666 wrote: Want ? Wrong use of word gmc.

30 years Is not long In politics. The BNP Is still a relatively young party and Is still evolving. The Consititution changes and Is not a totalitarian organisation as It was some years ago.

In relation to the opening post, I simply do not agree with the treatment of some elderly in care homes and the luxury that prisoners find on entering the system. It Is nothing at all to do with what you wrote earlier about a criminal having a right of appeal or representation. It Is the the money spent Inside prisons keeping them happy that needs to be prioritised.

You keep bringing up the matter of human rights legislation and how well criminals are treated in threads where it has no real relevance to the subject matter at hand. It seems to be a hobby horse of yours and you always express surprise if anyone picks you up on it. You clearly have no real appreciation of the importance human rights legislation and while there might be problems with it such as your perception that prisoners lead the life of Riley throwing it all out would be an act of folly. It applies equally to OAP's, it has for instance been used to prevent married couples being separated when they both go on to a home. It might yet be used to prevent councils from going after estates to recover the cost of long term care. Why don't you just start a thread where you can sound off about all the things you like to hate about British society and liberal democracy.

At least you now concede the BNP used to be a totalitarian organisation, they are also in favour of a totalitarian state it's just most people are not actually fooled.