Thoughts and prayers for strangers yet again

minks · Post by **minks** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 3:29 pm

My thoughts and prayers go out to all those affected by the horrific shootings in Las Vegas Sunday night.

This is getting to be too frequent.

RIP to all who have passed on at the hands of these murderous idiots

When does it stop.

cars · Post by **cars** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 4:09 pm

minks;1513039 wrote: My thoughts and prayers go out to all those affected by the horrific shootings in Las Vegas Sunday night.

This is getting to be too frequent.

RIP to all who have passed on at the hands of these murderous idiots

When does it stop.

AMEN!

It stops/ or at least slows down when America wakes up and finally bans "military warfare" type mass killing the enemy "assault weapons"!

There really is no good reason for "civilians" to own assault weapons, as they are not a hunting sport type gun, that could be used for sport hunting! That type gun doesn't even give an animal a sporting chance!

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 4:30 pm

cars;1513042 wrote: It stops/ or at least slows down when America wakes up and finally bans "military warfare" type mass killing the enemy "assault weapons"!Agreed!

cars;1513042 wrote: There really is no good reason for "civilians" to own assault weapons,Agreed again (two for two) though I'd go further and say there is no good reason for guns to be manufactured. Other than to feed the stock market, that is. cars;1513042 wrote: as they are not a hunting sport type gun, that could be used for sport hunting!Perhaps that's exactly what they've become. We're animals too, you know. cars;1513042 wrote: That type gun doesn't even give an animal a sporting chance!Three for three! How about that!

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:14 pm

Just got a security warning.....shall come back ti this after trying to post twice

minks · Post by **minks** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 10:15 am

and "stop the media"

Let us NOT give budding assassins exact details and instructions on how mass killings work.

If the details of the first killer ever to use a vehicle to bowl down innocents were not splattered all over the news, I don't think we would be seeing as many copy cat incidents.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:46 am

cars;1513042 wrote: AMEN!

It stops/ or at least slows down when America wakes up and finally bans "military warfare"

??

cars;1513042 wrote: type mass killing the enemy" assault weapons"

Assault weapon is a political term having nothing to do with the military.

cars;1513042 wrote: There really is no good reason for "civilians" to own [SIZassault weapon, as they are not a hunting sport type gun, that could be used for sport hunting! That type gun doesn't even give an animal a sporting chance!

So-called assault weapons are legal, ethical and just fine for hunting.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 12:23 pm

Watch out Tude, youre wading into shark infested waters.

And ive just found out that i cant use the US second "A" word or "C" wordin conjunction with certain words others are using in this thread . A security watning flashes across my phone and im booted off the site

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:17 pm

Question....all the people who carry guns

to protect themselves and others......how come none of them ever shoot the shooters?

Where are all these gun owners when the proverbial hits the fan?

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:41 pm

Sometimes im proud of my fellow humans. It seems gallantry is not dead after i just saw a young woman say that the boys she was with covered the girls bodies with their own.

Post by **spot** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:41 pm

minks;1513039 wrote:

When does it stop.

It would be good to see people take things in context. Really.

Since I was born, somewhere between one and two million Americans have been shot dead. One in ten of those killings has been by foreigners (nearly all of them either Atheistic Viet Cong or Communist Chinese). Nine out of ten shot-to-death Americans were killed by Godfearing Americans.

I draw two lessons from this.

Firstly you can't force law-abiding adult American civilians to disarm, how else are they going to defend themselves from all these domestic compatriot killers.

Secondly, focusing on foreigners as The Enemy has obviously been a huge mistake.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:42 pm

What's left to be said? Nothing!

When we decided five years ago that, for adults, the right to nearly unrestricted access to firearms was more important than the lives of children, we sealed our fate. Since 2016 we've averaged more than one mass shooting (4+ victims including the shooter) daily. A very alarming trend indeed.

The sport of hunting has changed to include the human species. How does it feel to have a target on our backs? The only difference between us and those other species is we consciously fear death, while they just instinctively know to run.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:11 pm

magentaflame;1513088 wrote: Question....all the people who carry guns

to protect themselves and others......how come none of them ever shoot the shooters?

I suspect it is because there are not that many people who actually carry a gun. Not to mention, it may be a situation where no one would not want to get involved. I carry a gun to protect myself and feel no responsibility to stop crime or involve myself in an active shooting situation.

magentaflame;1513088 wrote: Where are all these gun owners when the proverbial hits the fan?

I would hope acting in a responsible manner considering the situation.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:17 pm

tude dog;1513106 wrote: I suspect it is because there are not that many people who actually carry a gun. Not to mention, it may be a situation where no one would not want to get involved. I carry a gun to protect myself and feel no responsibility to stop crime or involve myself in an active shooting situation.

I would hope acting in a responsible manner considering the situation.Priceless!

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 3:25 pm

Wow.

Well thats just...... i dont know.

So in a country where you have a "right" to own a firearm . I understand one or two guns......but ten to twenty of them? Including firearms and accessories that are okay to own but illegal to use.

Is it just me? Or could you drive a truck through that concept ?

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 5:28 pm

Ahso!;1513108 wrote: Priceless!

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Wed Oct 04, 2017 5:41 pm

magentaflame;1513110 wrote: Wow.

Well thats just...... i dont know.

So in a country where you have a "right" to own a firearm . I understand one or two guns......but ten to twenty of them? Including firearms and accessories that are okay to own but illegal to use.

Is it just me? Or could you drive a truck through that concept ?

I own several firearms and sit with envy to be able to have twenty quality firearms.

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 8:51 am

I own several guns also. Rifles for deer hunting and critter killing on the farm. Shotguns for bird hunting and clay shooting. pistols for target and protection.

Banning guns in America will work about as well as banning alcohol and drugs, it just wont work. The city of Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the country but still average around fifty gun related killings per month. I still can't figure out why this has never been addressed.

Saying all that I do agree "Assault" type military style rifles should be banned, yes some will still get them but they won't be readily available for the general public when some deranged person decides to go out in a blaze of glory. It may not stop mass shootings but it may lessen the amount of killing.

My 2 cents.

When Clinton outlawed theses style weapons I never felt my rights were denied me and no one came after my "regular" style guns.If I remember correctly the ban was 10 years long, I don't remember any problems during the ban.

minks · Post by **minks** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:35 am

I lost my original post bah.

Ahso, that is a terrifying thought, "targets on our backs"

I feel gun control here in Canada works well.

Myself I do not own a gun, but my husbands family own guns (farmers and ranchers). They must register them and assault weapons are not allowed.

Now having said that...

1) people do own assault weapons illegally. And when natural disasters happen, our RCMP have been known to enter peoples homes and confiscate the weapons and find out if they are illegal or not or if they are registered or not. This is a real grey area and I don't know if it is exactly legal or not.

2) we do not have the population of the USA so it's tough to say how successful gun control is here versus not having the control in the USA.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:09 pm

YZGI;1513123 wrote: I own several guns also. Rifles for deer hunting and critter killing on the farm. Shotguns for bird hunting and clay shooting. pistols for target and protection.

Banning guns in America will work about as well as banning alcohol and drugs, it just wont work. The city of Chicago has some of the strictest gun laws in the country but still average around fifty gun related killings per month. I still can't figure out why this has never been addressed.

Saying all that I do agree "Assault" type military style rifles should be banned, yes some will still get them but they won't be readily available for the general public when some deranged person decides to go out in a blaze of glory. It may not stop mass shootings but it may lessen the amount of killing.

My 2 cents.

When Clinton outlawed theses style weapons I never felt my rights were denied me and no one came after my "regular" style guns.If I remember correctly the ban was 10 years long, I don't remember any problems during the ban.

Fact is in the scheme of things rifles are not the first choice for murder.

For the years between 2011 - 2015

Handguns 6,251 6,404 5,782 5,673 6,447

Rifles 332 298 285 258 252

Shotguns 362 310 308 264 269

Other guns 97 116 123 93 171

Before I would worry about being shot by a rifle

Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.)1 751 707 687 682 624

FBI - Expanded Homicide Data Table 8.

I don't see the sense of passing laws just to ease somebody's phobia.

Post by **spot** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:20 pm

You're suggesting civilian handguns should be banned while civilian rifles remain legal? There's arguments for that. Nobody hunts in the woods with a handgun. I'd support your proposal.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:49 pm

spot;1513146 wrote: You're suggesting civilian handguns should be banned while civilian rifles remain legal? There's arguments for that. Nobody hunts in the woods with a handgun. I'd support your proposal.

It isn't clear to me what you are referencing.

FIREARMS

Centerfire rifles and handguns that are not fully automatic, while using only hard-cast solid lead, soft point, hollow point, or other expanding bullets; shotguns using only slugs. Any person who lawfully possesses a firearm suppressing device may use that device in conjunction with lawful hunting, fishing, and furharvesting.

KWDP

Handguns for Deer

Post by **spot** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 12:57 pm

tude dog;1513148 wrote: It isn't clear to me what you are referencing.

You had just written "Fact is in the scheme of things rifles are not the first choice for murder" from which I inferred you were pointing at handguns as the main weapon involved in shooting deaths in America. Were you not making that implication?

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:14 pm

spot;1513149 wrote: You had just written "Fact is in the scheme of things rifles are not the first choice for murder" from which I inferred you were pointing at handguns as the main weapon involved in shooting deaths in America. Were you not making that implication?

Not an implication, it is a fact handguns are the firearm of choice for murder.

You're suggesting civilian handguns should be banned while civilian rifles remain legal? There's arguments for that. Nobody hunts in the woods with a handgun. I'd support your proposal.

NO NO NO:-5

I have no idea where yu got that from.

Post by **spot** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:16 pm

tude dog;1513155 wrote: NO NO NO:-5

I have no idea where yu got that from.

You would agree that despite the legality of hunting with a handgun, the overwhelming proportion of gun hunting in America is with a rifle and not a handgun?

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:25 pm

tude dog;1513144 wrote: Fact is in the scheme of things rifles are not the first choice for murder.

For the years between 2011 - 2015

Handguns 6,251 6,404 5,782 5,673 6,447

Rifles 332 298 285 258 252

Shotguns 362 310 308 264 269

Other guns 97 116 123 93 171

Before I would worry about being shot by a rifle

Personal weapons (hands, fists, feet, etc.)1 751 707 687 682 624

FBI - Expanded Homicide Data Table 8.

I don't see the sense of passing laws just to ease somebody's phobia.

I understand most murders are done with hand guns, my point was if the military style rifle were outlawed the deranged that wanted to commit mass murder (not a single murder) would be slowed down. Also most handguns and hunting rifles can't be modified to shoot fully automatic which would slow a mass murderer down on the amount of lead he can put into the air in a short amount of time.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:48 pm

spot;1513156 wrote: You would agree that despite the legality of hunting with a handgun, the overwhelming proportion of gun hunting in America is with a rifle and not a handgun?

Where are you going with this?

Post by **spot** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:09 pm

tude dog;1513160 wrote: Where are you going with this?
That law-abiding adult American civilians can defend themselves with rifles from their domestic compatriot killers, they have no need for handguns.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:52 pm

A petition has gone round signed by behavioural psychologist and scientists to media to stop the saturation of information of the criminal in effect humanising what they have done.

Its giving the person the exactly what they want and encourages others.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 3:20 pm

I think i understand what they mean now. My news crossed to america for an update. The reporter outlined the mans planning and mentioned "music festival" countless times in the very short cross.

Maybe this is what a copycat needs?

At the beginning all we knew is that he was a rich, middle aged white male who owned mulriple firearms.

Now we know he had an unsuspecting girlfriend, how he planned it, how he carried it out ,how many people he affected and what his target was. The media has identified his family and friends and his girlfriends family.

I think i understand what these professionals are on about

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Thu Oct 05, 2017 4:41 pm

spot;1513161 wrote: That law-abiding adult American civilians can defend themselves with rifles from their domestic compatriot killers, they have no need for handguns.

Uh, you are not thinking that through.

I live in a small house. I don't want my defense gun to be sticking out 2 feet in front of me, subject to be shoved or diverted. I am not going to argue scenarios, but our go-to gun in our home is an S&W Model 10 .38 revolver, that is unless I get to my 3".45acp 1911 first.

Outside is totally different. Long guns may be the way to go, but best to be inside and wait for the cops.

It is not up to me to tell others how best to defend themselves.

Post by **spot** » Fri Oct 06, 2017 12:15 am

tude dog;1513170 wrote: Uh, you are not thinking that through.

I most certainly am thinking that through. I wouldn't be in the thread otherwise.

You sound as though you're making the defensive choice - handgun or rifle - a matter of convenience. I'm saying that if handguns are withdrawn from American civilians and made unavailable, American civilians would still have access to a rifle if they choose to, retaining their constitutional right to bear arms.

Some forms of arms are considered too dangerous to allow civilian access - mortars or machine guns, claymores, landmines edging the back porch and lawn for instance. There's no constitutional reason not to add handguns to that list. We're agreed that very few Americans kill Americans with rifles, yes? And that there's definitely more than 1,516,863 Americans shot dead by Americans since official figures started to be collected during my lifetime and that 1,516,863 is a distressingly high figure?

I agree it is not up to you to tell others how best to defend themselves. It's up to your government, within the restraint of the existing Constitution, if they decide there's a net benefit to society (like there is with, say, mortars and machine guns). I've suggested that withdrawing access to handguns still leaves Americans able to arm themselves with rifles. Registered rifles, for preference. I think it would reduce the carnage (you said " it is a fact handguns are the firearm of choice for murder" and "in the scheme of things rifles are not the first choice for murder"), and that people would like the carnage reducing.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Mon Oct 09, 2017 12:13 pm

spot;1513172 wrote: I most certainly am thinking that through. I wouldn't be in the thread otherwise.

You sound as though you're making the defensive choice - handgun or rifle - a matter of convenience.

I was thinking as a practical matter, like in best tool for the job.

spot;1513172 wrote: I'm saying that if handguns are withdrawn from American civilians and made unavailable, American civilians would still have access to a rifle if they choose to, retaining their constitutional right to bear arms.

On the one side, we have those who want to take our rifles and you suggest we give up our handguns.

spot;1513172 wrote: Some forms of arms are considered too dangerous to allow civilian access - mortars or machine guns, claymores, landmines edging the back porch and lawn for instance.

The above in bold are not arms which one would bear. Machine guns are allowed for those who can afford them. If what I think you mean by edging the back porch and lawn, that is a local issue.

spot;1513172 wrote: There's no constitutional reason not to add handguns to that list. We're agreed that very few Americans kill Americans with rifles, yes? And that there's definitely more than 1,516,863 Americans shot dead by Americans since official figures started to be collected during my lifetime and that 1,516,863 is a distressingly high figure?

Uh, sure you heard of it, the Second Amendment to the Constitution.

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

spot;1513172 wrote: I agree it is not up to you to tell others how best to defend themselves. It's up to your government, within the restraint of the existing Constitution,

spot;1513172 wrote: if they decide there's a net benefit to society (like there is with, say, mortars and machine guns). I've suggested that withdrawing access to handguns still leaves Americans able to arm themselves with rifles. Registered rifles, for preference. I think it would reduce the carnage (you said " it is a fact handguns are the firearm of choice for murder" and "in the scheme of things rifles are not the first choice for murder"), and that people would like the carnage reducing.

Within the framework of the Constitution, I can carry a handgun, rifle or machine gun to the local grocery store, or bank. I am not sure about state law and machine guns, but the rifle and handgun are good to go.

More often than not I carry a handgun, concealed. Very rare do I openly carry a handgun. Not only do I consider it impractical but to carry a rifle would attract way too much attention. Though legal, the open carry of firearms is almost never done here.

BTW, we have virtually no violent crime.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Oct 09, 2017 3:19 pm

I don't know how Minks intended the thread title, though I know her to be a thoughtful person. I mean no malice toward her or the thread, but it needs to be said.

With all the prayers being sent up lately due to these (almost daily) shootings, (some) one has to wonder what is going on with this. As far as I can tell, there are only three possibilities: 1) that there's no one to pray to. This one is my favorite. 2) the prayers are indeed being answered and God's will is contrary to the wishes of his faithful and is very much for these type events to continue and escalate. 3) these lying sobs are actually praying for this to continue and escalate.

Any other possibilities?

xfrodobagginsx · Post by **xfrodobagginsx** » Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:26 am

The Lord is good.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:34 am

xfrodobagginsx;1513289 wrote: The Lord is good.

So you f@*#ers are actually praying for this crap then?

minks · Post by **minks** » Thu Oct 12, 2017 1:27 pm

Ahso, I have to wonder exactly that.... (I do not feel maliced

)

Are people actually praying for this kind of human obliteration??

I also do not believe there is a god, to pray to, for the salvation of us humans. If there was some kind of god, why does he allow this kind of murder?

Now again I know war and terrorists kill way more than what the news is splattered with these days... but where, when, and how do we stop this kind of senseless murder.

Where have we lost the value of life? Good lives... gosh believe me I know there are people out there who do not deserve life, and I wish those ones would perish and others who have fallen victim to this kind of mindless killing should live.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Fri Oct 13, 2017 2:53 pm

When evangelists are praying for more **** to happen....the other week on commercial television an early morning evangelist said it was gods will and hurricanes will continue to happen (and these guys deny climate change) until everyone repents......****ing idiots! They are actually telling people its their fault!

The shooting in the gay night club? According to religious entities its the fault of the gays....whenare we going to hold up these people to hate speech and stop callibg it religious freedom.?

xfrodobagginsx · Post by **xfrodobagginsx** » Mon Oct 16, 2017 5:29 pm

Ahso!;1513292 wrote: So you f@*#ers are actually praying for this crap then?

Praying for what? Guns to be outlawed or guns to be kept legal? I am pro gun. Gun ownership lowers crime. Gun free zones are the most dangerous places. That's where all of these mass shootings are taking place.

xfrodobagginsx · Post by **xfrodobagginsx** » Wed Oct 18, 2017 6:19 pm

magentaflame;1513311 wrote: When evangelists are praying for more **** to happen....the other week on commercial television an early morning evangelist said it was gods will and hurricanes will continue to happen (and these guys deny climate change) until everyone repents......****ing idiots! They are actually telling people its their fault!

The shooting in the gay night club? According to religious entities its the fault of the gays....whenare we going to hold up these people to hate speech and stop callibg it religious freedom.?

I deny climate change is man made. I don't know of anyone who prayed for bad to happen to America. Saying it's God's will isn't hoping for it to happen, it's trusting God even though you don't understand why bad things happen. No one said it was gay people's fault either. Even IF they said those things, they DO have a right to say it, just like Liberals have a right to their hate speech.

xfrodobagginsx · Post by **xfrodobagginsx** » Thu Oct 19, 2017 7:53 pm

minks;1513039 wrote: My thoughts and prayers go out to all those affected by the horrific shootings in Las Vegas Sunday night.

This is getting to be too frequent.

RIP to all who have passed on at the hands of these murderous idiots

When does it stop.

It's a very sad tragedy.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Thu Oct 19, 2017 8:49 pm

xfrodobagginsx;1513353 wrote: Praying for what? Guns to be outlawed or guns to be kept legal? I am pro gun. Gun ownership lowers crime. Gun free zones are the most dangerous places. That's where all of these mass shootings are taking place.

Okay....fess up! Who let the nutter in?

Post by **spot** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 12:16 am

magentaflame;1513443 wrote: Okay....fess up! Who let the nutter in?

He sleeps in the attics over the East Wing, someone must have left the door unlocked today after they took his meal up.

magentaflame · Post by **magentaflame** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 1:45 am

I blame Heinrich Hertz!.....cause he slipped under that one.