Will President Trump run for a second term?

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:03 pm

YZGI;1523353 wrote: There was zero evidence of a breach of federal law.

The suspicion was there and the search was to find the evidence (if any), surely

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Fri Jun 14, 2019 1:20 pm

Bryn Mawr;1523354 wrote: The suspicion was there and the search was to find the evidence (if any), surely

The suspicion was manufactured and has never held up to any scrutiny what so ever.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 4:55 am

YZGI;1523324 wrote:

[QUOTE=LarsMac;1523322]I trust Putin a damn site more that I would ever trust the Trumpster.

Putin is actually quite predictable.

This bothers me, because I thought you were at least somewhat open minded and not just blinded by the rhetoric.

Not sure why it bothers you.

Putin is predictable.

Trump, not so much.

Trust is based, at least in part, on predictability.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 5:04 am

spot;1523329 wrote: Is it fair to say he's reined in the Pentagon?
How do you figure that?

spot;1523329 wrote: NASA has long-term manned exploration instructions for the first time in half a century?
Nearly every useful project has been all but shut down so we can "Send men to Mars".

spot;1523329 wrote: The economy is in permanent overdrive?

a line from song in an old Jeff Bridges film comes to mind:

"Falling feels like flying,

for a little while, ..."

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:15 am

YZGI;1523308 wrote: My best guess, would be greed, corruption and the 2 party system. Does capitalism cause this? Your guess is as good as mine. Term limits and less perks would be a start to curbing it somewhat.

What do you think imposing term limits would accomplish and, should only federal officeholders be subject to them? Also, which "perks" do you think should be abolished?

Most of these politicians come up through the system from state-elected positions, and some literally buy their way into office because they can afford to. What're your thoughts on those issues?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:31 am

AnneBoleyn;1523330 wrote: Nothing illegal about it. Trump offered up enough suspicions about himself that would have made FBI derelict in their duty NOT to investigate. Accepting dirt from a Foreign Source is against the law.

The FISA warrant was secured using information from the Steele Dossier which had no concrete evidence. The FBI clearly was out to stop Trump from being elected. That evidence is quite strong.

As much as I loathe Trump's visions, the fact is his civil rights were definitely violated, and those responsible should be held accountable. That said, OTOH, Trump is reaping from Democrats what he sowed with his Birther Bullsh!t.

This is what American politics has become.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:04 am

Bryn Mawr;1523352 wrote: Is it not the FBI's mandated function to investigate any suspected breach of federal law?

There was none, the suspected breach was fabricated.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 7:20 am

YZGI;1523324 wrote: Do you at least hope Trump is successful in his Presidency or do you also wish him to fail at all costs no matter what it does to the USA?

No, I honestly do not wish for success from Trump's presidency. That would mean a continuation of unlimited arms sales to Saudia Arabia, unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians, support for fabricated charges for Julian Assange, Chelsea Manning as well as other whistleblowers (Trump probably would have not won election had it not been for Wikileaks. The civil rights of those individuals have been violated as badly as Trump's was, and yet, he turns his back on them? Rather hypocritical on Trump's part. But that's Donald Trump), pardons for people like Joe Arpaio. I could go on.

Post by **spot** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:11 am

Ahso!;1523367 wrote: No, I honestly do not wish for success from Trump's presidency. That would mean a continuation of unlimited arms sales to Saudia Arabia, unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians,

Just on those issues before taking the others, can you tell me the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudia Arabia or unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians? Are we talking Nixon here?

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:16 am

spot;1523368 wrote: Just on those issues before taking the others, can you tell me the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudia Arabia or unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians? Are we talking Nixon here?

Well, we gotta be consistent with SOMETHING

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:20 am

LarsMac;1523326 wrote: Please tell me what he has actually accomplished that you would call a success.

The economy.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:23 am

Bryn Mawr;1523352 wrote: Is it not the FBI's mandated function to investigate any suspected breach of federal law?

It is to investigate, yes. Not to advertise.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:28 am

spot;1523368 wrote: Just on those issues before taking the others, can you tell me the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudia Arabia or unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians? Are we talking Nixon here?

Really?

Your comments are not even honest before dragging in the name of Nixon as if there were any similarities

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:32 am

LarsMac;1523362 wrote: Not sure why it bothers you.

Putin is predictable.

Trump, not so much.

Trust is based, at least in part, on predictability.

I'll tell you that it bothers me that an FBI investigation was advertised to hurt a citizen.

Post by **spot** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:32 am

tude dog;1523372 wrote: Really?

Your comments are not even honest before dragging in the name of Nixon as if there were any similarities

How about if you just answer the question instead of impugning my honesty, and then we can see why you have an issue. Can you tell me the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudi Arabia or unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians?

I admire President Nixon and I do think he challenged Israel's treatment of Palestinians, and I have trouble thinking of anyone since who made an effort in that regard. Do please educate me here.

As for the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudi Arabia, we might be looking at Lyndon Johnson. Again, tell me who I'm missing.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 8:44 am

spot;1523368 wrote: Just on those issues before taking the others, can you tell me the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudia Arabia or unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians? Are we talking Nixon here?

On S.A. - It might have been none for all I know. Sadly, I have to admit, It's an issue I'd been mostly unfamiliar with until the last couple of years.

On Israel - Beginning with Carter, none, with the one exception of Obama's protest both verbally and through the UN.

In both cases, the past does not excuse this president's behavior. Trump likes to make the case that he's doing what other presidents have avoided doing for political reasons, however, when it comes to the actual hard stuff where actual physical suffering is concerned, he's really no different than his predecessors.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:06 am

spot;1523374 wrote: How about if you just answer the question instead of impugning my honesty,

I apologize, just too lazy to start a long dragged out commentary about your broad statements which I find at best slanderous.

spot;1523374 wrote: and then we can see why you have an issue. Can you tell me the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudi Arabia or unchecked and unabashed support for Israeli mistreatment of Palestinians?

You make broad statements based on your opinion, whitch cannot be dishonest.

spot;1523374 wrote: I admire President Nixon and I do think he challenged Israel's treatment of Palestinians, and I have trouble thinking of anyone since who made an effort in that regard. Do please educate me here.

I'll have to take your word on that.

spot;1523374 wrote: As for the last President who held back on unlimited arms sales to Saudi Arabia, we might be looking at Lyndon Johnson. Again, tell me who I'm missing.

You got a better memory than me.

BTW, who cares about Lyndon Johnso or Richard Nixon's policies towards Israel?

Post by **spot** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:36 am

tude dog;1523376 wrote: BTW, who cares about Lyndon Johnso or Richard Nixon's policies towards Israel?

Nobody at all. What we care about is the long list of later Presidents who ignored the best interest of Americans by raping the the non-Wahabist Middle East on behalf of the Saudi Royal Family while arming the Kingdom to the hilt - do ask for details if you don't recognize the description, I'd relish an opportunity to list the violations - and who abandoned the Palestinians to disgraceful mistreatment by a succession of unrestrained Israeli administrations.

Post by **spot** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:11 am

tude dog;1523376 wrote: You make broad statements based on your opinion

And no, I'll not let that past either. I make broad statements based on verifiable factual evidence which I stack up until the cows come home, each statement backable by trustworthy news reports of real-world events. What happens afterwards is that people like you claim my statements are based on my opinions. They're not. They're factually precise. What you can not and will not do is provide factual evidence as opposed to personal insult in refutation.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:11 am

spot;1523377 wrote: Nobody at all. What we care about is the long list of later Presidents who ignored the best interest of Americans by raping the the non-Wahabist Middle East on behalf of the Saudi Royal Family while arming the Kingdom to the hilt - do ask for details if you don't recognize the description, I'd relish an opportunity to list the violations - and who abandoned the Palestinians to disgraceful mistreatment by a succession of unrestrained Israeli administrations.

I would rather talk of a promise kept

Here Are All the Presidents Who Promised to Move the US Embassy to Jerusalem but Never Did

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:20 am

spot;1523378 wrote: And no, I'll not let that past either. I make broad statements based on verifiable factual evidence which I stack up until the cows come home, each statement backable by trustworthy news reports of real-world events. What happens afterwards is that people like you claim my statements are based on my opinions. They're not. They're factually precise. What you can not and will not do is provide factual evidence as opposed to personal insult in refutation.

spot;1523378 wrote: who abandoned the Palestinians to disgraceful mistreatment by a succession of unrestrained Israeli administrations.

Opinion

You go wild off the horns in regard to the Saudi Arabia arms sales.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 1:40 pm

YZGI;1523355 wrote: The suspicion was manufactured and has never held up to any scrutiny what so ever.

OK, OK, I submit

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 1:41 pm

Ahso!;1523366 wrote: There was none, the suspected breach was fabricated.

I stand corrected.

Post by **spot** » Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:48 pm

Here we are - two quotes from four years ago to the day, when Donald Trump announced his candidacy.

Holly Shulman, DNC national press secretary:

Today, Donald Trump became the second major Republican candidate to announce for president in two days. He adds some much-needed seriousness that has previously been lacking from the GOP field, and we look forward hearing more about his ideas for the nation.

and Donald Trump, speaking of all the other candidates collectively:They will never make America great again. They don't even have a chance. They're controlled fully by the lobbyists, by the donors, and by the special interests - fully! Our country needs a truly great leader and we need a truly great leader now. We need a leader that wrote 'The Art of the Deal.'

Prescient words, discounted at the time. There was a well-written op-ed piece by Joseph Perkins a couple of weeks later which is worth re-reading (The plutocrat who would be president) in which he quotes a phrase popularly attributed to Napoleon: "Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake". It's amazing how that perspective backfired so spectacularly.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 3:46 am

spot;1523394 wrote: Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake. It's amazing how that perspective backfired so spectacularly.

Unless you're Putin.

Post by **spot** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:07 am

Ahso!;1523397 wrote: Unless you're Putin.

America regards Russia as an enemy because America can't function without a perceived enemy. The enemy can be a nuclear armed nation state, or Terrerists, or immigrants, or faggots, or anything Heathen, or extraterrestrials, or Drugs, it makes no difference. What America has to have is Us, the good guys, and Them, the enemy, so that Americans can cohere and form an orderly bunch of patriots in the face of whoever is flavour of the month. Iran, for example. Or President Putin.

None of this has anything at all to do with the world at large, it's entirely a function of American perception driven by American exceptionalism and the need for an obedient herd within the Homeland.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:12 am

It still makes America Putin's enemy. My point is that he laid back and allowed America to make mistake after mistake, and not only beginning in 2016.

Post by **spot** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:16 am

Ahso!;1523399 wrote: It still makes America Putin's enemy. My point is that he laid back and allowed America to make mistake after mistake, and not only beginning in 2016.

It might have been true twenty years ago. In 2019 America is a paper tiger, it is an irrelevance, it has no effect on the world. The world can manage quite well by just ignoring the antics.

There's an example today, if I can find it. India announces retaliatory trade tariffs against the US. That's not trade deals, that's world-class humor.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:30 am

My comments are from an American perspective. I'm not so sure the US is as much of a paper tiger as you claim. Much of what we see might be a response to Trump more so than the US. American business and Intelligence have their tentacles in lots of places. They pull lots of strings.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:34 am

We are not so much Putin's enemy, as his puppets, these days.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:56 am

LarsMac;1523403 wrote: We are not so much Putin's enemy, as his puppets, these days.

I'm not an enemy of the Russian people, nor am I a puppet of theirs. I doubt Putin is controlling events anywhere near where the media would lead me to believe.

America is its own worst enemy. Capitalism's purpose is to go where it wills and waits for an equal response from forces that are opposed to its actions. That adversarial philosophy creates division, not collaboration. America is at war with itself, but as Spot accurately points out, its leaders and media project enemies onto their people to keep the focus off the actual problem.

We have been witnessing a breach of this projecting within the intelligence community regarding Trump's election.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:27 pm

Ahso!;1523404 wrote: I'm not an enemy of the Russian people, nor am I a puppet of theirs. I doubt Putin is controlling events anywhere near where the media would lead me to believe.

America is its own worst enemy. Capitalism's purpose is to go where it wills and waits for an equal response from forces that are opposed to its actions. That adversarial philosophy creates division, not collaboration. America is at war with itself, but as Spot accurately points out, its leaders and media project enemies onto their people to keep the focus off the actual problem.

We have been witnessing a breach of this projecting within the intelligence community regarding Trump's election.

Sorry that you cannot see the fact that what I said was not personal.

I am not an enemy of the Russian People, either. The we to whom I refer is the "we the Americans" who have allowed this pustule of a human being to represent us and suck up to men like Putin, Kim, and the Saudi Princes. The Hawks he has put in his service have him dancing to a tune that will likely lead us to much more exciting future than we ever dreamed of.

denying any responsibility will not save our a--.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:02 pm

LarsMac;1523414 wrote: Sorry that you cannot see the fact that what I said was not personal.

I didn't take anything personally, just speaking for myself.

Post by **spot** » Mon Jun 17, 2019 10:49 am

'Reality,' sa molesworth 2, 'is so unspeakably sordid it make me shudder.'

A little late for a thread with 1236 posts perhaps, but it struck me as appropriate as we enter the lead-up to the Presidential Primaries.

I take it, in answer to the thread title, that there will only be one Republican candidate?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Mon Jun 17, 2019 6:09 pm

spot;1523434 wrote:

I take it, in answer to the thread title, that there will only be one Republican candidate?

Actually, spot, there will be two. Former Republican Governor of Massachusetts, William Weld (who also ran as Libertarian VP in 2016) is a challenger.

Post by **spot** » Tue Jun 18, 2019 12:12 am

AnneBoleyn;1523440 wrote: Actually, spot, there will be two. Former Republican Governor of Massachusetts, William Weld (who also ran as Libertarian VP in 2016) is a challenger.

Four years ago you could get 33:1 odds against Mr Trump, I expect you could get even longer odds today on Governor Weld (who, I note incredulously, is even older than the fossil he's proposing to replace!).

I'll tell you how to invigorate US politics - put a 42 year age cap on all Presidential hopefuls seeking a first term. Enough of these pensioned retiree geriatrics, if you have to use Viagra you're too old to serve. And Governor Weld got a medical deferment from Vietnam because of a back problem and he's still walking without a stick? How did that happen.

G#Gill · Post by **G#Gill** » Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:24 am

I really hope that, for the sake of the world. this tub-thumping prat will not be voted in again. He's the sort of idiot who could easily throw his toys out of the pram and press 'the button' whilst settling back into his pram, if another country ruffled his feathers badly enough.

I trust that the American people will be more careful and think round corners before they put their X on the ballot paper. I haven't the faintest clue who any alternatives are, but there must be some. I have enough trouble trying to fathom out our own pathetic idiots, who are supposed to be running this poor country of ours, let alone the prospective leader/s of the most powerful nation in the world ! Gawd help us all !

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:32 am

spot, although you are right about Weld, it is important that someone Republican takes a stand.

I also do not want a geriatric president.

Post by **spot** » Wed Jun 19, 2019 2:51 pm

Here, for the record, is a transcript of President Trump's speech officially launching his campaign for a second term as president of the United States.

Donald Trump Announces His 2020 Candidacy at a Political Rally in Orlando - June 18, 2019.

Post by **spot** » Sun Jul 07, 2019 12:39 pm

All the papers reported President Trump's Independence Day mis-speaking (the taking the airports in 1775 thing) as being a teleprompt error, as though the airport comment appeared erroneously on the teleprompt. The President actually did own up to it being his own stream of consciousness balderdash, not something fed to him from a rogue assistant:

Outside the White House on Friday, Mr Trump said: "I guess the rain knocked out the teleprompter.

"I knew the speech very well so I was able to do it without a teleprompter but the teleprompter did go out and it was actually hard to look at anyway because there was rain all over it"

Post by **spot** » Fri Jul 19, 2019 1:04 am

Someone might like this - the US/UK relationship summed up in a single photo...

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:25 pm

I think he will and he will win. However it is the loosers who support trump

Post by **spot** » Sun Jul 28, 2019 2:47 am

Ted;1524085 wrote: I think he will and he will win. However it is the loosers who support trump

That's democracy for you. Most people in any country are losers, that's how the winners get the most of the resources. That's very simple arithmetic.

Post by **spot** » Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:13 pm

The Washington Post is a bit outspoken this evening...

Trump is uniquely unsuited to the moment not only because he lacks empathy and decency. If we as a country truly want to speak with one voice and condemn hate, we must collectively throw him out of office. He's the largest, loudest megaphone for white nationalism and for anti-immigrant fervor. He's an implacable opponent of serious gun safety legislation. He is not merely in the way. He is the problem.

https://www.sfgate.com/opinion/article/ ... 281198.php

Good stuff, that.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:42 pm

spot;1524235 wrote: The Washington Post is a bit outspoken this evening...

Good stuff, that.

It might be, however, the WP, NYTimes, CNN, MSNBC and the rest of the neoliberal corporate media had better quit trying to decide who will run against him. There are two who can beat Trump in debates and a general election afaict and neither one is getting fair and unbiased coverage. Harris, Biden O'Rourk are all losers to Trump.

Post by **spot** » Mon Aug 26, 2019 10:26 am

Oh my word, Mr Trudeau, you'll start a war if you're not a bit more discreet.

That really has to win a photo-journalism award.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:36 am

spot;1524607 wrote: Oh my word, Mr Trudeau, you'll start a war if you're not a bit more discreet.

That really has to win a photo-journalism award.

That is not fair to Melania.

None-the less funny

Post by **spot** » Mon Aug 26, 2019 12:10 pm

tude dog;1524611 wrote: That is not fair to Melania.

None-the less funny

With any other provenance you could guarantee it had been photoshopped, what's so astonishing is that it's untouched. How on earth did the photographer manage that jackpot.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:44 am

spot;1524612 wrote: With any other provenance you could guarantee it had been photoshopped, what's so astonishing is that it's untouched. How on earth did the photographer manage that jackpot.

No doubt!

Nobody can beat dumb luck!

Post by **spot** » Sun Oct 06, 2019 1:45 am

There's a fine article in the Guardian, if anyone would like a look.

Through the looking glass, and a wormhole, in the farthest reaches of a parallel universe, Donald Trump is not facing impeachment. Instead he is truth-teller, a healer of divisions and such a moral champion of African Americans they wonder if that Obama chap was a bit overrated.

To be in the East Room of the White House on Friday afternoon was to step into this alternative reality. More than 200 African American students and young professionals roared with delight and adulation, chanting “USA! USA! and pointing camera phones, as Trump walked in and gave a typically jarring speech that veered off teleprompter.

In this reality, Trump can do no wrong. He is a standup comic whose lines always land. Millennials praise him for “saving America and demand “four more years! His pal Kanye West is a seer. The agent provocateurs of social media are venerated for their contrariness. The enemies are the liberals, the Democrats and their deep state cronies and the fake news media, all of which are to blame for everything from inner city crime to colluding to impeach.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/201 ... dace-owens

Another headline sums up President Trump's entire strategy as being the focus of discussion, "He wants you in a mud fight". That's the man in a nutshell.