TX Strippers Pay Poll Tax for Rape Victims

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:42 am

I have some comments on this one but I'd like to hear some from others first. What do y'all think of this?

Texas Slaps 'Pole Tax' On Strip Joints

Revenues Would Go To Rape Victims

POSTED: 3:41 pm CST December 21, 2007

UPDATED: 4:22 pm CST December 21, 2007

DALLAS -- Texas, where strip clubs have given rise to Anna Nicole Smith and many other less-generously endowed performers, is about to make it more expensive to watch a little bump and grind.In what some have dubbed the "pole tax," the Lone Star State will require its 150 or so strip clubs to collect a $5-per-customer levy, with most of the proceeds going to help rape victims. The tax goes into effect on New Year's Day.Club owners and some of their customers say the money is going to a noble cause, but they argue that the tax infringes on their First Amendment right to freedom of expression, that it will drive some bars out of business and that it unfairly links their industry to sex crimes."We'll be fine. I've already stopped advertising, and we're raising our cover charges. But this is going to kill some of the smaller clubs," said Dawn Rizos, who runs The Lodge, a Hemingway-inspired place that has exotic animal heads on the walls and is packed after Dallas Cowboys games at nearby Texas Stadium.The strip clubs are suing to block the tax, which state officials estimate will raise more than $40 million a year, based on liquor sales figures. If accurate, the estimate suggests at least 8 million people a year go to Texas strip clubs to get a lap dance or watch women pole-dance in a G-string.Supporters of the stripper tax say they are not out to close the clubs - that would just mean less money for victims of sexual assault."This is an industry that largely employs women, and this gives them an opportunity to raise funds for a crime that affects women," said state Rep. Ellen Cohen, a Houston Democrat who sponsored the bill, approved by the Legislature in May."I've been told the fees to get into these places can be $10, $15. I don't think another $5 is going to prevent someone from going," said Cohen, who is also president of a women's center that could get funding from the new law.Most places will probably raise drink prices and cover charges, or start charging a cover if they don't do so already.Strip clubs occupy a mythic place in Texas lore as a spot where young women can work their way through college and small-town girls with dreams of Hollywood stardom get their start on the lowest rung of show biz.Texas' topless spots range from dimly lit dives with pickup trucks lined up outside to gentlemen's clubs that resemble plush hunting lodges and attract men in business suits. The pole tax is unlikely to have much effect on your finer establishments.On a recent weekday at The Lodge, the cars in the valet parking lot included BMWs, a Ferrari and several Mercedes. At a table in a back corner sat Jerry Trigg, an architect who said he goes alone or takes customers to clubs in Dallas and Houston about three times a week.Trigg said he typically spends about $50 during each solo visit and $200 or more when entertaining clients. He said a $5 tax won't affect the number of Diet Cokes he consumes, tips he doles out or lap dances enjoyed.But Elle, a 28-year-old former Dallas dancer, said she worries the tax will hurt women like herself who work their way through college by stripping. She earned a degree from the University of Texas at Arlington and said she now runs a computer-servicing business with her husband.Elle said she averaged $200 a day at the Lodge - "on good days, a hell of a lot more."The owners of Players, a small topless bar in Amarillo, are among those suing the state. They said that adding a $5 tax to the $4 cover could drive away customers and force the club out of business."They won't pay it," said Chandra Brown, president of the company that owns Players. "They won't come in. They can't afford it."Some customers and clubs say it is not the extra five bucks; they resent the implication that strip clubs lead men to commit sex crimes.Rizos said The Lodge already pays the state $1.3 million a year in taxes, and the topless tax will be an additional $60,000 per month."Run the right way, these businesses can really be a benefit for the community," Rizos said. "We're a huge convention draw for the city. We raise money for charity with our car washes."Utah enacted a 10 percent tax on topless clubs in 2004. That same year, the Texas Legislature considered a $5-per-head fee, with the money going toward schools. But lawmakers didn't like the link between strip clubs and kids - the idea was mocked as "Tassels for Tots" - and the proposal died.The idea was resurrected last summer by the Texas Association Against Sexual Assault as a way to open more rape-crisis centers.In their lawsuit, the clubs said nude dancing is protected by the First Amendment and the state can't selectively tax it, even if it is conduct some may find offensive. Besides, they argued, the tax is so broad it could apply to concerts by performers like Madonna or Britney Spears who wear low-cut tops.Jonathan Turley, a constitutional law expert at George Washington University, said the Texas tax goes too far."It seems clear legislators are targeting strip clubs because they're unpopular," Turley said. "Laws like this would expose any unpopular industry to punitive taxes. It could be abortion clinics."

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 9:52 am

The owners of Players, a small topless bar in Amarillo, are among those suing the state. They said that adding a $5 tax to the $4 cover could drive away customers and force the club out of business.

First off this cracked me up. Players is one of the worse topless joints in Amarillo. I've heard this from my hubby, and several of his friends. The girls are aren't exactly anything you'd want to tip.

Secondly, if the tax was for something else, say to help homeless people, would there still be a fuss?

And I don't think it would hurt the stripping industry. If men want to go out to a strip club, they'll go. :rolleyes:

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 10:00 am

****ing politicians. I wonder if we could tax stupidity

suzycreamcheese · Post by **suzycreamcheese** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:02 pm

I think its a really good way of raising money for rape crisis centres.

If they really want to go to a strip club, then an extra few dollars wont make any difference, especially since all the toher clubs will be charging an extra few dollars more too. Just like inflation.

Only difference is this way the money goes to a worthy cause rather than lining big businesses and governments pockets

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:09 pm

rjwould;744824 wrote: I don't like the implication that that strip clubs are associated with rape.

Neither do I RJ. It smacks of discrimination as well. I also find it repugnant because you know what they're really saying is "we're gonna make you pay for your sin" and that flies in my face. I think this was a poorly thought out idea.

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:15 pm

I don't think it's a "gonna make you pay for your sin" kinda deal.

suzycreamcheese · Post by **suzycreamcheese** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:30 pm

I think they shouldnt stick with strip clubs, I think it would be good if the sex industry in general was made to help charities directly involved with the casualties of the exploitation of women. I dont think strip clubs are responsible for rapes - I dont think theres any evidence of that being the major cause. I think theres plenty of things that lead to a culture of men thinking that women are objects purely for their own gratification, and to blame the strip club industry or the porn industry is overly simplistic, but i do like it if industries can be made to give something back, and it seems like a good idea for who to give it to

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:32 pm

Good point SuzyCreamCheese..I gotta think of a shorter name for you. :wah:

The tax should be expanded to the adult stores, and other clubs. The article isn't clear on if this applies just to topless joints, or to both topless and full nudity. The difference being topless they can serve alcohol and can offer no cover charge, full nudity it's BYOB and a high cover charge.

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:38 pm

But if we tax the exploitation of women, we should make womens magazines with their anorexic models and the fashion design world with their anorexic unhealthy examples "give something back" to the very women they exploit- us. Us real women who have that in our face every day. How about cosmetic companies as well?

I feel bad because this is already two issues Suzy Cream Cheese and I have differed over in just a couple days :wah: and I don't want her thinking it's personal. But I have to disagree with giving something back. Charity is supposed to come from the heart and willingly...taxing strips clubs in my opinion is not any form of giving to the community. It's just stealing more money from people who work for it.

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:43 pm

I dunno RG. Not everyone is affected by the tax. It's a volunteer tax. You pay it if you visit a strip joint. Kind of like sin tax. You don't want to pay it, don't buy cigarettes or alcohol. :wah:

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:50 pm

Yeah but that still seems like a judgement call. I still have to agree with RJ in that it seems like implication and just what you said- a sin tax. Who's to say stripping is a sin? Who decides that for all? Maybe I'm just too liberal, I think we tax enough things.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 7:23 am

suzycreamcheese;744848 wrote: I think they shouldnt stick with strip clubs, I think it would be good if the sex industry in general was made to help charities directly involved with the casualties of the exploitation of women. I dont think strip clubs are responsible for rapes - I dont think theres any evidence of that being the major cause. I think theres plenty of things that lead to a culture of men thinking that women are objects purely for their own gratification, and to blame the strip club industry or the porn industry is overly simplistic, but i do like it if industries can be made to give something back, and it seems like a good idea for who to give it to

Should we make slaughterhouses donate to PETA ?

Or the textile industry donate to EPA because of dander in the air ?

Maybe career politicians should be made to donate to the Special Olympics.

cars · Post by **cars** » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:58 am

Seems like it is a tax on a particular segment of business, & it is a business.

If that's the case, why not go a step further and attack other lucritive businesses!? And "Tax the Insurance Companies", only for every claim they deny!? That would translate into "Billions" of unfathomable revenue to spread across all the medical needs of the general populace, not just rape centers! Go another step & Tax the "Oil Barons", on the "Trillions" of profits they pocket each & every day! Why tax the working man? If they're going to Tax anyone, it should a tax on the ones who best could afford it!!! :-2