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xyz;1355736 wrote:

Ludicrous. Peter warned that Satan goes about like a roaring lion, a phenomenon not unknown to ME ancients. A lion is not a mythical beast, anyway


I'm going to double check this to make sure it doesn't translate as "as" a roaring Lion, instead of like, but if it does translate to "like" than I stand corrected. I also still find it interesting that they chose a lion as the animal for the scripture, because as I said it ties into some of the early Gnostic Christian beliefs.

As far as what an Angel looks like, I'm not sure that I've ever seen one before. I do know that the Bible describes them as being very beautiful and radiant though possibly using other wards along those lines.

Nope, just as I thought, the Kings James version uses the word "as" and not "like". As and Like are two different words entirely.

King James Bible

Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

Something that would have the ability to take the form of something else would therefore be AS that form and not actually BE that form but could appear as though it was that form at least for a time. You see so the word "As" would therefore show the taking of the form rather than being "like" which would only be similar in either action, thought, or form. But the belief that Angels can take on other forms including Human forms is nothing new.

We can use it in context.

"I walked around the park AS a Human."

"I walked around the park LIKE a Human."

The first one makes it clear that I was a Human while I walked around the park. Or at the very least that I appeared to be a Human while I was walking around the park.

The second one only makes it clear that I walked around the park in a similar way or manner that a Human can or does.

xyz;1355736 wrote: What does an angel look like?



What does a dragon look like? And is the popular image of Satan, the hooved and horned goat-man, that of a dragon?



A contradiction in terms, but never mind.



:) Ludicrous. Peter warned that Satan goes about like a roaring lion, a phenomenon not unknown to ME ancients. A lion is not a mythical beast, anyway.



So what is the purpose of saying that 'the devil looks remarkably like some of the mythical beasts', if he can change his form at will? Could he not make himself look like Colonel Gadaffi, or Sarah Palin, or Herr Ratzinger, or Joyce Meyer?

This is an absurdly amateur, literalist, fundamentalist approach, the worldly version of things, the whole thing neatly, yet crazily, upside down:

'Satan himself masquerades as an angel of light. It is not surprising, then, if his servants masquerade as servants of righteousness.' 2 Cor 11:14-15 (NIV)


Satan can not enter into our realm of inhabitance at Will. The Bible makes this perfectly clear as does other scriptures related to Him or demons. They exist in a separate realm, however you want to look at it. Though demons do not appear to be permanent Beings like an Angel is because God did not create demons but He did in fact create Angels. It is my personal belief that a demon is a creature created through the manipulation of energy from using actual black magic spells or enchantments and or manipulating energy with a dark intention in mind. Both actually. In fact it would appear that a demon can be "dispelled" from either a Human body or from a Human environment and therefore can be destroyed by "White Magic" or by "Sending it towards the Light" through good intentions and practices and/or sending it towards the Holy Spirit to be purified/destroyed and then therefore I would assume turned back into a raw form of energy again. Lucifer on the other hand can not be destroyed by any Human activity. He can and will flee from you but he can not be "dispelled" because He is not a spell to begin with. And from what I gather only God can create Eternal Beings. Therefore a demon would not qualify as an Eternal Being because it did not come from God.

However, can Satan and/or a demon temporarily possess another body and use it therefore to do their bidding? Well, the part about Satan being able to do that is unclear, but the Bible speaks much about demonic possession and demons entering into bodies so I don't know how far fetched it would be to assume that Satan couldn't do the same if invited to. Therefore using a person's body as a vehicle but only when asked or invited to do so by that person or if that person had no protection against such a thing (most likely from dabbling in dark or black magic, etc. and turning their back on the Light/God), or from heavy drug usage/addiction and or from the constant and excessive abuse of mind altering drugs (which could very well tear open a rift in that persons original reality - therefore leaving them much more vulnerable to things which could exist outside of their original reality) and which are also used by many Satanic and or Luciferian cults that deal with channeling negative Spirits, etc., and then therefore using that body as a vehicle on our realm but not actually ever being able to take their own solid form in our realm as we can and as we live in it on a daily basis in each of our experiences with each other and our surroundings. So more like using that person's body in a similar fashion as a puppet on a string only being able to temporarily live through that "puppet" to penetrate at least visually from their realm into ours.

However, other intelligent Beings that could/do exist in our reality/realm/Universe be it on another planet or what have you are a whole different story. If a Being such as that could ever figure out how to replicate the Human Body and skin perfectly so that they can actually use it as a disguise than we could definitely be in for some serious trouble if the Beings that were doing it had negative intentions in mind for us. And it indeed makes you wonder sometimes if such a thing has ever been attempted/put into practice successfully. Either on a minute scale or a major one. Both could be highly consequential for our species depending upon the motives of such Beings. But currently that is pure speculation on my part and has never been proven to be the case or at least not publicly so.

One thing I know is this. Evil appears in many forms and in many places. So watch out. Also keep watch on your own intentions because they to can be corrupt but need not ever manifest into physical actions towards yourself or others. We all have and will continue for as long as we remain on the Earth to suffer from these types of negative intentions at times.

TruthBringer;1355812 wrote: Satan can not enter into our realm of inhabitance at Will. The Bible makes this perfectly clear as does other scriptures related to Him or demons.
The gospels mention several cases of demon possession, and also that humans can pre-dispose themselves for possession. Demons may be supposed to act on behalf of Satan, whose recorded characteristics are fabrication (quite often leading to self-contradiction), accusation (usually a general, non-specific charge) and attempts to command and control without proper authority. Readers may wish to take note of these, and look out for them in their dealings with others, particularly those who are involved in religion or religious conversation.

TruthBringer;1355811 wrote: Nope, just as I thought, the Kings James version
Let's be serious. That is not worth opening. Even a modern version is inadequate. Greek will do.

posted by xyz

It is more likely that eastern religions, and Greek philosophy also, were influenced by the following of Abraham and Israel (Jacob) before Jesus was born, and that any influence that reached Jesus was an echo of his own tradition- if not his own voice, if indeed he is the Jehovah of the Israelites.


That's a notion that doesn't stand up to much examination. However, i shall leave you to it.

gmc;1355830 wrote: That's a notion that doesn't stand up to much examination.
Any person who posts without a clue about anything much, who somehow has access to a cheap computer, and a bad conscience about his personal life, could write that....

However, i shall leave you to it.
... so you've got it all to do, chum.

:sneaky:

xyz;1355833 wrote: Any person who posts without a clue about anything much, who somehow has access to a cheap computer, and a bad conscience about his personal life, could write that....



... so you've got it all to do, chum.

:sneaky:


Actually I've got a relatively expensive computer but before that there were places called libraries where they had things called books that you could borrow. You don't have to believe the last you tube video you watched - do your own primary research.

Personally I find the notion that the only ancient history that matters is that of the middle east an absurd one- as if what happened elsewhere had no impact or was of little significance. You can cross reference some of the biblical history with what other cultures were writing about the jews at the same time if you are interested enough to dig deeper.

so you've got it all to do, chum.


No I don't it's up to you. If you believe the bible is true you shouldn't be afraid to dig in to it.

gmc;1355880 wrote: Actually I've got a relatively expensive computer
Really???? Can we have posts to match, please? Because nothing you've written so far is worth a carrot, except to show that you are terrified of dealing with someone who actually knows what he's talking about. Let's have solid substance, not pretentious drivel, troll.

Regarding reference to hell and the reality of it: As surely as there is a heaven, there is a hell.The word "hell" is found in many Bible translations. In the same verses other translaations read "the grave" "the world of the dead," and so forth. Other Bibles simply transliterate the original-language words that are sometimes endered "hell"; that is, they express them with the leters of our alphabet but leave the words untranslated. What are those words? the Hebrew ---sheohl---and it's greek equivalent ---hades----which refer, not to an individual burial place, but to the common grave of dead mankind, also the Greek----geennah----which is used as a symbol of eternal destruction. However, both in Christedom and in many non-christian religions it is taught that hell is a place inhabited by deamons and where the wicked, after death, are punished (and some believe this is with torment) What does the Bible really teach "hell" is?)

Loyal;1357598 wrote: Regarding reference to hell and the reality of it: As surely as there is a heaven, there is a hell.The word "hell" is found in many Bible translations. In the same verses other translaations read "the grave" "the world of the dead," and so forth. Other Bibles simply transliterate the original-language words that are sometimes endered "hell"; that is, they express them with the leters of our alphabet but leave the words untranslated. What are those words? the Hebrew ---sheohl---and it's greek equivalent ---hades----which refer, not to an individual burial place, but to the common grave of dead mankind, also the Greek----geennah----which is used as a symbol of eternal destruction. However, both in Christedom and in many non-christian religions it is taught that hell is a place inhabited by deamons and where the wicked, after death, are punished (and some believe this is with torment) What does the Bible really teach "hell" is?)
It's what most people get as their just desserts.

Yes, that bad.

I'm thinking you are saying when people do evil they get what they deserve. Do you know that good and bad go to hell?

Loyal;1357626 wrote: I'm thinking you are saying when people do evil they get what they deserve. Do you know that good and bad go to hell?
If people get a thousand years of hell for each singular personal pronoun, what's the tally so far?

It's important to talk with people that is really interested in what the Bible says. It seems that you only want to see the folly of it all.--- Are you interested in living forever, are you interested in what happen after death. Being an informed person means whether you live or you don't. Maybe, I can strike a cord in you somewhere.

i am not saying this as an undeniable truth but just as my own filtered idea that i have surmised through out my life experience i believe hell is created by oneself and its created only if you have things you have not forgiven yourself for in your life i mean isnt that what saves you in Christianity forgiveness of god well what if god is you that would mean that your salvation or damnation depends solely on if you forgive your self wouldnt it. i can also see how it would seem as an eternity because as long as you would be in hell you would be faced with the worst things you have done none stop until you forgive yourself and i again this is not an attack on anyone's beliefs nor am i stating this as stone cold truth just my own personal belief. love you all and all your wonderful opinions

In order to respond to your personal beliefs, I would first have to ask you, if you believe in what the Bible says on a given subject then I can break it down to show what God says on a particular subject. I never say what I believe, because what I believe doesn't amount to a hill of beans. IT'S WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS AND THE BIBLE IS GOD'S WRITTEN WORDS.

good luck with that

What do you mean? I can prove what I believe,

Loyal;1359093 wrote: What do you mean? I can prove what I believe,


This is someone other than who post here usually (my brother).

I am the createor of this account and, no that is not the point you can believe in whatever you want and you don't have to prove your beliefs to me my brother or anyone else. to the contrary of that, if you have to prove your beliefs to others it probably means you have problems believing in those beliefs yourself and have to have others to agree with you in order feel comfortable about believing in the beliefs you feel compelled to prove to others, but what you can't prove to me my brother or anyone else is that your belief is better than mine and that rule goes both ways.

If you want to quote scripture to me I will listen. We cannot believe whatever we want we must believe what the bible says. The scripture at Eph.4:5 says there is one faith. That would be ONE. The both of us cannot be right. So people have to come together and reason on what the bible says in order to come to a conclusion. I firmly believe the bible, not what I want to believe. I do not have any problem with my faith and I do not feel compelled. I was simply responding to what your brother had written. If that is called {compelled} then maybe I should have gone on to someone else.

Loyal;1359344 wrote: If you want to quote scripture to me I will listen. We cannot believe whatever we want we must believe what the bible says. The scripture at Eph.4:5 says there is one faith. That would be ONE. The both of us cannot be right. So people have to come together and reason on what the bible says in order to come to a conclusion. I firmly believe the bible, not what I want to believe. I do not have any problem with my faith and I do not feel compelled. I was simply responding to what your brother had written. If that is called {compelled} then maybe I should have gone on to someone else.


Why must we believe what the bible says what I want to believe it says maybe different what you want to believe it says or, what the pope may believe it says, or what peter or paul wanted you to believe or understand from what was written or what Jesus wanted peter or paul to get from what he did and taught. I don't feel a need to massivly quote scripture to you because I believe it does no good to utimately teach the message that jesus was really tryingt to get across, and unfortunately there is a growing stereotype of christians that are crusading scipture spammers who feel that the only way to be a good person in the world is to take everyting of the New testament, and in some cases the old testament litterally and that it is more important to believe that stories of the bible really happened than it is to learn from those stories about how to treat your fellow man. I feel that christianity will continue to be a declining religion giving way to buhdism, scientology, and even Islam if this stereotype continues to grow. Peace be with you.

I believe I quoted Ephesians 4:5 already where it says {1} ONE faith and that ONE faith is not going to give way to the three suggested by you. The bible says ALL {new testament and old testament }scriptures are inspired and beneficial. The Bible does not speak about what you referenced, therefore if it is not in the bible, it is not to be considered. JOHN 14:6 JESUS SAYS " I AM," THEREFORE, IF YOU BELIEVE JESUS YOU BELIEVE THE BIBLE. "THE WAY THE TRUTH AND THE LIGHT. it's comfortable to believe what we want and how we feel. That is not going to get us salvation. To get everlastiing life, we must gain knowledge of the bible, what it says and what we must do. We can't just sit back on a mushroom and say I believe. That won't cut it. We must work . Faith without works is dead. I don't say this to be sacarstic I say it because, as a christian I am interested in your salvation. Do you know if I know and do not tell you, then my life is in jeapordy as well.

Loyal;1359501 wrote: I believe I quoted Ephesians 4:5 already where it says {1} ONE faith and that ONE faith is not going to give way to the three suggested by you. The bible says ALL {new testament and old testament }scriptures are inspired and beneficial. The Bible does not speak about what you referenced, therefore if it is not in the bible, it is not to be considered. JOHN 14:6 JESUS SAYS " I AM," THEREFORE, IF YOU BELIEVE JESUS YOU BELIEVE THE BIBLE. "THE WAY THE TRUTH AND THE LIGHT. it's comfortable to believe what we want and how we feel. That is not going to get us salvation. To get everlastiing life, we must gain knowledge of the bible, what it says and what we must do. We can't just sit back on a mushroom and say I believe. That won't cut it. We must work . Faith without works is dead. I don't say this to be sacarstic I say it because, as a christian I am interested in your salvation. Do you know if I know and do not tell you, then my life is in jeapordy as well.


You just like all the other spammers on here have made your self clear that A.) you care little about what the bible teaches even though you say your christian. As you believe the bible in no way teaches to learn how to live your life and treat your fellow man b.) your fervorous attack on my, my brother's and other FG member's beliefs in order to impose your own as better in order to save us in the after life belittles the value of our lives here on earth which again shows me just how little about christianity or any religion for that matter you have a full grasp of. So I feel no need to further my conversation with you unless you can show some compassion for the lives of your fellow man/woman here on earth before and stop trying to play god "of which you are not" and pass judgement on someone. If you do get a response later in this post in my name it is by my brother

I do apologize if I have offended you. Sometimes, maybe I appear to come on to strong. I do that because lives are at stake. If I help just one person, I feel accomplished. If you do not want me to engage in conversations you are having. I will refrain. I do believe the Bible and every word it teaches. Most definitely the bible teaches how one must live his life and to relate to fellow man. If everyone would obey those laws found in the bible, we would not live in the world in which we live. The scriptures tells us if we have a cause for complaint against our fellow man go to that person and resolve the issue, which you have done with me and I appreciate the fact, you handled your complaint in this manner.------My best to you.

littleCJelkton;1359448 wrote: Why must we believe what the bible says what I want to believe it says maybe different what you want to believe it says or, what the pope may believe it says, or what peter or paul wanted you to believe or understand from what was written or what Jesus wanted peter or paul to get from what he did and taught. I don't feel a need to massivly quote scripture to you because I believe it does no good to utimately teach the message that jesus was really tryingt to get across, and unfortunately there is a growing stereotype of christians that are crusading scipture spammers who feel that the only way to be a good person in the world is to take everyting of the New testament, and in some cases the old testament litterally and that it is more important to believe that stories of the bible really happened than it is to learn from those stories about how to treat your fellow man. I feel that christianity will continue to be a declining religion giving way to buhdism, scientology, and even Islam if this stereotype continues to grow. Peace be with you.


Excuse me, sir. Did you really just lump Buddhism and Islam with scientology? Are you trying to say that any of these three religions are illegitimate?

tbone;1360011 wrote: Excuse me, sir. Did you really just lump Buddhism and Islam with scientology? Are you trying to say that any of these three religions are illegitimate?I think he asserted he believes Christianity may be on the decline while the others seem to have stronger staying power. Gutsy call.

Excuse me Sir, I know you asked me to go away. I have a question. How do you know what part of the scriptures to believe? Is there a mathematical equation or what?

Loyal;1360058 wrote: Excuse me Sir, I know you asked me to go away. I have a question. How do you know what part of the scriptures to believe? Is there a mathematical equation or what?That's easy: it's best to avoid believing any of it literally.

No one has requested you to leave AFAIK.

Some of those hellish testimonies are pretty darn convincing. The people that relate those experiences seem sincere in their belief that they truly experienced hell.

But I have no way of knowing if the experience was merely a product of their own consiousness as a hallucination. There seems to be no way to determine to what extent a dying brain can deceive itself. I've had profound dreams that seemed very real to me--until I woke up. And let's not discount the possibility of fraud with these stories. Some people are begging for attention, and might be willing to go to hell to get it, figuratively anyway. It also sells books too, so there's a good motive right there to take an extraordinary experience of the mind and turn it into a trip to hell.

Before one can believe in hell, one has to accept that our consciousness survives physical death. I'm still not one hundred percent sure that it does.