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oscar;1433576 wrote: Frankly you are talking bollocks and know nothing about this country and Muslim no-go zones.

So the article Is two years old ? And ???Do you seriously think Muslim no-go zones have failed to exist or abated In that two years?

Very much related to Muslim no-go zones In the UK are not reported by mainstream media for fear of Inciting racial unrest.

Yes, this Is an old video but mainstream media have never shown this and I bet middle England have never seen It either.

EDL - English Defence League - How Dare You Come To A Muslim Area? - YouTube

This Is the Home Secretary from 2006 to 2007 John Reid being told by Abu Izzadeen, a well-known fundamentalist who has been linked to a now banned organisation and who praised the ''martyrdom" of suicide bombers after the July 7 attacks in London " How dare you come to a Muslim area ".

His reply at the end of the clip being

" Somehow by me coming to a Muslim community in Britain, as he put it, which he appears to think is not part of Britain and that I should be excluded from her.

Well I think we should be able to go to any part of Britain, any area, any community, and discuss with any religion, the issues that are important to us."

I suggest you carry out some research Anne before you Insist further that you know any better than us.


OK, I'll ask you again - which area of the UK is a Muslim no go area?

Tell me where it is and I'll go there and prove that it's not.

It's you that's "talking bollocks" and being insulting too.

Bryn Mawr;1433593 wrote: OK, I'll ask you again - which area of the UK is a Muslim no go area?

Tell me where it is and I'll go there and prove that it's not.

It's you that's "talking bollocks" and being insulting too. So my video of John Reid being told " How dare you enter a Muslim area" Is no Indication to you that some Muslims regard Tower Hamlets as a Muslim area?

Going back to Bruv's OP and the subsequent video's and links I have provided to show that Tower Hamlets and parts of Manchester Including other area's of the UK are perceived by some Muslims to be no-go Zones hence " How dare you come Into a Muslim area".

It's a perception perceived by many Muslims hence the call to shut down Bookies In some area's.

You may be perfectly able to wander around Tower Hamlets or Manchester In denims and a shirt but look at what happened to the young white guy when he wandered Into what Is perceived as Muslim Territory after dark. Look at the OP when two men scantilly clad wander Into an area deemed a Muslim no-go Zone. It is not literal by the words but when ordinary British people are deterred from behaving In a Western manner In their own Western Country.

As for being offensive to Anne. I find It deeply offensive to see a blog written by a warring nationalist faction about a woman who's campaigning for justice for her murdered daughter presented as fact.

Tommy Robinson and even Nick Griffin may be many things but I find It offensive and libelous to read rubbish such as the EDL give Nazi Salutes and the EDL and BNP attack Mosques.

oscar;1433594 wrote: So my video of John Reid being told " How dare you enter a Muslim area" Is no Indication to you that some Muslims regard Tower Hamlets as a Muslim area?

Going back to Bruv's OP and the subsequent video's and links I have provided to show that Tower Hamlets and parts of Manchester Including other area's of the UK are perceived by some Muslims to be no-go Zones hence " How dare you come Into a Muslim area".

It's a perception perceived by many Muslims hence the call to shut down Bookies In some area's.

You may be perfectly able to wander around Tower Hamlets or Manchester In denims and a shirt but look at what happened to the young white guy when he wandered Into what Is perceived as Muslim Territory after dark. Look at the OP when two men scantilly clad wander Into an area deemed a Muslim no-go Zone. It is not literal by the words but when ordinary British people are deterred from behaving In a Western manner In their own Western Country.

As for being offensive to Anne. I find It deeply offensive to see a blog written by a warring nationalist faction about a woman who's campaigning for justice for her murdered daughter presented as fact.

Tommy Robinson and even Nick Griffin may be many things but I find It offensive and libelous to read rubbish such as the EDL give Nazi Salutes and the EDL and BNP attack Mosques.


That "some Muslims" regard Tower Hamlets as a Muslim area does not make it so and certainly does not make it a no go area for non-Muslims.

That you find some posts offensive does not give you the right to be rude and offensive.

oscar;1433585 wrote: Tommy Robinson was convicted of assault after he repeatedly told a moron giving Nazi salutes to stop. Finally he punched the guy. Go to any EDL march or rally and you'll see the Israeli flag being flown. There Is no way on Gods earth any member of the EDL would give a Nazi salute or attack a Mosque or any place of worship.

Now... Do you have any factual, documented evidence that any member of the EDL or BNP has been convicted or arrested for attacking a Mosque?


BBC News - Stoke-on-Trent mosque arsonists jailed

Bryn Mawr;1433593 wrote: OK, I'll ask you again - which area of the UK is a Muslim no go area?

Tell me where it is and I'll go there and prove that it's not.

It's you that's "talking bollocks" and being insulting too.


Ditto what Bryn says.

I've walked through the Tower Hamlets area that Bryn mentions a lot over the past few years and I feel safer there than in central London. Guess what, I found the whites to be rude and locked in a world of their own where they wouldn't step aside or hold a door open, let alone smile. The Muslims however, were polite, courteous, held doors open, smiled and chatted when I purchased items from them. That makes the area somewhere I am more than happy to spend to my time, any time of the day or night.

I'm sick of forum garden being used in this way, making out one person holds a majority view and the rest of us are idiots who are blinkered. :rolleyes:

Everytime someone disagrees they just get a whole pile of tripe posted at them, anyone noticed how many people are NOT posting around here any more because they are fed up being shouted down by someone who knows it all about everything.

Man who hung “Asians only” sign on this property blames his racism on . . . racism! | Violence Against Whites

Muslim gang shatter John Payne’s skull with a hammer in Stepney – because he was white | Violence Against Whites

The OP story Is how parts of the UK are perceived by some Muslims. So, how exactly do we deal with that?

oscar;1433600 wrote: Man who hung “Asians only” sign on this property blames his racism on . . . racism! | Violence Against Whites

Muslim gang shatter John Payne’s skull with a hammer in Stepney – because he was white | Violence Against Whites

The OP story Is how parts of the UK are perceived by some Muslims. So, how exactly do we deal with that?


The first link, fine - he's a racist and the courts have dealt with him as they would any other racist.

The second? How many links have you ignored because they don't support your ideas? There's far more white on black racial violence than there is black on white and one incident does not make a trend.

Betty Boop;1433598 wrote: Ditto what Bryn says.

I've walked through the Tower Hamlets area that Bryn mentions a lot over the past few years and I feel safer there than in central London. Guess what, I found the whites to be rude and locked in a world of their own where they wouldn't step aside or hold a door open, let alone smile. The Muslims however, were polite, courteous, held doors open, smiled and chatted when I purchased items from them. That makes the area somewhere I am more than happy to spend to my time, any time of the day or night.

I'm sick of forum garden being used in this way, making out one person holds a majority view and the rest of us are idiots who are blinkered. :rolleyes:

Everytime someone disagrees they just get a whole pile of tripe posted at them, anyone noticed how many people are NOT posting around here any more because they are fed up being shouted down by someone who knows it all about everything.


How dare you single me out when I log on every day to find tripe from Truth Is never too horrible and the God Squad moved In.

All of this has been contained In one thread which I did not post.

Equally, I have been Insulted by Anne In other threads as to my knowing diddly squat about Black Americans In The Travon thread.

Like I said, everyone Is entitled to an opinion on Tommy Robinson or Nick Griffin but writing libel as facts such as they attack Mosques Is likely to bring any forum problems.

oscar;1433603 wrote: How dare you single me out when I log on every day to find tripe from Truth Is never too horrible and the God Squad moved In.

All of this has been contained In one thread which I did not post.

Equally, I have been Insulted by Anne In other threads as to my knowing diddly squat about Black Americans In The Travon thread.

Like I said, everyone Is entitled to an opinion on Tommy Robinson or Nick Griffin but writing libel as facts such as they attack Mosques Is likely to bring any forum problems.


What has Truth got to do with this?

You are constantly agressive with those who disagree with you. Your first reaction is to insult.

The first rule on this site is, and has been since Tombstone's day, "Be civil" - follow that and you'll have no problem but you are going too far too often.

Bryn Mawr;1433602 wrote: The first link, fine - he's a racist and the courts have dealt with him as they would any other racist.

The second? How many links have you ignored because they don't support your ideas? There's far more white on black racial violence than there is black on white and one incident does not make a trend.


Have you seen the stats for that claim ?

Table 2.01: Trends in the percentage of adults who were victims once or more

of a BCS personal crime by ethnicity, England and Wales 2006/07 to 2010/11

2006/07 2007/08 2008/09 2009/10 2010/11

% victimised once or more

ALL 6.6 6.1 6.3 5.7 5.9

White 6.5 6.1 6.2 5.7 5.6

Non-White 8.0 6.0 7.0 5.6 7.5

Mixed 15.7 8.2 13.2 9.1 10.8

Asian or Asian British 6.6 5.3 6.5 4.0 7.0

Black or Black British 9.6 7.0 6.8 6.9 6.9

Chinese or other 6.2 5.5 6.2 7.2 8.5

Unweighted bases

ALL 47,138 46,903 46,220 44,559 46,754

In each of the five years, racially motivated incidents represented a small

proportion of all offences reported by adults. There were 150,000 racially

motivated incidents reported in 2010/11 compared with 9,618,000 incidents of

crime overall.



https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... s-2010.pdf

Bryn Mawr;1433604 wrote: What has Truth got to do with this?

You are constantly agressive with those who disagree with you. Your first reaction is to insult.

The first rule on this site is, and has been since Tombstone's day, "Be civil" - follow that and you'll have no problem but you are going too far too often.


Then I shall apologise Bryn but sorry, there's enough rubbish out there already by wannabe bloggers about Tommy Robinson and attacking Mosques and giving Nazi salutes Is libel.

Bryn Mawr;1433604 wrote: What has Truth got to do with this?

You are constantly agressive with those who disagree with you. Your first reaction is to insult.

The first rule on this site is, and has been since Tombstone's day, "Be civil" - follow that and you'll have no problem but you are going too far too often.


The point I was making about Truth who I used as an example, Is that we all have threads we are not Interested In. We see Ahso's gun agenda as another example but then I am accused of " using the forum for this agenda" when I didn't post the thread In the first place.

Bryn Mawr;1433597 wrote: BBC News - Stoke-on-Trent mosque arsonists jailed


" Beech told the court during the four-day trial that he had been a member of the English Defence League and the British National Party. But he said he was not racist and did not believe his views to be extreme.

Yes, It's unfortunate that both outfits attract nutters but Tommy and Nick are pretty quick at expelling them.

oscar;1433605 wrote: Have you seen the stats for that claim ?

Table 2.01: Trends in the percentage of adults who were victims once or more

of a BCS personal crime by ethnicity, England and Wales 2006/07 to 2010/11

2006/07 2007/08 2008/09 2009/10 2010/11

% victimised once or more

ALL 6.6 6.1 6.3 5.7 5.9

White 6.5 6.1 6.2 5.7 5.6

Non-White 8.0 6.0 7.0 5.6 7.5

Mixed 15.7 8.2 13.2 9.1 10.8

Asian or Asian British 6.6 5.3 6.5 4.0 7.0

Black or Black British 9.6 7.0 6.8 6.9 6.9

Chinese or other 6.2 5.5 6.2 7.2 8.5

Unweighted bases

ALL 47,138 46,903 46,220 44,559 46,754

In each of the five years, racially motivated incidents represented a small

proportion of all offences reported by adults. There were 150,000 racially

motivated incidents reported in 2010/11 compared with 9,618,000 incidents of

crime overall.



https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... s-2010.pdf


The paper you've linked to is facinating but the table you've extracted is totally irrelevant.

It does not show the percentage of victims of racial violence by race at all. It shows the percentage of any form of crime by race of victim as reported byt the British Crime Survey.

Given that "non-white" includes a disproportionate number of people living in inner city areas and you would expect the number of burglaries etc to be higher, as this statistic far outweighs the number of racially aggrivated assaults the table has no meaning in this context.

It is also interesting to note that the number of racially motivated incidents is falling over the years - from 180K in 2006/7 to 150K in 2010/11.

Betty Boop;1433598 wrote: Ditto what Bryn says.

I've walked through the Tower Hamlets area that Bryn mentions a lot over the past few years and I feel safer there than in central London. Guess what, I found the whites to be rude and locked in a world of their own where they wouldn't step aside or hold a door open, let alone smile. The Muslims however, were polite, courteous, held doors open, smiled and chatted when I purchased items from them. That makes the area somewhere I am more than happy to spend to my time, any time of the day or night.

I'm sick of forum garden being used in this way, making out one person holds a majority view and the rest of us are idiots who are blinkered. :rolleyes:

Everytime someone disagrees they just get a whole pile of tripe posted at them, anyone noticed how many people are NOT posting around here any more because they are fed up being shouted down by someone who knows it all about everything.


I didn't see Ahso post in this thread. :-2

oscar;1433606 wrote: Then I shall apologise Bryn but sorry, there's enough rubbish out there already by wannabe bloggers about Tommy Robinson and attacking Mosques and giving Nazi salutes Is libel.


You challenged me to find a case of a BNP or EDL member being arrested to attacking a Mosque - I found and posted just such a case within the fist few items of a simple google.

It happens - you just choose to ignore it.

Bryn Mawr;1433609 wrote: The paper you've linked to is facinating but the table you've extracted is totally irrelevant.

It does not show the percentage of victims of racial violence by race at all. It shows the percentage of any form of crime by race of victim as reported byt the British Crime Survey.

Given that "non-white" includes a disproportionate number of people living in inner city areas and you would expect the number of burglaries etc to be higher, as this statistic far outweighs the number of racially aggrivated assaults the table has no meaning in this context.

It is also interesting to note that the number of racially motivated incidents is falling over the years - from 180K in 2006/7 to 150K in 2010/11.


Yes It was that which I honed In on also. Is this because the UK has become more tolerant over the years?

Bryn Mawr;1433611 wrote: You challenged me to find a case of a BNP or EDL member being arrested to attacking a Mosque - I found and posted just such a case within the fist few items of a simple google.

It happens - you just choose to ignore it. I didn't Ignore It.... Go back a few posts... think we cross posted.

oscar;1433608 wrote: " Beech told the court during the four-day trial that he had been a member of the English Defence League and the British National Party. But he said he was not racist and did not believe his views to be extreme.

Yes, It's unfortunate that both outfits attract nutters but Tommy and Nick are pretty quick at expelling them.


Yes, the moment it became clear they were going down!

Bryn Mawr;1433614 wrote: Yes, the moment it became clear they were going down! I don't believe that for a minute Bryn. I don't believe either of them would condone such actions but with the BNP membership at 1 million at It's peak, It's difficult for any party to have tabs on all members.

One's like that tend to get flagged up pretty quick and they scuttle off to join combat 18 Instead.

By the same token then Bryn... are you saying the 27 Labour councilors convicted of child abuse over the years Is Indicative of the Labour Party and the Labour Party only ditched them when they got busted?

http://www.stormfront.org/forum/t982493/

Bryn Mawr;1433609 wrote: The paper you've linked to is facinating but the table you've extracted is totally irrelevant.

It does not show the percentage of victims of racial violence by race at all. It shows the percentage of any form of crime by race of victim as reported byt the British Crime Survey.

Given that "non-white" includes a disproportionate number of people living in inner city areas and you would expect the number of burglaries etc to be higher, as this statistic far outweighs the number of racially aggrivated assaults the table has no meaning in this context.

It is also interesting to note that the number of racially motivated incidents is falling over the years - from 180K in 2006/7 to 150K in 2010/11.


OK, the nearest I can find anywhere in the document is this :-



In the majority of homicide cases, victims were suspected of being killed by

someone from the same ethnic group, which is consistent with previous

trends. Of the cases with a current suspect in 2007/08 to 2009/10, 88% of

White victims, 78% of Black victims, and 60% of Asian victims were

suspected of being killed by someone from the same ethnic group.

There were differences between the relationship of the homicide victims and

principal suspects in cases with a current suspect across ethnic groups. While

the largest proportion of homicides involving White victims involved a principal

suspect from the victim’s family (37%),

the principal suspect in homicides with

Black victims was, in the largest proportion of cases, some other known

person (39%); and, in homicides involving Asian victims, strangers (45%).


and even here the inferences have got to be considered a stretch.

Given that we are looking for people assaulted by strangers from outside of their ethnic group as a superset of racially motivated assaults (which, by definition are not done by friends or family and are not done within an ethnic group) we have the following facts :-

only 12% or white victims were killed by someone outside of their ethnic group compared to 40% of asian victims

white victims tended to be killed by their own family

asian victims tended to be killed by strangers



I know this proves nothing but it is stronly suggestive.

Bryn Mawr;1433616 wrote: OK, the nearest I can find anywhere in the document is this :-



and even here the inferences have got to be considered a stretch.

Given that we are looking for people assaulted by strangers from outside of their ethnic group as a superset of racially motivated assaults (which, by definition are not done by friends or family and are not done within an ethnic group) we have the following facts :-

only 12% or white victims were killed by someone outside of their ethnic group compared to 40% of asian victims

white victims tended to be killed by their own family

asian victims tended to be killed by strangers



I know this proves nothing but it is stronly suggestive.


OK - I see the flaw in the argument

Given that 89% of the UK population are white a flat distribution of attackers would give 89% white attackers or only 11% outside the ethnic group

Given the only 6% of the population are asian a flat distribution of attackers would give 94% outside their ethnic group - that it is only 40% suggests a high rate of asian on asian attacks

Add into that the stat showing 45% of asian killings were by strangers and your "racially motivated crime" disappears into the other factors - there is not enough data in the document to reach a conclusion.

2 Things, oscar, 'cause rt. pinky still bandaged. You said:

"As for being offensive to Anne. I find It deeply offensive to see a blog......etc."

"Equally, I have been Insulted by Anne In other threads as to my knowing diddly squat about Black Americans In The Travon thread." That's only 'cause u don't. Not your fault.

My point being: I have never felt insulted by you. You shouldn't feel insulted either. I'm really hard to offend, & wish u were 2.

Bryn Mawr;1433616 wrote: OK, the nearest I can find anywhere in the document is this :-



and even here the inferences have got to be considered a stretch.

Given that we are looking for people assaulted by strangers from outside of their ethnic group as a superset of racially motivated assaults (which, by definition are not done by friends or family and are not done within an ethnic group) we have the following facts :-

only 12% or white victims were killed by someone outside of their ethnic group compared to 40% of asian victims

white victims tended to be killed by their own family

asian victims tended to be killed by strangers



I know this proves nothing but it is stronly suggestive. I do agree with you but for the exception that ethnic minority victims killed by strangers Is not always the case that the killer was white British.

I did once have some stats for It and I'll see If I can find them again.

There Is also problems between Asian and Black communities .... It's not always the case they are a victim of whites.

RIVAL GANGS UNITE TO FIGHT; Sikh and Muslim crime lords call truce to stand against black gunmen. - Free Online Library

Gang warfare on the streets of London as Asian and black youths battle outside Julie Christie's house | Mail Online

AnneBoleyn;1433618 wrote: 2 Things, oscar, 'cause rt. pinky still bandaged. You said:

"As for being offensive to Anne. I find It deeply offensive to see a blog......etc."

"Equally, I have been Insulted by Anne In other threads as to my knowing diddly squat about Black Americans In The Travon thread." That's only 'cause u don't. Not your fault.

My point being: I have never felt insulted by you. You shouldn't feel insulted either. I'm really hard to offend, & wish u were 2.


Sorry Anne, I missed your post last night...

First of all... when I said I have also been Insulted by you, It was In response to BB's post that apparently I have an agenda and am driving members away. I do not feel that to be true. As you nor anyone else have reported my posts, It appears no-one else Is offended either,

I did not post this thread and have been quoted throughout, there-for my posts have been a response to posts made to me unless there's a

new rule that everyone can quote me but I can't respond.

As for any offence... I know you were not offended as I have not been offended by you because we are big enough to enter a political heated debate without crying.

Ironically, when I reported a post by another member to someone a few months ago, I was told that If that member was offended, It was up to them to report the post not me.

There Is no animosity between you and I and never has been but sometimes this sort of thing causes animosity between members.

Getting back to the OP.... I find this Interesting. It's Nick Griffin Interviewing the two men who were stoned by Muslims on their charity walk. Before anyone even goes there... It was them who contacted Nick not the BNP jumping on the bandwagon.

Scroll down link for Interview with the two men. It raises questions...

Why did the police dumb down what was clearly assault.?

Why was Info given to the media skewed?

This Is why ordinary people turn to the Far Right, when they are treated like this by police and the media.

British Men Stoned in Birmingham – The BNPtv Interview | National News | British National Party

My first thought was, "Their area? Isn't it a free country?" My second thought was, 'On the other hand you won't catch me walking through Compton in L.A. after dark. That would just be asking for it."

So the short answer is this: There's the way things should be, then there's the way things are. It isn't fair but it's true. so the question this thread should have asked is, "Since life's not fair, what are you going to do about it?" I certainly wouldn't have pulled the stunt those two did, there are about a billion other ways to do that walk without ruffling feathers. If it was for an animal shelter, wouldn't dog costumes have been more appropriate?

As for the rock throwers...I'd have arrested every one of them and thrown them all in jail as a message that "This is everybody's area...not just yours."

Saint_;1433638 wrote: My first thought was, "Their area? Isn't it a free country?" My second thought was, 'On the other hand you won't catch me walking through Compton in L.A. after dark. That would just be asking for it."

So the short answer is this: There's the way things should be, then there's the way things are. It isn't fair but it's true. so the question this thread should have asked is, "Since life's not fair, what are you going to do about it?" I certainly wouldn't have pulled the stunt those two did, there are about a billion other ways to do that walk without ruffling feathers. If it was for an animal shelter, wouldn't dog costumes have been more appropriate?

As for the rock throwers...I'd have arrested every one of them and thrown them all in jail as a message that "This is everybody's area...not just yours."


It wasn't after dark, It was broad daylight. They had children with them, the youngest 9 years old.

I remember some time ago watching or reading something about muslims 'cleaning up' their areas, they had patrols moving on prostitutes and hassling drug dealers.

This is commendable, neighbourhood watch on steroids, or like the Guardian Angels of New York. The trouble is now the youngsters think it's OK to hassle people 'passing through' who exhibit un islamic behaviour, for instance loud drunkeness or revealing clothing.

I used to live opposite an Off Licence and I would have liked to have had the gumption sometimes to silence the mobile disco's or the shouting from inside the car, sometimes the out and out drunken brawling.........but it was only a short disturbance.

Bruv;1433642 wrote: I remember some time ago watching or reading something about muslims 'cleaning up' their areas, they had patrols moving on prostitutes and hassling drug dealers.

This is commendable, neighbourhood watch on steroids, or like the Guardian Angels of New York. The trouble is now the youngsters think it's OK to hassle people 'passing through' who exhibit un islamic behaviour, for instance loud drunkeness or revealing clothing.

I used to live opposite an Off Licence and I would have liked to have had the gumption sometimes to silence the mobile disco's or the shouting from inside the car, sometimes the out and out drunken brawling.........but it was only a short disturbance. I think we've all done that at some time. I went out to a group of teenage girls In the field outside my house last week around midnight because they were drunk and screaming their heads off. I just said ' come on girls, that's enough, there's people trying to get kids to sleep.... no big fuss, no abuse, they just left.

The problem with area's that are perceived as Muslim area's Is that all Muslims Including British Born Muslims live by the preachings of the Holy Qu'ran where dishonour Is used widely throughout. So It's a dishonour to their faith to dress like that or bring dogs Into what they perceive as their area during Ramadan. As gmc agreed at the beginning of the thread, It's not so much the people but the religion.