ForumGarden

I'm wondering why this question is aimed at Jives when two days ago you said you avoid him "at all costs."???

Knowing Jives and the way he feels about his lovely wife i'm sure he wont agree that he has a crappy homelife!

abbey wrote: Knowing Jives and the way he feels about his lovely wife i'm sure he wont agree that he has a crappy homelife!
I'm pretty sure that in the vows that are exchanged there's something about "in sickness AND in health...."



Yeah, I remember it distinctly.

Not sure why Jives has been singled out here, but Jives is a man of integrity and loves his wife very much....

Bez wrote: Not sure why Jives has been singled out here,
You don't? I sure do.... :yh_eyebro

BabyRider wrote: You don't? I sure do.... :yh_eyebro
I don't know why Jives was singled out, and I don't want to know why. It's none of my business. Anyways, I'll leave Jives to speak for himself.

Peg wrote: I don't know why Jives was singled out, and I don't want to know why. It's none of my business. Anyways, I'll leave Jives to speak for himself.
Which is one reason I didn't say why....

Having a crappy home life is not the same as loving a partner who is ill

I would venture to say that a person WITH a crappy home life would probably be interested in anything that would bring some relief. It would be much better if they tried to repair or eliminated the crappy home life. Cheaters under any circumstances are dispicable human beings. IVe never met Jives. However I will always remember him saying that he is grateful for everyday that God gives him with his cherished wife. Hopefully, God hears his heart.... gives him many many more happy days....... and takes the cue to "make" more men like him.

We love you Jives!

I have a difficult homelife, being a constant nurse, and having to work as much as possible. I would never consider looking elsewhere for affection-I may come to FG for a little attention now and then, but it is not the same. And believe me, as soon as my husband became ill, the wolves at my work came out. I gave them a quick kick somewhere needed, and went on with my life.

The question was a bit ham-handed, but it doesn't matter where it came from really. Jives posted this months ago. It covers the question quite well, I think.



I'm taking liberties in posting this without your permission, Jives. So say the word & I'll delete it.



Jives wrote: This post really strikes a chord with me. You see....my wife really did know she had terrible health problems when she married me. She had already had two bowel resections and a complete hysterectomy as well as a long history of other ailments.



I met her during a period of relative health for her and never suspected she had problems at all....and she didn't tell me for fear she would lose me.



We dated for a year, and then married. That's when the health problems resurfaced and they've been an uphill battle ever since. She's had TIAs, strokes, four more surgeries, each worse than the last. She's troubled by horrible post-traumatic syndrome thanks to an abusive marriage in her youth, and of course like anyone in her position, she has terrible insecurity and is constantly worried she will lose me. She suffers horrible nightmares, her circulation is so bad that parts of her body die off occasionally and have to be nursed back to health painstakingly.



We've been to 14 doctors, six hospitals, and innumerable specialists. She has been hospitalized, for periods greater than a month, over 110 times in the last 11 years that we have been married by my counting.



It's 11 years later now, I've been bankrupted twice, I work 4 jobs to make ends meet, and yet even with my stable and dependable job, over $5,000,000 worth of health bills loom in the future.



The future is unbelievably bleak. Her health continues to deteriorate, she will die, not too soon, but not too much later either. I give her slightly over 15 years, perhaps less with her heavy smoking, about the time I will retire. At that time, all that I have built in my life, my savings, my car, my very home will be forfeit for the bills.



I will end my life dead broke after a lifetime of work. (I've only been unemployed for a total of 7 days since I was 15). After lifetime of striving and grappling, I will most likely end my life a ward of the state, destitute and alone.



You'd most likely think this prospect would depress me. You might also be wondering why I stayed with her for so long at the sacrifice of my own entire life and future, despite her deception, and never bailed to save myself.



That would be love.



NVal, you say that your husband's character was to blame for his desertion. But I think it was something else. I don't think he truly understood what love is, and I am positive he wasn't ever in love with you at all, even if he thought he was. when I said, "in sickness and in health" like everyone else, i assumed that I would get way more health than sickness, but that hasn't turned out to be the case. A vow is a vow, however. And I don't intend to break it.



The good Lord knows I thought of it often, but each time I was reminded just how much she means to me, and that without her, life itself might be more comfortable, but would be infinitely pointless.



I have no regrets, I've lived a life of adventure that most men can only dream of, from the high stratophere of near space to the gutter, from the pinacle of the corporate world, to the depths of jail, from....well, you get the picture.



So I have held on to her, cherishing every single second that I get with her. A thousand times at her bedside, as I looked at her gray skin and closed eyes, listened to her shallow breathing and watched her sunken features, I have asked the Lord to grant me just one more hour, just another day, a month a year....



And each time he has relented and let me have her for just a little more time. (I'm kind of selfish that way.)



So when I die, others may see my final years as tragic, not me.



It was all worth it.

SnoozeControl wrote: I know your situation with your sick wife.

Imagine you meeting someone that really clicks with you. She's very attractive, intelligent and witty.

Do you think you'd be interested?

Sort of broadening this... does anyone think they'd be interested in this situation with a really crappy homelife?

No offense.
IMO, this was very rude Snooze.

Thanks for posting that Acc. Jives--It absolutely took my breath away.

As Chonsi said "We love you, Jives"



:yh_hugs

Lil~Basco wrote: IMO, this was very rude Snooze.


The post did end saying "No Offense", what ever that means ?

cars wrote: The post did end saying "No Offense", what ever that means ?
It meant nothing. This was a CYA move. (Cover your ass)

I don't think there's any doubt that Jives loves and cherishes his wife. No matter her condition, he wants to be with her. Those actions speak alot to me. Your a great man Jives. :-4

Hmmm this was a fairly stupid thing to do sneezer. Its petty and uncalled for. I thought higher of you than this.

SnoozeControl wrote: I know your situation with your sick wife.

Imagine you meeting someone that really clicks with you. She's very attractive, intelligent and witty.

Do you think you'd be interested?

Sort of broadening this... does anyone think they'd be interested in this situation with a really crappy homelife?

No offense.


I feel this as being very offensive to aim a question like that to any one person especially a man who has said on many occassions how much he loves his wife.

It does read to me as though you are contemplating doing something similar and are looking for someone to say go ahead its ok.

If I am wrong then I apologise in advance.

SnoozeControl wrote: Rude? Yes. But does it have any bearing in real life? I think it does. It's a valid question that takes some thinking about.



Sorry for offending everyone. But once again, I ask you to think about it.




Quit being cryptic sneeze state your case

No.

I love my husband and would only want to love him more than ever if I knew my time with him was very limited. I dont think I would have "time" to get interested in another person because all of my attention would be directed at my husband.

SnoozeControl wrote: Rude? Yes. But does it have any bearing in real life? I think it does. It's a valid question that takes some thinking about.



Sorry for offending everyone. But once again, I ask you to think about it.
You didn't "offend" everyone, Snooze. I can only speak for myself, and I'll say I was flat-out p!ssed. Sure, your topic has bearing on real life, but why did you aim your little dart at Jives who you profess to avoid at all costs?? There's an obvious motive here, and it's not an interesting conversation topic.

Your "valid question" was poorly and thinly veiled in a jab at Jives, and that's wrong. He deserves an apology.

SnoozeControl wrote: I know your situation with your sick wife.


That's very kind of you to remember.

Imagine you meeting someone that really clicks with you. She's very attractive, intelligent and witty. Do you think you'd be interested?


First of all, my most generous thanks to all those who PM'd me with nothing but support for me and concern for my welfare. You are all truly gems, each of you.

Secondly, I'm actually glad Snooze asked this question, because it gives me a chance to answer something, not just for myself, but for my gender. In a place and time where I know that my words will be heard and thought about.

Let's get this out of the way right now, I've never cheated on a girl in my life and I never will. Not in high school, not in college, and not in my adult life.

There is a movement afoot in this country that somehow not only is cheating somewhat acceptable, especially in hardship cases, but all men are doing it. Many people assume, and this is supported by the movies, TV, and common mythology, that men are slaves to their sex drives. And it's true that there are enough prominent examples out there (even a president!) to give even the most skeptical person pause.

But nothing could be more false.

Most of the men I know, and I'd venture to bet that most of the decent men in America, have a core value system. Call it dignity, honor, personal self-worth, or even the "Code of the West", most men do not and will never cheat on a girl.

Written into the souls of the males that call themselves "men" are a few hard, never-to-be-crossed lines:

1. I am responsible for my family.

2. I will never hit a girl.

3. I will not cheat on a girl.

4. I will not compromise my honor or integrity.

The men who follow those rules, and live by them, have a heart that is what I have labeled, "True Blue." This core decency and respect for those we care for is very obvious to any who speak or interact with us. It would come through to you instantly, were you to ever meet one of us on the street.

Far Rider has it, Clipper has it, Accountable has it, Nomad has it, and I have it.

As a matter of fact, I believe that most men have it, despite what you see on TV.

To us, to suggest that we betray the trust of those that we love and care for is to suggest that we betray our very nature. For one of us to break this bond we have with ourselves is to turn our backs on everything we are.

I have encountered the situation of which you speak many, many times in the past, Snooze. I'm 6' 1", broad-shouldered, blonde-haired and blue-eyed. People who know me tell me I look like Robert Redford and sound like Johnny Cash.

I've worked occupations that are almost virtual breeding grounds for this behavior too, fighter pilot and rock guitarist, radio DJ and corporate manager.

I'd be a liar if I said that the thought of cheating never crossed my mind, especially in the light of some of the incredibly attractive and intelligent women I've met in a very storied and diverse life.

But I am telling the honest truth when I say that each time that thought stuck me, I found it distasteful and appalling in a place that is at the very core of my being. I knew that to give in to such thoughts, much less the actual act, was not just weak, but abhorrent to my very soul.

Were I to do so, I knew that I would never again be who I am.

My "true blue" heart has helped me through most of my life to avoid this kind of dilemma, but now I have something that makes it even less likely...

I finally found someone I truly love.



Sort of broadening this... does anyone think they'd be interested in this situation with a really crappy homelife?


As to the crappy homelife, I'm terribly sorry if I've somehow given you the impression that my homelife is crappy. Nothing could be more untrue. My wife and I are so deeply in love that we cannot go anywhere without holding hands. I can't leave for work without kissing her face in her sleep.

Each meeting at a restaurant is treated as a first date by both of us. (We never go in the same car, we meet each other there and flirt with each other as if we are still going steady, then we race each other home, weaving and dodging throught traffic, laughing all the way.

On cold days, I build a roaring fire in the fireplace and we cuddle on the couch and watch old romantic movies on Turner Classic Movie channel, then we play videogames together till long into the night. I sing and play the guitar for her and she paints paintings for me. We take turns cooking for each other.

When the weather turns nice, we swing on the tree swing behind our house. We sit out in the jacuzzi at midnight and listen to oldies as we count the stars, We float down rivers on inner tubers, we see movies together, we go camping, we ride bikes, we swim everday together (but that's geting harder to get her to do because of the horrible scars), we play pool and cards and trivial pursuit and ...a million other things. We are each other's best friend, confidant, and lover.

When she is ill, I am at her side in the hospital every waking moment I am not at work. I take her stuffed animals, (which reminds me, I really need to do something about them, they are taking over the back bedroom!) and read to her. I tape our favorite shows and bring a VCR to her room so that we can watch them together. I hold her hand and watch over her as she sleeps.

Deep down, (and we never talk about it) we both know that our time together will be cut heart-breakingly short. We didn't meet each other until we were in our mid-thirties, something we both lament. But to us, that just means that each hour, each minute, each second is more precious than the most beautiful diamond.

Like a flower that is cut, our days together are numbered, but all the sweeter for it.

No offense.


None taken, Snooze. I know you despise me for an arrogant fool. And in a way, you are right. I find that a bit funny, since before the Air Force, I was the most introverted, mild-mannered nerd you can imagine. My idea of a fast time was once playing chess and drinking chocolate milk in the lunchroom.

But when I moved to New Mexico, I found I didn't like that personality, so I rewrote it. It's most likely that I went too far in the opposite end of the spectrum. That wasn't helped much by the Air Force training.

When you are a fighter pilot, and your life rests on split second decision each day, day after day. You must believe, and this is a part of the training, that you are the fastest, most intelligent, and greatest pilot that ever lived. To doubt yourself in an emergency situation is certain death. The arrogance that I have was pounded into my persona then and is a permanent feature now. For the worse, I'm sure.

That self-assuredness is also an asset to a teacher who must make dozens of decisions a day involving the future of other people's lives. To be the leader of a classroom, much less a school, is a powerful opiate for the ego and I wouldn't be the first teacher to take too big a drink from that glass.

But I am what I am, and I am too old now to change what I am. Nevertheless, I'll do what I can to rein my unmitigated pride, and be more humble. ForumGarden, and you Snooze, can help me immeasureably in this goal.

After all, each day, I have the example of all the wonderful people here to emulate.

:-4 Oh Jives, you are a soul of beauty beyond description.

I'm actually all teary-eyed. Your wife is a very lucky and loved woman. :-6

chonsigirl wrote: :-4 Oh Jives, you are a soul of beauty beyond description.


Thanks!

I hope that helped you a little to understand my mind set and perhaps deal with your problems too.

(Sigh)... What a lucky, lucky lady you have Jon.

SnoozeControl wrote: I've been ragged on by someone I respect... apparently this question was beyond reproach.

I apologize. I'm obviously numb to this sort of question, and I'm very sorry that I brought up the subject. If I was asked the same thing, I'd answer, but I'm obviously a freak.

My apologies to everyone.


think what you may but maybe next time your approach will be a little different. Any question is worth asking but a badly asked question isn't always worth answering.

Jives you are a true credit to your gender.

(Jives cellphone rings. It is the theme song of "Star Trek: The Next Generation)

Jon: "Hi Sweetie!"

Vicki: "Hiya baby, what are you doing?"

Jon: "Oh, just cleaning up the room and getting ready to get out of here for Spring Break! How did your day go?"

Vicki: "Not so good, I'm not going to stay there."

Jon: "Yeah, it was a bit of a swamp, huh. Look, do you want me to bring you anything from the store on the way home?"

Vicki: "Well, I need some sugar for the mints, and bread, and a few other things..."

Jon: "Hey! Let's go shopping together! It's been forever since we did that!"

Vicki: "OK, sweetie! That sounds like fun!"

Jon: "I'll be right home!"

Sorry gang, I've got to go! I've got a date!

(Jives hurriedly tidies the room, pushes in the student's chairs, and erases the whiteboards. He dons his black leather jacket, turns up the collar, and walks to the door. For a second, he pauses, and looks again at the computer with a thoughtful expression... Then he puts on his sunglasses, turns out the lights and walks out the door.)

minks wrote: Jives you are a true credit to your gender.
I'll second that, Jives, you pompous ass. :yh_rotfl :-4

BabyRider wrote: I'll second that, Jives, you pompous ass. :yh_rotfl :-4


you will give him a big head!!! (behave) hehehehehe

minks wrote: (behave)
Oh, yeah....sure....THAT'S gonna happen. :yh_rotfl :yh_devil

BabyRider wrote: Oh, yeah....sure....THAT'S gonna happen. :yh_rotfl :yh_devil


welll.... it could;)

minks wrote: welll.... it could;)
I'll behave when I'm dead.

BabyRider wrote: I'll behave when I'm dead.no you won't :p

lady cop wrote: no you won't :p
Yeh, you're probably right. The devil's gonna have a bitch of a time with me, ya know??!! :yh_rotfl

When I first saw this thread my immediate thought was 'how extremely rude!'

But that was 3am this morning and I was yawning so hard my head nearly fell off!

Now I'm back again (at nearly midnight! It's often the only time I get to have a go on the pooter!) and instead of a continuation of the completely unnecessary dig at Jives I find a wonderful thread which shows how very highly regarded Jives is and which demonstrates once again how much he loves his wife and what a beautiful soul he has.

At 3am I thought it was extremely offensive. But now I'm glad it has been said because of the outpouring of love and respect it has shown for Jives.

Jives

Jives.. I take back every nice thing I ever said to you... Letting us view your golden soul has made me sick to my stomach.. BECAUSE..... I WANT YOU.... I WANT YOU........ I WANT YOU......... This isnt FAIR!!!!!!!!!!!!:wah: :wah: :wah:

Jives wrote: That's very kind of you to remember.







First of all, my most generous thanks to all those who PM'd me with nothing but support for me and concern for my welfare. You are all truly gems, each of you.



Secondly, I'm actually glad Snooze asked this question, because it gives me a chance to answer something, not just for myself, but for my gender. In a place and time where I know that my words will be heard and thought about.



Let's get this out of the way right now, I've never cheated on a girl in my life and I never will. Not in high school, not in college, and not in my adult life.



There is a movement afoot in this country that somehow not only is cheating somewhat acceptable, especially in hardship cases, but all men are doing it. Many people assume, and this is supported by the movies, TV, and common mythology, that men are slaves to their sex drives. And it's true that there are enough prominent examples out there (even a president!) to give even the most skeptical person pause.



But nothing could be more false.



Most of the men I know, and I'd venture to bet that most of the decent men in America, have a core value system. Call it dignity, honor, personal self-worth, or even the "Code of the West", most men do not and will never cheat on a girl.



Written into the souls of the males that call themselves "men" are a few hard, never-to-be-crossed lines:



1. I am responsible for my family.

2. I will never hit a girl.

3. I will not cheat on a girl.

4. I will not compromise my honor or integrity.



The men who follow those rules, and live by them, have a heart that is what I have labeled, "True Blue." This core decency and respect for those we care for is very obvious to any who speak or interact with us. It would come through to you instantly, were you to ever meet one of us on the street.



Far Rider has it, Clipper has it, Accountable has it, Nomad has it, and I have it.



As a matter of fact, I believe that most men have it, despite what you see on TV.



To us, to suggest that we betray the trust of those that we love and care for is to suggest that we betray our very nature. For one of us to break this bond we have with ourselves is to turn our backs on everything we are.



I have encountered the situation of which you speak many, many times in the past, Snooze. I'm 6' 1", broad-shouldered, blonde-haired and blue-eyed. People who know me tell me I look like Robert Redford and sound like Johnny Cash.



I've worked occupations that are almost virtual breeding grounds for this behavior too, fighter pilot and rock guitarist, radio DJ and corporate manager.



I'd be a liar if I said that the thought of cheating never crossed my mind, especially in the light of some of the incredibly attractive and intelligent women I've met in a very storied and diverse life.



But I am telling the honest truth when I say that each time that thought stuck me, I found it distasteful and appalling in a place that is at the very core of my being. I knew that to give in to such thoughts, much less the actual act, was not just weak, but abhorrent to my very soul.



Were I to do so, I knew that I would never again be who I am.



My "true blue" heart has helped me through most of my life to avoid this kind of dilemma, but now I have something that makes it even less likely...



I finally found someone I truly love.









As to the crappy homelife, I'm terribly sorry if I've somehow given you the impression that my homelife is crappy. Nothing could be more untrue. My wife and I are so deeply in love that we cannot go anywhere without holding hands. I can't leave for work without kissing her face in her sleep.



Each meeting at a restaurant is treated as a first date by both of us. (We never go in the same car, we meet each other there and flirt with each other as if we are still going steady, then we race each other home, weaving and dodging throught traffic, laughing all the way.



On cold days, I build a roaring fire in the fireplace and we cuddle on the couch and watch old romantic movies on Turner Classic Movie channel, then we play videogames together till long into the night. I sing and play the guitar for her and she paints paintings for me. We take turns cooking for each other.



When the weather turns nice, we swing on the tree swing behind our house. We sit out in the jacuzzi at midnight and listen to oldies as we count the stars, We float down rivers on inner tubers, we see movies together, we go camping, we ride bikes, we swim everday together (but that's geting harder to get her to do because of the horrible scars), we play pool and cards and trivial pursuit and ...a million other things. We are each other's best friend, confidant, and lover.



When she is ill, I am at her side in the hospital every waking moment I am not at work. I take her stuffed animals, (which reminds me, I really need to do something about them, they are taking over the back bedroom!) and read to her. I tape our favorite shows and bring a VCR to her room so that we can watch them together. I hold her hand and watch over her as she sleeps.



Deep down, (and we never talk about it) we both know that our time together will be cut heart-breakingly short. We didn't meet each other until we were in our mid-thirties, something we both lament. But to us, that just means that each hour, each minute, each second is more precious than the most beautiful diamond.



Like a flower that is cut, our days together are numbered, but all the sweeter for it.







None taken, Snooze. I know you despise me for an arrogant fool. And in a way, you are right. I find that a bit funny, since before the Air Force, I was the most introverted, mild-mannered nerd you can imagine. My idea of a fast time was once playing chess and drinking chocolate milk in the lunchroom.



But when I moved to New Mexico, I found I didn't like that personality, so I rewrote it. It's most likely that I went too far in the opposite end of the spectrum. That wasn't helped much by the Air Force training.



When you are a fighter pilot, and your life rests on split second decision each day, day after day. You must believe, and this is a part of the training, that you are the fastest, most intelligent, and greatest pilot that ever lived. To doubt yourself in an emergency situation is certain death. The arrogance that I have was pounded into my persona then and is a permanent feature now. For the worse, I'm sure.



That self-assuredness is also an asset to a teacher who must make dozens of decisions a day involving the future of other people's lives. To be the leader of a classroom, much less a school, is a powerful opiate for the ego and I wouldn't be the first teacher to take too big a drink from that glass.



But I am what I am, and I am too old now to change what I am. Nevertheless, I'll do what I can to rein my unmitigated pride, and be more humble. ForumGarden, and you Snooze, can help me immeasureably in this goal.



After all, each day, I have the example of all the wonderful people here to emulate.






Wow !

If I was going to cheat it would be with you ! :wah:

I dont think anyone is on a pedestal here sneeze. It was just in bad taste and you got called on it. I still love you.