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We Americans need to get over the idea that we are the center of the earth, but rather only part of it and a less important part every day. We don’t have the best health care system, or the best education system, we no longer graduate the best and brightest engineers and scientists, we are 18th in ranking in IQ, we don’t live the longest life or have the lowest infant mortality rate, our portion of the world economy is shrinking each year, we are in debt to the world up to our eyeballs and our people find it easier every year to seek answers not in their own efforts, but from government.

As we approach Memorial Day even the way we view our military has changed. Certainly we should honor those who made the ultimate sacrifice, and we must take care of our wounded and disabled, but…just because one is in the military does not entitled him or her to other special privileges. Serving in the military of the United States is both an obligation and an honor with emphasis on obligation. Sure we no longer have a draft, but that does not change the fact that serving ones country especially a democracy is not something to be rewarded, but certainly appreciated.

In short, we need to get over ourselves and get back to work on the basics, we need to take personal responsibility and to better understand what a globalized world means to the future of the United States of America in the decades ahead. We need to be part of that world and a leader because other people respect us and our accomplishments not because we rest on our laurels from 1945 (or carry a big stick).

It's time to get to work.

Peace:yh_flag

wow. well written, well said.

As far as I'm concerned you can speak for yourself...

I've always considered myself human before I've considered myself American...

K.Snyder;873781 wrote: As far as I'm concerned you can speak for yourself...

I've always considered myself human before I've considered myself American...


Not sure how to take that. Can't you be both?

QUINNSCOMMENTARY;873792 wrote: Not sure how to take that. Can't you be both?


I'm already doing my part so both is of no virtue...

Take it as if to say you don't have to include me in your reference to "Americans" on this subject...

Quote:

Originally Posted by K.Snyder

As far as I'm concerned you can speak for yourself...



I've always considered myself human before I've considered myself American...









QUINNSCOMMENTARY;873792 wrote: Not sure how to take that. Can't you be both?




Don't you get it............We Americans are not Americans first anymore......... Just plain ol only Humans............

I think that is what Mr Snyder is implying?

It is such a discrace to be labeled as an American first, these days?





Get it?

Yah, thought so.............. me neither:driving:

I just need to say I completely disagree with the OP.

Military people don't deserve a little more for putting their lives out there? Who decided this? I disagree.

I'm an American and I don't need to "get over" myself. I'm sure many here from other countries are just foaming at the mouth with happiness at seeing an opinion (and that's what it is) like this especially coming from an American.

America is far from perfect and isn't the be-all end-all of it all but it's a good place to live and I take offense to pretty much everything in the OP.

QUINNSCOMMENTARY;873736 wrote: We Americans need to get over the idea that we are the center of the earth, but rather only part of it [...]Yeh, but we're the center part.

QUINNSCOMMENTARY wrote: and a less important part every day. We don’t have the best health care system, or the best education system, we no longer graduate the best and brightest engineers and scientists, we are 18th in ranking in IQ, we don’t live the longest life or have the lowest infant mortality rate, our portion of the world economy is shrinking each year, we are in debt to the world up to our eyeballs and our people find it easier every year to seek answers not in their own efforts, but from government.All arguably true.

QUINNSCOMMENTARY wrote: As we approach Memorial Day even the way we view our military has changed. Certainly we should honor those who made the ultimate sacrifice, and we must take care of our wounded and disabled, but¦just because one is in the military does not entitled him or her to other special privileges. Serving in the military of the United States is both an obligation and an honor with emphasis on obligation. Sure we no longer have a draft, but that does not change the fact that serving ones country especially a democracy is not something to be rewarded, but certainly appreciated. What special privileges do you see us undeservedly getting, exactly? Also, since you see it as an obligation, what do you suggest we do with those who fail to fulfill their obligation?

QUINNSCOMMENTARY wrote: In short, we need to get over ourselves and get back to work on the basics, we need to take personal responsibilityHear Hear!QUINNSCOMMENTARY wrote: and to better understand what a globalized world means to the future of the United States of America in the decades ahead. We need to be part of that world and a leader because other people respect us and our accomplishments not because we rest on our laurels from 1945 (or carry a big stick).We need to lead because other people respect us? I think we may need to regroup and figure out what the right direction is, and head that way. If the rest of the world follows, all the mo better. We don't have to need and they don't need to follow.

Accountable;873819 wrote: Yeh, but we're the center part.

All arguably true.

What special privileges do you see us undeservedly getting, exactly? Also, since you see it as an obligation, what do you suggest we do with those who fail to fulfill their obligation?

Hear Hear!We need to lead because other people respect us? I think we may need to regroup and figure out what the right direction is, and head that way. If the rest of the world follows, all the mo better. We don't have to need and they don't need to follow.


Well I get a reduction in my property taxes because I am a veteran, I made money on educational benefits greater than the cost of the education even when I was employed full time, now other benefits are talked about in Congress. Many of us filled our obligation not by gung ho volunteering, but simply by going when called, but frankly while with three sons I am glad there is no draft, I truly believe that everyone should have some kind of service to the country for a period after high school or college, no exceptions. That doesn't mean the military necessarily, but something. I found many benefits from being in the army although I must admit I didn't see it at the time.

No we need to be respected because of the way we lead, but I have to admit it is a bit presumptuous that the US should always be the leader as I suspect that many parts of the world resent that. Perhaps lead by example is the better goal. There are many missed opportunities here.

Jester;873813 wrote: Posted by Quinn...





Quinn...

I disagree, any young man or woman who joins the military today deserves much more accolades than what you give them credit for. Service to ones coutnry is a sacrifice of great porportions, its extremely difficult on a family, it take courage, it takes committment, and ya get paid peanuts. You must keep yourself in top physical condition which take self denial, most of them are pretty young too so I have to say that when someone puts the uniform on and does what it takes to honor our contitution I will give them more than my basic respect, I'll honor them for thier sacrifice and stand.

America isnt measured by a standard like what your expressing, IQ, math scores, and or any of the things you mentioned. America's greatness has always been in its ideals. We have never ceased in our pursuit of those ideals although it is true that some of us loose our path from time to time, we usually swing back and find it, and then I'll have you note that not all of us loose the pathway at the same time.

Now to the line I bolded above, I think its rather assumptive on your part to believe any of us who served want any sort of 'special privialages'. I think 99% of us want to be quietly appreciated and not made a big deal over. And almost none of us ask for anything we wern't promised about when we joined up. I actually getting used to the biulding anti-military movement in this country I expect it to get worse too.

I have to say that while you were appreciative in your comments as a whole this one line really kinda bugs me. I can bypass your anti amercian statements, thats your opinion. But I dont understand what special privialges your infering we veternas are in pursuit of? I suppose your comments are typical of the country at this time, sort of a low undercurrent of 'those army guys arent that important'...


Quite to the contrary, none of my comments were anti-American, I am just looking at the bigger picture of what is a rapidly changing world. I don't see Americans understanding how rapidly things are changing.

And by the way, I was in the Army in 1964-65 and again in 1968-69. I was really smart, I joined the National Guard so I wouldn't get drafted, then my unit along with 25,000 other reservists was called up for two years for Vietnam. Most Americans don't even remember that use of the reserve.

RedGlitter;873811 wrote: I just need to say I completely disagree with the OP.

Military people don't deserve a little more for putting their lives out there? Who decided this? I disagree.

I'm an American and I don't need to "get over" myself. I'm sure many here from other countries are just foaming at the mouth with happiness at seeing an opinion (and that's what it is) like this especially coming from an American.

America is far from perfect and isn't the be-all end-all of it all but it's a good place to live and I take offense to pretty much everything in the OP.


You make my point. I am not knocking America, I stated some facts. We need to get our heads out of the sand and raise all of our standards.

Yeh, but we're the center part.


Of the world? Oh no....

Now I don't want to interfere withyour little domestic other than to say it doesn't do any country (or person) any harm to look at themselves from time to time and notice that they are not completely perfect, BUT:

A very long time ago when the world was young and bouncy we didn't have the seven continents we have now, they were all stuck together in one supercontinent which went by the sexy name of Pangaea. Eventually Pangaea got bored and decided to split, so the seven continents we know today wandered off to their present positions, and the little bit that was right in the middle of Pangaea went north and settled down off the northwestern end of Europe. Yes, the centre of the world is, in fact, Britain.

NB: This little bit of trivia wasn't designed to wind up the Americans, it was designed to annoy the French.

QUINNSCOMMENTARY;873825 wrote: Well I get a reduction in my property taxes because I am a veteran, I made money on educational benefits greater than the cost of the education even when I was employed full time, now other benefits are talked about in Congress.The property tax thing is not universal. It is a gift of gratitude from you state or local government that you are under no obligation to accept. I'm betting you had to fill out extra paperwork to receive the gift, so it's not like someone is forcing it on you.



The educational benefit has changed from your days. You're profit-making GI Bill is a thing of the past. It's still quite good, don't get me wrong, but not as good as it was. After I earned my masters degree in 2000 our employer (US government) increased tuition assistance for active duty personnel from 75% to 100%. There are other employers that pay the same. The current GI Bill is a dollar-for-dollar employer-matched savings plan for college after service, so if you don't put something into it, you get nothing out of it. It, too, may have changed. I don't keep up with it.



My point is that I don't know of any benefit that GI's get that aren't available to employees of large organizations. I also don't hear anyone except the most strident anit-military people complain that our benefit package is too extravagant for a bunch of people who only run around laying their lives on the line protecting our freedoms and our way of life.



QUINNSCOMMENTARY wrote: Many of us filled our obligation not by gung ho volunteering, but simply by going when called, but frankly while with three sons I am glad there is no draft, I truly believe that everyone should have some kind of service to the country for a period after high school or college, no exceptions. That doesn't mean the military necessarily, but something. I found many benefits from being in the army although I must admit I didn't see it at the time.I think some kind of peace corps service would probably be good for our country. I also think compulsory service to a country founded on freedom and individual liberty is oxymoronic.



QUINNSCOMMENTARY wrote: No we need to be respected because of the way we lead, but I have to admit it is a bit presumptuous that the US should always be the leader as I suspect that many parts of the world resent that. Perhaps lead by example is the better goal. There are many missed opportunities here.No doubt!

Clodhopper;873899 wrote: Of the world? Oh no....



Now I don't want to interfere withyour little domestic other than to say it doesn't do any country (or person) any harm to look at themselves from time to time and notice that they are not completely perfect, BUT:



A very long time ago when the world was young and bouncy we didn't have the seven continents we have now, they were all stuck together in one supercontinent which went by the sexy name of Pangaea. Eventually Pangaea got bored and decided to split, so the seven continents we know today wandered off to their present positions, and the little bit that was right in the middle of Pangaea went north and settled down off the northwestern end of Europe. Yes, the centre of the world is, in fact, Britain.



NB: This little bit of trivia wasn't designed to wind up the Americans, it was designed to annoy the French.:D I'm writing that one down.

K.Snyder;873781 wrote: As far as I'm concerned you can speak for yourself...



I've always considered myself human before I've considered myself American...




I completely understand your sentiment.

Actually I think your spirit coincides with what Quinn's intent is.

Globalization requires less border mentality and more humanistic endeavor.

Accountable;873914 wrote: The property tax thing is not universal. It is a gift of gratitude from you state or local government that you are under no obligation to accept. I'm betting you had to fill out extra paperwork to receive the gift, so it's not like someone is forcing it on you.



The educational benefit has changed from your days. You're profit-making GI Bill is a thing of the past. It's still quite good, don't get me wrong, but not as good as it was. After I earned my masters degree in 2000 our employer (US government) increased tuition assistance for active duty personnel from 75% to 100%. There are other employers that pay the same. The current GI Bill is a dollar-for-dollar employer-matched savings plan for college after service, so if you don't put something into it, you get nothing out of it. It, too, may have changed. I don't keep up with it.



My point is that I don't know of any benefit that GI's get that aren't available to employees of large organizations. I also don't hear anyone except the most strident anit-military people complain that our benefit package is too extravagant for a bunch of people who only run around laying their lives on the line protecting our freedoms and our way of life.



I think some kind of peace corps service would probably be good for our country. I also think compulsory service to a country founded on freedom and individual liberty is oxymoronic.



No doubt!


You are correct, you would think that people in a country founded on freedom and individual liberty (and dare I say responsibility) would be more willing to support such service. At the same time, you would think they (we) would rush to the polls to vote, not cheat on taxes and pay attention to what their elected officials actually do...but we are all human beings first and freedom remains fragile and in the hands of a relatively few people.

I posted the opening post on a UK site, changing the US names part to UK. I omitted the middle paragraph as being particularly American.

It was spotted as being a specificaly American statement.

You can make of that what you like, I only provide the information.

I posted it over there, as I thought the thrust was interchangable with the English attitude, obviously not.

Jester;873828 wrote: I'm glad, thanks for your service, it makes it more difficult to understand your comments though, what privialges do you see us veterans asking for other than what we were promised? And you don't recognize that volunteering expecially in wartime is not a reason to give more to them than just an appreciative thank you?I think they dont expect more than that, but they do deserve more than that.


It is not a matter of veterans asking for privledges, it is a matter of politicians creating a special status that turns what should be ones duty into a reward. I doubt many in the military join simply to get something special, but it is the attitude we are creating.

For example, the new G.I. Bill of Rights will pay full tuition and other expenses at a four year college for anyone who spends at least three years in the military after September 11, 2001. I bet there are a lot of deserving young people who are struggling to pay for college or who graduate heavily in debt, what is the logic of treating veterans so differently than others when we are talking about participation in one country, albeit in different ways. Who deserves more consideration, the brilliant student who may find the cure for a disease one day or one who served in the military simply because they served in the military.

It is a mindset created by politcians.

Bruv;874280 wrote: I posted the opening post on a UK site, changing the US names part to UK. I omitted the middle paragraph as being particularly American.

It was spotted as being a specificaly American statement.

You can make of that what you like, I only provide the information.

I posted it over there, as I thought the thrust was interchangable with the English attitude, obviously not.


It says to me that my essential perceptions on America in the world was basically correct (sad to say).

I think we do need to step down from the world scene, I think we need to withdraw all monetary aide, our military, and any other assistance and or 'interference', and return to our homeland, and let the world solve its own problems, while we take care of our own first.


chuckle. I know certain Middle Eastern countries would agree with you!

But my reason for quoting your sentence is that it illustrates what to me looks like a mistake in thinking that seems shared by a great many Americans (Lordy, now I'm in trouble:wah:) and that is to think of America as seperate from the rest of the world. You aren't, and if global warming/climate change doesn't convince you of this, then 9/11 should.

What I'm saying is that withdrawal will only make things worse for you, as (a possible example) Iran develops the delivery systems to put their nuclear capability into action over New York. The oceans are not a completely safe barrier any more. I have some sympathy for the shock this must be (we had a similar shock 100 years ago with the Channel), but you need to know how, where and when to lead. Roosevelt knew this. I wonder if Bush is even aware of the concept.

As Churchill said, "The only thing worse than waging war with allies is waging war without allies."

QUINNSCOMMENTARY;874834 wrote: For example, the new G.I. Bill of Rights will pay full tuition and other expenses at a four year college for anyone who spends at least three years in the military after September 11, 2001. I bet there are a lot of deserving young people who are struggling to pay for college or who graduate heavily in debt, what is the logic of treating veterans so differently than others when we are talking about participation in one country, albeit in different ways. Who deserves more consideration, the brilliant student who may find the cure for a disease one day or one who served in the military simply because they served in the military.
I'm sure you don't mean to imply that those who go straight to college are more honorable than those who enlist, but that's the way the post reads. I find it hard to understand how cheaply you consider a GI's service to be.



You ask who deserves more consideration. Don't forget that most of the greatest technological and medical advances were made by military researchers. How about the one who simply joined the military as a medic who's ingenuity kept his buddy alive?