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As many of you know I have been struggling to understand many, many problems that I have had with my son. Struggling to understand if he really does have a problem, and if so, how bad is it. Fighting with doctors, who feel that medication is the only answer. Not understanding why he has no co-ordination (to the point where he could not even walk through a doorway without crashing into it), no apparent ability to deal with his emotions. Diagnosed as ADHD, Bi-Polar, possible depression, possible autism, possible dysphasia, possible ¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦¦.

So, these last few weeks I have been dealing with many children 6-8 years. And as adults we have noted ’social issues’ , we have ran to the parents stating ’Tommy won’t listen’ (Parent response he is possible ADD), ’Billy hits other kids (parent response he has anger issues and we are seeking help), Billy won’t sit still (Parent response he is possible ADHD), ‘Sam phases out’ (Parent response he may autistic).

And I thought OMG, it hit me with a blow! These kids are just being kids! We as adults (and I mean us teachers) are complaining at the slightest to the parents, and they are scared. Also, as parents we are expecting our kids to be mini us, able to deal with anger, control our hyperness, and be adult in every situation. But no they are kids! and still learning the ways of life! Running around like crazy, lashing out when they feel emotion, or crying uncontrollably. That’s ok, they don’t know yet - it is our job to guide them!

I, as a child ,had many of the symptoms my son has. I never had medication, I never hurt anyone, I never tried to kill myself and I had plenty of friends. I WAS A LITTLE ****! But my parents just guided this little **** ¦. Cried a lot, cos this little **** was a pain in the butt ¦. Lost a lot of sleep over this little ****! But this little **** turned out to be a un-medicated decent person ( note ¦ I did not say sane, just decent LOL).

So what do you think? Are we (and society) just not letting kids “go the course and be kids before we decide if they have 'problems'?

If you can go without the meds, it is better for him. My son was ADHD, and I took him off all the foods that make it worse-sugar, artifical color, etc. It helped alot, he grew up to be just fine.

In most case Pheasy it is a simple as that. Kids today are to structured they aren't allowed to be kids much.

We use to go outside and play with a stick for hours digging holes, kids today can't do that. My younger sister was so clumby she would fall upstairs. She was like a new pony long legs and no idea in hell how to use them. She would bang into walls as well till my parents figured out her eye sight was so bad she didn't see the wall. :wah: Sometime its just grown pains.

We need to let our kids be KIDS for a bit and work through this stuff as they grow to adulthood. That can take some longer than others. Sure some have real problems and need help. This ADHD, all the other acronyms for a over active kid drives me crazy. Half the kids I grew up with would have been considered ADHD by today's standards unrealistic and not the case. :-5

[QUOTE]And I thought OMG, it hit me with a blow! These kids are just being kids! We as adults [/QUOTE]

Pheas

It is as simple as that..!! Let kids be kids

Kids have alot of energy - don't release this energy - kids don't play like they use to or walk to school - parents find it irritating - slow this kid down..

Kids crave alot of attention - parents busy, busy, can't provide the necessary attention, and kids act out since any attention will do good or bad..

I'll never forget my sister was always cleaning her two boys - I said let them be kids - they're boys, they're suppose to do this - sit in the mud puddle with them & play.

She thanks me to this very day for teaching her how to play & let them play & get dirty

I don't have a troubled child/disabled nor do I know the strain on all involved.

I do feel society/some parents look for the quick fix and medication is the answer when the kid was just trying to be a silly kid.

Life can't be real structured for kids daily - it's very healthy for a kid to be silly, play & use their imagination to develope properly.

Pheas - it's good to see you - I could rattle on & on ?:-2

Patsy

My oldest son ,now 31, was described by his 3rd grade teacher this way ,she said " Think of the class room as a box of fire crackers and Jason's a match" he was so full of energy they tried getting me to put him on ritlin and all kinds of meds, what I did was cut way down on his sugar intake and started giving him a couple of cups of black coffee during the day,, it worked very well ,, and you guys are all perfectly right ,,send them out to play or work in the yard give them something to burn up all that energy.

after suffering for three years ... in 2001 after a failed suicide attempt ... i was diagnosed with chronic depression ...

in my country any suicide attempt (unless its successful of course!) gets you an automatic sojourn in a psychiatric clinic .... during the 30 days i spent in this facility i was prescribed and given so much medication by the psychiatrists who "treated" me that i spent 24/7 in a drug induced daze ...

once discharged i had to visit a psychiatrist and psychologist once a week for a year ... during this time the standard question asked at the conclusion of each consultation was "do you still have enough tranquilizers and sleeping tablets?" ... at the end of this year i felt no better than i did the day i tried to kill myself ... total cost for "treatment" and medication at this time ... two hundred and fifty grand ...

then it hit me like a bolt out the blue! surely medical practitioners just like all other businessmen have to make money to survive? so perhaps it is NOT in their best interests to have a healthy patient simply because a healthy person has no need of them ... the rest of the equation fell into place at once ...

so i made a decision there and then ... i turfed out every tranquilizer and sleeping tablet and decided to go cold turkey! it wasn't easy but eventually i kicked the habit and managed ... by changing my mindset ... to if not cure myself .. at least keep depression at bay ... touch wood to this day i have not used another tranquilizer or sleeping tablet ...

the medical and pharmaceutical professions make no money from healthy people ... from that we can all draw our own conclusions ...

i am filled with so many positive thoughts pheasey that i have a lot to spare ... i am sending those to you and your children!

I had this conversation with my mother last night who is a bus driver for our local city schools and she was recently the Vice President of the cities board of transportation(Just for a bit of knowledge as far as her concern is concerned--as we all know sometimes these jobs are nothing more than headaches)...And headaches is what she described...Her specific job is to transport special needs and criminally biased children to and from school...

Her sentiment can be described in the same as Judy Andreas' and the readiness of parents to put their children on drugs...Note I said "drugs"...Just because it's legal should make you all the more ready to explore it's potential...

More Ritalin, Ma

By Judy Andreas

7-22-6



"Why don't you write about something that is ruining my generation?" My son asked. I pondered the plethora of possibilities.



"Which thing?"



"Pharmaceuticals", he replied.



I hardly knew where to begin. As a retired Caseworker, I had had first hand experience with the drugging of our young people. The array of prescribed pharmaceuticals would fill up a medicine chest no less an essay. I decided to begin with one popularly prescribed pill, Ritalin.



My mind drifted back to 1995 when I first began working for Child Protective Services. I had been called to investigate a case of child neglect. The investigation always commenced with a visit to the school to question the child. I called the school and arranged to meet the child in the nurses office.



When I arrived at the Nurse's office I noticed a long line of children.



I asked, "Why are these children lined up?"



"They are here for their Ritalin", She replied nonchalantly. They have ADD (Attention Deficit Disorder) and ADHD (Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder). The nurse's demeanor was the antithesis of what I was feeling.



When did ADD and ADHD reach epidemic proportions? Where had this "problem" been when I was teaching in the New York City School System? Where had this "problem" been when I was attending school? I could not believe my eyes and could only suspect that some great hoax was being perpetrated on our young people.



Ritalin is methylphenidate, a central nervous system stimulant. Paradoxically, it purportedly quiets down the hyperactive child and makes him manageable. And yet, there are many people who question whether or not Ritalin truly works and whether or not there are long term consequences of putting a child on, what amounts to, Speed. The consensus is that about 80% of the children who receive the drug experience a quieting effect. I wondered if that was true. http://www.omnipotentchild.com/chfive.html



I began to research some of the available studies. Many of them put an entirely different spin on this supposedly "harmless" pharmaceutical.



Granger et al, from the Department of Psychology of the University of California at Los Angeles report a study in which they enlisted ninety-six undergraduate college students to view and make judgments about videotaped play sessions. These were videos of two different ADHD boys playing an interaction game with three normal peers. One of the target boys was on Ritalin and one wasn't. (See Grander, DA, et al., Social Impressions of Methylphenidate Effects on Hyperactive Children's Peer Interactions," Journal of Abnormal Child Psychology 21: 67-81.)



The observations of these undergraduates were evaluated and more negative than positive behaviors were detected. The interesting thing is that the "negative behaviors" were strikingly different.



The negative ratings for the placebo child (the one not getting Ritalin) reported three behaviors:



non-compliance

aggression

disruption.



The negative ratings for the Ritalin child also reported three behaviors:



social inhibition

passivity

submissive behavior.



The question arises: When a child is reported to be better on Ritalin does "better" mean more compliant, less aggressive, and less disruptive?



For a teacher trying to control a room full of students, compliance and passivity are considered "desirable" qualities. However, are these the qualities we want to foster in our children? And what happens when these children grow into adulthood? Does Ritalin create critical thinkers and inventive contributors? Or, does Ritalin start our youngsters on the path to drug dependency?



In another study, three covert antisocial behaviors were measured: stealing, destroying property, and cheating. Ritalin was found to reduce the incidence of the first two, but it increased the incidence of cheating. The authors speculate that this is because Ritalin enhances task involvement. (See Hinshaw, SP, Heller, T, and McHale, JP, "Covert Antisocial Behaviour in ADHD," Journal of Consulting Clinical Psychology April 1992 (60/2): 274-81.)



At the end of the day, Ritalin may be have a calming affect, but it may also involve changes you or I would hardly label as improvements.



Many parents go along with the recommendation of the school and doctors. They do not question whether this drug will have any side effects or long term consequences. According to the head of psychiatry at the Vancouver Children's Hospital, Ritalin is not even as dangerous as aspirin. To me, this merely calls into question the safety of aspirin. (See the report in the Vancouver/Lower Mainland area newspaper the Tri-City News, 26 August 1990.)



Further investigation reveals that the above is a gross understatement. The fact is that Ritalin has many known side effects. Some of them may be rare but others are quite common. Some of them are extremely serious. How many psychiatrists or school personnel tell parents of the possible consequences of the mummifying of their kiddies?



In a publication called Methylphenidate (A Background Paper) published in 1995,and available through the DEA, a few of the side effects were listed. They included palpitation, tachcardia, increased blood pressure, insomnia, psychosis, dizziness, headache irritability, Gilles de la Tourette's disease, tics, nausea, anorexia, dry mouth, weight loss, and growth delay.



Reports of psychotic reactions are rare but have occurred. Leukopenia, caused by poisoning of the bone marrow, is equally rare. Deaths from Ritalin have been reported as a result of teen-agers crushing Ritalin pills and injecting them intravenously. As for whether this drug is addictive, I have heard they some adolescents have now taken to snorting Ritalin.



My son has a friend who was put on Ritalin as a child. And now, at 23, he is in a constant struggle with pill and drug addiction. Another friend of mine has a daughter who was given Ritalin in Junior High. She has been in and out of rehabs in her 20's. Is this merely a coincidence? I seriously doubt it. Giving kids Ritalin to improve their behavior may help to make them more docile, but at the same time, it teaches them to look to drugs for the solution to life's problems. In addition, it may habituate them and make them dependent.



And now for the million dollar question. Are there really such conditions as ADD and ADHD and can they be "fixed" with a "pharmie"?



It seems to me that we have lost sight of what childhood is about. It seems to me that we have lost sight of what teaching is all about. Is it really about having a classroom of 30 submissive students sitting silently? Is it about teachers who are forced to pressure their children to get good grades on standardized tests? Is there any excitement and love of learning left?



I seriously doubt whether there are any miracle drugs for squirming and boredom. And one thing I will say for certain, "Speed" is not the answer. It is not a life enhancer, it is a life reducer. It robs the child of his vitality and a great deal more.



Parents have also been lied to. They've been told that children have a neurobiological disorder. They've been told their children have biochemical imbalances and genetic defects. On what basis? Is it because they fit into a checklist of attention deficit disorder, which is just a list of behaviors that teachers would like to see stopped in a classroom? Because, my friends, at the end of the day, that's all it really is. http://www.rense.com/general72/pharm.htm

Not to mention that the public seems to have been lulled into this false sense of trust related to pharmaceuticals and health care in general...I mean we do live in an era where there have been numerous medical breakthroughs...But like anything I think there is a negative to every positive you just have to look for it or at least keep in mind the possibilities associated with supposed "positives"...

I myself would like to hear the opinions of others on this subject...

Many parents go along with the recommendation of the school and doctors.


I find this particularly unsettling...

It's far easier for teachers and doctors(Let's not kid ourselves hospitals are more or less privately owned and benefit from drugs being prescribed to anyone) who have a tolerance problem(30-35 screaming kids) to conform to the idea that a simple "well prescribed" drug will nullify their problems making for a much better work environment...What's really happening, in my opinion, is the over excessive wrongful diagnosis of children and the fact that teachers, doctors and parents don't question enough the potential of these drugs because it's accepted as being "a quick and easy solution" that leads to unforeseen behaviors in kids...

I'm not saying everyone who has prescribed their children on Ritalin, or any other drug for that matter, is wrong I'm saying I along with others feel the magnitude of these drugs' use is much too common and should be questioned existentially more...

There were many times during his growing up that doctors suggested medication for my younger son. He is now 23. He did all along the way show symptoms of having some emmotional issues. I could never bring my self to go along with the reccommendations that he be medicated. Those same emmotional stumbling blocks are things that are still with him now, but one by one, he is working them out. A little delayed perhaps, a little slower than others. But its all stuff he has to handle. His issues made him difficult to deal with when he was young. He is still difficult to deal with now. But he is who he is. I dont see medication as the answer. Given a host of new conditions for doctors to choose from like add adhd etc.... I think often the medical professionals grab for one of these as answer for behavior that wil work itself out over time, with guidance from parents.Todays children live in a very stressful and frightening world. It is difficult to know what is going on in their heads, or how they feel. Sometimes I think their internal struggles manifest themselves in symptoms that are quickly, and wrongly labeled, and then masked with medication. To me its very much the same as a woman who goes into a doctors office with vague complaints like cramps or mood swings. The over zealous gynocologist, wanting to make the patient happy says " Total hysterectomy!!!" So many women went along with this, only to discover later that the procedure wasnt necessary. I do have to warn from experience that a young person who does exhibit behavior that is suspect of depression, or other problems, is often a candidate for self medication. That is the use of drugs. I did have this problem with my son. And so as you already know, these kids need to be monitored closely by their parents.

Youve got a good head, your a concerned and committed mom. You will make the right decision. It is very wise of you to notice character traits that were present in yourself, when you were young. Your child is a fortunate child.

Hi Pheasy, sounds like you know whats best for him hun. I think you have all along but havent felt strong enough and have bowed to peer pressure to have the strength to go with your gut instinct on the best course of action to take...Minime is clever, bright and a bundle of fun...Enjoy x:-6



p.s. did he ever get that creepy vampish stuff he ordered off the net????