ForumGarden

Let me get this straight, now Congress is talking about a auto Czar to oversee money given to a failing auto industry based in Detroit, In return Congress is demanding more “green cars and ever higher mileage as if simply waiving a magic wand or pen makes all that happen. Does anyone really think that if cars that get 50 miles to the gallon were possible and were desirable that someone wouldn’t build them and a lot of people buy them? :rolleyes:

Why would Congress have to force an industry to build something if that industry could to it on its own and make money, corporations are greedy, right? The answer is if you could make money (and create jobs) Congress would not have to do a thing. Confused, so is Congress.

Hey, you can buy a Smartcar built by Mercedes that gets tons of miles to the gallon (and no space for much other than two people) but you don’t see the streets clogged with them, ever wonder why? Or, if people were so concerned in America about fuel efficiency the streets of New York would be awash in small motor bikes and scooters as they are in Rome. Perhaps they have a law in Italy mandating travel on scooters. :driving:

QUINNSCOMMENTARY;1079712 wrote: Let me get this straight, now Congress is talking about a auto Czar to oversee money given to a failing auto industry based in Detroit, In return Congress is demanding more “green cars and ever higher mileage as if simply waiving a magic wand or pen makes all that happen. Does anyone really think that if cars that get 50 miles to the gallon were possible and were desirable that someone wouldn’t build them and a lot of people buy them? :rolleyes:

Why would Congress have to force an industry to build something if that industry could to it on its own and make money, corporations are greedy, right? The answer is if you could make money (and create jobs) Congress would not have to do a thing. Confused, so is Congress.

Hey, you can buy a Smartcar built by Mercedes that gets tons of miles to the gallon (and no space for much other than two people) but you don’t see the streets clogged with them, ever wonder why? Or, if people were so concerned in America about fuel efficiency the streets of New York would be awash in small motor bikes and scooters as they are in Rome. Perhaps they have a law in Italy mandating travel on scooters. :driving:


Its an interesting question, about how you can (or whether you should) manipulate the economy, private enterprise, taxation policies, or technological research to achieve desirable goals. There is a very good argument which says that basically human self-interest is really the only long time effective method to stimulate economic activity and I agree with that wholeheartedly; which is why Western Capitalism works (in general, though I think we can all agree at the moment, something has gone pretty horribly wrong).

In general its not a good idea for governments or the civil service to get involved in either finance or business, they are not good at it; they can play a role in making sure that the framework in which buisness is done is both good for business but also good for the long term health of the society they govern. This is a very old argument, and tends to be the fault line between European and American visions of society, and I am guessing we are not going to solve that one here now.

In general though, for cars and such products, standards should be set by regulation; more than anything, that regulation whether its on emissions, seat belts, speeds, all of that needs to be enforced properly and fairly.

The large vision of what a society actually wants to be, or what's to be for, is another question a much deeper question and its one that we in the west will need to ask ourselves again before too long, because this road of total consumerism we have been on has not been good for us, at least thats my own view, though its arguable.

QUINNSCOMMENTARY;1079712 wrote: Let me get this straight, now Congress is talking about a auto Czar to oversee money given to a failing auto industry based in Detroit, In return Congress is demanding more “green cars and ever higher mileage as if simply waiving a magic wand or pen makes all that happen. Does anyone really think that if cars that get 50 miles to the gallon were possible and were desirable that someone wouldn’t build them and a lot of people buy them? :rolleyes:

Why would Congress have to force an industry to build something if that industry could to it on its own and make money, corporations are greedy, right? The answer is if you could make money (and create jobs) Congress would not have to do a thing. Confused, so is Congress.

Hey, you can buy a Smartcar built by Mercedes that gets tons of miles to the gallon (and no space for much other than two people) but you don’t see the streets clogged with them, ever wonder why? Or, if people were so concerned in America about fuel efficiency the streets of New York would be awash in small motor bikes and scooters as they are in Rome. Perhaps they have a law in Italy mandating travel on scooters. :driving:


Actually cars that do 50+ to the gallon are not only possible but quite commonplace-just not in america.

You can't have it both ways- complain about manufacturers being forced to build more economical cars that people don't want to but and then in the same sentence almost wonder why your car industry is in such a state because people have stopped buying all the big suv's in favour of more economical models from foreign manufacturers. The reality is your companies asked for and got protection for suv's and the like from environmental legislation and didn't need to bother competing to make better cars kidding themselves that people would always buy them bacause they were amarican. You now have a car industry in the **** because it dodged the reality of declining oil supplies and future growing demand for more economical cars that other manufacturers anticipated.

Not only can you get big cars that do over 50 to the gallon some of them are actually made by ford and GM but just not in america.

Vauxhall Vectra Hatchback 1.8i VVT Design 5dr Running Costs Review - What Car?

Bog standard GM product sold over here. Not the most economical in the range as it's a petrol even allowing for the difference in us having a proper gallon rather than the funny one you use in the states it's still not too bad. Good motorway car but not so good on the corners. An 08 plate Now yours for just under £8,000 thanks to the credit crunch and the HIGH petrol consumption. Quite tempted actually (I like big cars as well but not off roaders or MPV's cos the handling is crap) but realistically I will go for a more economical car, one that averages 50+ to the gallon.

American made chryslers sold here are so bad in terms of build quality, reliability and image they are almost having to give them away.

Why don't they just use some of the expertise in the European divisions. They are building cars that hold their own with any of the other manufacturers. Honda and toyota and volkswagon build cars in america with american workers so there doesn't seem to be a problem with the workforce not being up to it, maybe look at what they are doing that is so much better.

Stop feeling sorry for yourselves and blaming foreign competition for the state of your car industry. Stop trying to blame environmentalists as well, maybe if you'd listened you wouldn't be in such dire straits. The reality is the big three in the states took their market for granted and sold them what they wanted to make rather than looking too far in to the future.

If you want to now why you shouldn't bail them out read about british leyland.

jimbo;1080379 wrote: i used ,sue's diesel ford focus yesterday it has a computer on board ,i had to go to portsmouth and back



i wanted to see just how good the mpg would be if i took it easy i went 55 mph all the way and the car returned figures of over 58 mpg :driving::driving:



mind you when sue drives it it returns 32 mpg i'm saying nothing :-3:-3


Bet she drives it like a petrol car.