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Israel stands ready to bomb Iran's nuclear sites - Times Online

WELL.............dUH

Ahmadinejad repeatedly demonizes the state of Israel and openly calls for its destruction at every opportunity. Most notoriously, he described Israel as a "fake regime" that "must be wiped off the map."



He termed Zionists "the most detested people in all humanity" and called the extermination of six million Jews during World War II "a myth," claiming that Jews have played up Nazi atrocities during the Holocaust in a bid to extort sympathy for Israel from European governments.



Ahmadinejad's virulently anti-Israel and anti-Semitic rhetoric and Holocaust denial are often matched by other Iranian leaders, and the Iranian regime itself has continued to sponsor anti-Zionism conferences and pseudo-academic lectures and exhibits questioning the fact of the Holocaust.

If I was Israel I would be concerned as well, Iran openly says they would wipe Israel off the face of the earth.

Well, attacking sovereign nations is hardly blinked at nowadays.

That being the case, why is it okay for Israel to state they are preparing to bomb Iran and not okay for Iran to state they are prepared to bomb Israel?

koan;1176964 wrote: Well, attacking sovereign nations is hardly blinked at nowadays.

That being the case, why is it okay for Israel to state they are preparing to bomb Iran and not okay for Iran to state they are prepared to bomb Israel?Well said Koan. Of course, there is another aspect to this which i fear. If Israel do strike Iran, the US will have to become involved.

mikeinie;1176919 wrote: If I was Israel I would be concerned as well, Iran openly says they would wipe Israel off the face of the earth.


And Israel does not attempt openly to wipe the Palestinians off the face of the Earth?

The only difference is that Israel has the power to achieve their objective whilst Iran does not and never will.

It wasn't until I began to see Israel as a fellow democracy in the midst of dictatorships that I began to understand how important to freedom for the world this tiny nation is.

Israel is a nation the size of New Jersey that the whole world seems to stay focused on. Why is that?

Why is Iran so intent on destroying Israel when they don't even share a border with her? Iran is the nation in the Mideast that most of its neighbors would like to see behaving better. Granted, most of the Muslim nations would like to see the Jewish state in their midst gone but the last time I checked the world doesn’t (openly) approve of displacing people because of their race or religion.

Israel is ready to launch an attack. Nations all over the world are readyto launch attacks on other nations but the focus is on tiny little Israel.

It seems that once a person gets it in their mind that they hate Israel there is no way to convince them differently. I don't understand it...it's like it is in their DNA.

Clint;1177269 wrote: It wasn't until I began to see Israel as a fellow democracy in the midst of dictatorships that I began to understand how important to freedom for the world this tiny nation is.

Israel is a nation the size of New Jersey that the whole world seems to stay focused on. Why is that?

Why is Iran so intent on destroying Israel when they don't even share a border with her? Iran is the nation in the Mideast that most of its neighbors would like to see behaving better. Granted, most of the Muslim nations would like to see the Jewish state in their midst gone but the last time I checked the world doesn’t (openly) approve of displacing people because of their race or religion.

Israel is ready to launch an attack. Nations all over the world are readyto launch attacks on other nations but the focus is on tiny little Israel.

It seems that once a person gets it in their mind that they hate Israel there is no way to convince them differently. I don't understand it...it's like it is in their DNA.


What has hate to do with it?

You say Israel are a minnow amongst sharks but it is Israel who are the nuclear armed nation with a standing army that is capable of (and has in the past) defeating the combined might of all her neighbours.

Any nation that is ready to launch an attack of another nation should be condemned - whoever, whenever, wherever and the focus is on Israel because they repeatedly do just that (with the open support and backing of the US). In contrast, whilst Iran are long on rhetoric, when was the last time they invaded anybody?

Clint;1177269 wrote: It wasn't until I began to see Israel as a fellow democracy in the midst of dictatorships that I began to understand how important to freedom for the world this tiny nation is.

Israel is a nation the size of New Jersey that the whole world seems to stay focused on. Why is that?

Why is Iran so intent on destroying Israel when they don't even share a border with her? Iran is the nation in the Mideast that most of its neighbors would like to see behaving better. Granted, most of the Muslim nations would like to see the Jewish state in their midst gone but the last time I checked the world doesn’t (openly) approve of displacing people because of their race or religion.

Israel is ready to launch an attack. Nations all over the world are readyto launch attacks on other nations but the focus is on tiny little Israel.

It seems that once a person gets it in their mind that they hate Israel there is no way to convince them differently. I don't understand it...it's like it is in their DNA.


Irans nucleur programme is all over the place and impossible to destroy in one attack. Israel can't stop Iran getting a bomb. If they attack Iran they opening themselves wide open as it's only time before Saudi and Egypt will also get one. I have no sympathy for Israel who have repeatedly threatened Iran in the past. I can't say that i blame Iran as after the repeated threats from Israel, they need a deterent. Who was to say that the day would not come where Israel carried out their threats? They can't have it all their own way. They can not threaten another country and them bleat for world support when it's turned round and bitten them on the bum.

oscar;1177327 wrote: Irans nucleur programme is all over the place and impossible to destroy in one attack. Israel can't stop Iran getting a bomb. If they attack Iran they opening themselves wide open as it's only time before Saudi and Egypt will also get one. I have no sympathy for Israel who have repeatedly threatened Iran in the past. I can't say that i blame Iran as after the repeated threats from Israel, they need a deterent. Who was to say that the day would not come where Israel carried out their threats? They can't have it all their own way. They can not threaten another country and them bleat for world support when it's turned round and bitten them on the bum.


See, this is what aggrivates me about the conflicts in the middle east.

If you swapped the words Iran and Israel round in that paragraph it would still read the same.

Its like listening to football supporters. Most of them cant see past their nose

Snowfire;1177349 wrote: See, this is what aggrivates me about the conflicts in the middle east.

If you swapped the words Iran and Israel round in that paragraph it would still read the same.

Its like listening to football supporters. Most of them cant see past their nose


The difference is in the history, in the past forty years Israel have repeatedly attacked their neighbours with wildly disproportionate force whilst Iran have attacked no-one - indeed, they have been on the receiving end of several attacks.

Bryn Mawr;1177364 wrote: The difference is in the history, in the past forty years Israel have repeatedly attacked their neighbours with wildly disproportionate force whilst Iran have attacked no-one - indeed, they have been on the receiving end of several attacks.


To a degree. its still about people taking sides.

I cant work out most of the historical " facts". Your interpretation of historical events are pretty much diametrically apposed to, say, Clints. I cant work out who is correct and who is simply taking sides.

Surely a lot of it is grounded in interpretation of biblical texts, as to whether Israel should exist. Which is where a lot of this arguement stems from

Snowfire;1177367 wrote: To a degree. its still about people taking sides.

I cant work out most of the historical " facts". Your interpretation of historical events are pretty much diametrically apposed to, say, Clints. I cant work out who is correct and who is simply taking sides.

Surely a lot of it is grounded in interpretation of biblical texts, as to whether Israel should exist. Which is where a lot of this arguement stems from


That is why I chose a cut off of forty years as being "recent history". The previous twenty years were the setting up of Israel as an independent state, go back before that and you get bogged down with the right of Israel to exist at all and I have no truck whatsoever with the argument that because that area was home to the Jews in biblical times they have a God given right to rule it now.

To me, the current threats and counter threats are about what is happening now and in recent history - how the Israelis are dealing with the Palestinian problem is the over-riding factor in how the Arab world is dealing with Israel.

If I think my life is threatened and have evidence such as thousands of rockets and suicide bombers deployed to destroy me, what is "disproportionate force"? I'd say whatever it takes to make the one trying to kill me stop the effort while I'm still alive is proportionate. Now, if they are trying to kill my family, I may make a real big mess.

Clint;1177377 wrote: If I think my life is threatened and have evidence such as thousands of rockets and suicide bombers deployed to destroy me, what is "disproportionate force"? I'd say whatever it takes to make the one trying to kill me stop the effort while I'm still alive is proportionate. Now, if they are trying to kill my family, I may make a real big mess.


OK, give us some comparative statistics - how many Israeli civilians have been killed by these "thousands of rockets and suicide bombers deployed to destroy me" and how many Palestinian civilians have been killed by the IDF?

Bryn Mawr;1177379 wrote: OK, give us some comparative statistics - how many Israeli civilians have been killed by these "thousands of rockets and suicide bombers deployed to destroy me" and how many Palestinian civilians have been killed by the IDF?


The rockets have slowed but not stopped so maybe not enough yet. The problem is that the IDF wears uniforms and fights against a force that, for the most part, doesn't. It's easy to say lots of civilians were killed when the combatants don't identify themselves as such and launch their attacks in the middle of those who are truly innocent.

Clint;1177387 wrote: The rockets have slowed but not stopped so maybe not enough yet. The problem is that the IDF wears uniforms and fights against a force that, for the most part, doesn't. It's easy to say lots of civilians were killed when the combatants don't identify themselves as such and launch their attacks in the middle of those who are truly innocent.


OK, if you don't accept male civilians as non-combatants, just give the figures for Israeli civilians against the number of Palestinian women and children killed by the IDF.

Just the ratio to the nearest order of magnitude will do.

Bryn Mawr;1177389 wrote: OK, if you don't accept male civilians as non-combatants, just give the figures for Israeli civilians against the number of Palestinian women and children killed by the IDF.

Just the ratio to the nearest order of magnitude will do.


How many Israeli women and children would have been killed if the suicide bombings and rocket attacks hadn't been stopped? The fact that the losing side had more casualties shouln't surprise or shock anyone.

Clint;1177402 wrote: How many Israeli women and children would have been killed if the suicide bombings and rocket attacks hadn't been stopped? The fact that the losing side had more casualties shouln't surprise or shock anyone.


Even given counting only women and children you know it is of the order of 100:1 - that is not casualties, that is genocide!

Bryn Mawr;1177406 wrote: Even given counting only women and children you know it is of the order of 100:1 - that is not casualties, that is genocide!


Define "genocide"? You use the word very broadly for the purpose of stirring emotions. Genocide is an attempt to wipe out an ethnic group. Israel could have if they had wanted to but they stopped so far short the word shouldn't come to anyone's lips.

It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood and I'm going to go enjoy it.:-6

Clint;1177420 wrote: Define "genocide"? You use the word very broadly for the purpose of stirring emotions. Genocide is an attempt to wipe out an ethnic group. Israel could have if they had wanted to but they stopped so far short the word shouldn't come to anyone's lips.

It's a beautiful day in the neighborhood and I'm going to go enjoy it.:-6


Take what the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians that live within Israel and that live in the Gaza strip and tell me that it is not genocide - it is a deliberate attempt to drive out or kill so many that the rest do not count. Not just emotive language but a genuine description of what has happened over the last forty years.

Enjoy your day - and your denial of reality.