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I've been banging on about him for a year. He's my avitar and signature.

The big race Boxing Day... Has any-one actually had a bet on 'Kauto Star'?

Just curious that's all.

I'm just preying that racing is not abandoned at Kempton Park on Saturday. He doesn't like snow or hard ground so the betting odds may go out a tad.

If he wins, I shall be one joyous little soul and he will match Desert Orchids record.

oscar;1275564 wrote: I've been banging on about him for a year. He's my avitar and signature.

The big race Boxing Day... Has any-one actually had a bet on 'Kauto Star'?

Just curious that's all.

I'm just preying that racing is not abandoned at Kempton Park on Saturday. He doesn't like snow or hard ground so the betting odds may go out a tad.

If he wins, I shall be one joyous little soul and he will match Desert Orchids record.


I don't do horse racing........:p

His odds don't look too good if he doesn't like hard surfaces oscar. but I'll tell my friends . they may want a bit of a flutter on him ....Why this horse?

Cos he's a very good one !!!!!!

Hey, Oscar, isn't it better to cancel the race, rather than risk a horses legs? Could put paid to his racing life for ever!

G#Gill;1275750 wrote: Hey, Oscar, isn't it better to cancel the race, rather than risk a horses legs? Could put paid to his racing life for ever! Very true Gill, as it is something that is a concern but thinking back, this is his bid for his 4th Consecqutive King George Stakes so he has run on Boxing day for more than four years running. If I remember correctly, two years ago, the going was hard with snow and he coped well and won. I still have great confidence in him but my concern is more for his stable mate 'Denman' who took a near fatal fall at Aintree earlier in the year. I hope he's up to it. I'm looking for him to come in for a place also with 'Forpaddytheplasterer'.



Fuzzy... Why this horse?

If your interested then It's because there has only ever been one horse who has won the Cheltenham Gold Cup twice and the King George stakes four times in a row.... Desert Orchid. Kauto Star has won the Cheltenham Gold Cup twice, runner up once and has won three consequtive King George. If he wins this one Boxing Day, he will match Desert Orchids record. If he wins a third Gold Cup in March he will have beaten the greatest horse that ever ran.

I have seen Kauto Star run many times, the last was at the Gold cup this year. He is just a superstar. :-6:-6:-6

fuzzywuzzy;1275661 wrote: His odds don't look too good if he doesn't like hard surfaces oscar. but I'll tell my friends . they may want a bit of a flutter on him ....Why this horse?
It's a crap piece of footage but still worth a watch.

YouTube - kauto

He is definately worth a flutter :-6:-6

R.I.P. Exotic Dancer

A couple of questions.

When was the horse gelded? Was this done in the interests of his health?

How do we feel, in general, about the concept of animals as possessions?

spot;1275807 wrote: A couple of questions.

When was the horse gelded? Was this done in the interests of his health?

How do we feel, in general, about the concept of animals as possessions?
I do not not know the answer off hand however, just for you Spotilicious, as the horse is local, I will try to find out. I'm sure my brother will know more than myself also.

I see the direction that your question is aimed in so I will ask you a question?

Why does every horse that falls, get up and carry on racing with the stable right to the line even hampering other racers to keep up?

oscar;1275812 wrote: I do not not know the answer off hand however, just for you Spotilicious, as the horse is local, I will try to find out. I'm sure my brother will know more than myself also.

I see the direction that your question is aimed in so I will ask you a question?

Why does every horse that falls, get up and carry on racing with the stable right to the line even hampering other racers to keep up?


At a guess, I would say that it has spent it's life being conditioned to do so.

oscar;1275812 wrote: Why does every horse that falls, get up and carry on racing with the stable right to the line even hampering other racers to keep up?


Not that I'm an animal psychologist, but at a guess...

Because the horse is a herd animal, and the consequence of the racing environment (being among other running horses, all of which have been artificially spurred into a herd activity) is for it to remain in the bunch for as long as the herd running behaviour is active.

I'm not even sure why horses run as a herd but I'm confident it has an evolutionary advantage. In the wild it doesn't depend on having a demented dwarf jumping up and down on your back, it doesn't involve running so fast or so far and it doesn't involve carrying sixty kilos of dead weight either.

For pity's sake don't try to persuade me that they're enjoying themselves.

How do we feel, in general, about the concept of animals as possessions?

spot;1275815 wrote: Not that I'm an animal psychologist, but at a guess...

Because the horse is a herd animal, and the consequence of the racing environment (being among other running horses, all of which have been artificially spurred into a herd activity) is for it to remain in the bunch for as long as the herd running behaviour is active.

I'm not even sure why horses run as a herd but I'm confident it has an evolutionary advantage. In the wild it doesn't depend on having a demented dwarf jumping up and down on your back, it doesn't involve running so fast or so far and it doesn't involve carrying sixty kilos of dead weight either.

For pity's sake don't try to persuade me that they're enjoying themselves.

How do we feel, in general, about the concept of animals as possessions? Firstly Spot, let me correct your terminology of the topic we are discussing. A 'herd' is the term used for a group of wild horses. A group of racing horses, is known as 'A Stable'

I have phoned my Bro and Kauto Star is indeed a Gelding and was gelded for the good of his health. In racing terms, It makes the animal calmer. This is apparently something not done lightly due to the enormous value of any offspring of a double Gold Cup winner.

As for, are they possessions? From the evolution of humans, animals have been possessions. It depends in what sense you are enquiring. Preempting you next question, I would say you are asking, should these horses be used for personal and monatary gain? Races take place where there is no monetary gain at all.

As for BB post, she has a good point, however should you ever study racing form, you will see 'PU' which means in that race, the horse stopped and refused to move any further. You will also see horses 'Refuse' a fence... Very common at Bechers Brook, second time round. The horse does not have to carry on should he not wish to. Most horses will 'Pull Up' at some point in their career.

Incidently, horses of Kauto Star's Ilk are Chasers. Many began life to hunt with hounds. They then progress to 'Point to Point', then on to National Hunt Chasing.

oscar;1275820 wrote: Firstly Spot, let me correct your terminology of the topic we are discussing. A 'herd' is the term used for a group of wild horses. A group of racing horses, is known as 'A Stable'Whatever you call it, it's still true that "the horse is a herd animal" which is what I wrote. That's what it evolved into, it's one of the things mammals can become. Some mammals don't. Horses did. All horses inherently have it, race horses as much as wild horses. It's why they behave like horses. It's why every horse that falls, gets up and carries on racing with the stable right to the line even hampering other racers to keep up. Not because it's enjoying itself but because that's what herd animals under pressure do when the rest of the herd is already running. "Wild" isn't a deciding factor, "Horse" is.

I utterly dispute your "gelded for the good of his health". What you mean is gelded in order to become or remain a successful racehorse. At what age was the horse gelded?

"From the evolution of humans, animals have been possessions" is, perhaps, true of domesticated species but it's certainly not true of wild animals. There are even, these days, laws against the possession or abuse of wild animals. Some wild animals even have a legal right to life. Racehorses are, by contrast, domesticated. That's part of the background to my asking how we feel about the concept of animals as possessions. And no, I'm making no implication about financially profiting from them.

How do we feel, in general, about the concept of animals as possessions?

spot;1275825 wrote: Whatever you call it, it's still true that "the horse is a herd animal" which is what I wrote. That's what it evolved into, it's one of the things mammals can become. Some mammals don't. Horses did. All horses inherently have it, race horses as much as wild horses. It's why they behave like horses. It's why every horse that falls, gets up and carries on racing with the stable right to the line even hampering other racers to keep up. Not because it's enjoying itself but because that's what herd animals under pressure do when the rest of the herd is already running. "Wild" isn't a deciding factor, "Horse" is.

I utterly dispute your "gelded for the good of his health". What you mean is gelded in order to become or remain a successful racehorse. At what age was the horse gelded?

"From the evolution of humans, animals have been possessions" is, perhaps, true of domesticated species but it's certainly not true of wild animals. There are even, these days, laws against the possession or abuse of wild animals. Some wild animals even have a legal right to life. Racehorses are, by contrast, domesticated. That's part of the background to my asking how we feel about the concept of animals as possessions. And no, I'm making no implication about financially profiting from them.

How do we feel, in general, about the concept of animals as possessions?
And as I said in an earlier post, many race-horses do not follow the stable, they pull up, they refuse, they throw jockeys.

Your final question could be asked of any farmer who has used Oxen to toil the soil or Poultry breeding.

I am unable to reply further. It's Christmas Eve and I have had fart too much falling down water. I shall return to the thread however.

Goodnight Spotty and have a pleasurable Yuletide period.