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Phew, the heat is off us smokers (for the moment)...it seems that obese people are getting the blame for society's ills now. I thought that alcohol would follow smoking as the next scapegoat but that hasn't really taken off...yet.

Some of the anti obesity brigade are really quite spiteful in their approach to larger people. What puzzles me is that if you have a healthy, well proportioned body and you don't smoke or drink alcohol, why do you need to attack (frequently viciously) those that do?

I wish people would understand one thing, skinny does not equal healthy.

I am more healthy at a size 8 than I ever was at a size two.

Most of the severely overweight people I have met recently are not wealthy enough to eat healthy in America.

It takes education and money to eat well in this country.

Poor people tend to have neither.

LarsMac;1372116 wrote: Most of the severely overweight people I have met recently are not wealthy enough to eat healthy in America.

It takes education and money to eat well in this country.

Poor people tend to have neither.
By Co-Incidence, my husband and I were discussing this only recently. I don't know about America but I am sure that In the UK, everyone can eat well.

My husband has a fishing buddy who makes a career of knowing the days and times each supermarket Is about to reduce their meat, veg and fruit.

You ask - why do "they" need to attack? it's like a religion to preach for the time. it's narrow minded people to always think they're right so follow me...

LarsMac - your right - people of low income cannot afford nor are they dealt proper education to know.

It's a terrible cycle. of course before some one jumps on me - I'm not including all over weight people are poor or stupid..

Patsy

OH we had obesity ..then smoking then alcohol. I think 'breathing' will be next. no no ..going out to the letter box unaccompanied cause you might get mugged. lol

was interesting once ..was talking to a scientist and she told how 'they' try to get people off smoking .....give all the horror stories show nasty pics etc until the actual average person doesn't feel afraid of dying of lung cancer but is afraid of the picture they have made smoking to be ....another words it's this horrible monster that the average human can't fight . So what happens ...they continue to fear what it says ...without me you'll go to *****.

Again with fast food ..they SAY it's nutricious...but we actually know it's not ...but they keep saying it....joseph goebels of all people said something once and those evil pricks have taken heed of it and make it work as he did.

“The most brilliant propagandist technique will yield no success unless one fundamental principle is borne in mind constantly - it must confine itself to a few points and repeat them over and over”......Joseph Goebbels." .......and there you have it .....fast food that's good for you .

and then there are those who recite over and over that it's cheaper for you ...it's not ..tally a month of income ..keep a diary for everything you buy sell for a month I dare you !!! fresh food is actually cheaper if you kow where to get it and how to keep it . grow your own I'll show you how in pots if necersary and inside your house or apartment. No I'm not a greeny nor a vegan... do as you will but take heed of the consequences.

I understand Obesity all to well, along with the smoking and any other "unhealthy" habits that there are in this wonderful world we live in. The only one I can't say that I ever had a problem with was alcohol, just don't care for it.

When I saw the title I immediately thought of this episode of Dr. Oz that I watched recently:

Dying to be the Fattest Woman, Pt 1 | The Dr. Oz Show



This to me is just taking it to an extreme, watched it a week or so ago and it really bothered me that this poor woman thinks that this is okay. Don't get me wrong, feeling good about yourself is a great thing, but striving to be the fattest woman in the world is just too much.

fuzzywuzzy;1372179 wrote:



and then there are those who recite over and over that it's cheaper for you ...it's not ..tally a month of income ..keep a diary for everything you buy sell for a month I dare you !!! fresh food is actually cheaper if you kow where to get it and how to keep it . grow your own I'll show you how in pots if necersary and inside your house or apartment. No I'm not a greeny nor a vegan... do as you will but take heed of the consequences.


I totally agree with you.

I do not believe for one minute In the Western world that anyone can not eat healthilly due to poorness. It's laziness.

Last night, an Indian resturant local to me rang and told me they had just butchered a lamb and would I like the off cuts for my Foxes.? Yes, please I said...and Mr O drove out and collected It.

On getting It home, I was decanting Into smaller quantities for the freezer and looking at It, thought, 'Hang on... I'm having this'...

OK there was a lot of fat and It took me a good hour to trim all the bits of prime meat off It but this morning, I slowed stewed the meat and had enough to make 3 large lamb hot pots ( stew).... A few carrots, onions etc and that Is 3 healthy meals there.

Anyone who says they can only afford to buy fast food Is bonkers and lazy. Have they seen the mark up on fast food ????

fuzzywuzzy;1372179 wrote: was interesting once ..was talking to a scientist and she told how 'they' try to get people off smoking .....give all the horror stories show nasty pics etc until the actual average person doesn't feel afraid of dying of lung cancer but is afraid of the picture they have made smoking to be ....another words it's this horrible monster that the average human can't fight . So what happens ...they continue to fear what it says ...without me you'll go to *****.

Again with fast food ..they SAY it's nutricious...but we actually know it's not ...but they keep saying it....joseph goebels of all people said something once and those evil pricks have taken heed of it and make it work as he did.

“The most brilliant propagandist technique will yield no success unless one fundamental principle is borne in mind constantly - it must confine itself to a few points and repeat them over and over”......Joseph Goebbels." .......and there you have it .....fast food that's good for you .

and then there are those who recite over and over that it's cheaper for you ...it's not ..tally a month of income ..keep a diary for everything you buy sell for a month I dare you !!! fresh food is actually cheaper if you kow where to get it and how to keep it . grow your own I'll show you how in pots if necersary and inside your house or apartment. No I'm not a greeny nor a vegan... do as you will but take heed of the consequences.


I agree about the fresh food being cheaper, I used to always think that wasn't true-basically because I wanted the junk food ALONG with the healthy food...I buy very little junk food nowadays and love it! I have been looking into growing my own veggies, have always wanted a greenhouse in my back yard!

I know for a fact that is some neighborhoods is Chicago there aren't any markets to shop at, there aren't any fresh veggies or fruit stands. They have moved out because of the dangerous neighborhoods. I saw a piece on CNN that had a young women going to these neighborhoods to bring them fresh produce and show them how to grow then in their neighborhoods. In these neighborhoods people have to travel miles on a bus, train or if they are lucky they can drive to the nearest market which is very far away. Sad ..

theia;1372095 wrote: Phew, the heat is off us smokers (for the moment)...it seems that obese people are getting the blame for society's ills now. I thought that alcohol would follow smoking as the next scapegoat but that hasn't really taken off...yet.

Some of the anti obesity brigade are really quite spiteful in their approach to larger people. What puzzles me is that if you have a healthy, well proportioned body and you don't smoke or drink alcohol, why do you need to attack (frequently viciously) those that do?


Can't see that it helps by being spiteful, but then people are, maybe it acts as a way of making that person feel better about their own shortcomings. Maybe it's a case of the thinner people resenting the fact that they maybe have to work at staying slim. Maybe it also takes a certain amount of self control over what they allow themselves to consume, they may view obese people as lacking in self control causing a certain amount of resentfulness within themselves.

Just another thought, food is essential to us all, if we smoke or drink alcohol we don't generally die from giving either of those up. If we give up food completely we will eventually die. I'm not sure what my point is really lol but we all have food in common, each and every one of us. Is it that fact that makes people feel they can attack the obese, like a 'look I can control my intake/cravings/addictions to food, why can't you?'

People have always been a variety of sizes, the difference now is that we're seeing more and more obese people who then seem to raise obese children that are little caricatures of themselves. Is it bad habits? Is it genetics?

I recall several families back in the late seventies early eighties where one of the parents would be large and the other was skinny and they'd have a mixture of children. So you would look at one child and think oh that one takes after Mother and the other one has Dad's build. Nowadays it seems that both parents are likely to be overweight and all children then seem to be overweight.

Bad habits, comfort eating, lack of time spent at home - most parents work nowadays and ease of convenience foods are most likely all to blame. I don't think it's necessarily bad education to blame either. It's life, I spent four years studying and beating myself up over food that was reaching our tea table. Being out of the house all day, collecting the children from school then heading home to throw the quickest thing possible on the table for tea. Knowing that once all the other bits and pieces had been done I needed to study for a few hours it soon became a lifestyle that I imagine most working mothers have to adopt. Yes, occasionally we can be superwoman and throw a nutritious healthy meal on the table but we can't physically do it every single day. It's not just the cooking, it's the organising of shopping for the fresh produce to fit in as well.

Supermarkets may well reduce items near the end of the day but you show me a Mother who is going to be there waiting for it to happen. She's at home feeding her children, bathing them, nit checking them, doing homework with them and getting them to bed so she can crawl into bed herself :wah:

We have one fruit and veg shop left in our town, the others have all packed up and gone since the arrival of the out of town supermarkets. I try to NOT buy veg from the supermarkets, it doesn't keep and you're never sure it's at all fresh.

We also don't eat anything in season any more, once upon a time you ate meals based on the seasons. Now it's a free for all, you can more or less eat most fresh items all year round. Does that play a part in over-eating?

I'm off to crawl into bed, I threw beans on toast on the table tonight, Mondays is always something quick and easy due to after school clubs for one child and dance lessons for the other, but I'm not going to feel too guilty for not cooking a proper meal, both children have had school dinners.

You made some good points, Betty, including working mothers and the quality of fresh produce in the supermarkets. I'm off to work shortly but will respond more fully this evening.

see thing is you neede a hectare to survive in the world ...and you need a full time person to work that hectare ...okay which are you are going to do it ? (oh by the way it's about the size of a soccer field ) the woman or the man? One, you need a cow. You need chickens . You need a vege patch. And you need somone who will not tire of it all...... basically the world is saying you need to be a peasant.....but tha'ts not true....you need to look after yourself......Do you honestly think the rich havent been looking after themselves ? of course they have . on your work. On your food!!!

It's not healthy food .....it's normal food ....why doesn't anyone get that ?

Betty Boop;1372243 wrote: Can't see that it helps by being spiteful, but then people are, maybe it acts as a way of making that person feel better about their own shortcomings. Maybe it's a case of the thinner people resenting the fact that they maybe have to work at staying slim. Maybe it also takes a certain amount of self control over what they allow themselves to consume, they may view obese people as lacking in self control causing a certain amount of resentfulness within themselves.

Just another thought, food is essential to us all, if we smoke or drink alcohol we don't generally die from giving either of those up. If we give up food completely we will eventually die. I'm not sure what my point is really lol but we all have food in common, each and every one of us. Is it that fact that makes people feel they can attack the obese, like a 'look I can control my intake/cravings/addictions to food, why can't you?'

People have always been a variety of sizes, the difference now is that we're seeing more and more obese people who then seem to raise obese children that are little caricatures of themselves. Is it bad habits? Is it genetics?

I recall several families back in the late seventies early eighties where one of the parents would be large and the other was skinny and they'd have a mixture of children. So you would look at one child and think oh that one takes after Mother and the other one has Dad's build. Nowadays it seems that both parents are likely to be overweight and all children then seem to be overweight.

Bad habits, comfort eating, lack of time spent at home - most parents work nowadays and ease of convenience foods are most likely all to blame. I don't think it's necessarily bad education to blame either. It's life, I spent four years studying and beating myself up over food that was reaching our tea table. Being out of the house all day, collecting the children from school then heading home to throw the quickest thing possible on the table for tea. Knowing that once all the other bits and pieces had been done I needed to study for a few hours it soon became a lifestyle that I imagine most working mothers have to adopt. Yes, occasionally we can be superwoman and throw a nutritious healthy meal on the table but we can't physically do it every single day. It's not just the cooking, it's the organising of shopping for the fresh produce to fit in as well.

Supermarkets may well reduce items near the end of the day but you show me a Mother who is going to be there waiting for it to happen. She's at home feeding her children, bathing them, nit checking them, doing homework with them and getting them to bed so she can crawl into bed herself :wah:

We have one fruit and veg shop left in our town, the others have all packed up and gone since the arrival of the out of town supermarkets. I try to NOT buy veg from the supermarkets, it doesn't keep and you're never sure it's at all fresh.

We also don't eat anything in season any more, once upon a time you ate meals based on the seasons. Now it's a free for all, you can more or less eat most fresh items all year round. Does that play a part in over-eating?

I'm off to crawl into bed, I threw beans on toast on the table tonight, Mondays is always something quick and easy due to after school clubs for one child and dance lessons for the other, but I'm not going to feel too guilty for not cooking a proper meal, both children have had school dinners.


what a **** life you live .....I'm sorry

hhmmm time to turn that around eh? and i think forum members should put in. I'll do some research eh?

fuzzywuzzy;1372260 wrote: what a **** life you live .....I'm sorry




That was my life for four years whilst I studied, I now have my degree, a beautiful bouncy 4 month old and two wonderful slim children who now enjoy the home cooked meals once again, apart from on busy Mondays :wah:

And... let's face it, your **** is someone else's paradise. I worked damn hard for four years and some things had to go by the wayside but it's been worth it for the BA Hons Degree I've achieved. :driving::driving:

Daughter is on a savings kick and so for the last two weeks we've hit the discounted grocer. They sell generics instead of brand named items. You bring your own bags and rent a cart for a quarter.... it works.

I read labels for carb, protein and fat since I got diagnosed with my diabetes. Carbs run about 15 to 20% higher in the products at this discount grocer. It may just be the lack of variety, but I'm having a hard time finding packaged foods that meet the same standards of their brand named partner.

On the other hand, fresh veggies and fruits are every bit as good and somethings even fresher than the big chains. Variety is still an issue and the potato area is huge, but so are the greens area.

fuzzywuzzy;1372260 wrote: what a **** life you live .....I'm sorry


Are you okay, fuzzy?

Betty Boop;1372243 wrote: Can't see that it helps by being spiteful, but then people are, maybe it acts as a way of making that person feel better about their own shortcomings. Maybe it's a case of the thinner people resenting the fact that they maybe have to work at staying slim. Maybe it also takes a certain amount of self control over what they allow themselves to consume, they may view obese people as lacking in self control causing a certain amount of resentfulness within themselves.

Just another thought, food is essential to us all, if we smoke or drink alcohol we don't generally die from giving either of those up. If we give up food completely we will eventually die. I'm not sure what my point is really lol but we all have food in common, each and every one of us. Is it that fact that makes people feel they can attack the obese, like a 'look I can control my intake/cravings/addictions to food, why can't you?'

People have always been a variety of sizes, the difference now is that we're seeing more and more obese people who then seem to raise obese children that are little caricatures of themselves. Is it bad habits? Is it genetics?

I recall several families back in the late seventies early eighties where one of the parents would be large and the other was skinny and they'd have a mixture of children. So you would look at one child and think oh that one takes after Mother and the other one has Dad's build. Nowadays it seems that both parents are likely to be overweight and all children then seem to be overweight.

Bad habits, comfort eating, lack of time spent at home - most parents work nowadays and ease of convenience foods are most likely all to blame. I don't think it's necessarily bad education to blame either. It's life, I spent four years studying and beating myself up over food that was reaching our tea table. Being out of the house all day, collecting the children from school then heading home to throw the quickest thing possible on the table for tea. Knowing that once all the other bits and pieces had been done I needed to study for a few hours it soon became a lifestyle that I imagine most working mothers have to adopt. Yes, occasionally we can be superwoman and throw a nutritious healthy meal on the table but we can't physically do it every single day. It's not just the cooking, it's the organising of shopping for the fresh produce to fit in as well.

Supermarkets may well reduce items near the end of the day but you show me a Mother who is going to be there waiting for it to happen. She's at home feeding her children, bathing them, nit checking them, doing homework with them and getting them to bed so she can crawl into bed herself :wah:

We have one fruit and veg shop left in our town, the others have all packed up and gone since the arrival of the out of town supermarkets. I try to NOT buy veg from the supermarkets, it doesn't keep and you're never sure it's at all fresh.

We also don't eat anything in season any more, once upon a time you ate meals based on the seasons. Now it's a free for all, you can more or less eat most fresh items all year round. Does that play a part in over-eating?

I'm off to crawl into bed, I threw beans on toast on the table tonight, Mondays is always something quick and easy due to after school clubs for one child and dance lessons for the other, but I'm not going to feel too guilty for not cooking a proper meal, both children have had school dinners.


Nowt wrong with beans on toast :wah:

A couple of us were talking about bodies and ageing today during our break at work...and we concluded that our bodies were merely a vehicle that enabled us to be human, and that it's only because we identify with them so fully that we think our bodies are who we are. I did some archive work (paperwork!) in the organ museum in a hospital and, after my initial fascination with the hearts, lungs etc in formaldehyde, I can remember thinking that they were just "organs". They were only part of a person because that's what we believed. But nowadays we seem to be obsessed with the "vehicle" and not the mind behind it.

I thought I had a point here that would have linked in with obesity but I'm afraid I've lost it!

I've lost nearly 70 pounds over the last two years.

Primarily by a few of simple changes.

1. forego potato products, such as fries, chips, and restaurant prepared potatoes of any sort.

2. No canned products. Frozen or fresh fruit and veggies, only.

3. carbs in the morning only.

It's tough, some times, but it's working.

LarsMac;1372304 wrote: I've lost nearly 70 pounds over the last two years.

Primarily by a few of simple changes.

1. forego potato products, such as fries, chips, and restaurant prepared potatoes of any sort.

2. No canned products. Frozen or fresh fruit and veggies, only.

3. carbs in the morning only.

It's tough, some times, but it's working.


Congratulations! I've lost 60 lbs and do the same thing as you have mentioned along with eliminated sugar substitutes and limit my sugar intake/carbs. I have another 40 lbs to lose, and right now I am trying to not eat meat for two weeks. I'm on day three and feel great!

If I was 6 feet tall I would be thin.

CARLA;1372388 wrote: If I was 6 feet tall I would be thin.


I will invent a stretching device for you!

WAMOMMA;1372108 wrote: I wish people would understand one thing, skinny does not equal healthy.

I am more healthy at a size 8 than I ever was at a size two.


Hmm - I guess I need to recalibrate.

Over here a size eight is skinny and a size two is beyond anorexic and your last sentence would go without saying.

CARLA;1372388 wrote: If I was 6 feet tall I would be thin.


Me too, but the problem is that I seem to be losing height as I get older :wah:

Bryn Mawr;1372850 wrote: Hmm - I guess I need to recalibrate.

Over here a size eight is skinny and a size two is beyond anorexic and your last sentence would go without saying.


A size 8 measurements are approximately 35" x 27" x 38". However, I wore a size 8 (many years ago) and my waist was 24" and my butt was 35". So I'm guessing the sizes are actually changing as the world gets bigger. A current size 2 is probably an old size 6.

SnoozeAgain;1372865 wrote: A size 8 measurements are approximately 35" x 27" x 38". However, I wore a size 8 (many years ago) and my waist was 24" and my butt was 35". So I'm guessing the sizes are actually changing as the world gets bigger. A current size 2 is probably an old size 6.


My wife and I were, strangely, discussing dress sizes last weekend and I came to the conclusion that the only way you could make a realistic comparison was to use unisex jeans. They must be sized for all four sexes to understand so what would be the equivalent of a 32R or a 30L?

Sadly I've not had chance to go into a clothing shop since.

Given that unisex jeans have been around for a few years now, has this comparison changed?

I'm chronically and irreparably skinny but I can eat a double cheeseburger for lunch cheaper than a can of soup. That is where the problem is likely coming from. Mind you I did survive on a can of homemade peanut butter for nearly a week when I was 17. Not that I'd recommend it.

Affordable food. Affordable housing. Dignity for all people. That's where health comes from as a nation.