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There is, as I understand it, a gentleman being processed through the American Court system whose name can only ever be mentioned if combined in some permutation with the cognomen "Suge".

Rap mogul Suge Knight collapses in court after judge sets $25 million bail - BBC Newsbeat

He has previous convictions for assault with a deadly weapon, he is already on bail over a separate robbery case and he's accused of murder, attempted murder and hit-and-run after allegedly "running down two men with a pickup truck in Los Angeles following an argument in January on the set of a commercial for the film Straight Outta Compton".

All this information, for some reason, comes from a BBC Children's News webpage. Why the BBC thinks children have an interest in Suge puzzles me, but not so much as how to pronounce this concocted nickname. Suge.

Does it rhyme with Sludge but without the "l"?

Is it like Suggs without the final "s"?

Are we meant to say "Sugar" without the "er" sound at the end?

I don't dispute his right to a common-use name of his own choosing but I do think the world ought to spell it phonetically. Shug, for instance, to rhyme with slug, if that's what it does.

He has taken exception to bail being set at £25m.

The same Children's News area reports, in an unrelated story, the passing of one A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS, who inadvertently consumed sufficient opiates and benzodiazepines as to consitute a lethal dose. The same problem I face with Suge confronts me here too. What guidance did A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS, in life, give regarding the pronunciation of his twattish moniker, and why on earth did anyone go along with it? And why's it all in the Children's Section!

"Are we meant to say "Sugar" without the "er" sound at the end?"

Yes, that is the correct pronunciation.

AnneBoleyn;1476339 wrote: "Are we meant to say "Sugar" without the "er" sound at the end?"

Yes, that is the correct pronunciation.


Perhaps Mr Knight should be told that it is a fundamental never-broken rule of English Grammar that the letter "e", when appended to a letter "g" at the end of a word, softens it into the "j" sound in jelly, while omitting the letter "e" invariably leaves the "g" hard as in gun, gormless or git. Should he ever, in some future incarnation, find a renewed desire to make up a unique name by which to be known to the masses, he would do well to consult a grammarian rather than struggle on alone.

spot;1476347 wrote: Perhaps Mr Knight should be told that it is a fundamental never-broken rule of English Grammar that the letter "e", when appended to a letter "g" at the end of a word, softens it into the "j" sound in jelly, while omitting the letter "e" invariably leaves the "g" hard as in gun, gormless or git. Should he ever, in some future incarnation, find a renewed desire to make up a unique name by which to be known to the masses, he would do well to consult a grammarian rather than struggle on alone.


You read an article like that and top of the list of crimes committed comes the bad English ?

You are uneeek.

(Something else to worry about)

I'm baffled why anyone facing a potential Death Sentence would be given bail at all.

I've also always found it comical that all Death Sentencees (is that the right term?) have to undergo a medical exam before the sentence is carried out so as to ensure they are physically fit to be put to death. And then they sterilise the area where they insert the needle.

Bruv;1476359 wrote: You read an article like that and top of the list of crimes committed comes the bad English ?I have no reason to believe Suge will be found guilty of any offence with the sole exception of the grammatical one I've outlined. To be fair, my sense of sympathy extends to a very limited selection of those alive on this planet and the name of Suge is not to be found on the shortlist, but that doesn't require that I prejudge him.

spot;1476363 wrote: I have no reason to believe Suge will be found guilty of any offence with the sole exception of the grammatical one I've outlined. To be fair, my sense of sympathy extends to a very limited selection of those alive on this planet and the name of Suge is not to be found on the shortlist, but that doesn't require that I prejudge him.
He's black. He's bound to be found guilty - whether he did it or not.

FourPart;1476366 wrote: He's black. He's bound to be found guilty - whether he did it or not.


You're thinking of the Mississippi Delta back when King Cotton was the man.

My deployment of the vernacular may be shaky but Mr Knight is a Californication and as such entitled to due process.

spot;1476363 wrote: I have no reason to believe Suge will be found guilty of any offence with the sole exception of the grammatical one I've outlined. To be fair, my sense of sympathy extends to a very limited selection of those alive on this planet and the name of Suge is not to be found on the shortlist, but that doesn't require that I prejudge him.


You have obviously overlooked the fashion crime of shaven head and full beard made popular by certain religious fundamentalists.

Bruv;1476371 wrote: You have obviously overlooked the fashion crime of shaven head and full beard made popular by certain religious fundamentalists.


Moses was a long time ago. The immediate influence is that muscled chap who had a Team and called himself Mister.

spot;1476373 wrote: Moses was a long time ago. The immediate influence is that muscled chap who had a Team and called himself Mister.


Immediate ??? As in 1987 ?

You old fashioned thing you.

FourPart;1476366 wrote: He's black. He's bound to be found guilty - whether he did it or not.Like O. J. Simpson?

Mark Aspam;1476378 wrote: Like O. J. Simpson?


If Mr Simpson were carried the length of Las Vegas nailed to a wooden cross and with a crown of thorns jammed onto his head, the scene would only just manage to portray the appalling injustices visited on him by the American legal system. He's the nearest man alive to being a modern-day Son of God.

spot;1476332 wrote: There is, as I understand it, a gentleman being processed through the American Court system whose name can only ever be mentioned if combined in some permutation with the cognomen "Suge".

Rap mogul Suge Knight collapses in court after judge sets $25 million bail - BBC Newsbeat

He has previous convictions for assault with a deadly weapon, he is already on bail over a separate robbery case and he's accused of murder, attempted murder and hit-and-run after allegedly "running down two men with a pickup truck in Los Angeles following an argument in January on the set of a commercial for the film Straight Outta Compton".

All this information, for some reason, comes from a BBC Children's News webpage. Why the BBC thinks children have an interest in Suge puzzles me, but not so much as how to pronounce this concocted nickname. Suge.

Does it rhyme with Sludge but without the "l"?

Is it like Suggs without the final "s"?

Are we meant to say "Sugar" without the "er" sound at the end?

I don't dispute his right to a common-use name of his own choosing but I do think the world ought to spell it phonetically. Shug, for instance, to rhyme with slug, if that's what it does.

He has taken exception to bail being set at £25m.

The same Children's News area reports, in an unrelated story, the passing of one A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS, who inadvertently consumed sufficient opiates and benzodiazepines as to consitute a lethal dose. The same problem I face with Suge confronts me here too. What guidance did A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS, in life, give regarding the pronunciation of his twattish moniker, and why on earth did anyone go along with it? And why's it all in the Children's Section!


You forget the speech defect Americans share with many English people from the south of England in that they are unable to pronounce the letter r properly. That's why they say ass instead of arse the origins of that lie in the speech defect imported by early English speaking English settlers. (I think that is the case but don't quote me)

American is dialect of English just as cockney is a dialect or someone speaking broad Yorkshire or Lancashire or a Caribbean jamiacan patois that American pronounce suge differently from us is interesting but hardly surprising there are many words they don't pronounce the same way we do they also spell many words differently as well - personally I think they should stop calling it English and just call it American or at least American English and accept the fact it is becoming a more and more distinct dialect.

You are complaining about something that is a feature of English and probably one of the main reasons it has become so pervasive in that words are picked up used and discarded as time goes on and a dialect speaker can usually quickly adapt when they have to.

Do you have to be a language fascist as well? Look on the bright side at least on this forum people can come across your nuggets of linguistic wisdom and discard or keep as they see fit.

gmc;1476409 wrote: Do you have to be a language fascist as well?Do you know, asking how to pronounce A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS seems to me to be a perfectly legitimate query. It isn't pernickety, over-critical or hair-splitting, it's isn't picky, it's just as baffled as anyone else in his right mind would be on seeing A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS used as a means of personal identification instead of a password.

On the matter of Suge I feel sure you've nailed the answer firmly in the forehead: Mr Knight desires to be addressed by what was presumably his old Army rank from when his taste-buds got fried and has used the locally phonetic spelling for the abbreviated Sarge.

Whether he rolls his Rrrrs like a native Rhotic Scot is another matter and were you to ask him he might react badly.

First of all, I have no idea who this Suge is, nor do I have any idea what his accent is, but it cannot be denied that accent & overall manner of of speech makes a great deal of difference as to how someone is seen. For instance, regardless of heritage or education, can you imagine the credibility of a politician making the campaign plea "Gimme yo vote cos I is gonna be yo Prime Min'ster, innit?". On a much smaller scale, the single reason I don't watch Storage Hunters is the pretentious little idiot who thinks doing the stupid 'brrrrr' thing makes him come across as some sort of professional auctioneer, and it just grates on me. A totally different scenario, I know, but it's all a matter of how dialects are viewed.

FourPart;1476413 wrote: can you imagine the credibility of a politician making the campaign plea "Gimme yo vote cos I is gonna be yo Prime Min'ster, innit?".
I would take Ali G as Prime Minister in preference to either Cameron or Miliband and feel relieved at the choice.

posted by spot

The same Children's News area reports, in an unrelated story, the passing of one A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS, who inadvertently consumed sufficient opiates and benzodiazepines as to consitute a lethal dose. The same problem I face with Suge confronts me here too. What guidance did A[Dollar]AP[SPACE]YAMS, in life, give regarding the pronunciation of his twattish moniker, and why on earth did anyone go along with it? And why's it all in the Children's Section!


Who cares? It's their life let them get on with it. Mind you it has served to get your attention which is probably the point of the name anyway.

Your own name in broad scots would be pluke which is one of those wonderfully onomatopoeic words prevalent in scots vernacular.

Scottish word of the week: Pluke - The Scotsman

Want to scare an English teacher? Ask them to explain the difference between bough and bow or rough and ruff.