The Problem With HOODIES In The UK:

[Derryck]

:-6

The HOODIES or Hooded-Youth Attire:

The phenomena that seem to be creating a stir in the UK, is the wearing of the 'Hood' or head cover, on the heads of youths or adolescents. It is associated with gangsterism, Inner City robberies, and working class hoodlums from both Black & White backgrounds.

This phenomena is creating resentment within those so-called upright communities or individuals, who feel that certain social norms for personal attire must be adhered to, less it creates mis-conceptions within the society.

Or is associated with elements that are anti-establishment, anarchic, or deviant. And this ascription is leveled against the Black & White working class and Inner City youths, who seem to fancy this type of head wear. More or less associated with crime, burglary, and miscreants.

The local media in The UK, by and large is guilty of portraying this local phenomena as indicative of Black & White inner city youth behavior, their lack of moral, social, civil dis-regard for decent conduct and behavior.

This is also indicative of Blacks in the Big Cities of The USA, who wear the baggy trousers, with it's waistline hanging from the lower hips or under the buttock, as their way of saying that we are the Hip-Hop generation, and we chose to identify ourselves in this way generally. And we don't care if you grownups don't like it!

Some adults have complained that this type of attire is indicative of prisoners in the Southern States of America, in the historic chain gang, or those who are sexually molested in prison, or "prison queens."

Whether there truth in these statements or not, the youths who wear them, seem not to care the least about those associations.

Therefore, it is my belief and experience as a former youth, that every generation identifies itself in certain ways that may or may not be appreciated by their adult counterparts.

However, in every culture there are certain elements that are known to be hooligans, or misfits. But that does not give us the right as adults to castigate the entire aggregate as hooligans, misfits, or social degenerates.

By so doing, we would be distancing these youths from us adults, and in fact making the statement that they (the youths), are not appreciated for what they are. And that my friends would be very ill-advised and wrong!

Om Shanti.

Derryck.

Yahoo IM: mimbari2003

[minks]

However, in every culture there are certain elements that are known to be hooligans, or misfits. But that does not give us the right as adults to castigate the entire aggregate as hooligans, misfits, or social degenerates.

Reminds me of Elvis's appearance on stage, he was deemed scandalous and they would not film him below the waist because it was morally unacceptable to see this man "swivel" Yes I have to agree with the above statement. Some of us had fathers who as teens wore tight jeans, tight white t-shirts with sleeves rolled up and our grand parents thought they were hooligans, it appears generation after generation.

[minks]

Fashion style does not make a criminal.....

[pink princess]

but where i live the majority of hoodies are all trouble makers



personally when i was growing up the youth culture thing was to gel hair back tight and basically look tarty, then it was to wear tracksuit bottoms and turn the bottoms of them up



those girls were associated with a naff image much as hoodies are today (tho they werent thought of as criminals more just bullies)



i didnt want to be thought of like that so i made a point of never ever gelling my hair and certainly never wearing tracksuit bottoms. if the kids know its how they will be perceived then why dress like it? i think many do it on purpose so then they can whinge and say how unfair it is.



perhaps if todays kids werent all such sheep and actually got some balls they would learn to be individual and really make a statement, instead of following the trend out of what really has to be fear.



they are so determined that they should have rights etc and they all want to be treated like adults when they are only 14, they must now deal with the consequences of trying to force that into society.....



if i could burn ever hooded jumper and melt ever damn scooter i would and id do it with a BIG smile on my face!!

[pink princess]

minks wrote: Fashion style does not make a criminal.....


your right thats absolutely true



BUT



why do they want to dress in a way thats perceived as being criminal? would you want to dress in a way that made people think you were a 'lady of the night'?

[minks]

pink princess wrote: your right thats absolutely true



BUT



why do they want to dress in a way thats perceived as being criminal? would you want to dress in a way that made people think you were a 'lady of the night'?


Quite simply, kids like the attention, no matter how they are perceived they like to be looked at. Bottom line....

And negative attention is still attention, it stems way back to toddlers, ... example

Johnny is in the store with mom and he wants that little toy plane, mom says no, he pitches a fit and has a tantrum on the spot, he gets attention, be it negative or positive. Susy is playing with her friends, she jumps off the 3rd step of the stairwell to show off, she got attention. It is human/child nature. Always looking for attention, once we hit adulthood we then realize maybe we don't always want to stand out in the crowd. I believe it is all part of testing, and growing. Kids always are testing limits, and a big part of that is to see how much attention they can draw upon themselves. They aren't always thinking about how they are seen, and hey in todays society folks who draw attention in the adult world are what kids will model themselves after. Shock rockers like Marilyn manson, Criminals, Cult styles etc. They just want us adults to look and react.

[pink princess]

its up to the parents to teach their kids some manners and respect.



half the problem here in the UK is its not adults having children its children haveing children



i never wanted negative attention, i used the negative attention others got to my advantage so i guess kids today just arent that clever!

[pink princess]

AL i agree that many teenagers are sheep but i dont think theres ever been such a total 100% sweep of 'sheepness'!!



when i grew up there were 2 distincts, tarty bullies and then combat wearing nice people who got picked on by the others for being different



but today everyone is the same, theres no way to distinguish between whos nice and who isnt, they all look identical so they all get perceived the same way but as i said earlier where i am the majority are trouble makers and deserve to be thought of like it



i feel sorry for the ones who arent trouble makers but then they could do something about it..... its their choice not to

[minks]

pink princess wrote: AL i agree that many teenagers are sheep but i dont think theres ever been such a total 100% sweep of 'sheepness'!!



when i grew up there were 2 distincts, tarty bullies and then combat wearing nice people who got picked on by the others for being different



but today everyone is the same, theres no way to distinguish between whos nice and who isnt, they all look identical so they all get perceived the same way but as i said earlier where i am the majority are trouble makers and deserve to be thought of like it



i feel sorry for the ones who arent trouble makers but then they could do something about it..... its their choice not to


Well if it is any consolation in the end, the majority of our "bad sheep like teens" grow up to be well rounded, responsible adults. Like Arnie said, the teen years just arent' the time for them to grasp the concept of contributing positively to society. Parents can only teach and preach right from wrong and hope their children will make the best choices they can.

[pink princess]

minks wrote: Well if it is any consolation in the end, the majority of our "bad sheep like teens" grow up to be well rounded, responsible adults. Like Arnie said, the teen years just arent' the time for them to grasp the concept of contributing positively to society. Parents can only teach and preach right from wrong and hope their children will make the best choices they can.


im helping raise a 6 yr old boy so im not speaking from no experience.....



most the kids round where i am are scum and they scare me, if i ever saw my child behaving like they do i would be mortified i would question where i went wrong



i have little sympathy for them, the ones im talking about are 16+ and that is old enough to know better



perhaps my opinion on this is quite strong because i dont like what i see around me and i want to just blitz it all out???

[minks]

pink princess wrote: im helping raise a 6 yr old boy so im not speaking from no experience.....



most the kids round where i am are scum and they scare me, if i ever saw my child behaving like they do i would be mortified i would question where i went wrong



i have little sympathy for them, the ones im talking about are 16+ and that is old enough to know better



perhaps my opinion on this is quite strong because i dont like what i see around me and i want to just blitz it all out???


I guess time will tell huh. I always felt that way about some of my oldest daughters friends and some of them are close to 20 and as time goes on and I curb my judgemental nature I see they are fine young adults, so I suppose there is 2 sides to the coin huh

[Bez]

Derryck wrote: :-6



The HOODIES or Hooded-Youth Attire:..............



Therefore, it is my belief and experience as a former youth, that every generation identifies itself in certain ways that may or may not be appreciated by their adult counterparts.



However, in every culture there are certain elements that are known to be hooligans, or misfits. But that does not give us the right as adults to castigate the entire aggregate as hooligans, misfits, or social degenerates.



By so doing, we would be distancing these youths from us adults, and in fact making the statement that they (the youths), are not appreciated for what they are. And that my friends would be very ill-advised and wrong!



Om Shanti.

Derryck.

Yahoo IM: mimbari2003


I agree with you Derryck....look at 'Mods and Rockers' , Teddy boys, Hells Angels( who do much for charity) etc. A very small minority were/are trouble makers, but the rest were 'tarred with the same brush'. I believe that anyone that steps out of the so called 'norm' are quite often ostracised for no other reason than they 'look different' listen to the 'wrong music' etc etc. We are again suffering the intolerance of the human race....if your are a non-conformist you must be a 'badd'n'...RUBBISH !

[actionfigurestepho]

We had the same problem a few years back with black trenchcoats after the Columbine shootings.

Sure some of the kids wore them for shock value.

But a lot of kids wore them because they were warm. Hoodies are also warm. They're functional. If a hoodie wearer who's a hooligan is really a hooligan he's going to be a jerk whether or not they ban his style of sweatshirt.

[pantsonfire321@aol.com]

Ban hoodies and bring in curfews thats what i say -

[actionfigurestepho]

Curfews for minors are a great idea. They've always helped in the small town I grew up in. That way the cops can drive someone home even if they claim to only be standing on the corner, doing nothing. It really cut down on a lot of vandalism and arson (yes, arson!) that we'd been having.

[minks]

actionfigurestepho wrote: Curfews for minors are a great idea. They've always helped in the small town I grew up in. That way the cops can drive someone home even if they claim to only be standing on the corner, doing nothing. It really cut down on a lot of vandalism and arson (yes, arson!) that we'd been having.


I agree bring in cerfews for the minors however imagine the protest you would see from those parents who would rather not have their kids "in their hair" ahahahaha would serve them parents right to maybe they would do something with their kids then, like teach them something, spend time with them, be a freaking parent to them. Oooo I am sorry I went off into a tangent there.

[pink princess]

actionfigurestepho wrote:

Hoodies are also warm. They're functional. If a hoodie wearer who's a hooligan is really a hooligan he's going to be a jerk whether or not they ban his style of sweatshirt.


but they dont just wear them in winter to keep warm........ they were wearing them in the height of summer with the hoods up and still with a cap on underneath!



i think a lot of kids do wear them for shock value like you said, and in a vain attempt to p*** people off but if thats their reason for wearing them and they arent really a hooligan they have to deal with the consequences of it



if im walking down a street and theres a gang of 20 of them standing round im not gonna think, oh maybe they are the good ones ill give them the benefit of the doubt, im gonna think about my safety and go a different way or cross the road.... sometimes apperance is all you have to go on



im a champion for the underdog, and the ones that get picked on, i always stuck up for the ones that didnt conform and i still do, dont know why i typed that just thought it might be relevant somehow

[Peg]

My kids wear hoodies and guess what. They're not thugs! They are actually good kids. My generation had Elvis. Adults thought it was absolutely horrible the way he danced and dressed, yet he is still as well known today as he was then. I remember my parents horror at seeing the Beatles "and that long hair". Every generation has had their groups that made people gasp. How many times, when someone gets arrested, are people in shock because they thought they were a normal, loving, decent human being? I agree that it is intimidating to walk down the street and see a group of 20. The problem is, people want to judge these kids without knowing anything at all about them. Don't want them hanging out on the street corner? Give them skateparks, playgrounds, gathering places.

On the other hand, I have always told my kids if they want to hang out with people who always wear black, wear the chains, wear hoodies, not to whine to me because although it's not fair, they will be judged on appearances instead of the fact that they are all good kids who like to hang out together and are trying to find themselves and their identity just like we did.

[pink princess]

Peg wrote: I remember my parents horror at seeing the Beatles "and that long hair".



Don't want them hanging out on the street corner? Give them skateparks, playgrounds, gathering places.






but having long hair wasnt threatening, these kids are threatening and intimidating



a park and skate park was recently put in near where i live, within 2 weeks there was grafitti everywhere and the park was so full with thugs that the decent honest kind people didnt want to be there...

[Bez]

pink princess wrote: but having long hair wasnt threatening, these kids are threatening and intimidating



a park and skate park was recently put in near where i live, within 2 weeks there was grafitti everywhere and the park was so full with thugs that the decent honest kind people didnt want to be there...


I think they would be threatening whatever they wore.....the fact that they cover their heads with the hoods make us feel they have something to hide...like masks or balaclavas etc. We humans like to have an open view of peoples faces ....faces tell us a lot about a person. Some terrorists and football hooligans wear scarves round their faces so they won't be recognised.

[pink princess]

see i dont find the fact they cover their face intimidating, its not that i cant see their face....

its the fact that they stand in groups of twenty, running in front of cars in the road like a game, smashing bottles against walls, hurling abuse at people as they walk by

[Bez]

pink princess wrote: see i dont find the fact they cover their face intimidating, its not that i cant see their face....



its the fact that they stand in groups of twenty, running in front of cars in the road like a game, smashing bottles against walls, hurling abuse at people as they walk by


I do know what you mean...we have a small park opposite us and the youngsters congregate out there at night. Now it's nearing November 5th, they are setting off fireworks...they also break the trees and bench seats. The language they use is disgusting...specially the girls.... sometimes they are out there quite late and some of them only about 12 years old. I don't know what the parents are thinking about.



It sounds really bad where you are....it's so hard to move away isn't it ?

[Peg]

Question. Would you feel intimidated if there were 20 kids standing in the middle of the sidewalk wearing new jeans, polo shirts, and clean Nikes?

[Bez]

Peg wrote: Question. Would you feel intimidated if there were 20 kids standing in the middle of the sidewalk wearing new jeans, polo shirts, and clean Nikes?


Would depend on their attitide, behaviour and demeanour...we have a lot of foreign students here in the summer that are exactly as you describe.

[Astra]

Me and my 4 year old grandson wear hoodies and we ain't too scarey...well, I am sometimes!!!

Seriously tho...one of the fears about "hoodies" seem to be that they're muggers who will use their hoods as a disguise. One quote from someone famous, I can't remember who, said that " .....there are more thieves in Armani suits than there ever are in hoodies". I think that 's probably true and that it's important to try not to stereotype ppl.

[Jives]

minks wrote: Fashion style does not make a criminal.....


So it's Ok with you if I paint a giant 'swastika" on my jacket?

I'm with Princess with on this one. This is another example of glorifying gangster activity. It crosses the line. In my time, we were as fascinated with death and destruction as all young people at that age. As soon as Ozzie bit the head off a bat, his sales soared. the same exact thing that makes Adolf Hitler interesting to young people is at work here....Evil, plain and simple.

But sometimes, when adults say that something is bad.......it really is bad. Don't smoke, don't drink and drive, and don't dress like a gangster. They all fall into the same category.

I know for a fact that not everyone who dresses like a gangster is bad, I have many students who do it and they are very nice people. That's not what I am stating. I'm putting forth the concept that glorifying death, destruction, murder, mayhem, rape, and negativity is harmful to people. It desensitizes them to violence. It makes violence more acceptable in our society...and violence should never be acceptable.

You can't tell me that it doesn't afffect you either. Remember the incident with the 6-year olds who kicked a fellow classmate to death on the playground in Sweden? They said they did it because they were emulating what they saw and heard on the "Power Rangers" cartoon show.

Younger minds have trouble differentiating between reality and fiction. The message of pure evil and hatred that gangsters spew out gets inside young minds and changes the basic value and moral structure there.....for the worse.

The motivation? Money, pure and simple.

To me that takes any kind of "message" that you say you get from it and throws it in the dirt. What we have here is just a money-hungry, greedy, evil form of pop culture purposely selling hatred to young people and never caring about the damage they do.

Like I said...despicable, abhorrent, detestable.