'According to reports in the media, Obama may appoint President kennedy's daughter, Caroline, to be American Ambassador to London.
Obama has every reason to do so because he needs to reward the Kennedy family for throwing it's weight behind his candidacy at a critical time during his battle with Hilary Clinton.
However, before making such a decision, he ought to reflect that giving the post to a Kennedy would be an insult to Britain. Some of her family were long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism during the Irish troubles. Nor should it be forgotton that Caroline's grandfather, Joe, himself American Ambassador to britain in the 30's, notoriously favoured Hitler over Churchill.
In general, the Kennedy family have a history of being anti-British.
Relations between Gordon Brown and Obama threaten to be tricky enough without this additional complication'.
Obama insults great britain
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Obama insults great britain
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Obama insults great britain
I don't think those are sustainable allegations, neither the Hitler one nor the "long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism" either. A quote or two would be useful.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Obama insults great britain
oscar;1066677 wrote: 'According to reports in the media, Obama may appoint President kennedy's daughter, Caroline, to be American Ambassador to London.
Obama has every reason to do so because he needs to reward the Kennedy family for throwing it's weight behind his candidacy at a critical time during his battle with Hilary Clinton.
However, before making such a decision, he ought to reflect that giving the post to a Kennedy would be an insult to Britain. Some of her family were long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism during the Irish troubles. Nor should it be forgotton that Caroline's grandfather, Joe, himself American Ambassador to britain in the 30's, notoriously favoured Hitler over Churchill.
In general, the Kennedy family have a history of being anti-British.
Relations between Gordon Brown and Obama threaten to be tricky enough without this additional complication'.
don't worry so much, everyone insults Canadians eh?:yh_rotfl
Obama has every reason to do so because he needs to reward the Kennedy family for throwing it's weight behind his candidacy at a critical time during his battle with Hilary Clinton.
However, before making such a decision, he ought to reflect that giving the post to a Kennedy would be an insult to Britain. Some of her family were long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism during the Irish troubles. Nor should it be forgotton that Caroline's grandfather, Joe, himself American Ambassador to britain in the 30's, notoriously favoured Hitler over Churchill.
In general, the Kennedy family have a history of being anti-British.
Relations between Gordon Brown and Obama threaten to be tricky enough without this additional complication'.
don't worry so much, everyone insults Canadians eh?:yh_rotfl
Life is just to short for drama.
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Obama insults great britain
spot;1066693 wrote: I don't think those are sustainable allegations, neither the Hitler one nor the "long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism" either. A quote or two would be useful.
I shall try to find a quote,
I shall try to find a quote,
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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Tried to find a link and found this. I don't like this
Foreign Affairs - An Irish Policy Born in the U.S.A.: Clinton's Break with the Past - Joseph O'Grady
Foreign Affairs - An Irish Policy Born in the U.S.A.: Clinton's Break with the Past - Joseph O'Grady
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Obama insults great britain
oscar;1066704 wrote: Tried to find a link and found this. I don't like this
Foreign Affairs - An Irish Policy Born in the U.S.A.: Clinton's Break with the Past - Joseph O'Grady
You don't like what?
The exclusive Ulster Protestant rule in Northern Ireland from the 1920s to the 1990s with no Roman Catholic representation and no Roman Catholics in the police force and employment discrimination, all bolstered by the British Army deployment whenever the IRA was active, all of it was an outrage. It should have been argued against more strongly at Westminster instead of supported, it's quite reasonable that political factions in the US tried to apply pressure on their behalf. They have Irish immigrant connections, they have lots of Roman Catholic voters. The fundraising for arms around Boston and the arms purchasing on the US market were separate matters entirely.
Foreign Affairs - An Irish Policy Born in the U.S.A.: Clinton's Break with the Past - Joseph O'Grady
You don't like what?
The exclusive Ulster Protestant rule in Northern Ireland from the 1920s to the 1990s with no Roman Catholic representation and no Roman Catholics in the police force and employment discrimination, all bolstered by the British Army deployment whenever the IRA was active, all of it was an outrage. It should have been argued against more strongly at Westminster instead of supported, it's quite reasonable that political factions in the US tried to apply pressure on their behalf. They have Irish immigrant connections, they have lots of Roman Catholic voters. The fundraising for arms around Boston and the arms purchasing on the US market were separate matters entirely.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Obama insults great britain
Why should she pay for the sins of her forefathers?
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Obama insults great britain
abbey;1066931 wrote: Why should she pay for the sins of her forefathers?
Your right. I have tried to find some links re: Joe Kennedy's links to the IRA and his anti-British feeling but have not as yet. Most of what i remember is from the books i have read on Joe Kennedy many years ago. I don't want to agree with the post i took from a newspaper until i can check that out.
I watched the vid.......... sooooooo sweet. :-4
Your right. I have tried to find some links re: Joe Kennedy's links to the IRA and his anti-British feeling but have not as yet. Most of what i remember is from the books i have read on Joe Kennedy many years ago. I don't want to agree with the post i took from a newspaper until i can check that out.
I watched the vid.......... sooooooo sweet. :-4
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Obama insults great britain
oscar;1066937 wrote: Your right. I have tried to find some links re: Joe Kennedy's links to the IRA and his anti-British feeling but have not as yet. Most of what i remember is from the books i have read on Joe Kennedy many years ago. I don't want to agree with the post i took from a newspaper until i can check that out.
I watched the vid.......... sooooooo sweet. :-4
Nobody here is pretending that Ambassador Kennedy was pro-British. Ambassadors can be effective while not liking their hosts much. They're here to talk and negotiate, not to get in bed with the chambermaids.
As for "pro-Hitler", before the outbreak of war lots of people were pro-Hitler. Saying everyone must be anti-Hitler is hindsight. Before the war it was quite reasonable to approve of many of the things Hitler had achieved. What's more, I think that if Hitler had honestly answered the question "do you intend to oversee the extermination of European Jews" in, say, 1938, he'd have said no. Circumstances push people into odd places. Where he ended up isn't where he set out to reach. What he ended up as isn't what he started out as. Simplifying the man into a demon is a waste of experience but it became an obligation to do exactly that outside academic circles or to be labelled an apologist or supporter. I'd much rather see his life and actions discussed honestly than turned into a parody of events. The demonisation of Hitler is practically an attempt at humour, in my opinion, and none of it should be a laughing matter.
I watched the vid.......... sooooooo sweet. :-4
Nobody here is pretending that Ambassador Kennedy was pro-British. Ambassadors can be effective while not liking their hosts much. They're here to talk and negotiate, not to get in bed with the chambermaids.
As for "pro-Hitler", before the outbreak of war lots of people were pro-Hitler. Saying everyone must be anti-Hitler is hindsight. Before the war it was quite reasonable to approve of many of the things Hitler had achieved. What's more, I think that if Hitler had honestly answered the question "do you intend to oversee the extermination of European Jews" in, say, 1938, he'd have said no. Circumstances push people into odd places. Where he ended up isn't where he set out to reach. What he ended up as isn't what he started out as. Simplifying the man into a demon is a waste of experience but it became an obligation to do exactly that outside academic circles or to be labelled an apologist or supporter. I'd much rather see his life and actions discussed honestly than turned into a parody of events. The demonisation of Hitler is practically an attempt at humour, in my opinion, and none of it should be a laughing matter.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Obama insults great britain
That is ridiculous. How would making this woman an ambassador be an "insult" other than the fact she comes from an Irish-American family, and a famous and successful one? She has no part in what happened in Northern Irelands past troubles, which I have to remind you are (in any case) now over, and Sinn Fein are in the government in Northern Ireland now, administering the law within a state that is part of the UK, so the whole thing is wrongheaded anyway.
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"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Obama insults great britain
oscar;1066677 wrote: 'According to reports in the media, Obama may appoint President kennedy's daughter, Caroline, to be American Ambassador to London.
Obama has every reason to do so because he needs to reward the Kennedy family for throwing it's weight behind his candidacy at a critical time during his battle with Hilary Clinton.
However, before making such a decision, he ought to reflect that giving the post to a Kennedy would be an insult to Britain. Some of her family were long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism during the Irish troubles. Nor should it be forgotton that Caroline's grandfather, Joe, himself American Ambassador to britain in the 30's, notoriously favoured Hitler over Churchill.
In general, the Kennedy family have a history of being anti-British.
Relations between Gordon Brown and Obama threaten to be tricky enough without this additional complication'.
Stop living in the past...
Obama has every reason to do so because he needs to reward the Kennedy family for throwing it's weight behind his candidacy at a critical time during his battle with Hilary Clinton.
However, before making such a decision, he ought to reflect that giving the post to a Kennedy would be an insult to Britain. Some of her family were long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism during the Irish troubles. Nor should it be forgotton that Caroline's grandfather, Joe, himself American Ambassador to britain in the 30's, notoriously favoured Hitler over Churchill.
In general, the Kennedy family have a history of being anti-British.
Relations between Gordon Brown and Obama threaten to be tricky enough without this additional complication'.
Stop living in the past...
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Obama insults great britain
mikeinie;1067136 wrote: Stop living in the past...
I'm mis-understood here. I took an article from The Daily mail merely to see what others thought of it. I didn't put in the post where i had sourced the article and should of.
As i said in an earlier post, i'd like to read a little more before making judgement.
I'm mis-understood here. I took an article from The Daily mail merely to see what others thought of it. I didn't put in the post where i had sourced the article and should of.
As i said in an earlier post, i'd like to read a little more before making judgement.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Obama insults great britain
oscar;1067319 wrote: I'm mis-understood here. I took an article from The Daily mail merely to see what others thought of it. I didn't put in the post where i had sourced the article and should of.
As i said in an earlier post, i'd like to read a little more before making judgement.
Yes kennedy as ambassador was intensely hostile to Britain. Henry Ford help fund the nazi party as did many other americans who actively supported them and tried to prevent US aid getting through in congress. Quite a few people here supported them as well because of the way he dealt with the communists and anti semitism was far more ingrained here than it was in germany.
Should have guessed it was the daily mail again. They should take a leaf out of their own book and be consistent. Guess which newspaper actively supported the nazis in the 1930's. Given the tone of some of the editorial content nothing much has changed about the way they think.
As i said in an earlier post, i'd like to read a little more before making judgement.
Yes kennedy as ambassador was intensely hostile to Britain. Henry Ford help fund the nazi party as did many other americans who actively supported them and tried to prevent US aid getting through in congress. Quite a few people here supported them as well because of the way he dealt with the communists and anti semitism was far more ingrained here than it was in germany.
Should have guessed it was the daily mail again. They should take a leaf out of their own book and be consistent. Guess which newspaper actively supported the nazis in the 1930's. Given the tone of some of the editorial content nothing much has changed about the way they think.
Obama insults great britain
oscar;1067319 wrote: I'm mis-understood here. I took an article from The Daily mail merely to see what others thought of it. I didn't put in the post where i had sourced the article and should of.
As i said in an earlier post, i'd like to read a little more before making judgement.
Oh.
In that case, I do not agree with the article.
As i said in an earlier post, i'd like to read a little more before making judgement.
Oh.
In that case, I do not agree with the article.
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Obama insults great britain
oscar;1066677 wrote: 'According to reports in the media, Obama may appoint President kennedy's daughter, Caroline, to be American Ambassador to London.
Obama has every reason to do so because he needs to reward the Kennedy family for throwing it's weight behind his candidacy at a critical time during his battle with Hilary Clinton.
However, before making such a decision, he ought to reflect that giving the post to a Kennedy would be an insult to Britain. Some of her family were long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism during the Irish troubles. Nor should it be forgotton that Caroline's grandfather, Joe, himself American Ambassador to britain in the 30's, notoriously favoured Hitler over Churchill.
In general, the Kennedy family have a history of being anti-British.
Relations between Gordon Brown and Obama threaten to be tricky enough without this additional complication'.
Can't say I am qualified to talk about Irish/English affairs and Joe Kennedy was clearly a crook and bootlegger among other things, but I don't see Caroline as ambassador as an issue. All that other stuff was long in the past and regardless of what you may think of the Kennedy's, that family surely has had more than its share of misfortune and trouble.
On a topic slightly off target but related, can someone help me understand the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland, or why there is a Northern Ireland in the first place?
My father's family was Irish Catholic, he married an English Presbyterian and never went to Catholic church, I married an Italian Catholic and my children are catholic and now I have grandchildren named Sean and Conor who are back to being catholic. Who cares, it's all irrelevant to me. Is religion the real issue in Northern Ireland?
Obama has every reason to do so because he needs to reward the Kennedy family for throwing it's weight behind his candidacy at a critical time during his battle with Hilary Clinton.
However, before making such a decision, he ought to reflect that giving the post to a Kennedy would be an insult to Britain. Some of her family were long-standing supporters of IRA terrorism during the Irish troubles. Nor should it be forgotton that Caroline's grandfather, Joe, himself American Ambassador to britain in the 30's, notoriously favoured Hitler over Churchill.
In general, the Kennedy family have a history of being anti-British.
Relations between Gordon Brown and Obama threaten to be tricky enough without this additional complication'.
Can't say I am qualified to talk about Irish/English affairs and Joe Kennedy was clearly a crook and bootlegger among other things, but I don't see Caroline as ambassador as an issue. All that other stuff was long in the past and regardless of what you may think of the Kennedy's, that family surely has had more than its share of misfortune and trouble.
On a topic slightly off target but related, can someone help me understand the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland, or why there is a Northern Ireland in the first place?
My father's family was Irish Catholic, he married an English Presbyterian and never went to Catholic church, I married an Italian Catholic and my children are catholic and now I have grandchildren named Sean and Conor who are back to being catholic. Who cares, it's all irrelevant to me. Is religion the real issue in Northern Ireland?
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." George Bernard Shaw
"If everybody is thinking alike, then somebody is not thinking" Gen. George Patton
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Obama insults great britain
It's tribal, Quinn. Up until around 1400 the Irish governed themselves, then they fell in thrall to the King of the English (around the same time that the Welsh did, effectively). England had a two centuries of increasing tension regarding allegiance to the Roman Catholic Church after Henry took the Church In England and made the Church Of England from it. By 1640 a generation of extremist Protestants were (for the one and only time) fully in charge of the whole of the Island of Great Britain - these were the same people who a generation later sailed on the Mayflower, having lost power here. While they were ascendant they invaded the Island of Ireland, slaughtered the aristocracy and a lot of the peasants, transported Protestant settlers and disenfranchised the Irish (who were and remained Roman Catholic) completely.
From then until 1990 the Protestant Settlers (or, eventually, Ulstermen) retained control of all political patronage, police membership and employment opportunities within Northern Ireland. The settlements of the last ten years have finally fixed that outrage.
The rest of Ireland was fixed back in the 1920s when the Irish Free State became a country in its own right, immediately had a slightly bloody civil war and became the Republic of Ireland.
The border between the two was totally porous, the Irish Republican Army (which had lost the civil war) became an underground armed resistance funded primarily from the USA and was to a large extent tolerated in the Republic so long as it only committed violent acts in the North. Within the North the IRA were hunted like foxes, thereby sharpening the urban skills of the British Army for many years.
So, the "fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland"? The Ulstermen were all foreign settlers with all the power, that about sums it up. In America they killed 95% of the aboriginal peoples, in Ireland they failed to. They were the same bunch of people though.
From then until 1990 the Protestant Settlers (or, eventually, Ulstermen) retained control of all political patronage, police membership and employment opportunities within Northern Ireland. The settlements of the last ten years have finally fixed that outrage.
The rest of Ireland was fixed back in the 1920s when the Irish Free State became a country in its own right, immediately had a slightly bloody civil war and became the Republic of Ireland.
The border between the two was totally porous, the Irish Republican Army (which had lost the civil war) became an underground armed resistance funded primarily from the USA and was to a large extent tolerated in the Republic so long as it only committed violent acts in the North. Within the North the IRA were hunted like foxes, thereby sharpening the urban skills of the British Army for many years.
So, the "fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland"? The Ulstermen were all foreign settlers with all the power, that about sums it up. In America they killed 95% of the aboriginal peoples, in Ireland they failed to. They were the same bunch of people though.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
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Obama insults great britain
gmc;1067664 wrote:
Should have guessed it was the daily mail again. They should take a leaf out of their own book and be consistent. Guess which newspaper actively supported the nazis in the 1930's. Given the tone of some of the editorial content nothing much has changed about the way they think.
Don't be a nob gmc. It's a little like saying i'm still a punk rocker. Industrie's moods and times change.
In reply to Quinn, i remember reading the books on Joe Kennedy with Interest when i was young. It may have been the bi-ographer but it painted a poor picture of the man. As you said .. a crook among other things.
On reflection, i think that it has to be left in the past and I think we can only wait to see what she has to offer.
Britain certainly had a love affair with the whole 'Kennedy' ideal as much as America did and still does.
By co-incidence, i was up late last night and watched a re-construction of 'John Kennedy's' last hours. What a waste?? I think he would have been an iconic figure if he had ran.
Should have guessed it was the daily mail again. They should take a leaf out of their own book and be consistent. Guess which newspaper actively supported the nazis in the 1930's. Given the tone of some of the editorial content nothing much has changed about the way they think.
Don't be a nob gmc. It's a little like saying i'm still a punk rocker. Industrie's moods and times change.
In reply to Quinn, i remember reading the books on Joe Kennedy with Interest when i was young. It may have been the bi-ographer but it painted a poor picture of the man. As you said .. a crook among other things.
On reflection, i think that it has to be left in the past and I think we can only wait to see what she has to offer.
Britain certainly had a love affair with the whole 'Kennedy' ideal as much as America did and still does.
By co-incidence, i was up late last night and watched a re-construction of 'John Kennedy's' last hours. What a waste?? I think he would have been an iconic figure if he had ran.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
Obama insults great britain
QUINNSCOMMENTARY;1067752 wrote: Can't say I am qualified to talk about Irish/English affairs and Joe Kennedy was clearly a crook and bootlegger among other things, but I don't see Caroline as ambassador as an issue. All that other stuff was long in the past and regardless of what you may think of the Kennedy's, that family surely has had more than its share of misfortune and trouble.
On a topic slightly off target but related, can someone help me understand the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland, or why there is a Northern Ireland in the first place?
My father's family was Irish Catholic, he married an English Presbyterian and never went to Catholic church, I married an Italian Catholic and my children are catholic and now I have grandchildren named Sean and Conor who are back to being catholic. Who cares, it's all irrelevant to me. Is religion the real issue in Northern Ireland?
Spot's explanation is a bit simplistic try this for a wider historical view.
BBC - History - The Road to Northern Ireland, 1167 to 1921
Religion, or perhaps more accurately bigotry is a very real issue. It's also a history that had a direct impact on you in the states. Why do you think your founding fathers were so keen on freedom of religion and a separation of church and state?
On a topic slightly off target but related, can someone help me understand the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland, or why there is a Northern Ireland in the first place?
My father's family was Irish Catholic, he married an English Presbyterian and never went to Catholic church, I married an Italian Catholic and my children are catholic and now I have grandchildren named Sean and Conor who are back to being catholic. Who cares, it's all irrelevant to me. Is religion the real issue in Northern Ireland?
Spot's explanation is a bit simplistic try this for a wider historical view.
BBC - History - The Road to Northern Ireland, 1167 to 1921
Religion, or perhaps more accurately bigotry is a very real issue. It's also a history that had a direct impact on you in the states. Why do you think your founding fathers were so keen on freedom of religion and a separation of church and state?
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gmc;1067903 wrote: Spot's explanation is a bit simplistic try this for a wider historical view.
BBC - History - The Road to Northern Ireland, 1167 to 1921
Religion, or perhaps more accurately bigotry is a very real issue. It's also a history that had a direct impact on you in the states. Why do you think your founding fathers were so keen on freedom of religion and a separation of church and state?
Thanks, I'll take a look, I am trying to understand why when the Republic of Ireland was established why wasn't Northern Ireland included so there was one Ireland.
BBC - History - The Road to Northern Ireland, 1167 to 1921
Religion, or perhaps more accurately bigotry is a very real issue. It's also a history that had a direct impact on you in the states. Why do you think your founding fathers were so keen on freedom of religion and a separation of church and state?
Thanks, I'll take a look, I am trying to understand why when the Republic of Ireland was established why wasn't Northern Ireland included so there was one Ireland.
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." George Bernard Shaw
"If everybody is thinking alike, then somebody is not thinking" Gen. George Patton
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Obama insults great britain
QUINNSCOMMENTARY;1068599 wrote: Thanks, I'll take a look, I am trying to understand why when the Republic of Ireland was established why wasn't Northern Ireland included so there was one Ireland.
The threat of another civil war, the Ulstermen were very armed and determined not to join with the south. The other name for the Ulstermen is the Loyalists or the Unionists, they refused to part company with Great Britain despite Great Britain's willingness to let them go.
I didn't think what I'd written was simplistic at all, you'd asked for "the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland" and that's what I wrote.
The threat of another civil war, the Ulstermen were very armed and determined not to join with the south. The other name for the Ulstermen is the Loyalists or the Unionists, they refused to part company with Great Britain despite Great Britain's willingness to let them go.
I didn't think what I'd written was simplistic at all, you'd asked for "the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland" and that's what I wrote.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious.
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Obama insults great britain
spot;1068605 wrote: The threat of another civil war, the Ulstermen were very armed and determined not to join with the south. The other name for the Ulstermen is the Loyalists or the Unionists, they refused to part company with Great Britain despite Great Britain's willingness to let them go.
I didn't think what I'd written was simplistic at all, you'd asked for "the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland" and that's what I wrote.
It was me that described it as simplistic, which it was but it's difficult to see how it could be anything else in a few short sentences. but please don't take umbrage I wasn't trying to be deliberately derogatory. It's still not as simple as they don't want to part company-they don't want to be part of a catholic country or have anything to do with Catholicism. It's a mind set that is difficult to understand in this day and age.
The civil war was also about the divine right of kings-who rules-the king, the pope in rome or a parliament of the people. The whole religious wars in europe were basically about the same issues.
Which laws are supreme god's laws or the laws agreed by the people. Who rules, the priests or the people. You still argue about it in the states, what place does religion have in the order of things. When you see a christian fundamentalist telling his flock how to vote how does it make you feel?
I didn't think what I'd written was simplistic at all, you'd asked for "the fundamental issue that has plagued Northern Ireland" and that's what I wrote.
It was me that described it as simplistic, which it was but it's difficult to see how it could be anything else in a few short sentences. but please don't take umbrage I wasn't trying to be deliberately derogatory. It's still not as simple as they don't want to part company-they don't want to be part of a catholic country or have anything to do with Catholicism. It's a mind set that is difficult to understand in this day and age.
The civil war was also about the divine right of kings-who rules-the king, the pope in rome or a parliament of the people. The whole religious wars in europe were basically about the same issues.
Which laws are supreme god's laws or the laws agreed by the people. Who rules, the priests or the people. You still argue about it in the states, what place does religion have in the order of things. When you see a christian fundamentalist telling his flock how to vote how does it make you feel?