Poverty rises.

nvalleyvee · Post by **nvalleyvee** » Tue Aug 30, 2005 10:27 pm

Guess what - I am not among the poverty stricken because I chose to bring myself out of it. Before my business I worked damned hard and long hours so I could raise myself above it. I get really tired of people talking about being stuck in poverty. All it takes is some forethought and ambition and some dedication to go there. If you want to sit of your laurels and allow others to do the same and suck off a democratic welfare system --- go right ahead - I have NO sympathy. AND guess what a-hole. I had NO insurance when I got cancer and because I had brought myself out of that stinking quagmire of poverty I no longer qualified for assisstance - Was I mad - HELL YES. They told me I could die first. The hospitals let me make payments - can you just imagine their position when I told them I would take it to the media. You really **** me off Scrat because I AM of the working class, I just choose to do something about it rather than complain.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Wed Aug 31, 2005 4:22 am

I agree with everything NV said except the a-hole part. Our definition of poverty in the US is far richer than poverty in other countries. The 3rd world comment is way off base. We have welfare recipients with multiple TVs and cable. The very poor and illegal aliens get excellent medical care when needed. Hospitals only allow people to suffer and die if they have jobs.

What are we doing with the education system to prevent poverty? I don't have kids and am out of touch. Do we teach money management, budgeting, planning for the future? Home economics? there's your answer to poverty. Teach self-reliance rather than over-spending and government dependence.

actionfigurestepho · Post by **actionfigurestepho** » Fri Sep 02, 2005 7:32 am

I can see both sides of the issue here. Cleveland (my city) JUST dropped out of the "number 1 poorest city in the US" slot to number 12, and we STILL don't have any jobs that pay more than $6 an hour. It really can be hard to fight your way out of "poverty" when you're not allowed to work overtime and your apartment is $500, your car insurance is $150 a month, your heat/cooling bill is $70 a month, you don't have the money to move to a city with employment opportunities, and you're not eligible for financial aid to go back to college so that you can earn more because since you have a job you "make too much."

Of course, most "poor" people I know are still able to rent houses, they still have food on the table, and yes they have TVs and computers.

There are valid reasons for being pushed into financial difficulty---illness is definately one of them. Our country loves to discriminate against the sick and their families. You have your disaster situations and your unexpected baby situations (even with precaution, only 99% effective and all that). Death of the primary income earner. That's what we have assistance for. That's why those of us who've been busting our butts working multiple jobs from the instant we were old enough to work have been paying into the system. You use it, they give you money for college, you better yourself, you get a higher than minimum wage job, you get out.

Then you have your abusers. We all know about the abusers. You have your welfare baby pyramids, your tax evaders, your people who file bankruptcy every seven years because they can.

I think most of us are going to experience being broke at some point. The key is recognize why, see if there's any help for your particular situation, and to claw your way out.

nv--when my hospital was dragging its rear end on my testing, I told them I work with the media...that's when they told me "3-6 months" as soon as I have a donor! They really hate bad press, don't they? Hospitals are supposed to be there to save lives, not to collect money. Sometimes we need to "remind" them of that.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 7:28 am

Scrat wrote: Aw gee NV :yh_giggle you called me an a-hole, I actually agree with most of what you said. People should work to get themselves out of poverty provided they have the opportunity.

The key is opportunity, it is finite.
This is, unequivocably, the most wrong statement I have read from you.

The rest is below me to respond to, and should have been below you to post.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Sep 03, 2005 5:20 pm

Opportunity is most definitely not finite. Not while one lives and has imagination. Life is not easy, but life almost always gives you a way out.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sun Sep 04, 2005 10:18 am

So inventors are psychic? I don't buy it. Imagination has no limits. Hopelessness is our only limiter.

actionfigurestepho · Post by **actionfigurestepho** » Sun Sep 04, 2005 11:02 am

I'm going to play devil's advocate and say that I think we're misunderstanding Scrat a wee bit.

Scrat, are you trying to say that it's harder to claw your way to the top when you're not being born into money?

Or that more people are being born into tough situations?

Because if that's what you're saying, I totally agree with you. It's a hell of a lot harder to do things when you don't have much money. My friends who were born into families that had money were able to pay for their educations without loans and they're all starting real jobs now.

We couldn't even afford to buy FOOD for several years and I'm just now working on my degree extremely slowly...I had to work to earn the money. As far as options go, I think we all had the same options open (to go to college) but how we got there was decidedly different. When we're 80 it'll all even out. And in terms of being born into tough situations, look at the teen pregnancy rates. Those are families who are going to have to work extra hard for things. And that's not necessarily a bad thing. It's just not as easy.