The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by spot »

Shelbell prefixed her "Where were you on 9/11" thread with "PLEASE DO NOT TURN THIS INTO A POLITICAL, ANTI-WAR, SLAM PRESIDENT BUSH THREAD. THIS IS NOT ABOUT GOVERNMENT, IT IS ABOUT REAL PEOPLE AND THEIR THOUGHTS, MEMORIES AND FEELINGS OF THAT DAY".

This is a response thread to her rejection of a post I made there.

shelbell;1240636 wrote: Spot...I thought I was clear about the rules on this thread, apparently your comprehension is slipping. If you want to cause trouble today, do it somewhere else, and if you can't just go along with the intent of this thread, then just shut up!!!! :mad:


shelbell wrote: I'm sorry about my outburst but thought it appropriate...I'd like to thank whomever removed his post.


Actually, Shel, it was me. I'd already deleted my post several minutes before you exploded.

If you're quite so pathologically terrified of anyone posting George Bush's published memories, though, I'll start this new thread just so you can join in here instead. The blindness involved in refusing to look at it astonishes me. A lot of people died on 9/11, or had you not noticed? It's important to remember.

Here's the missing post.spot wrote: George Bush isn't a member of ForumGarden but it would be interesting to note his answer when a 3rd grader asked him "how did you feel when you heard about the terrorist attack?" since it also gives his version of where he was on 9/11.THE PRESIDENT: Thank you, Jordan. Well, Jordan, you're not going to believe what state I was in when I heard about the terrorist attack. I was in Florida. And my Chief of Staff, Andy Card -- actually, I was in a classroom talking about a reading program that works. I was sitting outside the classroom waiting to go in, and I saw an airplane hit the tower -- the TV was obviously on. And I used to fly, myself, and I said, well, there's one terrible pilot. I said, it must have been a horrible accident.

But I was whisked off there, I didn't have much time to think about it. And I was sitting in the classroom, and Andy Card, my Chief of Staff, who is sitting over here, walked in and said, "A second plane has hit the tower, America is under attack."

And, Jordan, I wasn't sure what to think at first. You know, I grew up in a period of time where the idea of America being under attack never entered my mind -- just like your Daddy's and Mother's mind probably. And I started thinking hard in that very brief period of time about what it meant to be under attack. I knew that when I got all of the facts that we were under attack, there would be hell to pay for attacking America. (Applause.)

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I do hope people keep asking him the same question in years to come. I wonder how many different stories he'll come out with.

He's on the money with "you're not going to believe what state I was in when I heard about the terrorist attack", that's for sure.




A month later he repeated the bit where he says he watched the first plane fly into the World Trade Center before going into the classroom. I've no reason to doubt what he said.

Why is it that after a disaster of the magnitude of 9/11 Americans in general are so content that no American at all has been held to account for failure to react adequately? Why does nobody want to look under the stone to see what was crawling around?
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by Snowfire »

I think Shel had perfectly good reasons for wanting the thread to flow the way it did. Its a relevant question. There have been several "where were you when " moments in our lives.

I do however think the question you ask is also relevant. His well publicised reaction to that question made me squirm. Not a response from a competent President but one that begs a million questions.

Or would that be percieved as a conspiricist knee jerk ?

I'm interested to what you think is crawling around under that stone.
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Post by Clodhopper »

????

Are you implying that because Bush was watching the tv as footage of the first plane hitting the tower was shown, he was involved in a conspiracy?

Nobody would be stupid enough to involve GW Bush in a conspiracy. He'd blurt it out by accident at some point.
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Post by spot »

Clodhopper;1240648 wrote: Are you implying that because Bush was watching the tv as footage of the first plane hitting the tower was shown, he was involved in a conspiracy?You're suggesting footage of the first plane hitting the tower was shown on TV before he went into the classroom? That's an unprecedented suggestion. I wonder why a news crew was pointing a camera at the tower when the first plane hit it.

Nobody else in the USA has admitted seeing the broadcast he's talking about. Just President Bush.

"Anyway, I was sitting there, and my Chief of Staff -- well, first of all, when we walked into the classroom, I had seen this plane fly into the first building. There was a TV set on. And you know, I thought it was pilot error and I was amazed that anybody could make such a terrible mistake. And something was wrong with the plane, or -- anyway, I'm sitting there, listening to the briefing, and Andy Card came and said, "America is under attack."

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Post by Clodhopper »

You're suggesting footage of the first plane hitting the tower was shown on TV before he went into the classroom? That's an unprecedented suggestion. I wonder why a news crew was pointing a camera at the tower when the first plane hit it.


Well, it's a while back now, but as I remember it the footage of the first plane hitting was taken by a tourist. What I saw was news coverage of the burning FIRST tower as the second plane hit. There was quite a gap between the two strikes...20 mins? half an hour? Didn't see footage of the first strike 'til much later...but it's a while back now and I wouldn't like to put money on it. Nothing I've heard Bush say contradicts that sequence - and if it did, I'd probably put it down to his general incoherence.
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Post by Bryn Mawr »

Clodhopper;1240658 wrote: Well, it's a while back now, but as I remember it the footage of the first plane hitting was taken by a tourist. What I saw was news coverage of the burning FIRST tower as the second plane hit. There was quite a gap between the two strikes...20 mins? half an hour? Didn't see footage of the first strike 'til much later...but it's a while back now and I wouldn't like to put money on it. Nothing I've heard Bush say contradicts that sequence - and if it did, I'd probably put it down to his general incoherence.


How long would it take the media to find a tourist who had the scene on video, process that video into news format and send it out on air?

How long would it take the secret service to here of the strike and 'phone their man on the ground to get the President to safety.

Either one is unbelievably quick or the other is unbelievably slow.

It's a quote I've not heard before but it does ask a lot of questions.
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Post by spot »

Clodhopper;1240658 wrote: Well, it's a while back now, but as I remember it the footage of the first plane hitting was taken by a tourist. What I saw was news coverage of the burning FIRST tower as the second plane hit. There was quite a gap between the two strikes...20 mins? half an hour? Didn't see footage of the first strike 'til much later...but it's a while back now and I wouldn't like to put money on it. Nothing I've heard Bush say contradicts that sequence - and if it did, I'd probably put it down to his general incoherence.


The tourist footage[1] wasn't shown on TV before the second plane hit. Go on, think about the logistics involved. It wasn't broadcast until the day after. It has nothing to do with "I had seen this plane fly into the first building. There was a TV set on." He's not talking about the second plane, he was already in the classroom before that hit and there was no TV in there. He's talking about the first plane, as he was when he said about being in the classroom "I was concentrating on the program at this point, thinking about what I was going to say. Obviously, I felt it was an accident. I was concerned about it, but there were no alarm bells" - he can only have been thinking that before Andy Card came in and whispered there had been a second tower hit.

eta:[1] Actually I think you're referring to a documentary crew out filming the New York Fire Department rather than a tourist but however many clips there are of the first plane hitting the World Trade Center, none of them were shown on any domestic TV channel that day.
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Post by spot »

Bryn Mawr;1240662 wrote: It's a quote I've not heard before but it does ask a lot of questions.


Both the quotes are linked. The links are both to the Bush White House dot gov site.
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Post by Bryn Mawr »

spot;1240665 wrote: Both the quotes are linked. The links are both to the Bush White House dot gov site.


Not a site I'm known to frequent.
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Post by dubs »

French film makers, the Naudet brothers caught the impact of the first aircraft.




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Post by Clodhopper »

"Anyway, I was sitting there, and my Chief of Staff -- well, first of all, when we walked into the classroom, I had seen this plane fly into the first building. There was a TV set on. And you know, I thought it was pilot error and I was amazed that anybody could make such a terrible mistake. And something was wrong with the plane, or -- anyway, I'm sitting there, listening to the briefing, and Andy Card came and said, "America is under attack."


See my earlier point about Bush's incoherence. It's hindsight: thanks to a colleague who was on the internet at work, I saw the second plane fly into the second tower, but I was already watching the first tower burning - LIVE, and we knew a plane had flown into it. It's just Bush being a little imprecise about what he knew, when. No conspiracy, just incoherence and the brain of a retarded chicken.
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Post by spot »

dubs;1240670 wrote: French film makers, the Naudet brothers caught the impact of the first aircraft.


On the morning of 9/11, Jules was taping as firefighters examined a reported gas leak when American Airlines Flight 11 flew right over him (while in the footage the plane is not seen until the impact is about to happen, the sound of the jet engines can be heard) and slammed head-on into the North Tower. They immediately raced to the World Trade Center (WTC). The Naudet video footage thus became some of the most comprehensive on-site coverage of the 9/11 attacks in New York.

Jules and Gedeon Naudet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



Thank dubs, that's helpful detail. The quote makes it quite obvious they weren't broadcasting at the time. That footage didn't get broadcast at all on 9/11.
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Post by spot »

Clodhopper;1240672 wrote: See my earlier point about Bush's incoherence. It's hindsight: thanks to a colleague who was on the internet at work, I saw the second plane fly into the second tower, but I was already watching the first tower burning - LIVE, and we knew a plane had flown into it. It's just Bush being a little imprecise about what he knew, when. No conspiracy, just incoherence and the brain of a retarded chicken.


I don't happen to think so but we can take that as an answer. It's not what he said and he said it more than once, I happen to think what he said is entirely plausible but we can leave it as unanswerable from current information.

That leaves the main problem raised in the thread unaddressed: Why is it that after a disaster of the magnitude of 9/11 Americans in general are so content that no American at all has been held to account for failure to react adequately?
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Post by Clodhopper »

Why is it that after a disaster of the magnitude of 9/11 Americans in general are so content that no American at all has been held to account for failure to react adequately?


React adequately to what? The initial hijackings or the actual strike?

If the former - inexperience and complacency; if the latter I'd say they probably over-reacted without thinking it through properly. Understandable if unfortunate.
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Post by Nomad »

spot;1240677 wrote: I don't happen to think so but we can take that as an answer. It's not what he said and he said it more than once, I happen to think what he said is entirely plausible but we can leave it as unanswerable from current information.



That leaves the main problem raised in the thread unaddressed: Why is it that after a disaster of the magnitude of 9/11 Americans in general are so content that no American at all has been held to account for failure to react adequately?


I dont have a transcript in front of me but I believe military jets were in the air about 7-11 minutes after the first crash. If it had been one minute what difference would it have made?

Say the second plane was within sights of the second tower, which would be a more desirable outcome, shooting down a plane full of civians over NYC or the plane crashing into the second tower?

They immediately grounded all air traffic but that doesnt happen quickly. Every flight in the nation was ordered down. Which of the remaing two are the other hijacked planes? The third plane hit the Pentagon and the fourth a field shortly after the second tower was hit.

We didnt have a chance of turning anything around that day.
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Post by spot »

Nomad;1240680 wrote: I dont have a transcript in front of me but I believe military jets were in the air about 7-11 minutes after the first crash. If it had been one minute what difference would it have made?

Say the second plane was within sights of the second tower, which would be a more desirable outcome, shooting down a plane full of civians over NYC or the plane crashing into the second tower?

They immediately grounded all air traffic but that doesnt happen quickly. Every flight in the nation was ordered down. Which of the remaing two are the other hijacked planes? The third plane hit the Pentagon and the fourth a field shortly after the second tower was hit.

We didnt have a chance of turning anything around that day.
Not one paragraph of that is true.

Would you like to discuss the actual timeline?
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Post by shelbell »

Like you said, George Bush is not a member of FG, so obviously I wasn't asking about what he thought, felt or anything else. This is a very important day in American history, and a very somber day for us. This "thread" of yours is nothing but a flaming attempt at slamming the great country of the USA. This thread is nothing but disgusting and an insult to America. Don't bother responding, I won't even read the trash and filth you like to spew. This is beneath even you at the timing of this...or so I thought.
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Post by spot »

Clodhopper;1240679 wrote: React adequately to what? The initial hijackings or the actual strike?

If the former - inexperience and complacency; if the latter I'd say they probably over-reacted without thinking it through properly. Understandable if unfortunate.


Reacting to the hijackings.

To describe the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD), the National Military Command Center, the Pentagon, the White House and the Secret Service as inexperienced is astonishing in its own right. To call them complaisant is a possible interpretation of events. In either case you'd expect heads to have rolled except that Americans in general are so content that no American at all has been held to account for failure to react adequately. Why do so few Americans want truthful answers that would explain the lack of adequate responses to the hijackings that morning?
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Post by buttercup »

Sorry for going off topic a bit but its something ive always wondered.

There was a film made about the people who were on the plane that crashed into the field and their names no doubt are known and some kind of monument to them? Could someone point me to a news article of where that monument is or if indeed there is no such thing who these people were and how they have been remembered?

Also is there a passenger list of names, monuments to the people who were on the other three planes or were these cargo planes only? Thanks.
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Post by spot »

shelbell;1240687 wrote: Like you said, George Bush is not a member of FG, so obviously I wasn't asking about what he thought, felt or anything else. This is a very important day in American history, and a very somber day for us. This "thread" of yours is nothing but a flaming attempt at slamming the great country of the USA. This thread is nothing but disgusting and an insult to America. Don't bother responding, I won't even read the trash and filth you like to spew. This is beneath even you at the timing of this...or so I thought.It's not a great country in the slightest, it's a corrupt rogue state regardless of who's running the White House. Americans burying their heads simply because patriotism makes them feel so good is why the problem happened in the first place.
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Post by Clodhopper »

To describe the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA), the North American Aerospace Defense Command (NORAD), the National Military Command Center, the Pentagon, the White House and the Secret Service as inexperienced is astonishing in its own right.


They'd never dealt with a real, proper, terrorist attack before (I don't count nutters like McVeigh (sp?)) which means they were, in the literal sense of the world, inexperienced in dealing with this sort of thing.

We were all brought up with PIRA terrorism. We were used to it and our Intelligence services were used to it and expected it. America was sacrosanct. Never attacked. Never. I think there was a real sense that somehow America couldn't be attacked...

Complacency and inexperience.
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Post by spot »

Clodhopper;1240694 wrote: They'd never dealt with a real, proper, terrorist attack before (I don't count nutters like McVeigh (sp?)) which means they were, in the literal sense of the world, inexperienced in dealing with this sort of thing.


Military interception of planes which went off course over the USA by 2 miles or 15 degrees was a weekly event for years, the system for implementing it was routine and invariable. Until 9/11 when it didn't happen. The experience was there in spades. Whether it was a real, proper, terrorist attack or not only appeared after the event, it was indeterminable beforehand. What failed, for no good reason, was the standard routine reaction - report, intercept and investigate.
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Post by dubs »

buttercup;1240690 wrote: Sorry for going off topic a bit but its something ive always wondered.

There was a film made about the people who were on the plane that crashed into the field and their names no doubt are known and some kind of monument to them? Could someone point me to a news article of where that monument is or if indeed there is no such thing who these people were and how they have been remembered?

Also is there a passenger list of names, monuments to the people who were on the other three planes or were these cargo planes only? Thanks.


B Cup...

Flight 93 National Memorial - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia




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Post by buttercup »

dubs;1240700 wrote: B Cup...

Flight 93 National Memorial - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Thank you so much Dubs. Now what about the other three planes, were they cargo or passenger?
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Post by Clodhopper »

Intercepting planes which went off course by 2 miles or 15 degrees was a weekly event for years, the system for implementing it was routine and invariable. Until 9/11 when it didn't happen.


That only shows their drills/routines/whatever were not adequate to the real thing.

I'm not saying a conspiracy is impossible. I just doubt it. Too much is explicable though ordinary human failings.

We need a mole. Any moles out there?
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Post by Clodhopper »

Buttercup: I thought the two that hit the towers and the one that went down in the field were passenger....?
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Post by Kathy Ellen »

Clodhopper;1240708 wrote: Buttercup: I thought the two that hit the towers and the one that went down in the field were passenger....?




That's correct Clod:)
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Post by buttercup »

Clodhopper;1240708 wrote: Buttercup: I thought the two that hit the towers and the one that went down in the field were passenger....?


Kathy Ellen;1240709 wrote: That's correct Clod:)


So where is the monument to them or list of their names?
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Post by spot »

Clodhopper;1240706 wrote: That only shows their drills/routines/whatever were not adequate to the real thing. The "real thing" was the actual deviation of any kind of civil flight from flight paths over the USA through previous decades which had invariably resulted in interceptions. It's the dog not barking in the night, this lack of interception on 9/11.

The first flight to go off course happened at 8:13. Both NORAD and the FAA claim no notification of the hijacking was made to NORAD for 27 minutes, despite the duty Air traffic control manager saying subsequently that "we considered it at that time to be a possible hijacking”. Nobody's been criticized for that delay, nobody's been held to account for it, it's been skated over. Why are Americans in general are so content that no American at all has been held to account for failure to react adequately?
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Post by Nomad »

spot;1240684 wrote: Not one paragraph of that is true.



Would you like to discuss the actual timeline?


Are you nitpicking or saying the events as I described them didnt occur?
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Post by Clodhopper »

The "real thing" was the hitting of the towers. By what you're saying, wandering off course was a weekly occurence and they got complacent...

Why no-one's been called to account - I dunno. But it's a big stretch to just assume it must have been a plot (if that is what you are suggesting????).
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by spot »

Clodhopper;1240706 wrote: We need a mole. Any moles out there?
Daniel Ellsberg is the hero who blew the reality of the Vietnam War open. Here's his article on the need for a similar response to the Bush Administration's activities - Where are Iraq's Pentagon papers? as indexed on his website under Articles
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Kathy Ellen
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by Kathy Ellen »

buttercup;1240711 wrote: So where is the monument to them or list of their names?


Hi Buttercup,



As usual, our government works in surreal time...Here's a link to our 'nonmemorial tribute' to the innocent people who died due to terrorism...





U.S. Acquires Land for Flight 93 Memorial - CBS News
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

Kathy Ellen;1240724 wrote: Hi Buttercup,



As usual, our government works in surreal time...Here's a link to our 'nonmemorial tribute' to the innocent people who died due to terrorism...





U.S. Acquires Land for Flight 93 Memorial - CBS News


Hi Kathy

Maybe ive got something wrong here but that link is for flight 93 which was the plane that crashed into the field. All the phone calls ect are documented but what about the other 3 planes? If they were passenger planes then there would be a list of passengers on them, who were these people, did no-one on those planes make calls?

Why is the only stuff reported on the one plane (flight 93)
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by spot »

Nomad;1240715 wrote: Are you nitpicking or saying the events as I described them didnt occur?


"I believe military jets were in the air about 7-11 minutes after the first crash" ignores the actual time it took to get them airborne after the hijackings became known. Has they been intercepted as NORAD and the FAA had routinely intercepted previous planes going off course there would have been no planes hitting either the World Trade Center or the Pentagon. The question has nothing to do with "Say the second plane was within sights of the second tower".

"They immediately grounded all air traffic" is obviously inaccurate - the order to ground all air traffic was issued at 9:45 - but it's also beside the point. The question is why so long a delay happened before military aircraft were dispatched, less importantly why they were directed to anywhere but to the hijacked planes themselves and less importantly why they took so long to get anywhere even after they were airborne. I only write "less importantly" because the first question is overwhelmingly the important one.

"We didnt have a chance of turning anything around that day"? No, but interceptions were avoided and with them the only chance to bring the planes down. Except for the Pentagon plane: nobody deployed any of the Washington missile air defenses either despite both Trade Center buildings having been hit before anything arrived there. What were the Washington missile air defenses for other than to deploy in exactly those circumstances?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left. ... Hold no regard for unsupported opinion.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by Mustang »

buttercup;1240725 wrote: Hi Kathy

Maybe ive got something wrong here but that link is for flight 93 which was the plane that crashed into the field. All the phone calls ect are documented but what about the other 3 planes? If they were passenger planes then there would be a list of passengers on them, who were these people, did no-one on those planes make calls?

Why is the only stuff reported on the one plane (flight 93)


Here BC, I think this is what you're looking for:

Flight 93 - Passengers & Crew - Names and Profiles of the 40 Heroes of United Flight 93
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

Mustang;1240728 wrote: Here BC, I think this is what you're looking for:

Flight 93 - Passengers & Crew - Names and Profiles of the 40 Heroes of United Flight 93


Hi Mustang

No, that is still just one plane (flight 93)

I want to know about the other three planes, if they were passenger planes people were killed, who were they?
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by dubs »

Buttercup. Here's a list of victims in alphabetical order, but not separated by where they died. It just says whether it was World Trade Centre, Pentagon, or one of the flights..

CNN.com - September 11 Memorial




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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

dubs;1240730 wrote: Buttercup. Here's a list of victims in alphabetical order, but not separated by where they died. It just says whether it was World Trade Centre, Pentagon, or one of the flights..

CNN.com - September 11 Memorial


Thanks Dubs but as you said these people could have died anywhere, don't you think its odd that there is so much coverage of flight 93 and yet apparently none of the other 3 flights?
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by dubs »

buttercup;1240731 wrote: Thanks Dubs but as you said these people could have died anywhere, don't you think its odd that there is so much coverage of flight 93 and yet apparently none of the other 3 flights?


I think that's simply because the passengers themselves, foiled the attack of that particular aircraft. The other three reached their targets!




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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

dubs;1240732 wrote: I think that's simply because the passengers themselves, foiled the attack of that particular aircraft. The other three reached their targets!


I would have thought just as much would have been made of them. Why on earth make a monument for flight 93 and not a monument for the other three or at least include them?
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by Oscar Namechange »

I can not believe any one could be so insensitive to post this thread on this day of all days.

For gods sake... can't you just once leave the conspiricy theories or the Bush Administration behind for one day and think of the people who died and the families that are still grieving?

Your timing is appalling and I'm disgusted.
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

dubs;1240730 wrote: Buttercup. Here's a list of victims in alphabetical order, but not separated by where they died. It just says whether it was World Trade Centre, Pentagon, or one of the flights..

CNN.com - September 11 Memorial


Actually Dubs via that link i typed the aircrafts numbers into google and have some info so thanks for that ;)
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

oscar;1240734 wrote: I can not believe any one could be so insensitive to post this thread on this day of all days.

For gods sake... can't you just once leave the conspiricy theories or the Bush Administration behind for one day and think of the people who died and the families that are still grieving?

Your timing is appalling and I'm disgusted.


I don't think we have 'ever' had a member here who knew anyone killed on 9/11.
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by spot »

oscar;1240734 wrote: For gods sake... can't you just once leave the conspiricy theories or the Bush Administration behind for one day and think of the people who died and the families that are still grieving?My reaction's entirely dictated by concern for all the people who've died as a result of the Bush Administration's lethal choices. This thread's a response to Shelbell's capitalized sentences in the first post of her thread and it's chiefly in disgust at all the buried heads in the sand her comments imply. Why are Americans in general are so content that no Americans have been held to account for the failure to react adequately on 9/11? Today's the anniversary of the unexplained collapse of the US Homeland's defenses. What day could be more appropriate to ask?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left. ... Hold no regard for unsupported opinion.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by Kathy Ellen »

buttercup;1240729 wrote: Hi Mustang

No, that is still just one plane (flight 93)

I want to know about the other three planes, if they were passenger planes people were killed, who were they?


I think you'll find your answer in this article BC....





September 11 attacks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

Oscar - 13 members and 7 guests are viewing the thread so its obviously of some interest.
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by buttercup »

Kathy Ellen;1240739 wrote: I think you'll find your answer in this article BC....





September 11 attacks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Thanks Kathy.

Were the people that died on the three fights i was searching widely reported in America or just the 93 flight?
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by chonsigirl »

buttercup;1240733 wrote: I would have thought just as much would have been made of them. Why on earth make a monument for flight 93 and not a monument for the other three or at least include them?


There should be a monument for all. Flight 93 is the one where the passengers stopped the attack, at the cost of all their lives. They knowingly did this. They sacrificed themselves for the safety of others.

Spot, any other day would be appropriate to ask. Today it is seen in very bad taste. It is a day to honor the dead, not stirring up embers of something else in disrespect for those who died.
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The general refusal of Americans to look squarely at 9/11

Post by Oscar Namechange »

spot;1240738 wrote: My reaction's entirely dictated by concern for all the people who've died as a result of the Bush Administration's lethal choices. This thread's a response to Shelbell's capitalized sentences in the first post of her thread and it's chiefly in disgust at all the buried heads in the sand her comments imply. Why are Americans in general are so content that no Americans have been held to account for the failure to react adequately on 9/11? Today's the anniversary of the unexplained collapse of the US Homeland's defenses. What day could be more appropriate to ask? Because you have 364 other days you can discuss the failures of the Bush Administration.

I am not commenting further on this thread.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning, we will remember them. R.L. Binyon
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