A Question on Memory

[chonsigirl]

I thought I would ask FG’s opinion. I have come upon an unusual aspect in my research, it is the loss of memory. Sometimes a group of people over time will not pass down important knowledge that once was invaluable to them. In today’s modern age, this probably holds no meaning, if they live within new boundaries of land and modern conveniences. But when they recall so-and-so in the old days knew this, should someone else find what has been written, and let them know? What if the new generation does not care?

It is not something that would be used in my usual manner, for their land claims, future cases, litigation, big old scholarly work for historical purposes, etc. It is just a great amount of knowledge that is gone from their pool of lore. And the ones who remember it are in their 80s just a little but not all of it, they will be gone one day soon.

I wanted your opinions. It would entail a specific amount of work for me, in the years remaining here. But one if I thought was needful and would gladly do. I had a hard time dealing with this the last two weeks, when asked for something specific, they knew it was done, but the records are not there. I thought-it is gone forever. Maybe I can gather what is left, if it would hold meaning for them. Since it would encompass more than one group, I thought I would ask my friends here first, before I ask my prof’s and some of them in October when I shall see most of the major groups. Opinions are graciously asked.

[spot]

I'd have thought there were few things more important than rescue archaeology whether it's a physical site, a language or a mental landscape. If there's something on the brink of oblivion with no possible way back once it's gone, what could be more vital? If you can see it and nobody else has recorded it or taken up the challenge then surely it has to be yours to handle, the next generation doesn't have that option. Discovering what's already in print or on tape will be a major task, especially if it was set down a century ago, but even if it exists there's a gain to be had by exploring the current evolved perception.

[Rapunzel]

I agree with Spot, if it exists in print or tape then to amalgamate that knowledge would be a wonderful thing.

I think the problem is that so many older folks had a limited education that many things are passed down by word of mouth rather than in any written form. Also, histories told by word of mouth change with every telling.

I have often thought it is a terrible shame that so much information is lost as the older generation pass on. I'm so pleased that people are now recording their memories of their wartime experiences, for instance. Even the smallest details can be fascinating.

But for more personal memories, my dad, for example, has a fascinating history of growing up as a boy in Ireland and I've always loved listening to his tales of the Olde Days. Sadly, it annoys my mum and she tells him to shut up whenever he starts talking about them.

I also think it's a shame that in the New Forest, near where I live, there are a few folks who carry out traditional woodland crafts using traditional methods passed down by their fathers and grandfathers. Sadly, the modern generation don't want to carry on these traditional crafts and the old ways of making things and doing things is gradually dying out.

Soon they will be lost forever.

If you can record any history, Chonsi, or any knowledge in any form then you will be doing a huge (but probably unrecognised for now) service to future generations.

Best of luck to you in your quest. :-6

[chonsigirl]

Thank you spot and Rapunzel, I appreciate your thoughts. The memories and remembrances I think need to be saved I know where they are, and what is left of them passed on to the appropriate tribal entities. It is remembrances taken verbatim in the 50s, from memories reaching back until the 1880s, from things they were told from the previous generation, so it can go back until early 1800s. I will write up my proposal for them to read when I see them.

Rapunzel, write down your father's stories, you will want them again one day to pass to your children. It is something you will enjoy doing, and remember forever.

[Bryn Mawr]

chonsigirl;1327781 wrote: I thought I would ask FG’s opinion. I have come upon an unusual aspect in my research, it is the loss of memory. Sometimes a group of people over time will not pass down important knowledge that once was invaluable to them. In today’s modern age, this probably holds no meaning, if they live within new boundaries of land and modern conveniences. But when they recall so-and-so in the old days knew this, should someone else find what has been written, and let them know? What if the new generation does not care?

It is not something that would be used in my usual manner, for their land claims, future cases, litigation, big old scholarly work for historical purposes, etc. It is just a great amount of knowledge that is gone from their pool of lore. And the ones who remember it are in their 80s just a little but not all of it, they will be gone one day soon.

I wanted your opinions. It would entail a specific amount of work for me, in the years remaining here. But one if I thought was needful and would gladly do. I had a hard time dealing with this the last two weeks, when asked for something specific, they knew it was done, but the records are not there. I thought-it is gone forever. Maybe I can gather what is left, if it would hold meaning for them. Since it would encompass more than one group, I thought I would ask my friends here first, before I ask my prof’s and some of them in October when I shall see most of the major groups. Opinions are graciously asked.


If information that was once invaluable to them has been lost then either the pool of information carriers was too small to transmit all of the necessary information or the social / physical environment canged sufficiently that the information was no longer needed and it was dropped in order to carry new information that became more inportant to their survival.

The former would be one stage of the breakdown of a culture but the second would be a natural part of the culture's adaptation to the new environment.

[chonsigirl]

One thing I was specifically asked to look for was knowledge lost, due to a change in where they were permitted to live. You cannot recall the former places exactly if forbidden to walk the land for 60+ years. Something came up in this decade, and the knowledge was needed to prevent destruction of specific sites. It is combination of a destruction of a culture and adaptation to where they were relocated, a distance away. This was the original request to look where I know some things are, I just know there is alot more there.

It is the dichotomy of time-cultures change through conquest, relocation, adaptation, many factors.

[Clodhopper]

People who are involved in the movement of a culture towards a writing down of hitherto oral traditions are at a big moment. I think what you seem to be considering is of great importance. So much can be lost, never never never to be retrieved. Write it down.

[OpenMind]

I wish you all the best of luck in your quest, Chonsi. Every fact you find should be quite fascinating.

After my Mum passed on, I discovered a book in her possessions that I'd never seen before. I have kept it and it is called The Household Encyclopaedia. It is a fascinating book containing info on things such as ointments, medication, recipes, cleaning, and even includes the wedding ritual and many other fascinating items.

The book doesn't have a publishing date and I have had it roughly dated to the early part of the last century. Thus, it was written well before a lot of products we now use were ever invented and when we relied on home made concoctions.

Having this book helps me to appreciate how things were done once in the days before we had wholesale gas and electricity.

I wish you all the best of luck with your endeavours.

[chonsigirl]

I wrote up the propsal last month, and sent it to my prof'. He called me last night, the elders and all are going to sit down and talk to me about it next month when I go to the conference. He sounded very happy at my suggestion.

[ZAP]

Good luck to you, Chonsi. What you are doing is invaluable. As has been said, once it's lost--it's gone! I tried to ask my aunt (the last of my dad's side with the Indian ancestors) questions about my grandmother and she told me she didn't want to talk about it, as if it was a stigma that was best forgotten. But when I was in Maryland with some nieces and nephews, they were asking me question after question about what life was like when I was a girl. I have a very sharp memory and their father had forgotten a lot of it until I started answering the questions. I was encouraged when my grand niece Nadia, who is 10 years old, sat down beside me and asked some very pointed and intelligent questions of her own.

[Odie]

good luck to you Chonsi!:-6