Osama Bin Laden Has Been Killed ..

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Sun May 01, 2011 7:52 pm

His body is in US hands he is dead announcement at 7:45pm PST...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/ma ... dead-obama

Osama bin Laden has been killed by US operatives in Pakistan, President Obama announced. Photograph: AFP/Getty Images

Osama bin Laden, the criminal mastermind behind al-Qaida and the world's most sought-after terrorist since the attacks of 11 September 2001, has been killed by a US operation, President Barack Obama will announce late on Sunday night.

Osama's body is in possession of the US, having been killed in Pakistan as the result of a US special forces and CIA operation, according to the first leaks of reporting from the US television networks.

President Obama is to make a highly unusual Sunday night live statement to announce the news, around 11pm eastern time.

The news comes eight years to the day that President George Bush declared "Mission accomplished" in Iraq – but it is now the unlikely figure of Barack Obama is the commander in chief who announces the final triumph over the focus of so much international attention.

This is a turning point in the global "war on terrorism" that has been waged since 9/11 – and the news will reverberate around the world.

Patsy Warnick · Post by **Patsy Warnick** » Sun May 01, 2011 8:40 pm

I'm very happy with the news.

Pres. Bush said wanted "Dead or alive".

Patsy

Scrat · Post by **Scrat** » Sun May 01, 2011 9:34 pm

About time. I guess he was staying in a fortified mansion. I wonder how the Pakis are going to explain this away. Can we leave Afghanistan now?

Patsy Warnick · Post by **Patsy Warnick** » Sun May 01, 2011 9:54 pm

Did you see the large crowds out front of the White House?

New York must be going crazy right now.

Yeah !!! Obama got Osama... good news to me.

Patsy

Scrat · Post by **Scrat** » Sun May 01, 2011 10:11 pm

All we did was kill the dog of war we made. Can we get out of Afghanistan now?

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Sun May 01, 2011 10:12 pm

just heard it on the news, thank god!

Patsy Warnick · Post by **Patsy Warnick** » Sun May 01, 2011 10:35 pm

Scrat

Do you think we can get out of Afghsnistan?

I say NO

Patsy

Post by **Betty Boop** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:04 am

The news fills me with dread, and I can't stomach the cheering crowds being shown in America.

theia · Post by **theia** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:12 am

I feel concerned about the potential backlash from followers of Bin Laden. For me, the world doesn't feel like a safer place now that he's dead.

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:37 am

They buried him at sea.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 6:21 am

flopstock;1358514 wrote: They buried him at sea.

my question is why?

- now there is no body to prove it.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Mon May 02, 2011 6:37 am

There are pictures and DNA testing is happening as we speak. From what I read if they show the pictures there is no doubt that it is him. Shot in the head buried at sea so there was no place to build a shrine. He is GONE.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 6:38 am

Could we have a reaction from some of the US posters about where this firefight occurred? The compound is, to pick an American equivalent, a residential annexe to the West Point Academy:The Abbottabad residence is just a few hundred metres from the Pakistan Military Academy - the country's equivalent of West Point. The BBC's Aleem Maqbool in Abbottabad says it will undoubtedly be a huge embarrassment to Pakistan that Bin Laden was found not only in the country but also on the doorstep of the military academy.

BBC News - Osama Bin Laden, al-Qaeda leader, dead

So who do you suppose was providing that physical bodyguard protection?One resident, Nasir Khan, told Reuters the helicopters had come under "intense firing" from the ground. The size and complexity of the structure in Abbottabad had "shocked" US officials.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 6:49 am

CARLA;1358518 wrote: There are pictures and DNA testing is happening as we speak. From what I read if they show the pictures there is no doubt that it is him. Shot in the head buried at sea so there was no place to build a shrine. He is GONE.

Indeed he is, Carla, indeed he is.

Perhaps we should remind ourselves of Osama bin Laden's strategic objectives.

He set out to trigger a US invasion of the Middle East. He did that in order to radicalize large numbers of Muslims around the world, and especially in the Middle East, into an anti-American pro-Jihad point of view. He did it with the ultimate objective of establishing Islamic theocratic, as opposed to secular, government across the Arab-speaking world.

The US administration in the White House while this plan went down was ball-achingly eager to put its troops into the Middle Eastern theater and keep them there permanently. It was predominantly influenced and staffed by PNAC supporters, and that's exactly what PNAC had advocated for the previous five years.

So, between the two participating parties, who on earth was going to prevent 9/11? Who had any reason to prevent it? Osama bin Laden was undoubtedly an enemy of the American people but he wasn't a traitor. History will, one hopes, expose those who were.

And now that Osama bin Laden's been killed, by operatives under orders to kill and not capture, another first-hand witness is dead. Rather like Saddam Hussein with potential evidence of US interference in the Middle East from a previous decade and held extremely incommunicado until hanged.

I'd quite like to read that order in detail, if I may.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:36 am

CARLA;1358518 wrote: There are pictures and DNA testing is happening as we speak. From what I read if they show the pictures there is no doubt that it is him. Shot in the head buried at sea so there was no place to build a shrine. He is GONE.

I just read the same Carla about an hour ago, what gets me is because he is Muslim and that is their custom to bury at sea, why would Obama obey that custom after all he did to the US?

In all decency, he should have brought the body back to the US.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:46 am

Don't worry Odie, I expect they brought back enough of his organs from their autopsy to rebuild the chap if they felt inclined.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:48 am

I don't think there was any need to bring Osama's body back to the US we don't want any part of that monster on our soil. Dead is dead get rid of him as they did at sea over and done. As Spot stated I'm sure they brought back enough of him to prove it was him.

Is the threat of terror over not in the least. Has their leader been killed yes, one step in the right direction.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:52 am

Leader, Carla? I doubt that very much. The point of a loose-knit collective is that it has no hierarchic chain of command. What's been martyred today was a figurehead, and I bet you'll find he's more powerful dead than he was when alive.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:56 am

He was a terrorist, look what happened in 2001, Obama gave him more respect by burying him at sea than he ever did with us.

He should have been brought back to the US, interrogated and shot for millions to watch.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 8:02 am

Odie;1358527 wrote: he brought Husein back here.That'll be Barrack Husein, presumably, the famous Kenyan runner.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 8:03 am

spot;1358529 wrote: That'll be Barrack Husein, presumably, the famous Kenyan runner.

I edited that spot as that was untrue.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Mon May 02, 2011 8:08 am

I fear you will be right about him being more powerful dead then he was alive. He was the mastermind of 9-11 we wanted him dead or alive and now after a decade of searching we got the monster.

I heard it was a "Navy Seals" and CIA operation that started last August with intel on his location.

Leader, Carla? I doubt that very much. The point of a loose-knit collective is that it has no hierarchic chain of command. What's been martyred today was a figurehead, and I bet you'll find he's more powerful dead than he was when alive.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Mon May 02, 2011 8:12 am

Odie;1358527 wrote: He was a terrorist, look what happened in 2001, Obama gave him more respect by burying him at sea than he ever did with us.

He should have been brought back to the US, interrogated and shot for millions to watch.

That's just sick.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 8:18 am

Odie;1358527 wrote: He was a terrorist, look what happened in 2001

There are lots of words that describe the fellow. Terrorist is undoubtedly a very good one. Pan-Arab Patriot might be too. What he certainly can't be accurately described as, by anyone, is a traitor. I would regard "traitor" as a far worse judgement than either of the other terms. I doubt whether there are many significant people who worked on foreign or intelligence affairs for the Bush Administration who don't qualify.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Mon May 02, 2011 8:27 am

Odie;1358523 wrote: I just read the same Carla about an hour ago, what gets me is because he is Muslim and that is their custom to bury at sea, why would Obama obey that custom after all he did to the US?

In all decency, he should have brought the body back to the US.

Actually they have the same attitude to burial and cremation as christians - muslims only get buried at sea if they actually die there otherwise buried on land is the custom. It's not showing any respect at all just making sure there can be no shrine as it would be if his grave was on land. Bringing him back to the US to put on show would just add to his martyred status and would it's hardly be the action of a civilised people to put the bodies of criminals on display. Actually I don't know if the states ever did use gibbets for that purpose.

Canny move imo. He's dead end of story, they'd have had a bigger problem if he was captured alive and had to stand trial.

He was a terrorist, look what happened in 2001, Obama gave him more respect by burying him at sea than he ever did with us.

He should have been brought back to the US, interrogated and shot for millions to watch.

You're just like him. How is that any different from al queda posting videos of captured americans being executed?

You don't execute terrorists you put them in prison otherwise all you do is create martyrs for the cause. Look at Northern ireland, do you really think the peace process would have had a chance if every IRA bomber had been executed? At least six of them would have been posthumously pardoned as it is.

posted by spot

And now that Osama bin Laden's been killed, by operatives under orders to kill and not capture, another first-hand witness is dead. Rather like Saddam Hussein with potential evidence of US interference in the Middle East from a previous decade and held extremely incommunicado until hanged.

You mean you dont know all that already - It's hardly a big secret is it?

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 9:13 am

Betty Boop;1358532 wrote: That's just sick.

so what your saying is that it was okay for him to terrorize your country and just let him be buried in the sea? Betty, throughout threads you have contemned me and others, I really don't think your grasping just who he was and what he did to your country and mine.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Mon May 02, 2011 9:36 am

Odie;1358539 wrote: so what your saying is that it was okay for him to terrorize your country and just let him be buried in the sea? Betty, throughout threads you have contemned me and others, I really don't think your grasping just who he was and what he did to your country and mine.

I'm not saying that at all, why not leave him out at sea, there is no shrine, no burial place where people will visit, that's fine by me.

Why bring him back to the USA? So you can all act like barbarians and stamp and spit on his body? Is that going to change what he was accused of? No.

By wishing to witness his dead body so that you can feel a sense of what, justice is it? it's just sick, it lowers you to his level, be satisfied he is dead, nothing can be gained from gloating over a dead body.

You should be more concerned about what the aftermath is going to be, because if you think this is over now that he's been taken out then you're living in cloud cuckoo land.

And, yes Odie, I do grasp who he was. :rolleyes:

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 9:52 am

It might be worth asking, today, while summing him up, whether he succeeded in what he set out to achieve. There are some aspects which haven't come to a conclusion such as whether countries such as Egypt - particularly Egypt - will stay Westernized or adopt a more Islamic form of government. The last couple of months, there and in Libya, may indicate movement in the direction he intended. Several corrupt complaisant Western tools like Mubarrak have tumbled and the secular Gaddafi revolution has been hit hard. Osama bin Laden was both anti-secular (theocratic) and anti-nationalist (Pan-Islamic).

theia · Post by **theia** » Mon May 02, 2011 9:57 am

Odie;1358539 wrote: so what your saying is that it was okay for him to terrorize your country and just let him be buried in the sea? Betty, throughout threads you have contemned me and others, I really don't think your grasping just who he was and what he did to your country and mine.

Odie, how can you possibly conclude that when Betty was actually showing her disgust at your "shot for millions to watch" comment?

Patsy Warnick · Post by **Patsy Warnick** » Mon May 02, 2011 9:58 am

Betty Boop

We are satified that he's dead - we are happy with glee that he is dead

yet you stated that turned your stomach - made you sick that the U.S. was celebrating.

He orchestrated a attack on the U.S. - We are happy..!!!!!!!!

Will this death stop terrorism - probably not. We have thousands protecting you - us & others.

This is just one less to worry about.

Patsy

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 10:00 am

theia;1358547 wrote: Odie, how can you possibly conclude that when Betty was actually showing her disgust at your "shot for millions to watch" comment?
Odie, like millions of others, has been taught to hate without thinking. I doubt whether they can be deprogrammed.

buttercup · Post by **buttercup** » Mon May 02, 2011 10:02 am

Bloody disgrace it took 10 years to do it.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 10:05 am

Patsy Warnick;1358548 wrote: We have thousands protecting youNo Patsy, you can say many things but you can't claim that. The people you refer to are the problem, not the solution. They are the threat, not the liberators. There are two words to balance, "Warrior" and "Guerilla". "Warrior", without exception, is an antique and despicable notion which is never going to come back into fashion. By all means fight if the need arises (as it often does) but never, ever, gloat in your all-powerful capability. The warrior concept is a vile and impotent perversion of what might otherwise be a civilized people.

Patsy Warnick · Post by **Patsy Warnick** » Mon May 02, 2011 10:17 am

Spot

Are you upset that people are happy with this?

Patsy

flopstock · Post by **flopstock** » Mon May 02, 2011 10:27 am

My initial reaction was 'so what'.

I can't see this having any more of an affect than if they had killed our president. We'd keep on keeping on and perhaps even experience a stiffening of resolve.

What do we do now, exactly? Pack up and leave the area?

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 11:16 am

Patsy Warnick;1358557 wrote: Spot

Are you upset that people are happy with this?

Patsy

Not in the slightest. I'm delighted too, the man did a great deal of harm to a large number of people, most of whom I might say in passing were Muslims. What part of my reaction here suggests I'm not happy about it, or upset that others are happy? Bible-literalists of any religion are invariably part of the problem, never part of the solution.

I also happen to think he acted in collusion with US intelligence, deliberately during the Afghan war against the Russians and perhaps unwittingly when authorizing the events of 9/11.

I'm quite certain that, had PNAC not been so major an influence on the Bush White House administration, the attacks would have been shut down before any plane got into the air. Osama bin Laden bears far less responsibility for those deaths ten years ago than the American traitors who enabled the operation to succeed.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:02 pm

CARLA;1358531 wrote: I fear you will be right about him being more powerful dead then he was alive. He was the mastermind of 9-11 we wanted him dead or alive and now after a decade of searching we got the monster.

I heard it was a "Navy Seals" and CIA operation that started last August with intel on his location.

Which is exactly what they should have done ten years ago instead of invading Afghanistan and starting all the trouble that has happened since.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:15 pm

Bryn Mawr;1358566 wrote: Which is exactly what they should have done ten years ago instead of invading Afghanistan and starting all the trouble that has happened since.You're ignoring what they said at the time:America’s strategic goal used to be containment of the Soviet Union; today the task is to preserve an international security environment conducive to American interests and ideals. The military’s job during the Cold War was to deter Soviet expansionism. Today its task is to secure and expand the “zones of democratic peace;” to deter the rise of a new great-power competitor; defend key regions of Europe, East Asia and the Middle East; and to preserve American preeminence through the coming transformation of war made possible by new technologies. From 1945 to 1990, U.S. forces prepared themselves for a single, global war that might be fought across many theaters; in the new century, the prospect is for a variety of theater wars around the world, against separate and distinct adversaries pursuing separate and distinct goals.Staying within the Homeland was never on offer. Finding a moment of voter acceptance for permanently deploying the Warrior Class was the one essential goal. You don't remember? Here it is...the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor. Domestic politics and industrial policy will shape the pace and content of transformation as much as the requirements of current missions.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:37 pm

posted by spot

I'm quite certain that, had PNAC not been so major an influence on the Bush White House administration, the attacks would have been shut down before any plane got into the air. Osama bin Laden bears far less responsibility for those deaths ten years ago than the American traitors who enabled the operation to succeed.

While PNAC had a baleful influence on what happened the notion that the 911 attack was colluded in by the white house is a ludicrous one on a par with the theory that roosevelt deliberately didn't warn the commanders at pearl harbour.

There are so many other more efficient and simpler ways to wage a terror campaign than hijacking planes I wonder why they bother with planes now. You can see why it was used to great effect in the 1970's by the PLO but now the effort seems out of proportion to the result, 911 aside. If you want to paralyse america a few car bombs parked on wall street or at docks would be far more effective, a gas tanker going up in new york would have a tremendous effect. Happily the IRA never tried it either, well so far as we know.

Saint_ · Post by **Saint_** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:39 pm

I remember people, burning, throwing themselves out of the 200th floors of the collapsing World Trade Towers. I have pity for the families that had to grow up these long ten years without their fathers, mothers, sons and daughters. I have respect for the courage of the men and women of Flight 93 who, knowing it might mean their deaths, chose to try to take control of their hijacked aircraft fighting for their lives. I admiration for the men and women of the Pentagon that stayed at their posts while their building burned around them. I have nothing but the greatest esteem for our servicemen and women who have shoulder the burden of the fight for these many years.

But I'm not God. I'm just a fallible man.

I have no mercy for a mass murderer of innocents. Just like a predator pedophile that executes a defenseless child, or a vicious dictator that slaughters millions, there is no room in my heart for any forgiveness or compassion for those vermin.

I also have no regrets, and no doubts. I'll sleep softly and quietly tonight safe in the knowledge that a great evil in the world is erased forever from the sunny day of Life and will live now only in the dark nightmares of men.

Comes around, goes around. Hell yawns open for Osama Bin Laden.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:43 pm

gmc;1358569 wrote: While PNAC had a baleful influence on what happened the notion that the 911 attack was colluded in by the white house is a ludicrous one on a par with the theory that roosevelt deliberately didn't warn the commanders at pearl harbour. What you express is a reasonable opinion, obviously. I think you ignore the written intentions and desires of PNAC and the utterly amoral nature of their directors. You trust them. I, quite simply, don't.

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 1:46 pm

Saint_;1358570 wrote: I have no mercy for a mass murderer of innocents.Then why aren't you pressing for the investigation and trial of George W Bush and his cronies? You seem very selective in which killers of innocents you're prepared to condemn.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 2:25 pm

Betty Boop;1358543 wrote: I'm not saying that at all, why not leave him out at sea, there is no shrine, no burial place where people will visit, that's fine by me.

Why bring him back to the USA? So you can all act like barbarians and stamp and spit on his body? Is that going to change what he was accused of? No.

By wishing to witness his dead body so that you can feel a sense of what, justice is it? it's just sick, it lowers you to his level, be satisfied he is dead, nothing can be gained from gloating over a dead body.

You should be more concerned about what the aftermath is going to be, because if you think this is over now that he's been taken out then you're living in cloud cuckoo land.

And, yes Odie, I do grasp who he was. :rolleyes:

justice is not sick.

Justice was to have him brought back to the US, not buried at sea as per the Muslim wishes?:rolleyes:

They were not even sure it was him?

DNA testing will confirm, but the US government can say what they want, and we have to believe that, but in all reality perhaps it was Obama's way to get elected again.

I never said it was over, of course there will be consequences, did you not want him found and killed because of that?

Post by **spot** » Mon May 02, 2011 2:41 pm

I asked two questions earlier in the thread and none of the responses have gone anywhere near them, it's as though they're taboo. May I try again?

1.Could we have a reaction from some of the US posters about where this firefight occurred? The compound is, to pick an American equivalent, a residential annexe to the West Point Academy:The Abbottabad residence is just a few hundred metres from the Pakistan Military Academy - the country's equivalent of West Point. The BBC's Aleem Maqbool in Abbottabad says it will undoubtedly be a huge embarrassment to Pakistan that Bin Laden was found not only in the country but also on the doorstep of the military academy.

BBC News - Osama Bin Laden, al-Qaeda leader, dead

So who do you suppose was providing that physical bodyguard protection?One resident, Nasir Khan, told Reuters the helicopters had come under "intense firing" from the ground. The size and complexity of the structure in Abbottabad had "shocked" US officials.

and 2.It might be worth asking, today, while summing him up, whether he succeeded in what he set out to achieve. There are some aspects which haven't come to a conclusion such as whether countries such as Egypt - particularly Egypt - will stay Westernized or adopt a more Islamic form of government. The last couple of months, there and in Libya, may indicate movement in the direction he intended. Several corrupt complaisant Western tools like Mubarrak have tumbled and the secular Gaddafi revolution has been hit hard. Osama bin Laden was both anti-secular (theocratic) and anti-nationalist (Pan-Islamic).

Scrat · Post by **Scrat** » Mon May 02, 2011 2:43 pm

Do you think we can get out of Afghsnistan?

Yes, I think we should get out of Afghanistan. The only reason we are there is the Great Game and we are not going to win it. It's called a Pyrrhic victory.

As for OBL he's just a trophy, he will simply be replaced by another although I think less capable leader for awhile. Al Q is still here, we best learn to live with it.

Post by **Bryn Mawr** » Mon May 02, 2011 3:08 pm

Odie;1358575 wrote: justice is not sick.

Justice was to have him brought back to the US, not buried at sea as per the Muslim wishes?:rolleyes:

They were not even sure it was him?

DNA testing will confirm, but the US government can say what they want, and we have to believe that, but in all reality perhaps it was Obama's way to get elected again.

I never said it was over, of course there will be consequences, did you not want him found and killed because of that?

Muslim wishes are for the body to be buried as quickly as can be arranged (generally accepted to be within twenty four hours), not for the body to be buried at sea. (and just how dumping the body out of a flying helicopter is seen as giving it respect I'm not sure but it is the most likely interpretation of burial at sea in this instance).

Justice is not sending in the troops with a shoot to kill order, it would be trying him in a court of law. In this I agree with the reasoning, don't give him a platform to incite further trouble, but it is not justice.

As to it not being him - can you imagine the egg-on-face if he made further broadcasts after this? That they've claimed it is a fairly good indication that they're sure he's dead.

fuzzywuzzy · Post by **fuzzywuzzy** » Mon May 02, 2011 3:14 pm

Al Q have affiliates . it doesn't matter if they were to not exist anymore there are plenty of other organisations that have carried out al quadas work . OBL didn't do all the work personally, he has experts and soldiers everywhere.

This whole thing has way too many holes in it for my liking.

Our prime minister is warning Australians not to get swept up in anti west/ OBL protests or public mourning overseas. Why is she saying that? why isn't she warning the opposite as true?

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:16 pm

Odie;1358523 wrote: I just read the same Carla about an hour ago, what gets me is because he is Muslim and that is their custom to bury at sea, why would Obama obey that custom after all he did to the US?

In all decency, he should have brought the body back to the US.

Where did you get that Muslim custom requires burial at sea?

Interesting for a religion born in the desert, no?

Scratch that question.

Others addressed that.

The only rule seems to be to bury the dead quickly, at sea if no land is available, but really, it was quite clever to dump the body in the sea.

I just hope taking this one guy out makes a difference.

Enough people have died because of this guy.

Too bad we pissed him off. He would have made a terrific ally.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:52 pm

Patsy Warnick;1358548 wrote: Betty Boop

We are satified that he's dead - we are happy with glee that he is dead

yet you stated that turned your stomach - made you sick that the U.S. was celebrating.

He orchestrated a attack on the U.S. - We are happy..!!!!!!!!

Will this death stop terrorism - probably not. We have thousands protecting you - us & others.

This is just one less to worry about.

Patsy

Canadians are also jumping up and down with glee, celebrations took place everywhere today and by the way, well said!

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:57 pm

Bryn Mawr;1358585 wrote: Muslim wishes are for the body to be buried as quickly as can be arranged (generally accepted to be within twenty four hours), not for the body to be buried at sea. (and just how dumping the body out of a flying helicopter is seen as giving it respect I'm not sure but it is the most likely interpretation of burial at sea in this instance).

Justice is not sending in the troops with a shoot to kill order, it would be trying him in a court of law. In this I agree with the reasoning, don't give him a platform to incite further trouble, but it is not justice.

As to it not being him - can you imagine the egg-on-face if he made further broadcasts after this? That they've claimed it is a fairly good indication that they're sure he's dead.

then why did Obama respect Muslim wishes?

to me, that's disgusting Bryn, look what he had done?

DNA Testing said today that in fact it was Osama.....that was quite fast.

are we to believe it was him, not seeing his body?

what's your opinion oscar, yes, I see your here.