One of the greatest shifting of gears in the bible is this; Matt. 26:28" For this is my blood covenant, which is poured out for many for forgiveness of sins." Jesus was actually killed so that human sins can be erased. And its a " Covenant."
And I want to examine the serious ramifications of such a wonderful covenant.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
A covenant is basically a contract; an agreement between God and man. God actually agreed that his son be killed in order to pay for humanitys sins. I look at all the sarcasm that some Atheist spew out, all the horrible insults they spit at God, well Jesus has them covered. I look at all the hate there exist for God, and how so many people have enbraced evil as their way of being; well Jesus contract has them covered.
Its a whole lot of love and forgiveness going on between Jesus and God for humanity.
Its a whole lot of love and forgiveness going on between Jesus and God for humanity.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In 1Tim. 2:6 Jesus gave himself a Ransom for All. This again is the death covenant which garentees humanity life. But it is all inclusive, leaving no one out. Religion seeks to limit that and exclude many people for as many reasons they can find. And that is " A war." Many believers are fighting for the condemnation of unbelievers , and few are fighting for the salvation of all peoples, reguardless of sin. So what does the covenant have to do with this apparent contridiction?
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freethinkingthuthseeker
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:22 pm
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1367960 wrote: A covenant is basically a contract; an agreement between God and man. God actually agreed that his son be killed in order to pay for humanitys sins. I look at all the sarcasm that some Atheist spew out, all the horrible insults they spit at God, well Jesus has them covered. I look at all the hate there exist for God, and how so many people have enbraced evil as their way of being; well Jesus contract has them covered.
Its a whole lot of love and forgiveness going on between Jesus and God for humanity.
Jesus and God are one but I am so happy to see you are beginning to see Jesus as our Saviour, how I prayed for you to know God, now all you have to do is pray the repentance prayer with all your heart and seek a true believer to discus the Bible with.
I strongly recommend any Charismatic Christian Church.
God bless you and praise is all for God
Its a whole lot of love and forgiveness going on between Jesus and God for humanity.
Jesus and God are one but I am so happy to see you are beginning to see Jesus as our Saviour, how I prayed for you to know God, now all you have to do is pray the repentance prayer with all your heart and seek a true believer to discus the Bible with.
I strongly recommend any Charismatic Christian Church.
God bless you and praise is all for God
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
freethinkingthuthseeker;1368191 wrote: Jesus and God are one but I am so happy to see you are beginning to see Jesus as our Saviour, how I prayed for you to know God, now all you have to do is pray the repentance prayer with all your heart and seek a true believer to discus the Bible with.
I strongly recommend any Charismatic Christian Church.
God bless you and praise is all for God
All I have to do, is understand each year what Christ has already done for humanity. I need no believer to discuss anything with, and I need no church. I walk alone in my belief, and I have yet to know God. But I would like to one day know him. Reguardless of these facts, I honor your concern and thank you for that.
I strongly recommend any Charismatic Christian Church.
God bless you and praise is all for God
All I have to do, is understand each year what Christ has already done for humanity. I need no believer to discuss anything with, and I need no church. I walk alone in my belief, and I have yet to know God. But I would like to one day know him. Reguardless of these facts, I honor your concern and thank you for that.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Jesus covenant with God is for the forgiveness of humanitys sin. Well, which sins? Past sins? Does it mean present sins? What about future sins? Only the believers sins? In 1John 2:2 " And Jesus himself is the Propitiation for our sins( our- meaning believers) and not just ours only, but also for those of the " Whole World." A stunning covenant of grace, Christ died for every single human born.
THATS what true amazing grace really is!
He died for ALL sin!
THATS what true amazing grace really is!
He died for ALL sin!
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In John 1:29;" Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world." Jesus made a covenant with God to take away the condemning sins of humanity. And nobody can bring those sins back in an effort to condemn anyone!
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In Hebrews 2:9;" But we see him who has been made a little lower than angels, namely Jesus, because of the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that by the grace of God he might " Taste death for Everyone!" Here again the covenant, again Jesus doing something for " Everyone", again the bible repeats over and over again, the " All inclusiveness of the covenant." There is no seperation of saint and sinner, of believer and unbeliever." It is for everyone, and exclusively applys to everyone, no matter WHAT they believe. Its NOT about their choice and beliefs. This is a deliberate act done FOR ALL of humanity by God and Christ themselves, the covenant is between those two, to complettely save their human children.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In Isaiah 49:6, latter part of verse;" So that my Salvation may reach to the end of the earth." I think God and Christ have spread Salvation all over the earth, like we would spread mayonaise on a sandwich. Just complettely cover it. Engulfed this planet with it. So then why does not everyone believe? Because Salvation is not based on belief; Salvation is something God and Christ has already done for humanity; its not what humans do for themselves.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
God and Christ are welcoming humanity to live with them in eternity. One of the most ugly things I have EVER witnessed, is for ANY religion to preach and place limitations and conditions on that free welcome mat covenant.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In 1John 3:8, Jesus destroys the works of the devil. The devil was the only threat to Gods covenant of salvation for humanity, the only viable threat, well now if Jesus has destroyed that threat, what is there to break Gods covenant? The humans themselves? No, Jesus has already died for humanitys sin, so whatelse can break Gods concentration and promise?
Nothing, the salvation of humanity is academic. So why are religions running around " Trying to save people", when they already have a garenteed covenant of Grace with God? Why are certain believers in God, preaching about the condemnation of unbelievers?
And I want to examine that strange phenom.
Nothing, the salvation of humanity is academic. So why are religions running around " Trying to save people", when they already have a garenteed covenant of Grace with God? Why are certain believers in God, preaching about the condemnation of unbelievers?
And I want to examine that strange phenom.
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freethinkingthuthseeker
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:22 pm
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1368891 wrote: In Isaiah 49:6, latter part of verse;" So that my Salvation may reach to the end of the earth." I think God and Christ have spread Salvation all over the earth, like we would spread mayonaise on a sandwich. Just complettely cover it. Engulfed this planet with it. So then why does not everyone believe? Because Salvation is not based on belief; Salvation is something God and Christ has already done for humanity; its not what humans do for themselves.
Matthew 9:2
Some men brought to him a paralyzed man, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”
13;58
And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.
23:23
“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former."
Mark 2:5
When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”
Luke5:20
When Jesus saw their faith, he said, “Friend, your sins are forgiven.”
7;50
Jesus said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”
18:7
7 And will not God bring about justice for his chosen ones, who cry out to him day and night? Will he keep putting them off? 8 I tell you, he will see that they get justice, and quickly. However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?”
22:32
But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.”
Acts: 3;16
By faith in the name of Jesus, this man whom you see and know was made strong. It is Jesus’ name and the faith that comes through him that has completely healed him, as you can all see.
Romans 1:12
that is, that you and I may be mutually encouraged by each other’s faith.
3:26
he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.
4:13
It was not through the law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.
4:16
Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.
5;1-2
Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we boast in the hope of the glory of God.
2 Corinthians 5:7
For we live by faith, not by sight.
Galatians 2:16
know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
3:22
But Scripture has locked up everything under the control of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe.
3:24
So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith.
3:26
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith
Ephesians 2:7-9
7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
3:12
In him and through faith in him we may approach God with freedom and confidence.
1 Timothy 4:1
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
6:12
Fight the good fight of the faith. Take hold of the eternal life to which you were called when you made your good confession in the presence of many witnesses.
2 Timothy 3:8
Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so also these teachers oppose the truth. They are men of depraved minds, who, as far as the faith is concerned, are rejected.
5:5
For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope.
5:6
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.
Hebrews 6:1
Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God
10:23
let us draw near to God with a sincere heart and with the full assurance that faith brings, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water.
10:39
But we do not belong to those who shrink back and are destroyed, but to those who have faith and are saved.
11:16
And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.
Hebrews is all about faith
James 2:5
Listen, my dear brothers and sisters: Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him?
1 Peter 1:9
for you are receiving the end result of your faith, the salvation of your souls.
1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
Jude 1:3 - 11
3 Dear friends, although I was very eager to write to you about the salvation we share, I felt compelled to write and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to God’s holy people. 4 For certain individuals whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.
5 Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord[c] at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe. 6 And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their proper dwelling—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day. 7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.
8 In the very same way, on the strength of their dreams these ungodly people pollute their own bodies, reject authority and heap abuse on celestial beings. 9 But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not himself dare to condemn him for slander but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”[d] 10 Yet these people slander whatever they do not understand, and the very things they do understand by instinct—as irrational animals do—will destroy them.
11 Woe to them! They have taken the way of Cain; they have rushed for profit into Balaam’s error; they have been destroyed in Korah’s rebellion.
Revelation 2:10
Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you life as your victor’s crown.
17:14
They will wage war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will triumph over them because he is Lord of lords and King of kings—and with him will be his called, chosen and faithful followers.”
Do you really still think all will be saved? Don't forget God also created all the angels including those who became evil
But bear in mind that when you come to Christ you will indeed be liberated and free from slavery over fleshly desires
Matthew 9:2
Some men brought to him a paralyzed man, lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man, “Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.”
13;58
And he did not do many miracles there because of their lack of faith.
23:23
“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former."
Mark 2:5
When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”
Luke5:20
When Jesus saw their faith, he said, “Friend, your sins are forgiven.”
7;50
Jesus said to the woman, “Your faith has saved you; go in peace.”
18:7
7 And will not God bring about justice for his chosen ones, who cry out to him day and night? Will he keep putting them off? 8 I tell you, he will see that they get justice, and quickly. However, when the Son of Man comes, will he find faith on the earth?”
22:32
But I have prayed for you, Simon, that your faith may not fail. And when you have turned back, strengthen your brothers.”
Acts: 3;16
By faith in the name of Jesus, this man whom you see and know was made strong. It is Jesus’ name and the faith that comes through him that has completely healed him, as you can all see.
Romans 1:12
that is, that you and I may be mutually encouraged by each other’s faith.
3:26
he did it to demonstrate his righteousness at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus.
4:13
It was not through the law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.
4:16
Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.
5;1-2
Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we boast in the hope of the glory of God.
2 Corinthians 5:7
For we live by faith, not by sight.
Galatians 2:16
know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified.
3:22
But Scripture has locked up everything under the control of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe.
3:24
So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith.
3:26
So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith
Ephesians 2:7-9
7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast.
3:12
In him and through faith in him we may approach God with freedom and confidence.
1 Timothy 4:1
The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
6:12
Fight the good fight of the faith. Take hold of the eternal life to which you were called when you made your good confession in the presence of many witnesses.
2 Timothy 3:8
Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so also these teachers oppose the truth. They are men of depraved minds, who, as far as the faith is concerned, are rejected.
5:5
For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope.
5:6
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.
Hebrews 6:1
Therefore let us move beyond the elementary teachings about Christ and be taken forward to maturity, not laying again the foundation of repentance from acts that lead to death, and of faith in God
10:23
let us draw near to God with a sincere heart and with the full assurance that faith brings, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water.
10:39
But we do not belong to those who shrink back and are destroyed, but to those who have faith and are saved.
11:16
And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him.
Hebrews is all about faith
James 2:5
Listen, my dear brothers and sisters: Has not God chosen those who are poor in the eyes of the world to be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him?
1 Peter 1:9
for you are receiving the end result of your faith, the salvation of your souls.
1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness.
Jude 1:3 - 11
3 Dear friends, although I was very eager to write to you about the salvation we share, I felt compelled to write and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to God’s holy people. 4 For certain individuals whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are ungodly people, who pervert the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.
5 Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord[c] at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe. 6 And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their proper dwelling—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day. 7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.
8 In the very same way, on the strength of their dreams these ungodly people pollute their own bodies, reject authority and heap abuse on celestial beings. 9 But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not himself dare to condemn him for slander but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”[d] 10 Yet these people slander whatever they do not understand, and the very things they do understand by instinct—as irrational animals do—will destroy them.
11 Woe to them! They have taken the way of Cain; they have rushed for profit into Balaam’s error; they have been destroyed in Korah’s rebellion.
Revelation 2:10
Do not be afraid of what you are about to suffer. I tell you, the devil will put some of you in prison to test you, and you will suffer persecution for ten days. Be faithful, even to the point of death, and I will give you life as your victor’s crown.
17:14
They will wage war against the Lamb, but the Lamb will triumph over them because he is Lord of lords and King of kings—and with him will be his called, chosen and faithful followers.”
Do you really still think all will be saved? Don't forget God also created all the angels including those who became evil
But bear in mind that when you come to Christ you will indeed be liberated and free from slavery over fleshly desires
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
So many religious people seem to think that it up to " Them" to save humanity, that " They" can convert others. Not understanding that Christ sealed Salvation, its a pre done deal.
And its the deal of the century.
And its the deal of the century.
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freethinkingthuthseeker
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:22 pm
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1369460 wrote: So many religious people seem to think that it up to " Them" to save humanity, that " They" can convert others. Not understanding that Christ sealed Salvation, its a pre done deal.
And its the deal of the century.
Indeed it is the deal of the millennium and way beyond everlasting but surely from the above Biblical references which after all are the words from God and again I reiterate I am not religious I have a two way personal relationship with God.
Jesus declared the end of religion when he kicked not only the money lenders out of the temple but also the sacrificial offerings as he was final offering of atonement. However you cannot ignore the fact that you do need to have faith or at least demonstrate what is wrong with the above quotes.
With the greatest respect, you often say you like to discuss things but then push them away dismissively without any in depth explanation just a reiteration of your position
Would you care to deconstruct the above quotes one by one?
Blessings
K
And its the deal of the century.
Indeed it is the deal of the millennium and way beyond everlasting but surely from the above Biblical references which after all are the words from God and again I reiterate I am not religious I have a two way personal relationship with God.
Jesus declared the end of religion when he kicked not only the money lenders out of the temple but also the sacrificial offerings as he was final offering of atonement. However you cannot ignore the fact that you do need to have faith or at least demonstrate what is wrong with the above quotes.
With the greatest respect, you often say you like to discuss things but then push them away dismissively without any in depth explanation just a reiteration of your position
Would you care to deconstruct the above quotes one by one?
Blessings
K
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
freethinkingthuthseeker;1369469 wrote: Indeed it is the deal of the millennium and way beyond everlasting but surely from the above Biblical references which after all are the words from God and again I reiterate I am not religious I have a two way personal relationship with God.
Jesus declared the end of religion when he kicked not only the money lenders out of the temple but also the sacrificial offerings as he was final offering of atonement. However you cannot ignore the fact that you do need to have faith or at least demonstrate what is wrong with the above quotes.
With the greatest respect, you often say you like to discuss things but then push them away dismissively without any in depth explanation just a reiteration of your position
Would you care to deconstruct the above quotes one by one?
Blessings
K
Well no, its too many of them. I hold no intrest in changing your interpitations of scripture. Faith is a static thing. In my view, when God calls and chooses a human, he gives it to them, thats WHY they then have it, but its not WHY he called and choose them. Faith is not a requirement for Salvation, only Jesus is the requirement, and Faith is a result of God working in a human, its not a self produced thing. I don't ignore faith, I ignore ANY reason a person creates to keep anyone out of Gods Kingdom.
Jesus declared the end of religion when he kicked not only the money lenders out of the temple but also the sacrificial offerings as he was final offering of atonement. However you cannot ignore the fact that you do need to have faith or at least demonstrate what is wrong with the above quotes.
With the greatest respect, you often say you like to discuss things but then push them away dismissively without any in depth explanation just a reiteration of your position
Would you care to deconstruct the above quotes one by one?
Blessings
K
Well no, its too many of them. I hold no intrest in changing your interpitations of scripture. Faith is a static thing. In my view, when God calls and chooses a human, he gives it to them, thats WHY they then have it, but its not WHY he called and choose them. Faith is not a requirement for Salvation, only Jesus is the requirement, and Faith is a result of God working in a human, its not a self produced thing. I don't ignore faith, I ignore ANY reason a person creates to keep anyone out of Gods Kingdom.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
freethinkingthuthseeker;1369469 wrote: Indeed it is the deal of the millennium and way beyond everlasting but surely from the above Biblical references which after all are the words from God and again I reiterate I am not religious I have a two way personal relationship with God.
Jesus declared the end of religion when he kicked not only the money lenders out of the temple but also the sacrificial offerings as he was final offering of atonement. However you cannot ignore the fact that you do need to have faith or at least demonstrate what is wrong with the above quotes.
With the greatest respect, you often say you like to discuss things but then push them away dismissively without any in depth explanation just a reiteration of your position
Would you care to deconstruct the above quotes one by one?
Blessings
K
I hold no interest in the exaltation of those groups that have faith, I am interested in those who do not have faith, like myself. I have discovered that we faithless people have a place in Gods heart too. That we, like the Faithful, have a prodical son father who plans on welcomming us home.
Jesus declared the end of religion when he kicked not only the money lenders out of the temple but also the sacrificial offerings as he was final offering of atonement. However you cannot ignore the fact that you do need to have faith or at least demonstrate what is wrong with the above quotes.
With the greatest respect, you often say you like to discuss things but then push them away dismissively without any in depth explanation just a reiteration of your position
Would you care to deconstruct the above quotes one by one?
Blessings
K
I hold no interest in the exaltation of those groups that have faith, I am interested in those who do not have faith, like myself. I have discovered that we faithless people have a place in Gods heart too. That we, like the Faithful, have a prodical son father who plans on welcomming us home.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In Titus 2:11;" For the grace of God has appeared, bringing Salvation to All men." Again the inclusion, again the Holy Impression that unbelievers and sinners are to benefit from Gods grace , just like believers will. And THATS why I like God; THATS what I like , no- Love about the biblical message.
-
freethinkingthuthseeker
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:22 pm
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1369497 wrote: I hold no interest in the exaltation of those groups that have faith, I am interested in those who do not have faith, like myself. I have discovered that we faithless people have a place in Gods heart too. That we, like the Faithful, have a prodical son father who plans on welcomming us home.
Dear Mickiel
I do not exult people who have Faith either but you continually state you wish to explore the Bible but whenever I invite you 9 and I am very willing to listen as well as offer my opinion of what we each believe, you seem to back off?
You also appear to believe in God who is the only one to be exulted in any case, but dismissing my many quotes as "too many to discuss" when you wish to explore with a fellow Biblical student confuses me. Are you only here to make your own opinions as declarations? Or do you really wish to get deep?
Lets start with what is your understanding of what Faith actually means to you?
I hope we can go forward together
Bless you
k
Dear Mickiel
I do not exult people who have Faith either but you continually state you wish to explore the Bible but whenever I invite you 9 and I am very willing to listen as well as offer my opinion of what we each believe, you seem to back off?
You also appear to believe in God who is the only one to be exulted in any case, but dismissing my many quotes as "too many to discuss" when you wish to explore with a fellow Biblical student confuses me. Are you only here to make your own opinions as declarations? Or do you really wish to get deep?
Lets start with what is your understanding of what Faith actually means to you?
I hope we can go forward together
Bless you
k
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
freethinkingthuthseeker;1369612 wrote: Dear Mickiel
I do not exult people who have Faith either but you continually state you wish to explore the Bible but whenever I invite you 9 and I am very willing to listen as well as offer my opinion of what we each believe, you seem to back off?
You also appear to believe in God who is the only one to be exulted in any case, but dismissing my many quotes as "too many to discuss" when you wish to explore with a fellow Biblical student confuses me. Are you only here to make your own opinions as declarations? Or do you really wish to get deep?
Lets start with what is your understanding of what Faith actually means to you?
I hope we can go forward together
Bless you
k
I have already deabated you in the past, and discussed scripture. I learned then that we simply hold different understandings; and I accept that, you just don't for some reason. I already know how you think. I am sure there are plenty of people on this website that are egar to engage you, I am not. I've been around your mountian already. I know how you are. It would be to your advantage to debate those who are interested in you. I simply hold no intrest in your views of scripture. I have debated people here for years, but I refuse to get into redundant conversations that end with a brick wall seperating two people who already know how the other thinks.
But I honor the respectful way you are carrying yourself. Peace.
I do not exult people who have Faith either but you continually state you wish to explore the Bible but whenever I invite you 9 and I am very willing to listen as well as offer my opinion of what we each believe, you seem to back off?
You also appear to believe in God who is the only one to be exulted in any case, but dismissing my many quotes as "too many to discuss" when you wish to explore with a fellow Biblical student confuses me. Are you only here to make your own opinions as declarations? Or do you really wish to get deep?
Lets start with what is your understanding of what Faith actually means to you?
I hope we can go forward together
Bless you
k
I have already deabated you in the past, and discussed scripture. I learned then that we simply hold different understandings; and I accept that, you just don't for some reason. I already know how you think. I am sure there are plenty of people on this website that are egar to engage you, I am not. I've been around your mountian already. I know how you are. It would be to your advantage to debate those who are interested in you. I simply hold no intrest in your views of scripture. I have debated people here for years, but I refuse to get into redundant conversations that end with a brick wall seperating two people who already know how the other thinks.
But I honor the respectful way you are carrying yourself. Peace.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Let me say this; In debate, one should be willing to engage anyone. But now " After you have engaged them, and are finished, " what is there left when you both have gone around and around in the exchange? Now conversation is different, there is no intrest in convincing anyone, your just talking to them. But when the person enters the conversation with intent of destroying your views, why should you want to converse with them?
The art of conversation is being lost in selfish intent. Its being corrupted by sarcasm and insulting induendo. " I want you to think like me, or theres going to be trouble." An conflicting religious conversation is no different. Rare are the two who can simply engage and exchange without underlying intent.
The art of conversation is being lost in selfish intent. Its being corrupted by sarcasm and insulting induendo. " I want you to think like me, or theres going to be trouble." An conflicting religious conversation is no different. Rare are the two who can simply engage and exchange without underlying intent.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Why do some churches have an evangelistic program? Do they think they can save people? Do they think they have the personal power to convert others? Can one human give another human Gods spirit? Can one human open up another humans mind to spiritual things? Well a lot of church groups seem to think the answer to all those questions is yes. They think God has left the salvation of humanity in the hands of humans. There are religions like " The Jehovahs Witnesses", who seem to think themselves Gods annointed, and they can evangelize people into real conversion.
Still there are other church doctrines which teach that now is the only day of salvation; if you don't " Get Saved Now", then your lost! They seem to feel that " The door to the church is open", come to Jesus as you are. But is that biblical? Does the bible teach that a human can just walk up to God on their own, anytime their ready, and be converted?
I want to go into these phenominal questions and examine the biblical truth of them.
Still there are other church doctrines which teach that now is the only day of salvation; if you don't " Get Saved Now", then your lost! They seem to feel that " The door to the church is open", come to Jesus as you are. But is that biblical? Does the bible teach that a human can just walk up to God on their own, anytime their ready, and be converted?
I want to go into these phenominal questions and examine the biblical truth of them.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In John 6:44 is a solid biblical principle that all evangelical churchs ignore;" No one can come to me, unless the Father who sent me, " Draws him." Now Jesus himself stated this, it means that God himself decides who and when is to be converted; there is no other way. Jesus said " No one can come", certain churchs say " Come to Jesus just as you are"- whenever you get ready. When Christ said no one can come unless God draws them, he was explaining the true correct order of conversion. It is God who begins the process, not human will.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1369776 wrote: In John 6:44 is a solid biblical principle that all evangelical churchs ignore;" No one can come to me, unless the Father who sent me, " Draws him." Now Jesus himself stated this, it means that God himself decides who and when is to be converted; there is no other way. Jesus said " No one can come", certain churchs say " Come to Jesus just as you are"- whenever you get ready. When Christ said no one can come unless God draws them, he was explaining the true correct order of conversion. It is God who begins the process, not human will.
It is simply a part of human pride, for someone to think to themselves that God needs them to save others. And its part of traditional learning passed down through churchs. Jeremiah 16:19, latter part of verse;" Our Fathers have inherited lies, nothing but falsehoods and things of no profit." Its tradition in many churchs, to evangelize other people into their church. Its fine to do that, IF within your mindset, you understand that only God can convert or draw a human to him. If you don't understand that, you will think its you who did it, which will open you up to further deception, AND the person you thought that you converted and lead to Christ.
It is simply a part of human pride, for someone to think to themselves that God needs them to save others. And its part of traditional learning passed down through churchs. Jeremiah 16:19, latter part of verse;" Our Fathers have inherited lies, nothing but falsehoods and things of no profit." Its tradition in many churchs, to evangelize other people into their church. Its fine to do that, IF within your mindset, you understand that only God can convert or draw a human to him. If you don't understand that, you will think its you who did it, which will open you up to further deception, AND the person you thought that you converted and lead to Christ.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In Galations 3:25;" Now that Faith " Has Come'- we are no longer under a Tutor.'
Two things here; Faith has " Come", it is given to a believer, they cannot work it up on their own. Secondly, true believers do not need to be ' Decipled by others", they are nurished by God himself.
Two things here; Faith has " Come", it is given to a believer, they cannot work it up on their own. Secondly, true believers do not need to be ' Decipled by others", they are nurished by God himself.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1370159 wrote: In Galations 3:25;" Now that Faith " Has Come'- we are no longer under a Tutor.'
Two things here; Faith has " Come", it is given to a believer, they cannot work it up on their own. Secondly, true believers do not need to be ' Decipled by others", they are nurished by God himself.
This verse here places a different light on the intense evangelical efforts by others to " Save this world themselves.," As if God himself is depending on humans to convert humans. If salvation was dependant on humans ability to evangelize this world, then this world is simply doomed!
In Gal. 2:6 God shows no partiality. What many fail to see, is that Salvation shows none either!
Two things here; Faith has " Come", it is given to a believer, they cannot work it up on their own. Secondly, true believers do not need to be ' Decipled by others", they are nurished by God himself.
This verse here places a different light on the intense evangelical efforts by others to " Save this world themselves.," As if God himself is depending on humans to convert humans. If salvation was dependant on humans ability to evangelize this world, then this world is simply doomed!
In Gal. 2:6 God shows no partiality. What many fail to see, is that Salvation shows none either!
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freethinkingthuthseeker
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:22 pm
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1369621 wrote: I have already deabated you in the past, and discussed scripture. I learned then that we simply hold different understandings; and I accept that, you just don't for some reason. I already know how you think. I am sure there are plenty of people on this website that are egar to engage you, I am not. I've been around your mountian already. I know how you are. It would be to your advantage to debate those who are interested in you. I simply hold no intrest in your views of scripture. I have debated people here for years, but I refuse to get into redundant conversations that end with a brick wall seperating two people who already know how the other thinks.
But I honor the respectful way you are carrying yourself. Peace.
Dear Mikiel,
firstly thank you for your kind words for me God bless you.
Please be assured that God is transforming me daily and my perspective and understanding changes on the word of God deeper and deeper, thanks be to God.
I am also now married to a deep PhD level Believer who has studied the word at the highest level yet still have some debates with her in peace and love. This is how I wish to be with you too my Brother.
But with the deepest respect, you never seem to give me any answers to any of the questions I have posed over the last two years on and off.
I do not have underlying intent, I respect you are a free individual as God made us all uniquely, The Bible is so rich there is so much to explore and discussing makes it richer for us all. That is why I ask questions.
It is truly not to catch you out or demonstrate any pride in me but to gain a richer understanding of the word of our Lord.
I welcome communication and not one way dead end discussions in all sincerity
God bless you
K
But I honor the respectful way you are carrying yourself. Peace.
Dear Mikiel,
firstly thank you for your kind words for me God bless you.
Please be assured that God is transforming me daily and my perspective and understanding changes on the word of God deeper and deeper, thanks be to God.
I am also now married to a deep PhD level Believer who has studied the word at the highest level yet still have some debates with her in peace and love. This is how I wish to be with you too my Brother.
But with the deepest respect, you never seem to give me any answers to any of the questions I have posed over the last two years on and off.
I do not have underlying intent, I respect you are a free individual as God made us all uniquely, The Bible is so rich there is so much to explore and discussing makes it richer for us all. That is why I ask questions.
It is truly not to catch you out or demonstrate any pride in me but to gain a richer understanding of the word of our Lord.
I welcome communication and not one way dead end discussions in all sincerity
God bless you
K
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
freethinkingthuthseeker;1370607 wrote: Dear Mikiel,
firstly thank you for your kind words for me God bless you.
Please be assured that God is transforming me daily and my perspective and understanding changes on the word of God deeper and deeper, thanks be to God.
I am also now married to a deep PhD level Believer who has studied the word at the highest level yet still have some debates with her in peace and love. This is how I wish to be with you too my Brother.
But with the deepest respect, you never seem to give me any answers to any of the questions I have posed over the last two years on and off.
I do not have underlying intent, I respect you are a free individual as God made us all uniquely, The Bible is so rich there is so much to explore and discussing makes it richer for us all. That is why I ask questions.
It is truly not to catch you out or demonstrate any pride in me but to gain a richer understanding of the word of our Lord.
I welcome communication and not one way dead end discussions in all sincerity
God bless you
K
Alright then, what would you like to discuss?
firstly thank you for your kind words for me God bless you.
Please be assured that God is transforming me daily and my perspective and understanding changes on the word of God deeper and deeper, thanks be to God.
I am also now married to a deep PhD level Believer who has studied the word at the highest level yet still have some debates with her in peace and love. This is how I wish to be with you too my Brother.
But with the deepest respect, you never seem to give me any answers to any of the questions I have posed over the last two years on and off.
I do not have underlying intent, I respect you are a free individual as God made us all uniquely, The Bible is so rich there is so much to explore and discussing makes it richer for us all. That is why I ask questions.
It is truly not to catch you out or demonstrate any pride in me but to gain a richer understanding of the word of our Lord.
I welcome communication and not one way dead end discussions in all sincerity
God bless you
K
Alright then, what would you like to discuss?
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freethinkingthuthseeker
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:22 pm
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Thank you so much Mikiel
firstly I would like to know how you understand the word Faith?
Is that ok?
firstly I would like to know how you understand the word Faith?
Is that ok?
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
freethinkingthuthseeker;1370663 wrote: Thank you so much Mikiel
firstly I would like to know how you understand the word Faith?
Is that ok?
Faith to me is the substance of things hoped for, and can be a personal evidence of God. To some, its confidence in God, belief that he will intervene for you. A high level of assurance, I believe it is obtained as a gift from God; it must be given to the human, I do not believe it can be self created or obtained by individual belief or desire somehow " Worked up within the individual by their self effort."
firstly I would like to know how you understand the word Faith?
Is that ok?
Faith to me is the substance of things hoped for, and can be a personal evidence of God. To some, its confidence in God, belief that he will intervene for you. A high level of assurance, I believe it is obtained as a gift from God; it must be given to the human, I do not believe it can be self created or obtained by individual belief or desire somehow " Worked up within the individual by their self effort."
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
The bible has shifted many gears in my mind. One thing which certainly puzzles me, is that the bible is the worlds most shoplifted book. Why are people stealing the truth? Why are they stealing a book that ask people not to steal?
And I want to go into that crazed phenom.
And I want to go into that crazed phenom.
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freethinkingthuthseeker
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:22 pm
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Thank you Mikiel again.
It is a very good definition of the well understood meaning of faith. You obviously have a good intellect. Do you thank our King for that gift?
Just to share with you my latest Revelation on what is faith for me but I also say your follow on post which I enjoyed mirthfully indeed!
My understanding is that having faith is not only knowing our Creator exists, but also understanding what pleases our Lord and following his beautiful guidance for what is best for our lives to Glorify our God.
I absolutely agree that this cannot be generated by any human alone, equally I ascribe the same idea to any creative act that man takes credit from from music to geology or astrophysics to philosophy.. All the Glory and kudos goes to God. Indeed all skills which each individual is given are Gifts from our Lord.
Thank you so much for answering my question on faith. I am also interested in what you think of my understanding of FAITH. IF THAT IS OK FOR YOU?
Also can I add, what is your understanding of the Holy Spirit?
and if it is not too much for you additionally have you seen references to the beautiful Holy spirit in the OT In your highly creditable reading of the Holy Word.
God bless you Mikiel and thank you so much for continuing to correspond with me.
Equally you are most welcome to ask me any questions you wish to.
I promise you I will always answer to the best of my honest ability
Praise to God
It is a very good definition of the well understood meaning of faith. You obviously have a good intellect. Do you thank our King for that gift?
Just to share with you my latest Revelation on what is faith for me but I also say your follow on post which I enjoyed mirthfully indeed!
My understanding is that having faith is not only knowing our Creator exists, but also understanding what pleases our Lord and following his beautiful guidance for what is best for our lives to Glorify our God.
I absolutely agree that this cannot be generated by any human alone, equally I ascribe the same idea to any creative act that man takes credit from from music to geology or astrophysics to philosophy.. All the Glory and kudos goes to God. Indeed all skills which each individual is given are Gifts from our Lord.
Thank you so much for answering my question on faith. I am also interested in what you think of my understanding of FAITH. IF THAT IS OK FOR YOU?
Also can I add, what is your understanding of the Holy Spirit?
and if it is not too much for you additionally have you seen references to the beautiful Holy spirit in the OT In your highly creditable reading of the Holy Word.
God bless you Mikiel and thank you so much for continuing to correspond with me.
Equally you are most welcome to ask me any questions you wish to.
I promise you I will always answer to the best of my honest ability
Praise to God
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
freethinkingthuthseeker;1370894 wrote: Thank you Mikiel again.
It is a very good definition of the well understood meaning of faith. You obviously have a good intellect. Do you thank our King for that gift?
Just to share with you my latest Revelation on what is faith for me but I also say your follow on post which I enjoyed mirthfully indeed!
My understanding is that having faith is not only knowing our Creator exists, but also understanding what pleases our Lord and following his beautiful guidance for what is best for our lives to Glorify our God.
I absolutely agree that this cannot be generated by any human alone, equally I ascribe the same idea to any creative act that man takes credit from from music to geology or astrophysics to philosophy.. All the Glory and kudos goes to God. Indeed all skills which each individual is given are Gifts from our Lord.
Thank you so much for answering my question on faith. I am also interested in what you think of my understanding of FAITH. IF THAT IS OK FOR YOU?
Also can I add, what is your understanding of the Holy Spirit?
and if it is not too much for you additionally have you seen references to the beautiful Holy spirit in the OT In your highly creditable reading of the Holy Word.
God bless you Mikiel and thank you so much for continuing to correspond with me.
Equally you are most welcome to ask me any questions you wish to.
I promise you I will always answer to the best of my honest ability
Praise to God
Well faith certainly is pleasing God, without it we simply couldnot please him. So I agree with that, as long as the person understands that their faith comes from God, and is empowered by God. As far as the Holy Spirit, I think there are ample references to it in the OT, but only a select few people had it, like King David and Job. The whole nation of Isreal certainly didnot have it, nor did any group of people, that I have seen. I believe the Holy Spirit is one of 7 Spirits that God has. Its the one he uses to impart his very nature into others. His nature is listed in Gal. 5:22-23. When a person has his Spirit, those charactheristics will flow out of them continually. It will impart understanding of his word, his ways, and his wisdom. It fine tunes the person " Into God." It begins the change of Life. The change which will eventually lead into eternal life.
It is a very good definition of the well understood meaning of faith. You obviously have a good intellect. Do you thank our King for that gift?
Just to share with you my latest Revelation on what is faith for me but I also say your follow on post which I enjoyed mirthfully indeed!
My understanding is that having faith is not only knowing our Creator exists, but also understanding what pleases our Lord and following his beautiful guidance for what is best for our lives to Glorify our God.
I absolutely agree that this cannot be generated by any human alone, equally I ascribe the same idea to any creative act that man takes credit from from music to geology or astrophysics to philosophy.. All the Glory and kudos goes to God. Indeed all skills which each individual is given are Gifts from our Lord.
Thank you so much for answering my question on faith. I am also interested in what you think of my understanding of FAITH. IF THAT IS OK FOR YOU?
Also can I add, what is your understanding of the Holy Spirit?
and if it is not too much for you additionally have you seen references to the beautiful Holy spirit in the OT In your highly creditable reading of the Holy Word.
God bless you Mikiel and thank you so much for continuing to correspond with me.
Equally you are most welcome to ask me any questions you wish to.
I promise you I will always answer to the best of my honest ability
Praise to God
Well faith certainly is pleasing God, without it we simply couldnot please him. So I agree with that, as long as the person understands that their faith comes from God, and is empowered by God. As far as the Holy Spirit, I think there are ample references to it in the OT, but only a select few people had it, like King David and Job. The whole nation of Isreal certainly didnot have it, nor did any group of people, that I have seen. I believe the Holy Spirit is one of 7 Spirits that God has. Its the one he uses to impart his very nature into others. His nature is listed in Gal. 5:22-23. When a person has his Spirit, those charactheristics will flow out of them continually. It will impart understanding of his word, his ways, and his wisdom. It fine tunes the person " Into God." It begins the change of Life. The change which will eventually lead into eternal life.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
A human can live without food about a month, without water about a week; and we can live without faith or belief in God. And many in history have had to live without God. Many are living without him now. Many believers in God don't understand that God gave humans life, in order for them to live their lives as a predestined roll call. Once a human is born, they were then inducted into a future eternity with God; BECAUSE of Gods agreement with Christ to live and die for us all. The burden of Salvation was on Christ, NOT individual humans. And Christ is the garentee of Salvation for the faithless unbelievers.
THATS the burden he took on him to Calvery; Golgotha- the place of the skull where he was crucified. That spot, is the greatest spot on earth.
THATS the burden he took on him to Calvery; Golgotha- the place of the skull where he was crucified. That spot, is the greatest spot on earth.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In John 12:32 Jesus claimed that if he were crucified that he would draw ' ALL humans to him." There has NEVER been a time since Christ was crucified, that ALL humans were drawn to him. This then is an obvious " Future Prophecy", which has yet to occur! Oh its going to occur, I have no doubts about it, its also absolute proof that right now is not the only day of salvation, there will be another " Great Day", and in that Great Day, all of humanity will be drawn to Christ. Thats when the collective Consciousness of humanity will be " Opened to God."
And I want to talk about that Great Day.
And I want to talk about that Great Day.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Have you ever heard about " The Last Great Day" in the bible? Look it up and read it, then lets discuss it.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In Revelations 20:11 " And I saw a Great white Throne and him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them." In verses 12-15 God begins his final judgement on humanity, the last great day. And I want to take a real close look at these future events.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1371287 wrote: In Revelations 20:11 " And I saw a Great white Throne and him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them." In verses 12-15 God begins his final judgement on humanity, the last great day. And I want to take a real close look at these future events.
Many believers think God is here on earth, again this verse proves that to be in error. The earth is too sinful to be in Gods pressence, it would repel from him. Thats one reason it will be purified by him with HIS Fire before he establishes his Kingdom here. And that is very significant to remember and understand about God and HIS purifying fire. It destroys corruption and rebuilds in Righteousness the thing destroyed. Keep that in mind as we consider Gods Judgement.
Many believers think God is here on earth, again this verse proves that to be in error. The earth is too sinful to be in Gods pressence, it would repel from him. Thats one reason it will be purified by him with HIS Fire before he establishes his Kingdom here. And that is very significant to remember and understand about God and HIS purifying fire. It destroys corruption and rebuilds in Righteousness the thing destroyed. Keep that in mind as we consider Gods Judgement.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Lets set this judgemt of God up by understanding ( as best we can, because the book of Revelations is a trip!) what has occured " Before" this Great white Throne Judgement. Rev. 20 1-10. Basically satan is " Put in some kind of jail" for a short time and then released. The first ressurection has taken place, the previously called and chosen group of humans, the firstfruits, are now with God. The devil and the false prophet are disposed of. Now God must deal with the vast majority of dead humanity, and those few left still living. And this is where many religions literally mercilesly condemn billions of humans to some horrible eternity of endless torture. But does Gods judgement do that? Religious interpitation does not determine humanitys future; God does.
So lets look into his Judgement.
So lets look into his Judgement.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Revelations 20:12;" And I saw the dead, the great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is the book of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds." Here we can admit to the obvious; God himself is on his throne and about to judge all of humanity; and his judgement is BASED on these " Books." Only one of these books is defined, the " Book of life." Many scholars believe one of these books to be the bible, which I agree with. Which one, we simply do not know. I don't think the bible is " The book of Life", because we will see later that this book has " Names written in it, vs. 15." Yet one could symbolically call the bible a book of life, and that be correct, in a sense. So this can be confusing; I have said the book of Revelations is " A Trip", it can be a strange trip too. Here is where things can be lost in assumption or speculation, so we have to stick to the only one of these possible books that we know of; the bible.
If Gods judgement is based on these books, then we can know this; 1Timothy 2:3-4;" This is Good and ACCEPTABLE in the sight of God our Savior, who DESIRES all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the Truth!" God has already accepted in his great mind that he wants all of humanity to be saved, he DESIRES it! So this is Gods personal desire, as he begins his judgement of all of humanity. Now Job 23:14 needs to be taken into account;" But God is unique and " Who can TURN " him? What his soul DESIRES, that he DOES!" It is clear then that God desires all of humanity to be saved, and according to Job, he gets what he desires, and nothing can turn him away from it. This then seems to garentee humanity is not going to be condemned in Gods judgement; so , according to the bible, if I were a lawyer, I could see a " Chance of getting humanity off of the penalty of sin." By using Gods own word to testify for humanity.
There is then a chance, IF, we have a good lawyer.
And we do! His name is Jesus Christ, the living word of God.
Remember this as we continue with Gods judgement. Also remember this; When the " Dead" are judged by a " Book of Life"- is that a contridiction?
If Gods judgement is based on these books, then we can know this; 1Timothy 2:3-4;" This is Good and ACCEPTABLE in the sight of God our Savior, who DESIRES all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the Truth!" God has already accepted in his great mind that he wants all of humanity to be saved, he DESIRES it! So this is Gods personal desire, as he begins his judgement of all of humanity. Now Job 23:14 needs to be taken into account;" But God is unique and " Who can TURN " him? What his soul DESIRES, that he DOES!" It is clear then that God desires all of humanity to be saved, and according to Job, he gets what he desires, and nothing can turn him away from it. This then seems to garentee humanity is not going to be condemned in Gods judgement; so , according to the bible, if I were a lawyer, I could see a " Chance of getting humanity off of the penalty of sin." By using Gods own word to testify for humanity.
There is then a chance, IF, we have a good lawyer.
And we do! His name is Jesus Christ, the living word of God.
Remember this as we continue with Gods judgement. Also remember this; When the " Dead" are judged by a " Book of Life"- is that a contridiction?
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Rev. 20:13;" And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and hades gave up the dead which were in them, and they were judged, everyone of them, according to their deeds." Here we see all of humanity being ressurected and judged " According to their deeds." Previously we saw they were also judged according to the things which were written in the BookS. So the judgement is based on the books, and our deeds. Not what does " Our Deeds mean?"
And I want to go into that.
And I want to go into that.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Well deeds means basically what we do. What we have done. What we have achieved. Now we are to be judged based on the " Books of God", and on what we have done. And oh how this can be misinterpited. I think its obvious that I believe all of humanity has been prejudged to be safe with God in eternity, ( which I will go into scripture on later) so I believe there will be some kind of way that God will " Reward humans" for how they lived. And some actually punished for how they have lived. But the punishment of God is " Sterile", I think it destroys the sin that has germinated within humanity and does not destroy the human.
So lets look at other scriptures which show that.
Remember Christ is our lawyer, so if we are to have Salvation free and not be judged to some kind of damnation; he has to have a way to excuse us from " All of our sins." He must do something to erase our quilt! Or we can be condemned.
So lets look at other scriptures which show that.
Remember Christ is our lawyer, so if we are to have Salvation free and not be judged to some kind of damnation; he has to have a way to excuse us from " All of our sins." He must do something to erase our quilt! Or we can be condemned.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In 1Corinth. 3:15;" If any mans work is burned up, he shall suffer loss; but he himself shall be saved; yet so as through fire." I think this verse is very interesting, and profound! The suggestion is that Gods fire can destroy that which needs to be destroyed in a human, but yet not destroy the human themselves. Even be actually saved by the fire. Which opens up all kinds of possibilities for " The purpose of Gods lake of Fire." Is it more to this lake than we know?
Rev. 20:14;" And death and hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire." Here God destroys death and the grave; the second death then is the death of the first death. So can God destroy death in a human, yet still the human can survive this dreaded experience?
And lets look into that.
Rev. 20:14;" And death and hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire." Here God destroys death and the grave; the second death then is the death of the first death. So can God destroy death in a human, yet still the human can survive this dreaded experience?
And lets look into that.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In Rev. 21:4;" And God shall wipe away every tear from their eyes, and there shall no longer be any Death." A most stimulating biblical promise; just imagine life with no death even ever possible. We have never known such a thing, it just seems incredible dosen't it?
God so often seems to be an incredible contridiction. A Super being of endless self producing life, who is using Death to accomplish his most misunderstood will. Its like using the very thing that hurts us, in order to make us well. Some medical practices use medicine in a simular manner. Infuse life with the very thing that stings it and hurts it, in order to heal it.
And Death certainly is the ultimate sting. Yet God, like a Master Potter, is certainly a Death Dealer;
But what is misunderstood about him is his Life dealing. A being who proposes to turn a mass planet of historical Death, into an incredible Kingdom of Neverending Life. The true neverending story.
Lets look further into Gods pathology of Life and Death.
God so often seems to be an incredible contridiction. A Super being of endless self producing life, who is using Death to accomplish his most misunderstood will. Its like using the very thing that hurts us, in order to make us well. Some medical practices use medicine in a simular manner. Infuse life with the very thing that stings it and hurts it, in order to heal it.
And Death certainly is the ultimate sting. Yet God, like a Master Potter, is certainly a Death Dealer;
But what is misunderstood about him is his Life dealing. A being who proposes to turn a mass planet of historical Death, into an incredible Kingdom of Neverending Life. The true neverending story.
Lets look further into Gods pathology of Life and Death.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In John 10:10 Jesus said that he came so that humanity could have life and have it abundantly. Why would he say that if he knew that God would condemn the vast majority of humanity to death or torture? No , one of the reasons Jesus came to earth was to give humanity a far better life. That is part of the pathology and plan of God; and it is a definte part of his mentality in his judgement of humanity.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
When we consider the book of Revelations, we should NEVER do so without considering every other book in the bible, to help us understand this most complexing " End of Story." And Gods Judgement is defintely " End of the Story of humanitys fleshly existence." To get into the mind of God, we simply have to get into his Word. To better understand his judgements. Remember this about God in Romans 5:19;" Where sin increased, Grace abounded all the more." This is an important hint at the Judgement of God.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
The more sin increases, the more God will show grace. Imagine every sinner who ever lived, now gathered together in one place to be judged by God; wouldnot that be the greatest event of sin increasing that has ever occured? Why is it that humans have been conditioned to think that Gods reaction to such a gathering, would be the greatest event of condemnation ever? Would he not then show the greatest event of Grace ever to be recorded?
And lets discuss that reality.
And lets discuss that reality.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
In 1John 4:14 is the " Real Reason" God sent Jesus to earth;" The Father has sent the Son to be the " Savior of the World." Of the World, not just those who believe in him, but the whole world of sinners and unbelievers. Jesus divine given mission from his Father was to Save a world. Now why would God send Jesus to be a World Savior, if this world as a whole will not be saved? Why would he send his Son on s specific purpose of worldwide salvation, when he plans on judging and condemning the vast majority of the world?
Well this must be considered when examing Gods mindset in his Judgement; is it a contridiction?
Well this must be considered when examing Gods mindset in his Judgement; is it a contridiction?
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Rev. 20:15;" And if anyones name was not found in the book of Life, he was thrown into the Lake of Fire." So the book of Life is a book that has a list of names in it. And now this Lake of Fire. So lets look at those two things.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1372788 wrote: Rev. 20:15;" And if anyones name was not found in the book of Life, he was thrown into the Lake of Fire." So the book of Life is a book that has a list of names in it. And now this Lake of Fire. So lets look at those two things.
Now in Rev. 20:15 the book of Life and a Lake of Fire comes into Gods judgement. But now remember that in verse 14 death has already been DISPOSED OF! Satan and the false prophet are already disposed of! And the bible NEVER mentions a book of death; so here we have a Lake of Fire and a Book of Life, with NO DEATH around!
And Gods Judgement.
So lets go into that with these things in mind.
Now in Rev. 20:15 the book of Life and a Lake of Fire comes into Gods judgement. But now remember that in verse 14 death has already been DISPOSED OF! Satan and the false prophet are already disposed of! And the bible NEVER mentions a book of death; so here we have a Lake of Fire and a Book of Life, with NO DEATH around!
And Gods Judgement.
So lets go into that with these things in mind.
The Bible shifted some Gears in my mind.
Mickiel;1372825 wrote: Now in Rev. 20:15 the book of Life and a Lake of Fire comes into Gods judgement. But now remember that in verse 14 death has already been DISPOSED OF! Satan and the false prophet are already disposed of! And the bible NEVER mentions a book of death; so here we have a Lake of Fire and a Book of Life, with NO DEATH around!
And Gods Judgement.
So lets go into that with these things in mind.
Now here we have a book of life, a Lake of Fire, no death and Gods Judgement. So its basically up to God here right? But the KEY here is that death is no longer an option; its been destroyed! I think its beginning to look better for humanitys future;
So lets examine this God a bit further, because its based on him.
Remember he sent his Son to be a " World Savior" in 1 John 4:14. Keep that in mind as we examine God more closely, in order to better understand his judgement.
And Gods Judgement.
So lets go into that with these things in mind.
Now here we have a book of life, a Lake of Fire, no death and Gods Judgement. So its basically up to God here right? But the KEY here is that death is no longer an option; its been destroyed! I think its beginning to look better for humanitys future;
So lets examine this God a bit further, because its based on him.
Remember he sent his Son to be a " World Savior" in 1 John 4:14. Keep that in mind as we examine God more closely, in order to better understand his judgement.