oscar's ban

koan · Post by **koan** » Mon Oct 08, 2012 8:57 pm

For those who may not be aware, it came to the moderators' attention on October 6 that oscar has been continuing to plagiarise despite numerous warnings in the past. It is my duty as a moderator to infract and edit all the posts spread about the forum that contain such violations. This has resulted in a ban.

I apologise to all whose copyright has been infringed. ForumGarden endeavours to catch these problems in a more timely manner. We encourage anyone who finds copyright infringement on our forum to notify us immediately so we can fix the problem.

I also apologise to all subscribing members who will have to scroll past the infractions on the 'today's posts' page until the matter has been dealt with.

Thank you.

eta: the infracted posts are now being merged into one thread for those of you who were affected.

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:33 am

Is it a permaban?

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:51 am

I've not made any changes to the infraction settings that exist, aside from customizing the first instance down to one point in credit for her admitting one of the two sources plagiarised afterwards.

That being the case, to the best of my knowledge the infractions will expire in 3 days from the time given.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 2:54 am

Additional note: my eyes are blurring so I won't be able to finish sorting back to the point where her final warning was given. I'm only in May 2012 right now. I will do my best to get through it as quickly as possible so the expiry date start points will stop refreshing.

FG-administator · Post by **FG-administator** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:32 am

SnoozeAgain;1407227 wrote: Is it a permaban?That's under consideration, I'd not rule it out as an available choice at the moment.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 4:50 am

Just to inform the thread, there are currently 16 instances of obvious plagiarism in the last six and a half months. The site has a duty to find and add the source links or delete all instances of copyright infringement. With the number of posts involved and that they may be quoted in other posts, it is preferable to add the links. It takes time. A lot of time.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:08 am

I've seen the e mail you have sent Oscar and it really begs the question why you went looking so hard Koan. Oscar is bad at not putting links in here and there, there's no denying that. It appears it started in the wildlife thread where she did add the link when asked. It seems you have gone from there. I may not post much but i do read a lot here and Oscar has not been the only one, yet you seem to have trawled through months of threads just to add points to the infractions. A simple warning would have sufficed as Pantoandy was repeatedly warned in the past. It also begs the question as to why you waited until Oscar's membership issue had been resolved. The wildlife issue was before she had the issue with membership. I've seen many a dubious post on this forum claiming to be the work of the poster.

Oh well, such is life.

Just in case you're wondering Koan, no this isn't Oscar.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:37 am

Peter Lake;1407259 wrote: I've seen the e mail you have sent Oscar and it really begs the question why you went looking so hard Koan. Oscar is bad at not putting links in here and there, there's no denying that. It appears it started in the wildlife thread where she did add the link when asked. It seems you have gone from there. I may not post much but i do read a lot here and Oscar has not been the only one, yet you seem to have trawled through months of threads just to add points to the infractions. A simple warning would have sufficed as Pantoandy was repeatedly warned in the past. It also begs the question as to why you waited until Oscar's membership issue had been resolved. The wildlife issue was before she had the issue with membership. I've seen many a dubious post on this forum claiming to be the work of the poster.

Oh well, such is life.

Just in case you're wondering Koan, no this isn't Oscar.

There's too much evidence to suggest this is a case of 'forgot' to post a link, the link that was picked up on the wildlife thread that oscar inserted after the query was raised did not contain the sentence the questioner had highlighted. Indeed the rest of the post that was not queried at the time, did turn out to come from that link. This isn't a case of the odd forgotten piece of text this is a case of constant copy and pasting to pad out her own words. Even to the point that when talking on Northern Ireland, a statement is made, (it was copied and pasted) and then to make it clear that she would know such things she inserts an add on, that her Dad is from Ireland on the end of the sentence. It can't even be called para-phrasing!

Sadly, many many many warnings have been issued to Oscar regarding declaring her sources. The warnings evidently have not worked.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:41 am

She plagiarised two sources in the October 6th part. The sentence that was in bold was the part being asked about and she gave a link to where the body of her post had come from but not the bold sentence. She has a long history of warnings going back to 2010 when she was temporarily banned for failure to comply and put on zero tolerance for plagiarism. Other members have not been warned to that extent. Of course people can forget to link or give their source, more often they just aren't aware of the formatting requirements. We want people to notify us when it happens so we can fix it. I certainly fix it and PM the member when it is brought to my attention. I write. I take plagiarism very seriously as do all the mods and admin on this site.

It is the history of oscars repeated plagiarism and seeing that she had stolen from two sources in one post, working them in so neatly as if they were her own thoughts that made me search recent posts. I found a few just from the last month which then warranted going further and it turned into an epidemic.

eta: cross posted with Betty sorry for the repeat info

Your wife quotes her sources more often than not. She knows exactly what is required to avoid taking credit for someone else's work. She chooses not to. No other member has been warned as often.

I was told after I started giving infractions that her supporting membership had been processed. It's irrelevant. Paying the site does not mean you can violate the TOS. If you have a problem and think you've been cheated I suggest you contact Bryn for your money back. I'm sure he won't have a problem reimbursing you as he has previously stated that he would do so if problems arose.

Snooz · Post by **Snooz** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:42 am

Great minds. I wondered about a refund for the membership she can't use now.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:43 am

koan;1407214 wrote: For those who may not be aware, it came to the moderators' attention on October 6 that oscar has been continuing to plagiarise despite numerous warnings in the past. It is my duty as a moderator to infract and edit all the posts spread about the forum that contain such violations. This has resulted in a ban.

I apologise to all whose copyright has been infringed. ForumGarden endeavours to catch these problems in a more timely manner. We encourage anyone who finds copyright infringement on our forum to notify us immediately so we can fix the problem.

I also apologise to all subscribing members who will have to scroll past the infractions on the 'today's posts' page until the matter has been dealt with.

Thank you.

eta: the infracted posts are now being merged into one thread for those of you who were affected.

As a matter of interest were admin/mods waiting for another member of FG to pick up on Oscar's plagiarising as an excuse to infract? I ask this because Oscar has been posting this way for months...why decide to act on October 6th, when I mentioned it?

Post by **Betty Boop** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:49 am

theia;1407265 wrote: As a matter of interest were admin/mods waiting for another member of FG to pick up on Oscar's plagiarising as an excuse to infract? I ask this because Oscar has been posting this way for months...why decide to act on October 6th, when I mentioned it?

The sad truth is that because there is always so much strife around Oscars posts none of us were reading them any more, silly us, it would seem. We've assumed that given the amount of warnings issued in the past, and given that Oscar does cite some sources that she'd been behaving. I think the use of capital I's comes into play here too, back along, copy and pasting placed within her text stuck out like a sore thumb there were no I's in odd places. Now it seems she's applying the I's to all the copy paste too.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:51 am

As a note on fair treatment, ask AnneBoleyn. I recently asked her to edit two posts where she had provided the link but used more than "fair use" allows.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 8:56 am

Betty Boop;1407266 wrote: The sad truth is that because there is always so much strife around Oscars posts none of us were reading them any more, silly us, it would seem. We've assumed that given the amount of warnings issued in the past, and given that Oscar does cite some sources that she'd been behaving. I think the use of capital I's comes into play here too, back along, copy and pasting placed within her text stuck out like a sore thumb there were no I's in odd places. Now it seems she's applying the I's to all the copy paste too.

That is so incredibly lame...you were all answering a lot of Oscar's posts. How could you reply to them if you weren't reading them?

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:01 am

Actually, you'll notice I had stopped posting in that thread before the post was put on.

You can't blame moderators for the plagiarism that oscar did.

If she hadn't done it systemically she wouldn't be banned. It's not our fault that she did it. It's not our fault that it has to be removed. It's not our fault that she can't be trusted to post with fair use. Neither should you feel responsible, theia. You asked a good question. It's not your fault that she stole the material.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:15 am

theia;1407268 wrote: That is so incredibly lame...you were all answering a lot of Oscar's posts. How could you reply to them if you weren't reading them?

I'm sorry that you think it lame.

I have also explained why the posts weren't screaming out copied copied copied either. I haven't been moderating 100% due to not really being on this planet for my own personal reasons. Other mods have not been following her around looking either, they too are fed up with it. That in itself is a huge sign of what damage she has done around here.

At the end of the day it's Oscar that did it, not us, forumgarden does not own special software that detects this stuff like universities do, it's up to each poster to ensure they are not stealing others words.

If you feel it were obvious, then considering the fact we've been running an open moderation policy for so long why did you not report your suspicions.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:29 am

A day was spent searching to see if it was happening often enough to do a full search. The results showed that it was. No action was taken until 10 posts had been identified.

These things take time, theia. She hid her plagiarism well. I don't see how you think the passage of two days was significant. BB posted. oscar's plagiarised post came after hers. You saw it. BB replied to it then reported that plagiarism had occured to the other mods querying how often it may have happened since it was hidden. An investigation began.

The timing only is delayed by the fact we are human and require sleep.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:29 am

Betty Boop;1407272 wrote: I'm sorry that you think it lame.

I have also explained why the posts weren't screaming out copied copied copied either. I haven't been moderating 100% due to not really being on this planet for my own personal reasons. Other mods have not been following her around looking either, they too are fed up with it. That in itself is a huge sign of what damage she has done around here.

At the end of the day it's Oscar that did it, not us, forumgarden does not own special software that detects this stuff like universities do, it's up to each poster to ensure they are not stealing others words.

If you feel it were obvious, then considering the fact we've been running an open moderation policy for so long why did you not report your suspicions.

I think we can all claim "personal reasons."

If you are 100% happy for me to answer your last question, please let me know and I'll answer it.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:37 am

This is a simple issue theia.

The timing and method of procedure is completely transparent.

Please don't try to make this a personal issue. It is not. It is clear violation of TOS by oscar who has been warned numerous times she was on zero tolerance for copyright. I wouldn't have even used the infraction if so many copyright violations hadn't occurred. When I found ten in the last three months of posts that's when action started. If I had not found so many nothing would have happened except another warning... even though she's already been given warning that no more warning will be given.

The only customized infraction given was to reduce the infraction from two points to one. I bent the system in her favour on the first one to recognize she'd named one source herself.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:40 am

I'd also note that one infraction was text that came from a previous link spot had posted and oscar had just forgotten to put quotes around the bit she used. This was pointed out and I immediately reversed the infraction.

If you think we are being unfair by all means watch all the infracted posts and let me know if I get one wrong. I have no desire to be unfair and my eyes start watering after an hour or two. I could use the double checking. I'd appreciate your help double checking if you really think I'm being unfair.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:41 am

koan;1407276 wrote: This is a simple issue theia.

The timing and method of procedure is completely transparent.

Please don't try to make this a personal issue. It is not. It is clear violation of TOS by oscar who has been warned numerous times she was on zero tolerance for copyright. I wouldn't have even used the infraction if so many copyright violations hadn't occurred. When I found ten in the last three months of posts that's when action started. If I had not found so many nothing would have happened except another warning... even though she's already been given warning that no more warning will be given.

The only customized infraction given was to reduce the infraction from two points to one. I bent the system in her favour on the first one to recognize she'd named one source herself.

Then what was your point in mentioning October 6th?

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:48 am

theia;1407278 wrote: Then what was your point in mentioning October 6th?

Seriously?

I was asked to explain why the investigation started.

FG-administator · Post by **FG-administator** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 9:53 am

Peter Lake;1407259 wrote: Oscar has not been the only one [...] A simple warning would have sufficed as Pantoandy was repeatedly warned in the past [...] I've seen many a dubious post on this forum claiming to be the work of the poster.I urge you to point some out, I would be very surprised if what you claim here is true and it would affect what's being discussed by the Moderator team. I'll be very upset if you've alleged it here and it's not the case.

Pantoandy isn't the only one to have been repeatedly warned over copyright infraction prior to being banned, oscar's account here has seven pages of warnings and infractions back through 2010 and 2009 and most of them relate to copyright issues and plagiarism. You make it sound trivial and infrequent, it's neither.

Just in case you're wondering Koan, no this isn't Oscar.That's quite apparent, I very much hope it stays that way. If oscar would like to answer the two questions I put to her relating to this, the Contact Us route is ideal. I'll repeat them here in case she has no access to any copy:1. Do you use a software setting to automatically capitalize the first letter of every word starting with "I" or is it something you type?

2. In either event, what reason do you have for doing it?

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:04 am

FG;1407280 wrote: I urge you to point some out, I would be very surprised if what you claim here is true and it would affect what's being discussed by the Moderator team. I'll be very upset if you've alleged it here and it's not the case.

Pantoandy isn't the only one to have been repeatedly warned over copyright infraction prior to being banned, oscar's account here has seven pages of warnings and infractions back through 2010 and 2009 and most of them relate to copyright issues and plagiarism. You make it sound trivial and infrequent, it's neither.

That's quite apparent, I very much hope it stays that way. If oscar would like to answer the two questions I put to her relating to this, the Contact Us route is ideal. I'll repeat them here in case she has no access to any copy:1. Do you use a software setting to automatically capitalize the first letter of every word starting with "I" or is it something you type?

2. In either event, what reason do you have for doing it?

For a while I thought the "I" thing might be some kind of Europe deal.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:18 am

koan;1407267 wrote: As a note on fair treatment, ask AnneBoleyn. I recently asked her to edit two posts where she had provided the link but used more than "fair use" allows. This is where this becomes more of an enigma.

From what you are saying here, its fair to assume that you will now be going back through six months worth of Anne's posts to find enough infraction points to equal a ban? I assume you are already doing that as you have with Oscar? Likewise i don't recall you ever asking Oscar to correct her posts, in fact you seemed quite at home in some instances of responding to those posts. I also seem to recall one particular offender being constantly reminded on the thread yet Oscar's posts seem devoid of any such similar warning.

I'm also wondering as to the true nature of posting this thread here and not in the members only site where yourself and the administrator have systematically reported a post each every few days of late despite no other poster finding her posts offensive as you have continually claimed. By combining the instances where she has not used a link makes the accumulative infraction points equal a ban, something you have been calling for, for weeks with the posts you have reported as offensive. Some of the instances you have given in the e mail you've sent her are examples where she has used two lines in among her own writing and not the entire text. This can be done when a poster has read an article at length and by memory can quote two lines when they are typing.

I'm by no means defending Oscar as if she's not put links in then so be it and i don't think she has a problem with that. What i am questioning here is that you claim you have only just gone back through all of her threads due to the two lines she retyped in the wildlife thread and found more. By the same token, it's fair to assume that you did the same with Anne when you asked her to edit her posts. Excuse me for being the old cynic but given the amount of posts you and the admin have been reporting every week, it's fair to question your real motives here.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:20 am

koan;1407279 wrote: Seriously?

I was asked to explain why the investigation started.

Yes, seriously...I wasn't trying to be humorous.

How does mentioning October 6th makes any difference to your explanation?

FG-administator · Post by **FG-administator** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:24 am

theia;1407288 wrote: How does mentioning October 6th makes any difference to your explanation?
Your post triggered a discussion among the moderator team, it's just a factual statement.

Post by **Betty Boop** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:28 am

Peter Lake;1407286 wrote: This is where this becomes more of an enigma.

From what you are saying here, its fair to assume that you will now be going back through six months worth of Anne's posts to find enough infraction points to equal a ban? I assume you are already doing that as you have with Oscar? Likewise i don't recall you ever asking Oscar to correct her posts, in fact you seemed quite at home in some instances of responding to those posts. I also seem to recall one particular offender being constantly reminded on the thread yet Oscar's posts seem devoid of any such similar warning.

I'm also wondering as to the true nature of posting this thread here and not in the members only site where yourself and the administrator have systematically reported a post each every few days of late despite no other poster finding her posts offensive as you have continually claimed. By combining the instances where she has not used a link makes the accumulative infraction points equal a ban, something you have been calling for, for weeks with the posts you have reported as offensive. Some of the instances you have given in the e mail you've sent her are examples where she has used two lines in among her own writing and not the entire text. This can be done when a poster has read an article at length and by memory can quote two lines when they are typing.

I'm by no means defending Oscar as if she's not put links in then so be it and i don't think she has a problem with that. What i am questioning here is that you claim you have only just gone back through all of her threads due to the two lines she retyped in the wildlife thread and found more. By the same token, it's fair to assume that you did the same with Anne when you asked her to edit her posts. Excuse me for being the old cynic but given the amount of posts you and the admin have been reporting every week, it's fair to question your real motives here.

That's seriously funny, good deflection try.

By the way, it's oscar that reports the majority of posts around here.

Anne has never offended before and probably never will again as she'll have realised what she's meant to do from now on. Maybe Oscar can think back and recall all the walking through what is allowed and isn't allowed that the mods have done with her. Then she can remember all the warnings she had, be they official or unofficial reminding her of what she could and couldn't do. Then given her persistence she received infractions, I will say what I said earlier, Oscar has been given more chances to clean up her act around here than any other poster ever has.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:34 am

FG;1407289 wrote: Your post triggered a discussion among the moderator team, it's just a factual statement.

And so very convenient!

I heard you were all plotting behind the scenes...what a gift for you when I queried Oscar's post on...yes, October 6th!!

FG-administator · Post by **FG-administator** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 10:53 am

theia;1407293 wrote: And so very convenient!

I heard you were all plotting behind the scenes...what a gift for you when I queried Oscar's post on...yes, October 6th!!As Professor Joad might have said, it all depends on what you mean by plotting. Your post on October 6th raised an issue which wasn't being actively looked at and as a consequence we looked at it. You say "you were all answering a lot of Oscar's posts. How could you reply to them if you weren't reading them?" but it's demonstrably not true, all anyone need do is look back and check. A number of us have quite simply not been opening most of oscar's threads just to remain peaceable and less pissed off, getting sucked in only when a problem's been highlighted.

You call the pre-6th discussions "plotting". I'd settle for "reacting". Plotting is what subversive renegades do prior to the revolution. We're the Establishment, we do not plot.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:00 am

this is silly.

did we plot to make oscar the biggest violator of plagiarism rules on this site too?

perhaps we covertly coerced her into it?

I'd rather be concentrating on cleaning up the rest of the site. As stated I'm trying to do this in a timely manner. If you think it's a plot then ask yourselves why I'm not just infracting 3/day to keep the ban going as long as possible.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:00 am

Betty Boop;1407290 wrote: That's seriously funny, good deflection try.

By the way, it's oscar that reports the majority of posts around here.

Anne has never offended before and probably never will again as she'll have realised what she's meant to do from now on. Maybe Oscar can think back and recall all the walking through what is allowed and isn't allowed that the mods have done with her. Then she can remember all the warnings she had, be they official or unofficial reminding her of what she could and couldn't do. Then given her persistence she received infractions, I will say what I said earlier, Oscar has been given more chances to clean up her act around here than any other poster ever has. As i recall, the last time Oscar received a warning for not adding a link was about two years ago. If she was so glib at the method, why was she not reminded on the thread or sent a reminder by private message?

It appears to me that given Oscar's ban date being lifted is three days, unless that has now changed seeing as Koan's infractions are appearing fast and furious in Oscar's inbox as the day wears on, the desire to post this for all to see is purely to belittle and humiliate. I'm afraid if that was the intention here, how little any of you really know Oscar.

I can only go by what i see and that is the administrator and Koan taking turns to report Oscar's posts on what appear's to be hurt feelings and no real offence for weeks. By co-incidence Oscar received an infraction for falling out with Spot in the members only room so i'm guessing that now is as good as time as any to keep upping the infraction points to equal a ban.

There also appears to be a level of malice of which this thread has been posted, to infer Oscar tries to make herself sound more intelligent. How many times have we seen that on forums around the world? The desire here to belittle i believe is greater than the need.

The subliminal message attempted in this thread is to discredit Oscar with some some sort of personal satisfaction to do it where all posters can see it or that a moderator on another continent knows Oscar so well that she can determine exactly what Oscar is thinking as she types.

I do know Oscar and i'll put my money on the fact it's down to laziness where it may be speedier to copy two lines or a text rather than the reasons some so badly want to see here.

FG-administator · Post by **FG-administator** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:05 am

We have, I think, discussed this enough and the thread is degenerating. The point of the thread was the opening post as a general apology on the open board to everyone, particularly offsite, who's been affected. It wasn't opened in order to disrupt the site or challenge moderation policy.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:07 am

koan;1407295 wrote: this is silly.

did we plot to make oscar the biggest violator of plagiarism rules on this site too?

perhaps we covertly coerced her into it?

I'd rather be concentrating on cleaning up the rest of the site. As stated I'm trying to do this in a timely manner. If you think it's a plot then ask yourselves why I'm not just infracting 3/day to keep the ban going as long as possible.

I have no beef with you Koan. I am also a moderator on a forum and it's very difficult at times. Oscar is lazy especially late at night when she can't be bothered to type sometimes. I don't believe she's set out to deliberately mislead posters here as so many do on forums.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:09 am

Peter Lake;1407298 wrote: I have no beef with you Koan. I am also a moderator on a forum and it's very difficult at times. Oscar is lazy especially late at night when she can't be bothered to type sometimes. I don't believe she's set out to deliberately mislead posters here as so many do on forums.

I'd agree with you if she hadn't invested all the energy of altering the "I"s to capitals to fit her posting style.

The facts just aren't on your side here.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:11 am

FG;1407297 wrote: We have, I think, discussed this enough and the thread is degenerating. The point of the thread was the opening post as a general apology on the open board to everyone, particularly offsite, who's been affected. It wasn't opened in order to disrupt the site or challenge moderation policy. Then perhaps given that Oscar's ban was just three days unless that's changed, it could have been dealt with in a more suitable manner ? If Oscar just didn't post for three days, i'm sure posters wouldn't have even noticed. It appears a song and dance was created in order to belittle Oscar here

FG-administator · Post by **FG-administator** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:15 am

Peter Lake;1407300 wrote: Then perhaps given that Oscar's ban was just three days unless that's changed, it could have been dealt with in a more suitable manner ? If Oscar just didn't post for three days, i'm sure posters wouldn't have even noticed. It appears a song and dance was created in order to belittle Oscar here

I suggest we set things on the back burner for a day. You are entirely wrong and pushing down your current avenue isn't smoothing the path.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:19 am

koan;1407299 wrote: I'd agree with you if she hadn't invested all the energy of altering the "I"s to capitals to fit her posting style.

The facts just aren't on your side here.

On the contrary Koan. You don't know Oscar and while she will never bake a decent cake in her life, she is blessed with an almost photographic memory. I know she can read a text and retype it minutes later word for word but you wouldn't know her well enough to know that. I'm sure there are many instances where Oscar has been lazy and not added a link but there are also instances where she can immediately retype text after reading it. The difference is, i've seen her do that for years and you haven't. It's the desire to oust Oscar for her failings that i find distasteful here not that of which i'm actually in agreement with you over.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 11:38 am

koan;1407267 wrote: As a note on fair treatment, ask AnneBoleyn. I recently asked her to edit two posts where she had provided the link but used more than "fair use" allows.

Peter:

From what you are saying here, its fair to assume that you will now be going back through six months worth of Anne's posts to find enough infraction points to equal a ban? I assume you are already doing that as you have with Oscar?

betty boop:

Anne has never offended before and probably never will again as she'll have realised what she's meant to do from now on.

I'm being dragged kicking & screaming into this. Don't like seeing my name in the same thread as the word plagerism. All I did was copy & paste full articles into my post, linking it & giving whole credit to author & publication. Didn't realize that ForumGarden only permits a paragraph from the original source. Other forums don't have this rule. So, I "offended" (:wah:) & Koan PM'd me. I didn't know what she was talking about, or her responsibility to attend these matters, so I let it pass. She wrote again, I said "do as you must, dear woman" & she already had. No big deal for either of us.

I do have opinions on what is happening here, questions too, but I'll let them pass.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:03 pm

Peter Lake;1407302 wrote: On the contrary Koan. You don't know Oscar and while she will never bake a decent cake in her life, she is blessed with an almost photographic memory. I know she can read a text and retype it minutes later word for word but you wouldn't know her well enough to know that. I'm sure there are many instances where Oscar has been lazy and not added a link but there are also instances where she can immediately retype text after reading it. The difference is, i've seen her do that for years and you haven't. It's the desire to oust Oscar for her failings that i find distasteful here not that of which i'm actually in agreement with you over.
My dear Mr. Lake. If what you said was true it wouldn't account for the glitches that result from copy/pasting text with symbols in them. It's one of the ways I'm finding some of the bits she's stolen.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:11 pm

This course of argument is not going to be useful. To suggest that someone be permitted to infringe copyright because they have a photographic memory is absurd. If she can remember what she read so well, she can remember where she read it. That's how photographic memory works. Additionally, the idea that she can remember full paragraphs word for word from something she read on another site earlier but can't remember many times what she wrote herself a few posts earlier just beggars belief.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:20 pm

koan;1407295 wrote: this is silly.

did we plot to make oscar the biggest violator of plagiarism rules on this site too?

perhaps we covertly coerced her into it?

I'd rather be concentrating on cleaning up the rest of the site. As stated I'm trying to do this in a timely manner. If you think it's a plot then ask yourselves why I'm not just infracting 3/day to keep the ban going as long as possible.

I wouldn't imagine so, no. Is that what you imagine other people think?

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:22 pm

theia;1407314 wrote: I wouldn't imagine so, no. Is that what you imagine other people think?

no. that's why I called it silly. it's the avenue the thread is suggesting we go.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:31 pm

koan;1407315 wrote: no. that's why I called it silly. it's the avenue the thread is suggesting we go.

In your opinion.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:34 pm

I have no idea where you are going with this and I don't want to know. Whatever it is, it does not relate to the rules on copyright.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:36 pm

koan;1407310 wrote: This course of argument is not going to be useful. To suggest that someone be permitted to infringe copyright because they have a photographic memory is absurd. If she can remember what she read so well, she can remember where she read it. That's how photographic memory works. Additionally, the idea that she can remember full paragraphs word for word from something she read on another site earlier but can't remember many times what she wrote herself a few posts earlier just beggars belief.

I didn't say she has a photographic memory so if you continue to quote me then at least quote accurately. I said an almost photographic memory yet from another continent you are claiming to know posters so well that you can envisage them as they're typing which is absurd arrogance. I also moderate a forum and regardless of how well i believe i know a poster, it remains fact that i don't know of their intention or thought process when they're typing. It appears all you are seeking here is to demonise Oscar long after Spot has asked for this to be put on a back burner which rather arrogantly, does tell me a little more about you. If you can't believe that anyone can't retype two lines they have just read on a site immediately after then you're too wrapped up in yourself. Other people do have abilities Koan when it comes to the written word and you don't have a monopoly. If i was claiming this was something Oscar did on every breach then you may have a point but i'm not saying that. I'm saying she can get lazy and she has been but the issue i see here with you is wanting to write far more into her motives than need be. Oscar doesn't pretend to be a great intellect as some do on forums, she doesn't have to for she's happy with who she is. It's your desire to find something sinister and make constant accusations that would make anyone in the circumstances question you're motives especially as you find the need to return and add more as the hour goes by.

theia · Post by **theia** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:40 pm

koan;1407320 wrote: I have no idea where you are going with this and I don't want to know. Whatever it is, it does not relate to the rules on copyright.

Well, I'm going to tell you, koan. It was unnecessary for you to mention October 6th in your opening post and hence link the complaint about the copyright abuse directly to my post when you had been planning a way to infract/ban oscar anyway. It's called using a third party as a scapegoat to avoid being open about your own motives.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:42 pm

If you give me a better excuse than that she has only the part of photographic memory that allows her to type the exact words from another site but it cuts out when it comes to remembering where she got it from then I'll consider other options.

As it stands there is no reason to believe it wasn't intentional and many reasons to believe it was.

The onus of proof is not on me, it's on oscar. All I'm doing is reporting what has been found and giving the links to where it came from. As I've told the members, they are welcome to sift through the reported posts and tell me if I've got something wrong. If that's the case, the infraction will be reversed.

There is one post in the report thread where I gave a link but only amended the post without an infraction because it was only one sentence stolen. I think I'm being completely fair.

Post by **Peter Lake** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:48 pm

koan;1407323 wrote: If you give me a better excuse than that she has only the part of photographic memory that allows her to type the exact words from another site but it cuts out when it comes to remembering where she got it from then I'll consider other options.

As it stands there is no reason to believe it wasn't intentional and many reasons to believe it was.

The onus of proof is not on me, it's on oscar. All I'm doing is reporting what has been found and giving the links to where it came from. As I've told the members, they are welcome to sift through the reported posts and tell me if I've got something wrong. If that's the case, the infraction will be reversed.

There is one post in the report thread where I gave a link but only amended the post without an infraction because it was only one sentence stolen. I think I'm being completely fair.

I don't have any beef with you banning Oscar because if she's breached regulations then so be it but i'm asking if you went back through all Anne's threads to find other examples? I'm also asking why if Oscar's ban is only three days, why post this thread when i'm sure most wouldn't have noticed her absence?

I'm all for fairness Koan, i have seen your objections and not entirely disagreed with you but if we're talking about fairness here, is it fair that a moderator private messages another poster telling them that Oscar is using them, which is an insult to that persons intelligence, and advising them to drop Oscar at the exact time these infraction points are mounting up? That's bullying isn't it?

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Tue Oct 09, 2012 12:55 pm

I demand an immediate investigation of myself. I might be getting away with something.