The Presidential Election of 2020

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Tue Sep 24, 2019 2:05 pm

It appears the neoliberal media and DNC is beginning to rethink its support of Biden and has been promoting Elizabeth Warren instead, labeling Warren as a progressive, which she isn't. It's their way of trying to marginalize Sanders.

Warren is a definite compromise on the neoliberal's part, not much of a compromise, but a compromise just the same.

Sanders is the actual compromise candidate for progressives (he's to the right of Eisenhower) and I'd vote for him over Trump instead of voting third party as I've done for the past two elections. Warren is a tougher call for me, but I'm listening and wanting to find reasons to support her should she be the nominee.

Biden is a loser to Trump because Biden is even less lucid than Trump. Pretty sick that we're even having to discuss these two for POTUS at all.

Post by **spot** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 8:57 am

Ahso!;1525497 wrote: Sanders is the actual compromise candidate for progressives (he's to the right of Eisenhower) and I'd vote for him over Trump instead of voting third party as I've done for the past two elections.

Perhaps they'll install a medical wing in the White House once he gets that far.

The 2020 Democratic presidential candidate Bernie Sanders, 78, has cancelled campaign events until further notice after undergoing surgery.

Mr Sanders was treated in hospital for an arterial blockage after experiencing chest pain at an event in Nevada on Tuesday.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-49911035

I won't keep on about gerontocracy but it ought to be blindingly obvious to everyone. Nobody past retirement age should be in office, much less just starting a first term.

Mr Sanders is carrying a torch. He ought to find someone to pass it to, preferably somebody old enough to be his grandchild. All three of the Democrat front runners are already in their seventies, they should just step aside and let a little optimism into the discussions.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 11:49 am

The problem is that anyone else even close to Sanders is completely vilified in the media and by both parties. A Sanders nomination or presidency would open the doors a bit more to actual progressive candidates, not to mention Sanders appointing more progressive people to his administration. Gabbard is the only other candidate that supported Sanders in 2016, and she's pretty much a neoliberal herself. That's as close as it gets and we can see everything the DNC and media are doing to malign Gabbard and try to restrict her access to the debate stage.

If Sanders could be elected at least the fearful would see that there's nothing to be afraid of by taking a more humane approach to governance in the eval office.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 12:50 pm

Well, Gabbard made the cut. She appears so far to be the best debater of the bunch. I wonder who she'll chew up and spit out this time. I'm sure the corporate candidates will be armed with the false accusation that she's an Assad apologist.

Post by **spot** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:07 pm

So am I an Assad apologist. There's much more to apologize for among the rebels and their paymasters. I'd be delighted if you had at least one Assad apologist running, it would show they're not all programmed.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:21 pm

spot;1525860 wrote: So am I an Assad apologist. There's much more to apologize for among the rebels and their paymasters. I'd be delighted if you had at least one Assad apologist running, it would show they're not all programmed.

Different connotations in the US, but I understand your meaning.

Post by **spot** » Wed Oct 02, 2019 2:40 pm

Ahso!;1525866 wrote: Different connotations in the US, but I understand your meaning.

The dirtiest word in America since I can remember has been "Non-aligned". Communist ran a poor second.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Oct 17, 2019 11:56 am

The last so-called debate showed me Elizabeth Warren commands a high degree of understanding of many of our domestic issues. It appears that it would be difficult for her administration heads to fool her to deviate from her policies without her catching it.

Bernie Sanders is still my choice. He has all the best ideas and doesn't hide any details regarding his policies. It seems clear to me he has a firm grasp of the ills our society suffers from. The msm is doing everything it can to elevate Warren over him.

Kamela Harris is too (spot will be proud of me for this one) anecdotal.

Cory Booker would make an excellent head of HUD, or, perhaps, poet laureate? He seems to be a really nice and empathetic person.

Tulsi Gabbard is a bit too spiritual, and too dedicated to Israel. Though I'm with her on our current war policy. The media has it in for her.

Joe Biden is just too loose in the head and too status quo. He should retire.

Beto O'Rouke is completely over his head.

Amy Klobuchar is trying too hard. Too much status quo too.

Post by **LarsMac** » Thu Oct 17, 2019 9:45 pm

I don't see anyone on that list that I would really feel comfortable with casting my vote for.

At this point, though, any one of them will get my vote before The T-Man.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:25 pm

LarsMac;1526279 wrote: I don't see anyone on that list that I would really feel comfortable with casting my vote for.

At this point, though, any one of them will get my vote before The T-Man.

Who would be your ideal candidate? What issues concern you most?

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Oct 18, 2019 8:01 am

Ahso!;1526280 wrote: Who would be your ideal candidate? What issues concern you most?

The whole selection process, in my opinion, is flawed.

I do like Sanders, but he is getting a bit long in the tooth for the job he is chasing, I fear. Same with Biden.

At this point, I am far more concerned with some of the Senate and congressional races.

It is time for McConnell to be sent packing, as well as Collins, in Maine.

I believe that the most important thing on the agenda for whoever takes the WH next is to get the health care crisis resolved, and figure out a way to sell the nation on a reasonable path to an energy system that is not reliant on Fossil Fuels.

It is now likely far too late to avoid the "Global Warming Crisis"

We need to come up with a plan for how to deal with the rapidly advancing new environment we have worked so hard to create. It is coming, and we are ill-prepared.

The thing that Donald has done for us is to destroy the myth and our credibility as "Defenders of the Faith (Democracy)" and it is time for us to take our wealth and invest it in the looming future.

I don't hear anyone chasing the Democrat nomination that seems to actually get that.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:12 am

LarsMac;1526288 wrote: I believe that the most important thing on the agenda for whoever takes the WH next is to get the health care crisis resolved,

Is there one being advocated that you prefer? I think Medicare For All is the most comprehensive and fair. I'd like to see everyone have access to equivalent care that I receive through the VA.

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:32 pm

Ahso!;1526292 wrote: Is there one being advocated that you prefer? I think Medicare For All is the most comprehensive and fair. I'd like to see everyone have access to equivalent care that I receive through the VA.

That could be a vast improvement over what we were left with in the Final ACA as passed.

We will have to see how it survives that committees and other actions.

H.R.1384 - Medicare for All Act of 2019

The original ACA was far more impressive than the one that was finally passed by Congress and signed by President Obama.

H.R.3590 - Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Fri Oct 18, 2019 4:48 pm

My thought is that the ACA in any form was a windfall for the insurance sector. I don't see why insurance companies need to be a part of healthcare. I understand that insurance has been involved in healthcare as a broker (middle man) for a long time, and so, the general mindset among the population is that they belong in it. I completely disagree with that thought. Costs can not come down significantly as long as brokers are involved.

I've seen the argument that lots of insurance sector jobs will be lost if insurance is taken out of the equation, however, with the influx of patient care that would be gained by opening up healthcare for the general population, many many jobs in other sectors would be gained.

Post by **LarsMac** » Fri Oct 18, 2019 8:14 pm

Ahso!;1526299 wrote: My thought is that the ACA in any form was a windfall for the insurance sector. I don't see why insurance companies need to be a part of healthcare. I understand that insurance has been involved in healthcare as a broker (middle man) for a long time, and so, the general mindset among the population is that they belong in it. I completely disagree with that thought. Costs can not come down significantly as long as brokers are involved.

I've seen the argument that lots of insurance sector jobs will be lost if insurance is taken out of the equation, however, with the influx of patient care that would be gained by opening up healthcare for the general population, many many jobs in other sectors would be gained.

I cannot argue with that. Insurance company participation was part of the compromise that was worked out to get the GOPers to join in.

And, of course, the delay that was written in to the bill allowed insurance companies to run up the bill before the act became effective.

There will be a lot of resistance to anything that does not allow insurers to keep their fingers in the pie.

I tried to pull up the various versions of the ACA from its origin to final bill, but Thomas seems to have gotten the bills confused. It might be useful to see the evolution of the thing.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:08 am

Hillary Clinton is now claiming, without any evidence of course, that both Tulsi Gabbard and Jill Stein are Russian assets. Hopefully, this latest accusation will do for actual progressives what "deplorable" did for Trump. Clinton's an idiot. The more we hear from her and about her, the more apparent it becomes that she is a dishonorable person and would have made a disastrous president.

Post by **spot** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 3:33 am

It is a distressing intervention on her part. She's doing no more than what she claims the Russians are doing, interfering in the 2020 election, and with far less excuse.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 5:16 am

If there's one person alive in the US who is capable of uniting any opposing group into a formidable force, it's HRC. She's just one of those people who brings out fierceness in competitors. Republicans didn't do that to her, she did it all herself. And to think I once supported her.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 6:52 am

Interesting. When I did a search on that, the closest to a credible news source that popped up was FOX News.

Clinton was not the first to suggest such a notion.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/12/us/p ... bbard.html

Back to Clinton,

I find her to be basically irrelevant.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:04 pm

LarsMac;1526308 wrote: Interesting. When I did a search on that, the closest to a credible news source that popped up was FOX News.

Clinton was not the first to suggest such a notion.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/12/us/p ... bbard.html

Back to Clinton,

I find her to be basically irrelevant.

I can't read the times' probable hit piece on Gabbard since I'm not a member. Am I right about it being a hit piece for warmongers?

Clinton might be irrelevant to me and you, but she has a large following. I was thinking about why she's out for Gabbard. It can't be for Biden since Gabbard beat up on Harris for Biden in the first debate. I doubt it would be for Warren because Gabbard had her sites set on Warren in the last debate. Then I thought it's because Gabbard is antiwar and Clinton is doing some dirty work for the Pentagon or Obama, but Hillary is too self-centered to give a rat's ass about anyone else. Then it hit me, Gabbard walked out on the DNC in 2016, let loose on the DNC for rigging the primary for Clinton and endorsed Sanders. Hillary is still pissing herself over that.

Post by **spot** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 12:30 pm

Saying what she did has scarcely advanced the interests of her country, she ought to know better than to behave like it.

It's front page on the BBC website, too.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-50104958

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 1:54 pm

spot;1526312 wrote: Saying what she did has scarcely advanced the interests of her country, she ought to know better than to behave like it.

It's front page on the BBC website, too.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-50104958

My point exactly. She doesn't care about her country or anyone else except herself. She is so self-absorbed, she can't remain in the background, always trying to steal headlines.

I understand that probably the most difficult part of aging is coming to terms with diminished relevancy and necessity by others as one's personal world shrinks. Aging with dignity is hard for some of us, most of us probably, but at least do so as silently as possible if it can't be done graciously in the public eye.

Post by **LarsMac** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 5:09 pm

Well, the more I watch of the Circus that is the Dem "Debate" process, the more I am convinced that Donald will win the election.

So, assuming the Dems manage to gain a majority in the Senate, Impeach looms likely, and the following disruption caused by the stormtrumpers will wreak havoc on the nation for the next decade.

My cabin in the Okefenokee is beginning to look like the best investment I even made.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Sat Oct 19, 2019 10:01 pm

LarsMac;1526316 wrote: Well, the more I watch of the Circus that is the Dem "Debate" process, the more I am convinced that Donald will win the election.

So, assuming the Dems manage to gain a majority in the Senate, Impeach looms likely, and the following disruption caused by the stormtrumpers will wreak havoc on the nation for the next decade.

My cabin in the Okefenokee is beginning to look like the best investment I even made.

Yes, the process is a joke, but that's due to the neoliberal control of the DNC and money-driven attitudes. However, it appears to me that most of the candidates themselves are trying to make an honest accounting of their views and opinions.

The best thing to do, IMO, is to remain clear of this Russia crap, Russiagate has been thoroughly debunked, and it's smart to stay clear of it. Most of them have done that. When I hear a Democrat bring up Russia, it's a dead giveaway that that is an establishment-minded, corporate neoliberal.

Provided the Democratic party ceases to try to divide us by maligning Sanders and his following, Donald Trump is history. Otherwise, if they continue to drive away actual progressives, they lose, or perhaps, win by keeping Trump in office, because as they've shown, being neoliberal, that they prefer Trump's policies of run-a-muck capitalism, over reasonable and fair economic policy that benefits the majority and seeks to protect the planet's inhabitants.

Post by **Raphael** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:44 am

With Hitlery having just committed final verbal suicide and Biden and Sanders ruled out as infirm--- though in the case of Biden ,even more corrupt than previously realised --- the Dem candidate choice is wide open .

Word on the street is that Gabbard is being teed up to take on Trump and , if so , this could be a very smooth and smart move .

She could take a lot of Donald's momentum away by neutralising him in terms of the only voice re. the futility of endless wars and being the only champion of Veterans and those that are first responders .

Her gender and military background are worth votes and her assumed position of being clean of any Deep State obligations and potential blackmail issues is possibly unique among leading Democratic figures .

Betting people might want to punt her .

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:20 am

There's little doubt Gabbard would make mincemeat of Trump one-on-one. I looked at her a few months back and other than her policy stance on the wars, I wasn't impressed. I'll take a second look. If she's for supporting the ACA and/or against reigning in corporate greed, she probably would not get Sanders' supporters, and that's a losing proposition.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 6:52 am

Raphael;1526358 wrote: Hitlery

My my what a clever a$$hole you are.

Post by **Raphael** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:07 am

AnneBoleyn;1526372 wrote: My my what a clever a$$hole you are.

Very widely and commonly used .

Seems to describe her perfectly as a majority decided three years ago . My feeling is that this is now shared by the vast majority of people and as hinted at by the low turn outs at any appearance made by her or her doddery and fast failing so called husband .

And judging by her last crackpot remarks , she could even finish by being a hated person within her own party and a prime cause for Trump's landslide re-election .

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:07 am

I have decided that I don't much care who gets the Dem nomination. Whoever it is will be better than Trump and his

disassembly of the Nation.

I am far more interested in working the state level, to help secure a Dem majority in the Senate.

That will go further to clean out the garbage and put an end to the madness that has become the Republican party.

If they regain the Senate, the Dems will need to settle on a somewhat conservative strategy to avoid alienating the mindful Conservatives.

Post by **Raphael** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:22 am

LarsMac;1526375 wrote: ---------------

I am far more interested in working the state level, to help secure a Dem majority in the Senate.

That will go further to clean out the garbage and put an end to the madness that has become the Republican party. --------

This is the difficulty with your dreams

Authored by Michael Snyder

"Is it just a coincidence that many of the greatest cities in America became poverty-infested hellholes once the Democrats took charge of things? Detroit, Baltimore, Chicago, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Oakland and Memphis were all once great cities. But after an extended period of control by the Democratic Party, each one of them has become a festering crisis that never seems to end. I thought that I was going to do an article about Baltimore today, but it occurred to me that the exact same things that are happening in Baltimore are also happening in a multitude of other major cities, and the common theme among all of them is that the Democrats are in control."

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 7:24 am

Raphael;1526374 wrote: Very widely and commonly used .

Seems to describe her perfectly as a majority decided three years ago . My feeling is that this is now shared by the vast majority of people and as hinted at by the low turn outs at any appearance made by her or her doddery and fast failing so called husband .

And judging by her last crackpot remarks , she could even finish by being a hated person within her own party and a prime cause for Trump's landslide re-election .

I'm not defending her, I'm on a critique about YOU.

"Very widely and commonly used"---by you? Another person who uses a similar phrase is Trump.

"Seems to describe her perfectly as a majority decided three years ago"

A majority of the electoral college you mean, not voters.

At least a year before a major election, questionable people like you with questionable motivations come out of the woodwork.

Post by **Raphael** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:59 am

AnneBoleyn;1526378 wrote: I'm not defending her, I'm on a critique about YOU.

"Very widely and commonly used"---by you? Another person who uses a similar phrase is Trump.

"Seems to describe her perfectly as a majority decided three years ago"

A majority of the electoral college you mean, not voters.

At least a year before a major election, questionable people like you with questionable motivations come out of the woodwork.

That sounds somewhat like Hitlery . A wee bit precious and paranoid --- worried about infestations of bugs from the trees . And ones which apparently all play the Trumpet .

It's best to listen to various shades of opinion before making wild assumptions and jumping to strange conclusions .imo

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 10:09 am

Raphael;1526377 wrote:

Authored by Michael Snyder

"Is it just a coincidence that many of the greatest cities in America became poverty-infested hellholes once the Democrats took charge of things? Detroit, Baltimore, Chicago, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Oakland and Memphis were all once great cities. But after an extended period of control by the Democratic Party, each one of them has become a festering crisis that never seems to end. I thought that I was going to do an article about Baltimore today, but it occurred to me that the exact same things that are happening in Baltimore are also happening in a multitude of other major cities, and the common theme among all of them is that the Democrats are in control."

A very popular myth. Especially among the Stormtrumpers

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:25 pm

Raphael;1526379 wrote: That sounds somewhat like Hitlery .

Yawn.

tude dog · Post by **tude dog** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:35 pm

LarsMac;1526375 wrote: I have decided that I don't much care who gets the Dem nomination. Whoever it is will be better than Trump and his

disassembly of the Nation.

Not sure about that.

LarsMac;1526375 wrote: I am far more interested in working the state level, to help secure a Dem majority in the Senate.

That will go further to clean out the garbage and put an end to the madness that has become the Republican party.

If they regain the Senate, the Dems will need to settle on a somewhat conservative strategy to avoid alienating the mindful Conservatives.

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 2:18 pm

tude dog;1526385 wrote: [QUOTE=LarsMac;1526375]I have decided that I don't much care who gets the Dem nomination. Whoever it is will be better than Trump and his

disassembly of the Nation.

Not sure about that.

One can only hope.

Post by **Raphael** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:15 pm

AnneBoleyn;1526383 wrote: Yawn.

You are absolutely right .

Leading with your chin is invariably a losing strategy .

So pick yourself up , dust yourself down etc etc .

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:44 pm

Raphael;1526396 wrote: You are absolutely right .

Leading with your chin is invariably a losing strategy .

So pick yourself up , dust yourself down etc etc .Is that what this is - a boxing match?

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Oct 21, 2019 4:45 pm

Clearly not American.

Post by **Raphael** » Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:34 am

Ahso!;1526400 wrote: Clearly not American.

Excellent . First correct answer .

Almost all the top heavy weights are British and God help Wilder when a fully fit Fury knocks him to kingdom come .

Check out Daniel Dubois . Might turn out the long term king pin .

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Tue Oct 22, 2019 6:36 am

Raphael;1526415 wrote: Excellent . First correct answer .

Almost all the top heavy weights are British and God help Wilder when a fully fit Fury knocks him to kingdom come .

Check out Daniel Dubois . Might turn out the long term king pin .

It was an observation, not an answer.

AnneBoleyn · Post by **AnneBoleyn** » Tue Oct 22, 2019 12:13 pm

Ahso!;1526417 wrote: It was an observation, not an answer.

Ahso, you dare dispute the claim of a self-reported member of Mensa? Cheeky!

Post by **Raphael** » Tue Oct 22, 2019 3:08 pm

Ahso!;1526417 wrote: It was an observation, not an answer.

Sound observations are the source data for correct answers

Source : Raphael , May 19 , 1536 . Wisdom, Chapter 3 , verse twenty nine .

The very day Anne Boleyn had her head removed .

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:08 pm

Kamala Harris is out. A big surprise to the media I suppose, but not me. She made poor showings in the so-called debates. Earlier than I expected though.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Feb 03, 2020 8:07 pm

And they're off.

Post by **LarsMac** » Mon Feb 03, 2020 9:12 pm

Ahso!;1530067 wrote: And they're off.

Not so fast.

News from Iowa. Complications with the process have slowed the release of results.

No news yet on the results.

Images of the Keystone Kops continue to come to mind.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/03/iowa-ca ... dates.html

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Mon Feb 03, 2020 9:58 pm

My first suspicion is that Biden did really lousy and they are trying to figure out how to manipulate the results.

Post by **LarsMac** » Tue Feb 04, 2020 9:04 am

Well, as of this AM, still no numbers to present. I do hope this is not predictive of the whole election cycle.

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Tue Feb 04, 2020 12:42 pm

Well, here we go. At the time of publication, 12 hours after voting in the Democratic Partyâ€™s Iowa caucuses ended, the results have not been announced. The delay in reporting is the result of a failed app developed by a company appropriately named Shadow Inc.

This firm was staffed by Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama campaign veterans and created by a Democratic dark-money nonprofit backed by hedge fund billionaires including Seth Klarman. A prolific funder of pro-settler Israel lobby organizations, Klarman has also contributed directly to Pete Buttigiegâ€™s campaign.

The delay in the vote reporting denied a victory speech to Sen. Bernie Sanders, the presumptive winner of the opening contest in the Democratic presidential primary. Though not one exit poll indicated that Buttigieg would have won, the former mayor South Bend, Indiana, took to Twitter to confidently proclaim himself the victor. https://consortiumnews.com/2020/02/04/b ... oting-app/

Ahso! · Post by **Ahso!** » Tue Feb 04, 2020 3:41 pm

Sanders leading the popular vote and Buttigieg leading in delegates. Biden in 4th place between Warren and Klobuchar. 62% of the votes counted.