Does music lead to violence?

anastrophe · Post by **anastrophe** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 12:57 pm

Noik wrote: Hello,

I am doing project in school on music. i need help i need your opinions on this plz!!!!

A. Can music lead to fatal incidences?yes. just as alcohol can. and infidelity. and fumbling with the cd player in the car and not watching the road. and by being so loud you don't hear the train coming.

B. Can the music affect you socially?yes. just as alcohol can. and pornography. and affective disorder. and excessive debt. and a poorly chosen set of eyeglass frames.

C. Can the music you listen to have a permanent affect on your life?yes. just like alcohol can. and the foods you eat. and home ownership. and a broken sewage main. and improperly disposing of batteries in fire.

D. Is it the music or do we just want something to blame?the latter.

glad i could help.

Please give me a serious answer in this topic!!!!

~Noik~
rather depends upon how seriously one takes the questions. i don't. it's like asking if a pickle knows what day of the week it is.

Paula · Post by **Paula** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 12:58 pm

i would have to say yes, because of the lyrics in some songs. this is something that is for young people as they like music, it is part of their lives. head bangin drill'in mental music does affect people, certain ones are affected. Add some drugs and liquor, oh boy...

abbey · Post by **abbey** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 1:11 pm

ROFL.. :yh_rotfl Seems like ya picked the wrong forum Noiks! Paula, another classic gem.. Anastrophe, so you Do have blood running through your veins!! very funny replies guys i havent laughed like that for ages. :wah:

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 1:35 pm

I guess I missed the humor in this one. I mean, I see anastrophe's point, but I am missing the need for sarcasm. Certain types of music have been blamed for all kinds of behavior, and I think it's absurd. It's another example of people never being held accountable for their actions. There is always some "excuse" for people's behavior, and some "drug" that is developed to counteract that behavior. Geez, I've seen a news report a few years back that told of a drug being developed to curb over-shopping. Seriously. It is a continual source of amazement to me how society repeatedly finds other things to blame for certain behavior, when people need to be held accountable, and are not. So, to answer Noiks question, I believe people DO look for something to blame, anything but themselves. But I really missed the point of being sarcastic about the question. :yh_ooooo

anastrophe · Post by **anastrophe** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 2:01 pm

BabyRider wrote: I guess I missed the humor in this one. I mean, I see anastrophe's point, but I am missing the need for sarcasm. Certain types of music have been blamed for all kinds of behavior, and I think it's absurd. It's another example of people never being held accountable for their actions. There is always some "excuse" for people's behavior, and some "drug" that is developed to counteract that behavior. Geez, I've seen a news report a few years back that told of a drug being developed to curb over-shopping. Seriously. It is a continual source of amazement to me how society repeatedly finds other things to blame for certain behavior, when people need to be held accountable, and are not. So, to answer Noiks question, I believe people DO look for something to blame, anything but themselves. But I really missed the point of being sarcastic about the question. :yh_ooooo
i didn't have a sarcastic tone in mind when i wrote it. my answers really are serious, after a fashion. all summed up by "the latter". it is as you state well above - just another excuse to blame anything other than the person responsible.

i guess to me, its a priori. that's why it's nonsensical to ask. IMNSFHO, of course.

:yh_silly

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 2:14 pm

anastrophe wrote: i didn't have a sarcastic tone in mind when i wrote it. my answers really are serious, after a fashion. all summed up by "the latter". it is as you state well above - just another excuse to blame anything other than the person responsible.

i guess to me, its a priori. that's why it's nonsensical to ask. IMNSFHO, of course.

:yh_silly
I guess I was thrown off by the pickle comment. I wasn't slamming you because of your response, I seriously thought I was missing something. When I read your stuff I generally find it very intelligent and concise.

I guess I looked at this thread, saw a new member, probably young, thought of helping my son with homework, and responded. That's all. Again, it's how things can be misconstrued communicating this way.

Paula · Post by **Paula** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 2:36 pm

its like asking a PICKLE what day of the week it is? This is wonderful, I love it...

LottomagicZ4941 · Post by **LottomagicZ4941** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 3:32 pm

"I'm going to go down fighting. I know that I'm right and I'm going to go down fighting. 'cuz I know that I'm right and. . . " Nazareth:)

"Hideing(SP?) in the sun like a loaded gun--reality." Deep Purple

"Vengence it's my right. . . .Eye for eye you can take one but I can take two." Ian Gillian

Seriously vengence is the Lords. Just 'cuz I like a song that says that I can take two does not mean that I shall do so.

'Eye for eye and the whole world shall be blind' Gandi(SP) in single quotes as I don't know exactly how he said it.

Lotto

http://www.flalottomagic.net/cgi-local/ ... elcome-344

MagicZ4941

Peg · Post by **Peg** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 4:52 pm

I agree with ScoupeSlave. It would be like my husband coming home and finding me in bed with a cowboy. I could tell him the song to me to do and I was saving a horse. Don't think he'd be okay with that

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 5:13 pm

Peg wrote: I agree with ScoupeSlave. It would be like my husband coming home and finding me in bed with a cowboy. I could tell him the song to me to do and I was saving a horse. Don't think he'd be okay with that

Oh, that's just hysterical! What a great analogy! (BTW, I love that song...)

:yh_clap

A Karenina · Post by **A Karenina** » Thu Jan 27, 2005 8:21 pm

Noik wrote: Hello,

I am doing project in school on music. i need help i need your opinions on this plz!!!!
Hmmmm....hello, Noik. I'll be glad to help you. The word "I" is capitalized, no exceptions. Phonetic spellings are not acceptable. Excessive punctuation marks do not add anything at all, except a modicum of annoyance.

I'm just playing. I'm a student, too, so it's fun to jump into the professor role, just for a minute.

Noik wrote: A. Can music lead to fatal incidences?

B. Can the music affect you socially?

C. Can the music you listen to have a permanent affect on your life?

D. Is it the music or do we just want something to blame?
Yes, to A, B, and C.

I think for most people, music brings joy, laughter, comfort, energy, encouragement, inspiration, and memories. On the flip side it can heighten pain, anger, hatred, etc...and these negatives can lead to violence.

Music does not cause violence nor does it cause joy. It merely touches/intensifies/heightens something that is already there...like alcohol. (LOL, Anastrophe.)

Some people will spend their time looking for a scapegoat. Some people will spend their time looking for a solution.

Good luck with your paper.

anastrophe · Post by **anastrophe** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 12:15 am

A Karenina wrote: Some people will spend their time looking for a scapegoat. Some people will spend their time looking for a solution.

and some will spend their time looking for the perfect vinyl copy of sir georg solti and the chicago symphony orchestra's matchless performance of beethoven's ninth.

:yh_clown

koan · Post by **koan** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 12:37 am

Oooooooo. I love surveys!!!!

Let's see....

A)Fatal. Is that a euphamism for suicidal? If so, music is chosen because it reflects the mood a person is in. A suicidal person will choose music that reflects that reality back at them. The music doesn't choose the person. Final answer: No.

B)Social. I think the reverse is true here as well, in some cases. Some people choose the music popular to the social group they wish to belong to. Because music is categorized it tends to socially categorize its listeners. I think people use it as a guide to find the social group they are likely to get along with. Final answer: Yes.

C)Effect. A good song like a good story can bring new understanding into a person's life. A song can also be a trigger forever reminding you of an event or time in yur life when it happened to be playing or popular. Final answer: Yes.

D)Blame. I have never blamed music for anything in my life. Final answer: I don't understand the question.

greydeadhead · Post by **greydeadhead** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 4:46 am

Noik wrote: Hello,

I am doing project in school on music. i need help i need your opinions on this plz!!!!

A. Can music lead to fatal incidences?

B. Can the music affect you socially?

C. Can the music you listen to have a permanent affect on your life?

D. Is it the music or do we just want something to blame?

Please give me a serious answer in this topic!!!!

~Noik~
Hey Noik...

Lets see what I can do to help you out here..

A.. no.. if someone is taking the lyrics or music that seriously then they need some help. Nothing should have that kind of hold over a person.

B. Yep.. it can. I know that when I am hanging with fellow Deadheads.. the social atmosphere is usually pretty mellow... whereas if I am sitting on a spinning bike at the gym and there is some kickass rock playing I tend to work harder at the workout..

C. This is a tough one.. but yeah.. I have seen it with Deadheads.. the ones that toured.. and Phishheads.. same thing. Usually they tend to grow out of touring but the music plays on forever

D. We have no one to blame for our actions but ourselves. It isn't the music.. or the lights.. or food.. The blame game just doesn't cut it...

Hope this helps ya..

Be well.. and have a grate day

Bill Sikes · Post by **Bill Sikes** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 5:55 am

Paula wrote: i would have to say yes, because of the lyrics in some songs.

http://www.fmlegacy.com/LegLyrics/headkickedin.html

greydeadhead · Post by **greydeadhead** » Fri Jan 28, 2005 6:21 am

yep.. and for every song that has lyrics that encourage violence you have lyrics like this...

If my words did glow with the gold of sunshine

And my tunes were played on the harp unstrung

Would you hear my voice come through the music

Would you hold it near as it were your own?

It's a hand-me-down, the thoughts are broken

Perhaps they're better left unsung

I don't know, don't really care

Let there be songs to fill the air

(Chorus)

Ripple in still water

When there is no pebble tossed

Nor wind to blow

Reach out your hand if your cup be empty

If your cup is full may it be again

Let it be known there is a fountain

That was not made by the hands of men

There is a road, no simple highway

Between the dawn and the dark of night

And if you go no one may follow

That path is for your steps alone

(Chorus)

You who choose to lead must follow

But if you fall you fall alone

If you should stand then who's to guide you?

If I knew the way I would take you home

-- Ripple

Lyrics by Robert Hunter

Music By Jerry Garcia

capt_buzzard · Post by **capt_buzzard** » Sat Jan 29, 2005 6:50 pm

Some Irish Rebel songs from North and South can lead to violence, and has done in Ireland and parts of Britain.

Rifles of the IRA,

Four Green Fields,

And there are many many more.

Post by **kensloft** » Sun Feb 13, 2005 6:36 pm

I agree with anastrophe. Right on.

Peg · Post by **Peg** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 6:58 pm

A lady had promised her daughter and her friends, my son being one of them, that she would take them to a concert tonight. They were so excited all last night and today. When it came time to go, she decided not to take them because she read the lyrics. Bad enough she let her own kid down, but she let others down too. She should have read the lyrics BEFORE promising to take them. I realize that not everyone feels that music doesn't lead to violence, but how could she let them down that way?

minks · Post by **minks** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 10:32 pm

Peg wrote: A lady had promised her daughter and her friends, my son being one of them, that she would take them to a concert tonight. They were so excited all last night and today. When it came time to go, she decided not to take them because she read the lyrics. Bad enough she let her own kid down, but she let others down too. She should have read the lyrics BEFORE promising to take them. I realize that not everyone feels that music doesn't lead to violence, but how could she let them down that way?

Maybe guilt, maybe she was worried what other parents would think if they read the lyrics so to look good she didn't go?

What concert was it.

LottomagicZ4941 · Post by **LottomagicZ4941** » Fri Mar 11, 2005 11:40 pm

One of the members of Korn has left to follow Christ.

One of the critizms of Korn is that their lyrics are violent.

My Korn review may have been one of mine that was off the mark on amazon.

Well it will be intresting to see if the guy leaving Korn puts out some quality music or if he just puts out some contempory blan stuff.

Lotto

http://www.flalottomagic.net/cgi-local/ ... elcome-344

MagicZ4941

Paula · Post by **Paula** » Sat Mar 12, 2005 7:09 am

If the person has a violent tendency to begin with YES. Add some drugs and liquor--you have a CLASS A Mental Patient, get away as fast as you can. OR better that Shut the music off.

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Sat Mar 12, 2005 1:46 pm

Noik wrote: Hello,

I am doing project in school on music. i need help i need your opinions on this plz!!!!

A. Can music lead to fatal incidences?

B. Can the music affect you socially?

C. Can the music you listen to have a permanent affect on your life?

D. Is it the music or do we just want something to blame?

Please give me a serious answer in this topic!!!!

~Noik~
There are some "Country Western" pieces that drive me to anger. I have been known to rip the plug out of the wall and toss the radio, CD or tape, out the window.

Post by **kensloft** » Sat Mar 12, 2005 9:15 pm

greydeadhead wrote: yep.. and for every song that has lyrics that encourage violence you have lyrics like this...

If my words did glow with the gold of sunshine

And my tunes were played on the harp unstrung

Would you hear my voice come through the music

Would you hold it near as it were your own?

It's a hand-me-down, the thoughts are broken

Perhaps they're better left unsung

I don't know, don't really care

Let there be songs to fill the air

(Chorus)

Ripple in still water

When there is no pebble tossed

Nor wind to blow

Reach out your hand if your cup be empty

If your cup is full may it be again

Let it be known there is a fountain

That was not made by the hands of men

There is a road, no simple highway

Between the dawn and the dark of night

And if you go no one may follow

That path is for your steps alone

(Chorus)

You who choose to lead must follow

But if you fall you fall alone

If you should stand then who's to guide you?

If I knew the way I would take you home

-- Ripple

Lyrics by Robert Hunter

Music By Jerry Garcia

Thanks for the song. Deadheads rule. However there are cultures that do promote violence in the followings. The violence is against things that should be worked against but because they are lyricized and people follow the words they will act. Punk comes to mind. They are not for violence but will resort to it if they see what they hate and have the opportunity to act upon it. They hate racism. The hate hard drugs. They hate pushers. Yes it does have an influence.

minks · Post by **minks** » Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:29 pm

Insane - am I the only mother****er with a brain?

I'm hearing voices, but all they do is complain

How many time have you wanted to kill

Everything and everyone - say you'll do it but never will

You can't see California without Marlon Brando's eyes

I am my father son

Cuz hes a phantom, a mystery, and that leaves me nothing!

How many time hace you wanted to die?

Its too late for me - all you have to do is get rid of me

Its all in your head

Its all in my head

Its all in my head

I tried - you lied to me for so long..

Everywhere I go, there's a sense of it

Freak on my antics and give me a choice

Doesn't matter if I give a **** - its the **** that you gave me

Do you wanna feel pain? Takin' my name in vain

Caring never felt so lame inside

Anybody else got pride? Do you wanna take my life?

Maybe I'll reverse my ride

Who the **** are you? **** you!

Better suck it up cuz you bled through

Better get away from me

Stay the **** away from me

I feel safe - seems you're saved

Look me in my brand new eye

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There ya go some classic Slipknot, yep the song is called Eyeless, does it make ya wanna kill somebody ... well I would really like to slap silly the person who wrote it.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 12:49 am

minks wrote: Insane - am I the only mother****er with a brain?

I'm hearing voices, but all they do is complain

How many time have you wanted to kill

Everything and everyone - say you'll do it but never will....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

There ya go some classic Slipknot, yep the song is called Eyeless, does it make ya wanna kill somebody ... well I would really like to slap silly the person who wrote it.

That they wrote it isn't as bad as the fact that kids like it and make it popular. That's the thing with free speech. If nobody likes it it has no power. Why do they like it?

greydeadhead · Post by **greydeadhead** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:05 am

Interesting.. but did you really really read the lyrics.. and understand what they are trying to say..

I am not a Slipknot fan.. but this is about a very lonely person..

Appears that Dad bailed on him..

he has been lied to..

and wants to change his life.. reverse his ride...

and he warns his old life to stay away.

he is looking at life thru a new eye...

least that is my simple analysis...

sure the vocabulary is rough, crude and rude..

but that just adds to the shock value of the lyrics...

and makes the point all that much more powerful...

RedSoxFan · Post by **RedSoxFan** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:10 am

I would never blam any Musician for causing people to be violent. But I would say its a cause of my road rage..... :driving:

Paula · Post by **Paula** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:13 am

Music can make you cry, you have to admit that one. Violence, i am not violent, if you are i reach for the phone, 911...please take this problem away.

Post by **kensloft** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 9:44 am

Youth are left with a world that is polluted and killing people. They hate. They fight against the system. They want to be heard and they are going to be heard. It's what they hate that matters and they seem to hate the things that their parents hate but they have their own langauge and they will voice their anger. Unklike the parents they need to do something about it because if they don't then their children will have nothing.

Peace, love and groovy doesn't do anything but add to the problem. The establihment destroys the environment and no one does anything about it because they're too busy driving their cars.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 10:34 am

greydeadhead,

In this case then the people that get into the lyrics are kids also enraged by neglect they have received. This is why it has power. So much abuse and neglect.

kensloft,

apparently people are too busy driving in their cars...drunk. :wah:

greydeadhead · Post by **greydeadhead** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 11:23 am

Koan...

Perhaps... or perhaps it is that they see that he has saved himself and sees life thru new eyes that attarcts them to the song.. sigh.. without actually discussing it with someone who can enlighten to the meaning behind the lyrics.. my supposition could run wild here....

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 2:14 pm

I agree 100%, slushpuppy!

Other kids that don't murder listen to the same music. I think the tendency to commit the crime must already exist and the music may only contribute to the way in which the act is done.

I wonder if the actress was Sharon Tate, murdered by the Charles Manson family? That would be a gruesome murder indeed. These details can be found in a mulitude of sources and films made about the Manson family even if it wasn't repeated in the Manson song.

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:00 pm

I know for a fact that when I listen to Frank Sinatra, I drive much more calmly. But when I turn on Rammstein, I begin to drive faster, cut people off, and generally be rude.

Of course music affects people!

How do you think this song by Ice Cube effects kids?

"Without a badge and a gun, what do ya got?

A sucka in a uniform, waitin' to get shot!

By me!, or another n***a!

And with a gat it don't matter

if he's smarter or bigger!

F**k the police

F**k the police

F**k the police

F**k the police

Or how about this one by NWA?

Since I was a youth, I smoked weed out.

Now I'm the M**********r that ya read about!

takin' a life or two,

that's what the hell I do,

you don't like how I'm livin'?

Wel...F***k You!

or here's a wonderful song about women....

I get 'em stuck-on, then get the f**ck on

give em' d**k to roam

and tell em' thanks for the p****y hole.

I find em, f***k em and flee you know, but before I do,

yo take the ho to a hotel

to the motel

to the holiday inn

yo, if that b***h starts f*****g up what do I do?

I'll just f***k her friend!

the kids are listening to this pure, unadulterated filth day and night. Does anyone here really think that this kind of "music" (and I use the term loosely) isn't having an effect on our kids?!

You can yell freedom of speech all you want, but I'm not buying it. I call this obscene. The kids adore it and worship the guys that sing this stuff. Ask any kid who Tupac was, He's a blasted role model now, a guy who got killed in a drive-by for Pete's sake!

Now there are videogames like "San Andreas" making it even more cool to rape, kill, plunder, curse, and generally be a meanace to everyone.

Thanks a bunch Hollywood.

koan · Post by **koan** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:14 pm

I've been thinking about this thread for some time today. I still stick to my idea that the violence and aggression must be present before the music has any effect. BUT. Most kids have a phase when they feel misunderstood and dislike society. The songs that they have to listen to now make it seem more acceptable and "cool" to strike out with weapons and commit crimes. Every generation has gone through a need to rebel as they grow up but this generation has expanded the repetoire of "badness".

I worked with a rap star and talked to him about his music. He has a chance to reach millions of kids with his music but he didn't give one whit about his personal beliefs, philosophies or morals being expressed in his music. It was business. He said he deals with his personal "stuff" elsewhere. The music is made to sell not to shape the world into what it should be and, frankly, not because they think the world is really like that. The more controversial the more albums that are sold. I lost a lot of respect I might have held for that singer. I gave him a mini violin as a wrap gift. It plays classical music.

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:17 pm

Priceless, Jives....Totally priceless. :yh_clap

Now. I agree with pretty much everything you have said. There are dozens of video games and songs I will not allow my son to listen to or own. BUT. Does the idea that these things (the songs and games) are being blamed directly for the violent acts sit well with you? What about accountability? It seems to have taken a dump in our society. There is always something else to blame, as long as it's not the person doing the violence, and I find that unacceptable. Your thoughts?

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:24 pm

slushpuppy wrote: music does not literally cause criminal behaviour. However, it may be a contributing factor especially if the person who commits the crime is already disturbed in some way,

So here is truth....there will ALWAYS be somebody out there that is disturbed. And you're right, slushy, I agree. You'd have to be whacked out to actually act upon a movie or a song and take them for reality.

After all, I've watched tons of "The Bugs Bunny Road Runner Hour" but I've never once dropped an anvil on anyone.

Then again, a group of children in Norway kicked a fellow 5-year old to death after watching "the Power Rangers". They are almost too young to process, all they were doing was emulating what they'd seen.

The question before us is this:

Should we censor violent music and violent movies, so that the few that are not all there aren't driven over the edge?

Or should we accept a certain amount of death, mayhem, and a decline of moral values as the cost of having complete freedom of speech?

Jives · Post by **Jives** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:32 pm

BabyRider wrote: Does the idea that these things (the songs and games) are being blamed directly for the violent acts sit well with you?

I know exactly what you're saying, BR. Would this person have committed this act if it weren't for the music? Probably. And you're right about something else, too. It's the criminal's PERSONAL FAULT that they commit crimes.

I won't stand for anyone saying something like, "The music MADE me do it." You had a choice. Lots of others with poor circumstances have chosen not to be violent or criminal. You just didn't have the guts and the fortitude to be good.

But I keep thinking of the analogy , "Don't pour gas on the fire."

Doesn't our acceptance of this kind of thing, increase the probablility of it happening?

BabyRider · Post by **BabyRider** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 3:44 pm

Jives wrote:

Doesn't our acceptance of this kind of thing, increase the probablility of it happening?That's it right there. Bingo.

I personally don't accept it, and I am only one voice. I think all this "blame dispersal" (hey, maybe I just made up a new term?) is a load of hooey. There's a problem though...And it comes in two words: "setting precedent."

Post by **kensloft** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 4:05 pm

greydeadhead wrote: Koan...

Perhaps... or perhaps it is that they see that he has saved himself and sees life thru new eyes that attarcts them to the song.. sigh.. without actually discussing it with someone who can enlighten to the meaning behind the lyrics.. my supposition could run wild here....
Talking to a young friend of mine today. He manages a store selling second hand clothing for operations that they have and are building with benefitting the AIDS epidemic in Africa. He is young and he has an extensive number of cds to play from that are young. Most people I don't even know are the musicians or bands. People are always asking him about music. I told him about this thread and I told him of how you interpreted the songs of the youth. He had a big grin on his face when he realized that the song by the foremost crude group had it translated without reference to the crudeness. Actually got the message beyond the swear words.

greydeadhead,

In this case then the people that get into the lyrics are kids also enraged by neglect they have received. This is why it has power. So much abuse and neglect.

They are enraged. No doubt. But even those that are not enraged use it as a basis for finding out what it would feel like. They would probably do it without music or whatever you want to make as the basic building blocks of why kids do things? It can be and is a catalyst for some to act on what lyrics they remember. But lyrics are not music per se. It is better to have a good message for them to react off of when they may think about trangressing the law. Straightening out the law as opposed to twisting it even more makes a lot of sense to me.

anastrophe · Post by **anastrophe** » Tue Mar 15, 2005 4:24 pm

Jives wrote: I know for a fact that when I listen to Frank Sinatra, I drive much more calmly. But when I turn on Rammstein, I begin to drive faster, cut people off, and generally be rude.

Of course music affects people!

How do you think this song by Ice Cube effects kids?

"Without a badge and a gun, what do ya got?

A sucka in a uniform, waitin' to get shot!

By me!, or another n***a!

And with a gat it don't matter

if he's smarter or bigger!

interestingly, ice cube has been a tv actor for quite a few years now....primarily playing...COPS.

the kids are listening to this pure, unadulterated filth day and night. Does anyone here really think that this kind of "music" (and I use the term loosely) isn't having an effect on our kids?!
having an effect is one thing. leading an otherwise healthy teen or adult to kill? nonsense. keywords there being 'otherwise healthy'.

You can yell freedom of speech all you want, but I'm not buying it. I call this obscene. The kids adore it and worship the guys that sing this stuff. Ask any kid who Tupac was, He's a blasted role model now, a guy who got killed in a drive-by for Pete's sake!
well, i will continue to yell freedom of speech. the Right as provided in the Bill of Rights is there specifically to protect just that kind of speech - the most egregious, the most unpleasant.

that said, an important aspect of our rights that people seem to have a pretty massive blind spot for is that constitutional rights do not confer to children, the mentally deficient, the criminal, or the insane. young adults - as in so many areas of life - fall into a tough grey area. it's hard to say that on day 364 of a person's 17th year, they are too immature to hear or read certain things, or drink, or smoke, but on the first day of their 18th year, suddenly they are.

i think *reasonable* restrictions on access to violent content are appropriate for those under 18/17. they do it in theaters. of course, access to music is much easier than access to theaters. unless we want CD stores to start 'carding' teens like they do for cigarettes and alcohol. maybe not a bad idea actually.

Now there are videogames like "San Andreas" making it even more cool to rape, kill, plunder, curse, and generally be a meanace to everyone.

Thanks a bunch Hollywood.
i saw some excerpts from san andreas on one of the news magazines just recently. pretty horrific stuff, and i definitely don't think anyone under 15 should be allowed to play it. tough sell when the parents are playing too though.