Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Strange one this, apparently used Polonium 210 to poison him, which is kinda like getting a piece of moon-rock to bash someones head in, a bit exotic shall we say, not a nice way for the poor man to die though, very nasty. And Polonium is not exactly a common or garden material, you usually have to sythesize it in a Nuclear reactor by bombarding a Barium isotope with neutrons. To go to thiese lengths to kill someone is definetly some kind of message what that is is hard to say. Its seems that the Russians remain as vindictive as ever though, one to watch, this one.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
it's put me right off sushi
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
ArnoldLayne;468203 wrote: G, do you not think the use of this polonium stuff has *Russia* flashing in neon lights. Surely they aint that stupid or do they just not care that everybody knows it was them ?
It does seem obvious, maybe it was meant to be obvious, not to the British, who are not that interested, but in other dissidents. Its of course possible that it was not the Kremelin, but seriously, obtaining and using Polonuim is really only possible by a couple of people in a handful of states in the world, and I doubt it was the UK, the US, China, or France, that did this, so it was either the Kremlin directly or dissafected KGB, how such people would be able to get this stuff is still hard to understand if they were not authorized, seriously, this stuff is really only ever seen (let used) by people working in experiemntal nuclear research work in a handful of labs in the world. And if it wasn't a government, thats more worrying, cause if they can get their hands on this then they can get their hands on pretty much anything, and they must be extremely sophisticated in what they know and how to do their business.
It does seem obvious, maybe it was meant to be obvious, not to the British, who are not that interested, but in other dissidents. Its of course possible that it was not the Kremelin, but seriously, obtaining and using Polonuim is really only possible by a couple of people in a handful of states in the world, and I doubt it was the UK, the US, China, or France, that did this, so it was either the Kremlin directly or dissafected KGB, how such people would be able to get this stuff is still hard to understand if they were not authorized, seriously, this stuff is really only ever seen (let used) by people working in experiemntal nuclear research work in a handful of labs in the world. And if it wasn't a government, thats more worrying, cause if they can get their hands on this then they can get their hands on pretty much anything, and they must be extremely sophisticated in what they know and how to do their business.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
booradley;468207 wrote: it's put me right off sushi
Yes it would do that alright, I admit I am a big sushi fan, I'm sure I will get over it.
Yes it would do that alright, I admit I am a big sushi fan, I'm sure I will get over it.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Scrat;470077 wrote: Can we put a little logic in this? It seems here lately that second and third hand news is being taken and ran with as if it were the truth.
If the guy was poisoned by Polonium (?) why in the hell not just have someone knock him off like they did Politikarpovskaya? It takes a lot of effort to pull of a drama like this, why do it?
Think about it. Why go through the trouble when a bullet will suffice? Think, the doctors said it was an unknown substance. I also heard that they found 3 metal objects in his intestines, where are they? Why weren't they removed? Have they been removed?
Facts are taking a backseat to wild speculation and drama here. In the Politikarpovskaya murder no one and I mean no one, ever mentioned the Georgian Mafia.
There's something else going on and it isn't necessarily bad Sushi or bullets or Polonium.
I'm tossing out this guy died of AIDS. 43 is a good age for it and unlike a poisoning, that can't be stopped.
Polonium seems favourite:
"Ex-spy's death: three sent for radiation tests"
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... spy127.xml
Various theories are, apparently:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... spy127.xml
If the guy was poisoned by Polonium (?) why in the hell not just have someone knock him off like they did Politikarpovskaya? It takes a lot of effort to pull of a drama like this, why do it?
Think about it. Why go through the trouble when a bullet will suffice? Think, the doctors said it was an unknown substance. I also heard that they found 3 metal objects in his intestines, where are they? Why weren't they removed? Have they been removed?
Facts are taking a backseat to wild speculation and drama here. In the Politikarpovskaya murder no one and I mean no one, ever mentioned the Georgian Mafia.
There's something else going on and it isn't necessarily bad Sushi or bullets or Polonium.
I'm tossing out this guy died of AIDS. 43 is a good age for it and unlike a poisoning, that can't be stopped.
Polonium seems favourite:
"Ex-spy's death: three sent for radiation tests"
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... spy127.xml
Various theories are, apparently:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... spy127.xml
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
I think this one is so strange because it was Polonium poisoning and its hard to see what using that substance was about or why someone would use something so exotic and difficult to obtain, I'm at a bit of a loss to understand what has happened here, but I think its most likely an FSB operation that wasn't necessarily sanctioned, maybe they did it this way just as an experiment to see how to use this material, its a high risk strategy to do something like this on UK soil as British intelligence (who are no amateurs) will eventually work out how and why this was done, and there may be political repercussions, but then security organizations are never very easy to figure out.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Scrat;470896 wrote: Here's a piece of the big picture. Whoever did this, be it one of the exiled oligarchs like Berezovsky and the mafia working for someone or some shadowy FSB group it's a very small part of a much bigger picture.
Russia is quickly rebuilding itself. It is forging ties with China and other countries and is a threat to the wests ambitions. It's down to politics now and both sides are playing it hard and fast. It appears to me that the west is trying to economically isolate Russia, something that will be very hard to do when it comes to energy but not so hard when it comes to business. The full extent of this I don't really know, the point of the current exercise is to distort the image of Russia in the eyes of the world. If you tell someone a lie enough they will believe it. Some of it is also undoubtably, retaliatory. See below.
I have deleted parts of the article but the link to the full text is below.
Russians See `Permanent War' Escalation as Aimed at Them
by Rachel Douglas
[http://www.larouchepub.com/other/2006/3342gazprom.html]
Scrat, trust me on this, no one except nation states and their operatives has access to polonium, most scientists don't even know much about polonoium, its not one of the more studied substances, its so rare that it has to be sythesized to gain any amount of it that would be meaningful to study or use, there are only a handful of labs in the world that actually have any, and its usefulness is very limited and of course its quite a dangerous substance, since its so highly radioactive any amount of it more that a say a gram produces such very high temperatures that it would melt most common metals, and its ludicrously toxic. The only place where it is obtainable is in nuclear research facilities, its rare, exotic, and difficult to produce, and its also (of course) extremely expenisve, and there isn't a snowballs chance in hell that the government of Russia or any other for that matter would allow people involved in organized crime to get their hands on it, why would they even want it, they wouldn't know what is is, and even if somehow they had heard of it, they wouldn't know what to do with it anyway. To be able to use polonium in the way in which hit has this month in london, would require the technical support of specialist scientists, and very very skilled agents. I think its far more probable that the FSB decided to get Litvinenko (who was after all a defected ex-KGB Colonel and was therefore a traitor in Russian security serice eyes). The whole methodolgy and execution of this assissination was definetly state seurity service stuff, not mafiso, they wouldn't have the imagination, resources, or the ability to pull it off. That doesn't mean that there isn't a lot of other stuff involved in whats currently happening in Russia, or that Putin is to blame for all of the murky stuff thats going on at the minute, but he certainly has managed to clamp down on a lot of anti-governemnt dissidents and political opponents, though as Russian leaders go, he is certainly not a particularly bad one, and he has managed to get the country back to stability after the shambolic way it was run in the immeadiate aftermath of the collapse of the Soviet Union, thats from a western perspective not a bad thing, as a stable Russia is very important, I don't see there being any great desire in the U.S. or Europe to upset the apple cart at the minute, though the British are pretty angry about this killing as they don't appreciate people using radioactive materials to posion British nationals on U.K. soil, and who can blame them. Russia has always been an autocratic state, and that mentality will always remain part of the Russian system I think, its cultural, the EU and the U.S. are not enemies of Russia, but they certainly don't trust the Russians fully and never have, no more than the Russians have ever really trusted western powers, thats politics and the nature of the game.
Russia is quickly rebuilding itself. It is forging ties with China and other countries and is a threat to the wests ambitions. It's down to politics now and both sides are playing it hard and fast. It appears to me that the west is trying to economically isolate Russia, something that will be very hard to do when it comes to energy but not so hard when it comes to business. The full extent of this I don't really know, the point of the current exercise is to distort the image of Russia in the eyes of the world. If you tell someone a lie enough they will believe it. Some of it is also undoubtably, retaliatory. See below.
I have deleted parts of the article but the link to the full text is below.
Russians See `Permanent War' Escalation as Aimed at Them
by Rachel Douglas
[http://www.larouchepub.com/other/2006/3342gazprom.html]
Scrat, trust me on this, no one except nation states and their operatives has access to polonium, most scientists don't even know much about polonoium, its not one of the more studied substances, its so rare that it has to be sythesized to gain any amount of it that would be meaningful to study or use, there are only a handful of labs in the world that actually have any, and its usefulness is very limited and of course its quite a dangerous substance, since its so highly radioactive any amount of it more that a say a gram produces such very high temperatures that it would melt most common metals, and its ludicrously toxic. The only place where it is obtainable is in nuclear research facilities, its rare, exotic, and difficult to produce, and its also (of course) extremely expenisve, and there isn't a snowballs chance in hell that the government of Russia or any other for that matter would allow people involved in organized crime to get their hands on it, why would they even want it, they wouldn't know what is is, and even if somehow they had heard of it, they wouldn't know what to do with it anyway. To be able to use polonium in the way in which hit has this month in london, would require the technical support of specialist scientists, and very very skilled agents. I think its far more probable that the FSB decided to get Litvinenko (who was after all a defected ex-KGB Colonel and was therefore a traitor in Russian security serice eyes). The whole methodolgy and execution of this assissination was definetly state seurity service stuff, not mafiso, they wouldn't have the imagination, resources, or the ability to pull it off. That doesn't mean that there isn't a lot of other stuff involved in whats currently happening in Russia, or that Putin is to blame for all of the murky stuff thats going on at the minute, but he certainly has managed to clamp down on a lot of anti-governemnt dissidents and political opponents, though as Russian leaders go, he is certainly not a particularly bad one, and he has managed to get the country back to stability after the shambolic way it was run in the immeadiate aftermath of the collapse of the Soviet Union, thats from a western perspective not a bad thing, as a stable Russia is very important, I don't see there being any great desire in the U.S. or Europe to upset the apple cart at the minute, though the British are pretty angry about this killing as they don't appreciate people using radioactive materials to posion British nationals on U.K. soil, and who can blame them. Russia has always been an autocratic state, and that mentality will always remain part of the Russian system I think, its cultural, the EU and the U.S. are not enemies of Russia, but they certainly don't trust the Russians fully and never have, no more than the Russians have ever really trusted western powers, thats politics and the nature of the game.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;471437 wrote: Scrat, trust me on this, no one except nation states and their operatives has access to polonium
...or other stuff such as enriched (weapons grade) uranium or other radioactive
substances.
Unfortunately, hundreds of Kg. of such substances have been stolen worldwide
over the last few decades.
...or other stuff such as enriched (weapons grade) uranium or other radioactive
substances.
Unfortunately, hundreds of Kg. of such substances have been stolen worldwide
over the last few decades.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Bill Sikes;471447 wrote: ...or other stuff such as enriched (weapons grade) uranium or other radioactive
substances.
Unfortunately, hundreds of Kg. of such substances have been stolen worldwide
over the last few decades.
Yes, a lot went missing after the south africans abandoned their nuclear weapon systems. Though they are not the same thing, and polonium is way more rare than uranium, still after reading scrats post there, I better have a look at that link and see what the story is with that firm in new mexico, if they really are somehow getting polonium and sellling it to private citizens I will have to rethink my last few posts, I am gob smacked if this is true its plain crazy.
substances.
Unfortunately, hundreds of Kg. of such substances have been stolen worldwide
over the last few decades.
Yes, a lot went missing after the south africans abandoned their nuclear weapon systems. Though they are not the same thing, and polonium is way more rare than uranium, still after reading scrats post there, I better have a look at that link and see what the story is with that firm in new mexico, if they really are somehow getting polonium and sellling it to private citizens I will have to rethink my last few posts, I am gob smacked if this is true its plain crazy.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Scrat is absolutely correct, I stand corrected, and thank you scrat for making that information available. I checked out the website, I am gobsmacked, its insane that these substances are being made freely available, even if the order sizes are in the picogram sizes, I am going to email sky news about this, it should be publicised. Who is giving this company these materials and how on earth are they able to give them to anyone by post, considering the current political situation with terrorism, its insane. Here is the link, check it out for yourselves and tell me what you think.
http://www.unitednuclear.com/isotopes.htm
The mind boggles.
http://www.unitednuclear.com/isotopes.htm
The mind boggles.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;471944 wrote: I checked out the website, I am gobsmacked, its insane that these substances are being made freely available, even if the order sizes are in the picogram sizes, I am going to email sky news about this, it should be publicised. Who is giving this company these materials and how on earth are they able to give them to anyone by post, considering the current political situation with terrorism, its insane. Here is the link, check it out for yourselves and tell me what you think.
http://www.unitednuclear.com/isotopes.htm
The mind boggles.
It's quite OK. Also from their site:
"United Nuclear has been featured on nationwide
CBS television news, "Coast to Coast" Radio
with host Art Bell, Wired Magazine, Maximum
Magazine, and many other publications & shows.
See the 'About Us' page for more on our company."
Also:
http://www.unitednuclear.com/faq.htm
http://www.unitednuclear.com/isotopes.htm
The mind boggles.
It's quite OK. Also from their site:
"United Nuclear has been featured on nationwide
CBS television news, "Coast to Coast" Radio
with host Art Bell, Wired Magazine, Maximum
Magazine, and many other publications & shows.
See the 'About Us' page for more on our company."
Also:
http://www.unitednuclear.com/faq.htm
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
ArnoldLayne;471932 wrote:
Quote:
"Because our products can be potentially hazardous in the wrong hands," the site states, "we will occasionally terminate and refund orders if we feel you are juvenile posing as an adult, inexperienced with the materials ordered, or using our products to make any sort of explosive device. All packages containing hazardous chemicals will require an adult signature on delivery."
WHAT ?
You mean they dont check before hand ?
They MIGHT terminate the transaction if they THINK you are a minor ?
What about an international terrorist? Is that ok providing they dont suspect you of being a minor
What possible use can this stuff be to anyone outside the Nuclear industry, that it could be sold to anyone ?
Use? Useful to interested private individuals, schools and universities, industrial
applications, etc.
Quote:
"Because our products can be potentially hazardous in the wrong hands," the site states, "we will occasionally terminate and refund orders if we feel you are juvenile posing as an adult, inexperienced with the materials ordered, or using our products to make any sort of explosive device. All packages containing hazardous chemicals will require an adult signature on delivery."
WHAT ?
You mean they dont check before hand ?
They MIGHT terminate the transaction if they THINK you are a minor ?
What about an international terrorist? Is that ok providing they dont suspect you of being a minor
What possible use can this stuff be to anyone outside the Nuclear industry, that it could be sold to anyone ?
Use? Useful to interested private individuals, schools and universities, industrial
applications, etc.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Bill Sikes;471966 wrote: Use? Useful to interested private individuals, schools and universities, industrial
applications, etc.
I understand that as a scientist bill, and you can make poisons and expolsives from everyday products and items of course, but surely due to the natur of these materials which are all radioactive isotopes, there should be some sort of system whereby private indivduals would have to register why they wanted such materials at least, and what they planned to do with them, considering you need a liscence for a car, I am quite sure the quanties are minute, but all the same it seems very irresponsible as it would be pretty easy for organized groups of people to accumulate enough of these materials for it to be a problem, (and I presume that someone must be keeping an eye on who this stuff is being sold to, hopefully), but still, I think its nuts that anyone over 18 in the US can apparently buy as much say strontium 90 as they can afford and not have to tell anyone, or explain why they want it.
applications, etc.
I understand that as a scientist bill, and you can make poisons and expolsives from everyday products and items of course, but surely due to the natur of these materials which are all radioactive isotopes, there should be some sort of system whereby private indivduals would have to register why they wanted such materials at least, and what they planned to do with them, considering you need a liscence for a car, I am quite sure the quanties are minute, but all the same it seems very irresponsible as it would be pretty easy for organized groups of people to accumulate enough of these materials for it to be a problem, (and I presume that someone must be keeping an eye on who this stuff is being sold to, hopefully), but still, I think its nuts that anyone over 18 in the US can apparently buy as much say strontium 90 as they can afford and not have to tell anyone, or explain why they want it.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Scrat;471973 wrote: Scarey isn't it Gal? In a lot of ways. I was willing to concede some Soviet scientist in a nuclear lab with a wife, kids and no paycheck made and sold some of this stuff to people. If it's this common there is a lot of work to do to track where it came from and who's hands it passed through. Namely certain associates of certain Oligarchs.
Yes, the mafia is limited in the tools it has available but apparently this stuff is easily obtained.
I'll say again, why would the Kremlin go through the trouble? Why would it off Politikaskaya when she has been a pure pain in its butt since 1999? Why do it now?
I think that after Putin shut down those casinos and other dubious businesses owned by Georgians the Georgian mafia retaliated in about the only way they could. They offed her to embarrass Putin.
This guy was offed for the same reason and is part of a wider effort.
It certainly makes your hypothesis much more probable than I thought scrat, I had no idea that these materials were so freely available in the U.S. and it is disturbing I think, I also think that company are very irresponsible as are the people who are supplying them with these isotopes whoever they are.
Yes, the mafia is limited in the tools it has available but apparently this stuff is easily obtained.
I'll say again, why would the Kremlin go through the trouble? Why would it off Politikaskaya when she has been a pure pain in its butt since 1999? Why do it now?
I think that after Putin shut down those casinos and other dubious businesses owned by Georgians the Georgian mafia retaliated in about the only way they could. They offed her to embarrass Putin.
This guy was offed for the same reason and is part of a wider effort.
It certainly makes your hypothesis much more probable than I thought scrat, I had no idea that these materials were so freely available in the U.S. and it is disturbing I think, I also think that company are very irresponsible as are the people who are supplying them with these isotopes whoever they are.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Scrat;471985 wrote: It's all about money and power.
Of that I have no doubt.
Of that I have no doubt.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;471979 wrote: I understand that as a scientist bill, and you can make poisons and expolsives from everyday products and items of course, but surely due to the natur of these materials which are all radioactive isotopes, there should be some sort of system whereby private indivduals would have to register why they wanted such materials at least, and what they planned to do with them, considering you need a liscence for a car, I am quite sure the quanties are minute, but all the same it seems very irresponsible as it would be pretty easy for organized groups of people to accumulate enough of these materials for it to be a problem, (and I presume that someone must be keeping an eye on who this stuff is being sold to, hopefully), but still, I think its nuts that anyone over 18 in the US can apparently buy as much say strontium 90 as they can afford and not have to tell anyone, or explain why they want it.
You can buy as much Americium-241 as you want in B&Q, or your local hardware
shop, in quantities approximately as "active" as the Sr-90 advertised on the
site in question. It's got a far longer half-life, too!
You can buy as much Americium-241 as you want in B&Q, or your local hardware
shop, in quantities approximately as "active" as the Sr-90 advertised on the
site in question. It's got a far longer half-life, too!
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Bill Sikes;471992 wrote: You can buy as much Americium-241 as you want in B&Q, or your local hardware
shop, in quantities approximately as "active" as the Sr-90 advertised on the
site in question. It's got a far longer half-life, too!
Yes I know its used in things like smoke detectors, which is why they have to be disposed of in landfills, but you know right well its not the same as buying Polonium 210 in a pure form from this US company. Can you also get Thallium 204 and Cesium 137 from Homebase I wonder, maybe some radium would be nice for lighting up the christmas tree?
shop, in quantities approximately as "active" as the Sr-90 advertised on the
site in question. It's got a far longer half-life, too!
Yes I know its used in things like smoke detectors, which is why they have to be disposed of in landfills, but you know right well its not the same as buying Polonium 210 in a pure form from this US company. Can you also get Thallium 204 and Cesium 137 from Homebase I wonder, maybe some radium would be nice for lighting up the christmas tree?
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;471996 wrote: Yes I know its used in things like smoke detectors, which is why they have to be disposed of in landfills, but you know right well its not the same as buying Polonium 210 (...)
You said Sr-90....
Galbally;471996 wrote: (...) in a pure form from this US company.
You cannot buy it "in a pure form" from that company.
Galbally;471996 wrote: Can you also get Thallium 204 and Cesium 137 from Homebase I wonder, maybe some radium would be nice for lighting up the christmas tree?
Caesium-137, yes (Caesium is IUPAC spelling, not "cesium").
Tl-204, maybe not, I'm unsure - you could from an instrumentation supplier.
Radium? I'm not sure that United Nuclear sell sources. You could buy some
vintage instrument such as a watch, or other glow-in-the-dark object, or
even nip off to Cornwall, Northampton, Sheffield, or wherever, and pick up
a lump of rock if you wanted some.
You said Sr-90....
Galbally;471996 wrote: (...) in a pure form from this US company.
You cannot buy it "in a pure form" from that company.
Galbally;471996 wrote: Can you also get Thallium 204 and Cesium 137 from Homebase I wonder, maybe some radium would be nice for lighting up the christmas tree?
Caesium-137, yes (Caesium is IUPAC spelling, not "cesium").
Tl-204, maybe not, I'm unsure - you could from an instrumentation supplier.
Radium? I'm not sure that United Nuclear sell sources. You could buy some
vintage instrument such as a watch, or other glow-in-the-dark object, or
even nip off to Cornwall, Northampton, Sheffield, or wherever, and pick up
a lump of rock if you wanted some.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Bill Sikes;472020 wrote: You said Sr-90....
You cannot buy it "in a pure form" from that company.
Caesium-137, yes (Caesium is IUPAC spelling, not "cesium").
Tl-204, maybe not, I'm unsure - you could from an instrumentation supplier.
Radium? I'm not sure that United Nuclear sell sources. You could buy some
vintage instrument such as a watch, or other glow-in-the-dark object, or
even nip off to Cornwall, Northampton, Sheffield, or wherever, and pick up
a lump of rock if you wanted some.
I was being faecetious Bill, there is no need to get all uppity on me, I'm a trained chemist ok?, and I'm not going to get into a technical debate right now to prove how clever I think I am, I will just say that I understand what these things are and I'm not just mouthing off. My problem with this one, and I admit I havn't spent all day looking at the site as I'm busy, but from a fairly brief look at what they are offering, and the way its being offered is that it seems far far to easy for someone with the right knowledge to abuse such an open and seemingly unregulated method of obtaining radioactive isotopes, which are by their nature dangerous.
You cannot buy it "in a pure form" from that company.
Caesium-137, yes (Caesium is IUPAC spelling, not "cesium").
Tl-204, maybe not, I'm unsure - you could from an instrumentation supplier.
Radium? I'm not sure that United Nuclear sell sources. You could buy some
vintage instrument such as a watch, or other glow-in-the-dark object, or
even nip off to Cornwall, Northampton, Sheffield, or wherever, and pick up
a lump of rock if you wanted some.
I was being faecetious Bill, there is no need to get all uppity on me, I'm a trained chemist ok?, and I'm not going to get into a technical debate right now to prove how clever I think I am, I will just say that I understand what these things are and I'm not just mouthing off. My problem with this one, and I admit I havn't spent all day looking at the site as I'm busy, but from a fairly brief look at what they are offering, and the way its being offered is that it seems far far to easy for someone with the right knowledge to abuse such an open and seemingly unregulated method of obtaining radioactive isotopes, which are by their nature dangerous.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;472061 wrote: I was being faecetious Bill, there is no need to get all uppity on me, I'm a trained chemist ok?, and I'm not going to get into a technical debate right now to prove how clever I think I am, I will just say that I understand what these things are and I'm not just mouthing off. My problem with this one, and I admit I havn't spent all day looking at the site as I'm busy, but from a fairly brief look at what they are offering, and the way its being offered is that it seems far far to easy for someone with the right knowledge to abuse such an open and seemingly unregulated method of obtaining radioactive isotopes, which are by their nature dangerous.
If you say so. What sort of trained chemist, as a matter of interest? I was
just making the point that radioactive sources are readily available from many
suppliers, in many forms. This one isn't anything to get specially het up about!
If you say so. What sort of trained chemist, as a matter of interest? I was
just making the point that radioactive sources are readily available from many
suppliers, in many forms. This one isn't anything to get specially het up about!
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Bill Sikes;472064 wrote: If you say so. What sort of trained chemist, as a matter of interest? I was
just making the point that radioactive sources are readily available from many
suppliers, in many forms. This one isn't anything to get specially het up about!
OK, I have honours degrees in industrial and environmental chemistry, i have accredited qualifications for analytical science and laboratory practice, and I am a member of the Royal Society of Chemistry, which is just next door to the Royal Academy in London if you ever want to drop in. I have worked in the petrochemcial industry, in r&d, and in science publishing as an editor and a writer, I am currently trying to get back into full time research and gain my doctorate, though I want to get into biochem and lifescience work as thats where the action is nowadays. I am not an authority on nuclear physics or these materials, though obviously I have a good understanding of them and have studied them to some extent and all that. I also know about radium and the celebrated case of the clever young man in America who managed to extract so much of it from old antique clocks and flouresent materials from a more naive time that he managed to cause a nuclear alert in his neighborhood, luckily no one seems to have been permanently effected by his little home made atomic reactor. I'm not questioing the fact that people can quite legally access radioactive isotopes in the course of research or industry, I am surprised that a company is selling polonium and thallium iostopes over the internet to anyone with no questions asked as long as they have a credit card number or a paypal account. You certainly can't buy these particular things in the U.K. in such a straightforward manner (if at all, I'm not sure), no more than you can go and buy large bulk quantities of selenium or polyphosporic acid "off the shelf" for personal use as it were, though you can certainly legally purcahse them from chemical suppliers, but there are laws and regulations controlling the sale and use of most hazardous substances and thats the way it should be. (rat poison and weedkiller, yes I know you can get as much of them as you want). I know because I've had to do chemical materials purchase invoicing and paperwork plenty of times. I am all for people being allowed to purcahse materials for research whether its as part of a company laboratory or their own work, but I think its only common sense that it should be regulated. I mean it used to be the case where you were able to buy paracetmol in bulk quantities, but that made suicide so convienent that they put a moratorium on pack sizes, its also of course true that lots of everyday things can be quite easily turned into explosives and poisons if you have a little knowhow and the right equipment, but honestly I am amazed that you can legally buy some of these isotopes so easily and legally in the U.S., I find it surprising anyway.
just making the point that radioactive sources are readily available from many
suppliers, in many forms. This one isn't anything to get specially het up about!
OK, I have honours degrees in industrial and environmental chemistry, i have accredited qualifications for analytical science and laboratory practice, and I am a member of the Royal Society of Chemistry, which is just next door to the Royal Academy in London if you ever want to drop in. I have worked in the petrochemcial industry, in r&d, and in science publishing as an editor and a writer, I am currently trying to get back into full time research and gain my doctorate, though I want to get into biochem and lifescience work as thats where the action is nowadays. I am not an authority on nuclear physics or these materials, though obviously I have a good understanding of them and have studied them to some extent and all that. I also know about radium and the celebrated case of the clever young man in America who managed to extract so much of it from old antique clocks and flouresent materials from a more naive time that he managed to cause a nuclear alert in his neighborhood, luckily no one seems to have been permanently effected by his little home made atomic reactor. I'm not questioing the fact that people can quite legally access radioactive isotopes in the course of research or industry, I am surprised that a company is selling polonium and thallium iostopes over the internet to anyone with no questions asked as long as they have a credit card number or a paypal account. You certainly can't buy these particular things in the U.K. in such a straightforward manner (if at all, I'm not sure), no more than you can go and buy large bulk quantities of selenium or polyphosporic acid "off the shelf" for personal use as it were, though you can certainly legally purcahse them from chemical suppliers, but there are laws and regulations controlling the sale and use of most hazardous substances and thats the way it should be. (rat poison and weedkiller, yes I know you can get as much of them as you want). I know because I've had to do chemical materials purchase invoicing and paperwork plenty of times. I am all for people being allowed to purcahse materials for research whether its as part of a company laboratory or their own work, but I think its only common sense that it should be regulated. I mean it used to be the case where you were able to buy paracetmol in bulk quantities, but that made suicide so convienent that they put a moratorium on pack sizes, its also of course true that lots of everyday things can be quite easily turned into explosives and poisons if you have a little knowhow and the right equipment, but honestly I am amazed that you can legally buy some of these isotopes so easily and legally in the U.S., I find it surprising anyway.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
dr g
why does EPDM rubber last so long ?
why does EPDM rubber last so long ?
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
jimbo;472304 wrote: dr g
why does EPDM rubber last so long ?
EPDM rubber? That stands for ethylene propylene rubber or something like that I think?, its probably because its a synthetic polymer and its got a very stable structure or something like that (like PET plastics which is what plastic bottles are made of and which last for a long time), polymers or plastics are very long lived becuase of their chemical structure which is based on long chains of repeating carbon chains that are hard to break down, its not really something I know much about, but thats my best guess, its kinda got similarities to a lot of other plastics so thats probably it. Guess that would make it better for a lot of applications than natural rubber, but I don't know what its exact properties are or anything. Don't think we would have any radioactivity issues with it, :wah: but a lot of these plastics are kinda bad because they don't degrade like other natural sustances over time, though they have biodegradeable ones now. Hamster has a chemistry degree as well you know, she would know about a lot of this stuff.
why does EPDM rubber last so long ?
EPDM rubber? That stands for ethylene propylene rubber or something like that I think?, its probably because its a synthetic polymer and its got a very stable structure or something like that (like PET plastics which is what plastic bottles are made of and which last for a long time), polymers or plastics are very long lived becuase of their chemical structure which is based on long chains of repeating carbon chains that are hard to break down, its not really something I know much about, but thats my best guess, its kinda got similarities to a lot of other plastics so thats probably it. Guess that would make it better for a lot of applications than natural rubber, but I don't know what its exact properties are or anything. Don't think we would have any radioactivity issues with it, :wah: but a lot of these plastics are kinda bad because they don't degrade like other natural sustances over time, though they have biodegradeable ones now. Hamster has a chemistry degree as well you know, she would know about a lot of this stuff.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;472325 wrote: EPDM rubber? That stands for ethylene propylene rubber or something like that I think?, its probably because its a synthetic polymer and its got a very stable structure or something like that (like PET plastics which is what plastic bottles are made of and which last for a long time), polymers or plastics are very long lived becuase of their chemical structure which is based on long chains of repeating carbon chains that are hard to break down, its not really something I know much about, but thats my best guess, its kinda got similarities to a lot of other plastics so thats probably it. Guess that would make it better for a lot of applications than natural rubber, but I don't know what its exact properties are or anything. Don't think we would have any radioactivity issues with it, :wah: but a lot of these plastics are kinda bad because they don't degrade like other natural sustances over time, though they have biodegradeable ones now. Hamster has a chemistry degree as well you know, she would know about a lot of this stuff.
thanks doc g
i use it for work and its spozed to last for 50 years , i guy took a sample tested it at his work and 2 years later i got the job i never knew why the stuff lasted so long ...:wah: it might be good for shielding yourself from poison rain though and nuclear fall out who knows it does everything else
thanks doc g
i use it for work and its spozed to last for 50 years , i guy took a sample tested it at his work and 2 years later i got the job i never knew why the stuff lasted so long ...:wah: it might be good for shielding yourself from poison rain though and nuclear fall out who knows it does everything else
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
jimbo;472329 wrote: thanks doc g
i use it for work and its spozed to last for 50 years , i guy took a sample tested it at his work and 2 years later i got the job i never knew why the stuff lasted so long ...:wah: it might be good for shielding yourself from poison rain though and nuclear fall out who knows it does everything else
Don't worry, if the bomb goes off somewhere, just go out and party until the drink runs out and the lights go out, there won't be much we can do about it! :wah:
i use it for work and its spozed to last for 50 years , i guy took a sample tested it at his work and 2 years later i got the job i never knew why the stuff lasted so long ...:wah: it might be good for shielding yourself from poison rain though and nuclear fall out who knows it does everything else
Don't worry, if the bomb goes off somewhere, just go out and party until the drink runs out and the lights go out, there won't be much we can do about it! :wah:
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;472332 wrote: Don't worry, if the bomb goes off somewhere, just go out and party until the drink runs out and the lights go out, there won't be much we can do about it! :wah:
wow wrapped in rubber , drunk partying till i die sounds good to me :wah: :wah:
wow wrapped in rubber , drunk partying till i die sounds good to me :wah: :wah:
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Scrat;472699 wrote: Well this mess isn't getting any clearer. That's the big point here, it's all theatrics, cloak and dagger and media hype. Other than the fact that Putin has made some very rich and very powerful (in the west at least) enemies Ineed to point out and try to emphasize the dramatics here. I haven't seen a lot of cold hard facts as of late.
Here's a link to an opinion piece. A good read and the last portion which I put up says a lot. Don't so much look at the intrigue and mystery, look at where the media is going with it.
Linky. http://comment.independent.co.uk/column ... 998839.ece
I would also recall this. In February 2004, journalists were invited to a plush hotel (as it happens, also in Piccadilly), to be regaled with an extraordinary story from a bedraggled Russian MP, who was standing against Putin in imminent elections. The MP, Ivan Rybkin, gave a muddled account of being abducted, put on a train, drugged and filmed in compromising positions. It was all, we were told, the doing of Putin and his secret agents.
The truth turned out to be rather different. Rybkin, not for the first time, had been on a bender. He and his supporters abroad had found an ingenious way of "explaining" his absence to his wife and discrediting Putin at the same time. Alas, Rybkin could not keep up the pretence.
As I write, there seems no doubt that Litvinenko is a one-time KGB agent and that his illness is real. For the rest, a great many questions remain open.
Not diagreeing with too much of what you are saying, just clarifying that Litvenko is not ill, he is dead.
Here's a link to an opinion piece. A good read and the last portion which I put up says a lot. Don't so much look at the intrigue and mystery, look at where the media is going with it.
Linky. http://comment.independent.co.uk/column ... 998839.ece
I would also recall this. In February 2004, journalists were invited to a plush hotel (as it happens, also in Piccadilly), to be regaled with an extraordinary story from a bedraggled Russian MP, who was standing against Putin in imminent elections. The MP, Ivan Rybkin, gave a muddled account of being abducted, put on a train, drugged and filmed in compromising positions. It was all, we were told, the doing of Putin and his secret agents.
The truth turned out to be rather different. Rybkin, not for the first time, had been on a bender. He and his supporters abroad had found an ingenious way of "explaining" his absence to his wife and discrediting Putin at the same time. Alas, Rybkin could not keep up the pretence.
As I write, there seems no doubt that Litvinenko is a one-time KGB agent and that his illness is real. For the rest, a great many questions remain open.
Not diagreeing with too much of what you are saying, just clarifying that Litvenko is not ill, he is dead.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
-
Bill Sikes
- Posts: 5515
- Joined: Fri Aug 20, 2004 2:21 am
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Galbally;472291 wrote: OK, I have honours degrees in industrial and environmental chemistry, i have accredited qualifications for analytical science and laboratory practice, and I am a member of the Royal Society of Chemistry, which is just next door to the Royal Academy in London if you ever want to drop in. I have worked in the petrochemcial industry, in r&d, and in science publishing as an editor and a writer, I am currently trying to get back into full time research and gain my doctorate, though I want to get into biochem and lifescience work as thats where the action is nowadays. I am not an authority on nuclear physics or these materials, though obviously I have a good understanding of them and have studied them to some extent and all that. I also know about radium and the celebrated case of the clever young man in America who managed to extract so much of it from old antique clocks and flouresent materials from a more naive time that he managed to cause a nuclear alert in his neighborhood, luckily no one seems to have been permanently effected by his little home made atomic reactor.
Ah! I thought you were a lab. technician, by the way you wrote. Have just
looked up "David Hahn". He didn't get very far, thank goodness - his efforts
were apparently disposed of in landfill as "low level radioactive waste".
Ah! I thought you were a lab. technician, by the way you wrote. Have just
looked up "David Hahn". He didn't get very far, thank goodness - his efforts
were apparently disposed of in landfill as "low level radioactive waste".
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Bill Sikes;473149 wrote: Ah! I thought you were a lab. technician, by the way you wrote. Have just
looked up "David Hahn". He didn't get very far, thank goodness - his efforts
were apparently disposed of in landfill as "low level radioactive waste".
Well, being considered a lab technician isn't the worst thing in the world I suppose! :wah: I think because I was genuninly surprised that these isotopes were being sold so easily over the net, which hadn't occurred to me, I may have come across as being a bit hysterical or naive about science-related matters, but I am not I assure you. I did actually consider going into a particular nuclear-chemistry postgrad master degree course after university as I find that particular area very interesting because of the cross-over with physics, and because you tend not to do very much of it in the degrees I did, but other things came up at the time like they always do. And now that I have been so kind as to bare my career-soul, what may I ask are you? in a professional sense of course.
looked up "David Hahn". He didn't get very far, thank goodness - his efforts
were apparently disposed of in landfill as "low level radioactive waste".
Well, being considered a lab technician isn't the worst thing in the world I suppose! :wah: I think because I was genuninly surprised that these isotopes were being sold so easily over the net, which hadn't occurred to me, I may have come across as being a bit hysterical or naive about science-related matters, but I am not I assure you. I did actually consider going into a particular nuclear-chemistry postgrad master degree course after university as I find that particular area very interesting because of the cross-over with physics, and because you tend not to do very much of it in the degrees I did, but other things came up at the time like they always do. And now that I have been so kind as to bare my career-soul, what may I ask are you? in a professional sense of course.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Diuretic;473177 wrote: I know this is a serious thread on as serious subject but my flippant tendencies got hold of me and I started thinking about a certain parrot. Okay, as you were.
Oh, like the norwegian blue in the pet shop, I get it, yes, perhaps not the thread for monty python references.
Oh, like the norwegian blue in the pet shop, I get it, yes, perhaps not the thread for monty python references.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Diuretic;473206 wrote: No, completely inappropriate. I did cough to impulsiveness in the "personal faults" thread though.
So now for something completely different.
So now for something completely different.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Russian ex-KGB colonel assasinated in London.
Not much to say more today in the way of opinion about this story, but its getting (as Lewis Carroll would say) "curiouser and curiouser". I'd say the British governmet must be quietly furious with the Russians about this, though I'm not saying that the Russian governemnt was directly reponsible, but I think that its pretty compelling that there are mixed up in it very deeply whether they have ordered this or not.
"We are never so happy, never so unhappy, as we imagine"
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.
Le Rochefoucauld.
"A smack in the face settles all arguments, then you can move on kid."
My dad 1986.