Jerry Falwell has....

Adam Zapple · Post by **Adam Zapple** » Tue May 15, 2007 11:12 am

...died.

crazygal · Post by **crazygal** » Tue May 15, 2007 11:13 am

OK

Something he had for breakfast I bet.

chonsigirl · Post by **chonsigirl** » Tue May 15, 2007 11:34 am

He was at the university when he collapsed....

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18679412/

WonderWendy3 · Post by **WonderWendy3** » Tue May 15, 2007 11:40 am

Thank you Chonsi....I'm sorry to hear about his death.:-1

Post by **spot** » Tue May 15, 2007 1:10 pm

The archetypal American has passed on? They'll not be an easy pair of boots to fill.

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Tue May 15, 2007 1:24 pm

spot;613517 wrote: The archetypal American has passed on? They'll not be an easy pair of boots to fill.
:wah: Thanks alot Spot.:wah:

WonderWendy3 · Post by **WonderWendy3** » Tue May 15, 2007 1:33 pm

magenta flame;613530 wrote: I read the article, never heard of him.

He's a Well-Known Evangelist over here, who gets a lot of critisizm.---Well used to.

Post by **spot** » Tue May 15, 2007 2:52 pm

YZGI;613527 wrote: :wah: Thanks alot Spot.:wah:

He's been eagerly awaiting this day since he was nineteen, I think a round of applause is in order. Bravo Jerry Falwell, safe at last.

An appropriate verse wouldn't go amiss:

Thou Judge of quick and dead,

Before whose bar severe,

With holy joy, or guilty dread,

We all shall soon appear;

Our cautioned souls prepare

For that tremendous day,

And fill us now with watchful care,

And stir us up to pray.

If anyone wants an entire hymn of welcome, I scanned http://www.ccel.org/w/wesley/hymn/jwg09/jwg0949.html a long time ago. I don't know a better funeral hymn.

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Tue May 15, 2007 3:02 pm

Pinky;613613 wrote: Who was Jerry Falwell?

He was a holier than thou Evangelist

Post by **spot** » Tue May 15, 2007 3:08 pm

Pinky;613619 wrote: Oh well. One less.

You misunderstand, Pinky. Practically everyone on the planet is a holier than thou evangelist in yzgi's context. The emphasis was on "thou".

saffy · Post by **saffy** » Tue May 15, 2007 3:22 pm

Nice one.

weinbeck · Post by **weinbeck** » Tue May 15, 2007 4:25 pm

magenta flame;613657 wrote: $200 million huh? may I ask what all that money went into? YOu tend not to make much of a profit when being charitable .hhhmmm I wonder.

I've just read the article. I don't know why everybody seems so ready to jeer at him. He stood against the things I stand against myself - pornography, homosexuality, lesbianism... I'd like to have met him. When God calls me you'll no doubt have a damn good laugh after having read my threads on the Christianity board, namely "Top-shelf magazines and all that..." He knew his health was less than perfect and was probably fully prepared to meet God, as am I if the Lord calls me tomorrow. As I told somebody earlier, you can laugh all the way to Hell, but you certainly won't laugh your way out.

His family will be in my prayers.

Sweet Tooth · Post by **Sweet Tooth** » Tue May 15, 2007 6:11 pm

Pinky;613694 wrote: You think Lesbians and Homosexuals are going to hell? They're born that way, which must mean 'God' made them that way. Why on earth would he send one of his own creations to hell?

How are you going to expain your judgemental attitude to god then? Would he want you to condemn his children? That's for 'Him' to do, not you.

I hope heaven is much more fun and far more tolerant than earth is for you, because it sounds to me like you're going by what some mysoginistic dude wrote at the turn of the last millenia.
you should probably start another thread on that one Pinky!

Post by **spot** » Tue May 15, 2007 6:31 pm

weinbeck;613676 wrote: I've just read the article. I don't know why everybody seems so ready to jeer at him. Umm. I thought I'd been entirely respectful throughout the thread. Perhaps I mis-expressed myself.

randmlaws · Post by **randmlaws** » Tue May 15, 2007 8:21 pm

Pinky, I dont believe that u r born queer/gay/homo/ or what ever u want to call them.

And since God is the reason that we are all here in the first place, if he was to make u that when u r born then the bible would not speak against homosexuality and the rest of the filth that has been on this earth since adam and eve disobeyed him.

He has destroyed cities because of the homos, drugs, whores, murderers, adultery, and devil loving people.

I have a brother that is homo and NO HE WAS NOT BORN THAT WAY. He chose that way of life and i pray for him every day. He also agrees that he was not born that way or that he is going to hell if he doesn't change his ways.

So the christian world has lost a person who stood up for what he belived no matter what people said to him or about him....

The least that any of us could do is show some respect for him and his family.

gmc · Post by **gmc** » Wed May 16, 2007 5:07 am

WonderWendy3;613534 wrote: He's a Well-Known Evangelist over here, who gets a lot of critisizm.---Well used to.

He's most famous over here for being the man who accused tinky winky of being gay.

On Tinky-Winky: "He is purple - the gay-pride colour; and his antenna is shaped like a triangle - the gay-pride symbol."

Adam Zapple · Post by **Adam Zapple** » Wed May 16, 2007 5:18 am

Falwell said some stupid things but I imagine that if we had the national media ready to jump on everything we said, that we could come up with a few doozies, too. Falwell was not a televangelist, he was not an activist ala Jackson/Sharpton, he was at heart simply a preacher who stood up for what he thought was right.

zinkyusa · Post by **zinkyusa** » Wed May 16, 2007 5:40 am

Falwell was a media savy preacher for sure. He pretty much stood for everything I am against in this country. He acknowledged that some of things he said were simply to get a spot on TV. For example when he denounced Bishop Desmond Tutu he was invited on CBS evening news the next night.

I think he was wrong on a lot things, abortion, gay rights, secularization, and evolution to name a few. Since he followed a literal interpretation of the Bible that is no surprise.

I think he certainly accomplished some very good things as well in his concerns and aid for the sick and poor (just had to make sure they got their prescribed dose of religous medicine with the aid).

Spot is right, he was an archetype for a large portion of America (but I think not a majority).

WonderWendy3 · Post by **WonderWendy3** » Wed May 16, 2007 7:33 am

WonderWendy3;613534 wrote: He's a Well-Known Evangelist over here, who gets a lot of critisizm.---Well used to.

....And still is.....

I understand that he has been the butt of a lot of jokes, but ummm, the man has passed away...It would be nice to show some respect to the Man's family and friends. He did love God, and stood up for what he believed. Right, wrong or indifferent.....

weinbeck · Post by **weinbeck** » Wed May 16, 2007 9:59 am

Pinky;614104 wrote: Filth? I'm sure the rest of your fellow christians are disgusted at you calling human beings filth. So You don't believe god is omnipotent then? Obviously not, since he didn't create gay people according to you. That's a really christian attitude that is. It's people with views like yours that have been the reason throughout history for religious wars and death because of intolerance. Your god did not give you the right to judge anyone else, or cause hatred in his world.

Think about that one.

And sorry, but it's been scientifically proven that gay people are born with a certain gene that makes them that way. Look it up for yourself.

God could have made us like little tin soldiers with no minds of our own, so that every Sunday we would go to church and worship Him. But He didn't: He gave me and most other people somethin almost as priceless as life itself - He gave me a mind and a free will to do whatever I wished, and He also gave me a consience to go with it. And, of course, a Bible, which I try to use to help me through my everyday life. If I choose to rape somebody or sit in a public lavatory masturbating myself senseless into a pornographic magazine, then that's my option - all I do know is I that I am answerable to God for my actions at the end of my life, as are we all, believers or atheists. A man shall reap exactly what he sows - Galatians 6 v 7 - 9. "Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. FOR HE WHO SOWS TO HIS FLESH WILL OF THE FLESH REAP CORRUPTION, BUT HE WHO SOWS TO THE SPIRIT WILL OF THE SPIRIT REAP EVERLASTING LIFE." The whole of Leviticus 18 is dedicated to what or what is not permissable by God concerning sexual morality. God's words, not mine. I won't preach because it's all covered in "top-shelf magazines and all that..." in the Christianity board. I am ready to meet God, because as a Christian, I place my my faith 100% in my Saviour Jesus Christ.

Sweet Tooth · Post by **Sweet Tooth** » Wed May 16, 2007 11:07 am

Pinky;614104 wrote: Filth? I'm sure the rest of your fellow christians are disgusted at you calling human beings filth. So You don't believe god is omnipotent then? Obviously not, since he didn't create gay people according to you. That's a really christian attitude that is. It's people with views like yours that have been the reason throughout history for religious wars and death because of intolerance. Your god did not give you the right to judge anyone else, or cause hatred in his world.

Think about that one.

And sorry, but it's been scientifically proven that gay people are born with a certain gene that makes them that way. Look it up for yourself.

As a fellow Christian, I am not disgusted in him calling the human race filth. God speaks against homosexuality in the Bible. It also says that God made us in His own image. Not saying that we don't think for ourselves now. So if God hated homosexuality, there is no way he created us that way. That, i think, is what we Christians are trying to say.

saffy · Post by **saffy** » Wed May 16, 2007 11:33 am

The bible also said that eating shellfish was an abomination...

Ted · Post by **Ted** » Wed May 16, 2007 8:10 pm

I have no desire to speak ill of the dead. I did not agree with him and firmly believe that he caused more harm then good. So I shall say no more about him.

However, I am in agreement with Pinky on the issue of sexual orientation. The Bible is being misused, misquoted, and has become an object of idolatry better known as Biblolatry.

Yes it would appear, and I do say appear, that homosexuality is a sin. If we take this literally then it is also a sin to eat shell fish, wear clothing created of more then one fiber, sow more then one kind of seed in a field. It is also quite all right to stone prostitutes, and recalcitrant children. So we have here a good example of the picking and choosing that goes on with the Bible and the resulting idolatry. This picking and choosing goes on in the fundamentalist/literalist camp though they vehemently deny it.

I could also speak to the NT comments as well but will save that for some time when someone is interested.

Pinky:-6

If you wish to start a thread on this I will support you completely.

The only filth in sexual orientation is the abuse that so called Christians subject them to. That is the sin and not the sexual orientation nor the acting upon that orientation.

That damned purple teletubby gay!!! LOL. I guess I saw a gay sun shade today as well.

Shalom

Ted:-6

saffy · Post by **saffy** » Thu May 17, 2007 4:39 am

But I wouldn't freely allow them to be around my kids or anyone I cared about to allow them the chance to convince others in an atempt to justify thier own misbehavior ans sin

What the heck are they going to do to your kids?

Touch them with their 'gay' hands and infect them?

What about bisexual people?

zinkyusa · Post by **zinkyusa** » Thu May 17, 2007 6:30 am

Some of the comments I have read here are so narrowminded and foolish they make me want to yak. You have as much chance of praying someone out being gay or therapizing (sorry Spot for my massacre of the English language) them out of being gay as you do of wishing someone out of being diabetic, or allergic to pennicillin. Of course it is hardwired in some manner and the proof will be soon be available, it's simply a matter of time. One hundred years ago people were locked up and put away for being crazy due to diabetic induced pyschosis. To say "Gee I wish you were not gay" makes as much as sense as shooting somone allergic to penicillin full of the stuff and then saying "Gee I really wish you wouldn't swell up like that". Sorry to stay off of topic but this Biblical nonsense cannot go unchallenged.

Richard Bell · Post by **Richard Bell** » Thu May 17, 2007 8:55 am

Adam Zapple;613887 wrote: . Falwell was not a televangelist, he was not an activist ala Jackson/Sharpton

The sanctimonious Three Stooges.

he was at heart simply a preacher who stood up for what he thought was right

So was the Ayatollah Khomeini.

Richard Bell · Post by **Richard Bell** » Thu May 17, 2007 9:04 am

spot;613517 wrote: The archetypal American has passed on? They'll not be an easy pair of boots to fill.

Just fill those boots with sh!t, and outside of the improvement, few will notice :

From wikipedia :

In the 1980s Jerry Falwell was critical of sanctions against the Apartheid regime of South Africa. He drew the ire of many when he called Nobel Peace Prize winner and Anglican Archbishop Desmond Tutu a phony "as far as representing the black people of South Africa." He later apologized for that remark and claimed that he had misspoken. He also urged his followers to buy up gold Krugerrands and push U.S. "reinvestment" in South Africa.

From wikipedia :

After the September 11, 2001 attacks, Falwell said on the 700 Club, "I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way, all of them who have tried to secularize America. I point the finger in their face and say 'you helped this happen.'"

Post by **spot** » Thu May 17, 2007 9:24 am

Pinky;615169 wrote: In light of that last quote, I'd like to say that I feel proud of myself in that case!:wah: :wah:

Reading many of the obituaries this week, I'm surprised nobody suggested yet that "He later apologized for that remark" be carved on his gravestone, he said it so often about so many things.

An ability to recognise one's failings and admit them in public marks a noble nature.

Richard Bell · Post by **Richard Bell** » Thu May 17, 2007 9:35 am

spot;615176 wrote: Reading many of the obituaries this week, I'm surprised nobody suggested yet that "He later apologized for that remark" be carved on his gravestone, he said it so often about so many things.

From blip.tv :

He told CNN just one week before his death that he still believes that gays and pro-choicers caused September 11. So much for his apology.

http://blip.tv/file/230035/

An ability to recognise one's failings and admit them in public marks a noble nature

Yet Falwell was a self appointed judge and jury when he would heap his scorn on those he deemed to have failed (gays, liberals, atheists,feminists,pro-choicers yadda, yadda, yadda...)

A less than noble individual AFAIC.

Sweet Tooth · Post by **Sweet Tooth** » Thu May 17, 2007 9:42 am

Ok, before you guys go slamming him for saying that stuff, its important to know what he believes in. As a Christian, what he is saying has some truth, his tact suffers though. God has promised us that the world will get so bad that countries will turn on each other and "natural disasters" will take place. This is all happening because the world is falling away from God. It's not jus the homosexuals hes targeting per say, its those who choose not to follow Christ.

Adam Zapple · Post by **Adam Zapple** » Thu May 17, 2007 9:59 am

Bigotry and intolerance comes from all corners. I had hoped this thread would stay focused on Falwell and not get hijacked to other issues that have been covered ad nauseam on this site. I will admit my motives in posting this thread were not what you might think. I made the OP short and didn't elaborated because I was interested seeing the responses. See, I have a theory that is being born out. I will say that with a few exceptions, FG has represented itself well.

The conventional wisdom seems to say that conservatives and right-wingers, esp of the religious variety, are hateful, mean-spirited, and intolerant. But certain events show the opposite - that left-wingers are far more intolerant that right-wingers. Take speeches on college campuses for example. Conservative speakers are routinely shouted down by protest groups who either try to prevent the speaker from coming to campus or attempt to keep them from being heard. Conservative student groups just don't engage in such behavior. Liberal guest speakers rarely face problems being able to speak.

When Ronald Reagan died, the reaction on the left resembled the arab streets. On sites such as Democratic Underground and Daily Kos, their was virtual dancing on his grave, you could almost hear the celebratory gunfire into the air. When conservative radio host Laura Ingraham was diagnoses with breast cancer and Tony Snow with colon cancer, there were universal wishes that they die long painful deaths and burn in hell. These leftist sites had no such reaction when Elizabeth Edwards was revealed to have breast cancer. And if you visit those type sites you will see that they are proudly, in their own words, dancing and "pissing' on Falwell's grave. These are not fringe left groups, these are prominent Democratic message boards that are visited by average people like you on me, they are just almost exclusive liberal and incredibly hateful and vile. You just don't see reactions from the right when a prominent liberal public figure dies. This thread was kind of an experiment.

Post by **spot** » Thu May 17, 2007 10:07 am

Richard Bell;615181 wrote: Yet Falwell was a self appointed judge and jury when he would heap his scorn on those he deemed to have failed (gays, liberals, atheists, yadda, yadda, yadda...)

A less than noble individual AFAIC.Hey, be careful whose toes you're stepping on, "self appointed judge and jury when he would heap his scorn on those he deemed to have failed" fits me to perfection.Sweet Tooth;615185 wrote: Ok, before you guys go slamming him for saying that stuff, its important to know what he believes in. As a Christian, what he is saying has some truth, his tact suffers though. God has promised us that the world will get so bad that countries will turn on each other and "natural disasters" will take place. This is all happening because the world is falling away from God. It's not jus the homosexuals hes targeting per say, its those who choose not to follow Christ.Choosing between fundamentalist Christianity and fundamentalist Islam is a no-brainer. I'll take fundamentalist Islam any day. It's less aggressive. Neither carries any more intrinsic or unique truth than the other.

Post by **spot** » Thu May 17, 2007 10:16 am

Adam Zapple;615193 wrote: These leftist sites had no such reaction when Elizabeth Edwards was revealed to have breast cancer. And if you visit those type sites you will see that they are proudly, in their own words, dancing and "pissing' on Falwell's grave. These are not fringe left groups, these are prominent Democratic message boards that are visited by average people like you on me, they are just almost exclusive liberal and incredibly hateful and vile. You just don't see reactions from the right when a prominent liberal public figure dies. This thread was kind of an experiment.You seem to have very little idea of what left-wing liberal means in the real world, Adam. There may exist a left-wing liberal American but I've seen four-leaved clovers more often. Compared to me (a reasonably representative European left-wing liberal) what you think of as a left-wing liberal has fewer socialist pretensions than Genghis Khan.

Gore Vidal, for example, is a left-wing liberal. I doubt whether you'll find him dancing and pissing on Falwell's grave. Anyone who does is better described, instead, as a representative American. Uncouth, noisy and shallow.

Sweet Tooth · Post by **Sweet Tooth** » Thu May 17, 2007 10:34 am

spot;615195 wrote: Hey, be careful whose toes you're stepping on, "self appointed judge and jury when he would heap his scorn on those he deemed to have failed" fits me to perfection.Choosing between fundamentalist Christianity and fundamentalist Islam is a no-brainer. I'll take fundamentalist Islam any day. It's less aggressive. Neither carries any more intrinsic or unique truth than the other.
I'm dissapointed in you spot! What ever happened to standing up for what you believe? You would rather take the less agressive approach and make everyone happy then to stand up for what you think is right and have some people mad at you? I think that Jerry Falwell should go down in history as a patriot! Martin Luther King did, and he started riots with some of his beliefs! The only reason we hate Jerry Falwell is because of his religious background- thats it! And thats bull!

zinkyusa · Post by **zinkyusa** » Thu May 17, 2007 10:35 am

Sweet Tooth;615185 wrote: Ok, before you guys go slamming him for saying that stuff, its important to know what he believes in. As a Christian, what he is saying has some truth, his tact suffers though. God has promised us that the world will get so bad that countries will turn on each other and "natural disasters" will take place. This is all happening because the world is falling away from God. It's not jus the homosexuals hes targeting per say, its those who choose not to follow Christ.

I recall no such promises, but then again I believe the Bible to be somewhat interesting mythology.

but Homer was better..