The group Move Forward America has responded to the Berkeley City
Council's recent "shenanigans"...
Move Forward ad
:yh_flag:yh_flag
Move Forward America ad...
Move Forward America ad...
"We served this nation to protect ingrates like you and we deserve some respect"?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left. ... Hold no regard for unsupported opinion.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Move Forward America ad...
Can you imagine if President Bush asked Congress for the money to send all our troops one of these or the holy book of their choice?
Gone Are the Days
Bobby
Attached files
Gone Are the Days
Bobby
Attached files
Move Forward America ad...
You do seem to have a large body of opinion in the US that regard political dissent as being the same as treason.
Move Forward America ad...
gmc;781206 wrote: You do seem to have a large body of opinion in the US that regard political dissent as being the same as treason.
Political dessent is an American right, that I would fight to defend. I don't call it treason maybe "unpatriotic".
There are a lot of people who were born in this country That get the benefits of being a citizen, but complain about the services.
Freedom is not not free!
Political dessent is an American right, that I would fight to defend. I don't call it treason maybe "unpatriotic".
There are a lot of people who were born in this country That get the benefits of being a citizen, but complain about the services.
Freedom is not not free!
Move Forward America ad...
BHughesNC;781228 wrote: Political dessent is an American right, that I would fight to defend. I don't call it treason maybe "unpatriotic".So what does "We served this nation to protect ingrates like you and we deserve some respect" mean? Where does the "deserve" fit into your description?
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left. ... Hold no regard for unsupported opinion.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Move Forward America ad...
spot;781230 wrote: So what does "We served this nation to protect ingrates like you and we deserve some respect" mean? Where does the "deserve" fit into your description?
I think you are quoting the wrong person.
Bobby
I think you are quoting the wrong person.
Bobby
Move Forward America ad...
I'm quoting John Bringuel, the subject of the original post. It's hard to tell when the original post is a video clip instead of text but that, I think, is what he said, and that's what the thread seems to be about. I wondered how what the clip contained relates to what you said.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left. ... Hold no regard for unsupported opinion.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Move Forward America ad...
spot;781254 wrote: I'm quoting John Bringuel, the subject of the original post. It's hard to tell when the original post is a video clip instead of text but that, I think, is what he said, and that's what the thread seems to be about. I wondered how what the clip contained relates to what you said.
Sorry, I didn't watch the video because I have dial up internet :-5
I was just following what I thought the topic was.....anti-military
Bobby
Sorry, I didn't watch the video because I have dial up internet :-5
I was just following what I thought the topic was.....anti-military
Bobby
Move Forward America ad...
I can't watch streamed videos either. They do seem to be this year's means of communication though. Text is obsolescent.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left. ... Hold no regard for unsupported opinion.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Move Forward America ad...
BHughesNC;781228 wrote: Political dessent is an American right, that I would fight to defend. I don't call it treason maybe "unpatriotic".
There are a lot of people who were born in this country That get the benefits of being a citizen, but complain about the services.
Freedom is not not free!
If political dissent is an american right how can it be possibly be unpatriotic to exercise that right?
Are you actually saying that being a citizen means you should not complain or dissent in any way about your government or agitate politically to change things?
Not being american it's not my problem, I'm just curious.
There are a lot of people who were born in this country That get the benefits of being a citizen, but complain about the services.
Freedom is not not free!
If political dissent is an american right how can it be possibly be unpatriotic to exercise that right?
Are you actually saying that being a citizen means you should not complain or dissent in any way about your government or agitate politically to change things?
Not being american it's not my problem, I'm just curious.
Move Forward America ad...
gmc;781299 wrote: If political dissent is an american right how can it be possibly be unpatriotic to exercise that right?
Are you actually saying that being a citizen means you should not complain or dissent in any way about your government or agitate politically to change things?
"I will just give a personal example that I hope will more adequately express my point. My grandson, Shawn, is 19. His great-grandfather was a soldier in WWII. I served 20 years in the Army. Last Veterans Day they had a program at the local elementary school honoring the veterans. The had a slide show of local vets. I and his GGF were both in the slideshow. He would not attend, because he is anti-war. I tried to talk to him about it and explain that the freedoms he has now were for the most part a result of war. I told him he could be under Japan's Emporer today. His Comment was "So what's so bad about that?" He enjoys ALL the luxuries of being free, but has paid no price nor shows any appreciation to those that have."
I will however work, fight, or whatever I have to do to defend his right.
Bobby
Are you actually saying that being a citizen means you should not complain or dissent in any way about your government or agitate politically to change things?
"I will just give a personal example that I hope will more adequately express my point. My grandson, Shawn, is 19. His great-grandfather was a soldier in WWII. I served 20 years in the Army. Last Veterans Day they had a program at the local elementary school honoring the veterans. The had a slide show of local vets. I and his GGF were both in the slideshow. He would not attend, because he is anti-war. I tried to talk to him about it and explain that the freedoms he has now were for the most part a result of war. I told him he could be under Japan's Emporer today. His Comment was "So what's so bad about that?" He enjoys ALL the luxuries of being free, but has paid no price nor shows any appreciation to those that have."
I will however work, fight, or whatever I have to do to defend his right.
Bobby
Move Forward America ad...
BHughesNC;781321 wrote: I tried to talk to him about it and explain that the freedoms he has now were for the most part a result of war. I told him he could be under Japan's Emporer today.Those are the two lies. It's heartening to hear that some of the younger generation are refusing to believe the soft repetitive lies of nationalist propaganda any longer.
Nullius in verba ... ☎||||||||||| ... To Fate I sue, of other means bereft, the only refuge for the wretched left. ... Hold no regard for unsupported opinion.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
When flower power came along I stood for Human Rights, marched around for peace and freedom, had some nooky every night - we took it serious. [Fred Wedlock, "The Folker"]
Who has a spare two minutes to play in this month's FG Trivia game! ... My other OS is Slackware.
Move Forward America ad...
spot;781332 wrote: Those are the two lies. It's heartening to hear that some of the younger generation are refusing to believe the soft repetitive lies of nationalist propaganda any longer.
I would ask how you think most of us have become so poluted in their beliefs, but I don't have time for the answers right now. Tell you what put it in a book and I'll buy it.
Bobby
I would ask how you think most of us have become so poluted in their beliefs, but I don't have time for the answers right now. Tell you what put it in a book and I'll buy it.
Bobby
Move Forward America ad...
BHughesNC;781321 wrote: "I will just give a personal example that I hope will more adequately express my point. My grandson, Shawn, is 19. His great-grandfather was a soldier in WWII. I served 20 years in the Army. Last Veterans Day they had a program at the local elementary school honoring the veterans. The had a slide show of local vets. I and his GGF were both in the slideshow. He would not attend, because he is anti-war. I tried to talk to him about it and explain that the freedoms he has now were for the most part a result of war. I told him he could be under Japan's Emporer today. His Comment was "So what's so bad about that?" He enjoys ALL the luxuries of being free, but has paid no price nor shows any appreciation to those that have."
I will however work, fight, or whatever I have to do to defend his right.
Bobby
Slightly different perspective for you. If you go to any village in town in the UK or in france, germany Italy you will see WW1 war memorials with long lists of names. Memorials to the dead but also a reminder to the folly of warfare for no better reason than blind patriotism, my country right or wrong without question.
The ones for ww2 are smaller since they list the soldiers and not all the civilians that died in the cities, in germany and the rest of europe they are all over the place as well. Different war, different reasons perhaps (you can argue the pros and cons till the cows come home) but on one level a war against those who would follow blind patriotism my country right or wrong. militarism has only one end. In our case it was to remain free which we managed to do when those who would later be our allies didn't think we could
You don't owe your freedom to armies, you owe it to all those individuals who were prepared to stand up and not be silenced when they thought something was wrong. When the patriotic duty would have been to shut up and do what you are told and never question the way things were and that to so so was unpatriotic, or in the case of women wanting the vote or were against slavery and wanted one man one vote that it was against the natural order of things.
It's peculiarly American viewpoint to argue that political dissent is unpatriotic. can't say i understand it. On the other hand I couldn't understand why opposition to the Vietnam war was aimed at the conscript soldiers that fought it rather than the politicians that started it.
I will however work, fight, or whatever I have to do to defend his right.
Bobby
Slightly different perspective for you. If you go to any village in town in the UK or in france, germany Italy you will see WW1 war memorials with long lists of names. Memorials to the dead but also a reminder to the folly of warfare for no better reason than blind patriotism, my country right or wrong without question.
The ones for ww2 are smaller since they list the soldiers and not all the civilians that died in the cities, in germany and the rest of europe they are all over the place as well. Different war, different reasons perhaps (you can argue the pros and cons till the cows come home) but on one level a war against those who would follow blind patriotism my country right or wrong. militarism has only one end. In our case it was to remain free which we managed to do when those who would later be our allies didn't think we could
You don't owe your freedom to armies, you owe it to all those individuals who were prepared to stand up and not be silenced when they thought something was wrong. When the patriotic duty would have been to shut up and do what you are told and never question the way things were and that to so so was unpatriotic, or in the case of women wanting the vote or were against slavery and wanted one man one vote that it was against the natural order of things.
It's peculiarly American viewpoint to argue that political dissent is unpatriotic. can't say i understand it. On the other hand I couldn't understand why opposition to the Vietnam war was aimed at the conscript soldiers that fought it rather than the politicians that started it.
Move Forward America ad...
In our case it was to remain free which we managed to do when those who would later be our allies didn't think we could
sorry, missed a couple of words.
posted by rjwould
And actually many, many of us Americans don't understand the blind patriotism either...but we don't voice our objection much anymore because; a) we are accused of being being traitors and b) It has become more and more difficult to protest in our country (even in a peaceful manner) over the years, and the police have way too much authority over us and our behavior.
Right wing politics became deeply unpopular in europe. In the US they didn't really go away but perhaps morphed in to something else. Maybe that's the reason but it's a question you should maybe ask yourselves. The argument that if you don't support the war you are not supporting the troops tends to get very short shrift in the UK with the response often being quite impolite.
You're the electorate so presumably are the ones letting them have the authority. Reading these posts I realise I don't really get the US political system, especially where it comes to state vs federal govt.
I remember as a kid seeing the reports of the Kent state shootings on TV and being amazed that you actually had armed troops out to deal with a normal demonstration. At least you don't seem to do that any more.
sorry, missed a couple of words.
posted by rjwould
And actually many, many of us Americans don't understand the blind patriotism either...but we don't voice our objection much anymore because; a) we are accused of being being traitors and b) It has become more and more difficult to protest in our country (even in a peaceful manner) over the years, and the police have way too much authority over us and our behavior.
Right wing politics became deeply unpopular in europe. In the US they didn't really go away but perhaps morphed in to something else. Maybe that's the reason but it's a question you should maybe ask yourselves. The argument that if you don't support the war you are not supporting the troops tends to get very short shrift in the UK with the response often being quite impolite.
You're the electorate so presumably are the ones letting them have the authority. Reading these posts I realise I don't really get the US political system, especially where it comes to state vs federal govt.
I remember as a kid seeing the reports of the Kent state shootings on TV and being amazed that you actually had armed troops out to deal with a normal demonstration. At least you don't seem to do that any more.