Star SPangled Banner replaced with Black National Anthem, Upsets People

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 2:32 am

I have mixed feelings on this. What do you guys think?

DENVER - Mayor John Hickenlooper's annual State of the City address may get more attention for what wasn't included than what was.

At the start of the event Tuesday morning, City Council President Michael Hancock introduced singer Rene Marie to perform the national anthem.

Instead, she performed the song "Lift Ev'ry Voice and Sing," which is also known as the "black national anthem."

When she finished, the audience responded with mild applause. The national anthem was never performed.

Governor Bill Ritter (D-Colorado) discussed the incident on The Mike Rosen Show on 850 KOA on Wednesday morning, calling it "inappropriate."

"I don't think it's fair artistic expression," said Ritter.

Ritter went on to say he felt Marie's actions were "wrong" and "outside the bounds."

"It certainly is operating as a distraction," said Ritter.

Marie told 9NEWS she kept her plans to switch songs quiet until the very last moment. She says only she, her husband and a friend knew she was going to sing something other than the "Star-Spangled Banner."

She says she wanted to express her love of her country by mixing the lyrics of "Lift Ev'ry Voice and Sing" with the melody of the "Star-Spangled Banner."

"When I decided to sing my version, what was going on in my head was: 'I want to express how I feel about living in the United States, as a black woman, as a black person,'" said Marie.

Hickenlooper's staff picked Marie to sing the national anthem. The mayor says he believes Marie did not intend to offend anyone or make a political statement.

When asked if he was offended, Hickenlooper said, "You know I was more confused and I think I was more – what I was, was disappointed and confused and that's why I wanted to talk to her."

"Lift Ev'ry Voice and Sing" was written as a poem by James Weldon Johnson in 1899 and set to music by his brother in 1900.

City Councilman Charlie Brown took to talk radio Tuesday afternoon to criticize the absence of the national anthem at the State of the City proceedings.

"There is no substitute for the national anthem, period," Brown said. "And that's what really bothered me. You know when we fly the flag, the American flag, it's always the highest flag, as it should be. And that didn't come across today, that didn't happen today."

In hindsight, both Brown and Hickenlooper say they should have stopped Marie or began singing themselves.

Marie says if she had the benefit of doing it over, she would sing the same song.

When asked if she would apologize for what happened she said, "No I do not."

Marie has been singing professionally for 10 years.

Brown says he doesn't have a problem with people expressing their views, but he says Marie chose the wrong venue.

Below are the full lyrics to "Lift Ev'ry Voice & Sing"

LIFT EV'RY VOICE AND SING

Also known as "The Black National Anthem"

by James Weldon Johnson

Lift ev'ry voice and sing,

Till earth and heaven ring.

Ring with the harmonies of Liberty;

Let our rejoicing rise,

High as the list'ning skies,

Let it resound loud as the rolling sea.

Sing a song full of the faith that the dark past has taught us,

Sing a song full of the hope that the present has brought us;

Facing the rising sun of our new day begun,

Let us march on till victory is won.

Stony the road we trod,

Bitter the chast'ning rod,

Felt in the days when hope unborn had died;

Yet with a steady beat,

Have not our weary feet,

Come to the place for which our fathers sighed?

We have come over a way that with tears has been watered,

We have come, treading our path through the blood of the slaughtered,

Out from the gloomy past,

Till now we stand at last

Where the white gleam of our bright star is cast.

God of our weary years,

God of our silent tears,

Thou who has brought us thus far on the way;

Thou who has by Thy might,

Led us into the light,

Keep us forever in the path, we pray.

Lest our feet stray from the places, our God, where we met Thee,

Lest our hearts, drunk with the wine of the world, we forget Thee,

Shadowed beneath thy hand,

May we forever stand,

True to our God,

True to our native land.

Victoria · Post by **Victoria** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:02 am

A few weeks ago someone posted on here about singing the Baptist anthem before the national anthem and wondering if that was treason.

But then.... I guess this is PC :rolleyes:

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 6:57 am

If nothing else she was hired to sing the "National Anthem" she didn't she lacks integrity and broke her contract. If she was getting paid they owe her nothing.

Is this the story where she sang the "Black Anthem" to the melody of the "National Anthem". If so that was even worse in my opinion.

Post by **spot** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 7:09 am

Doesn't the National Anthem accuse African Americans of cowardice? Perhaps I'm reading it wrongly but it might seem that way to those who are sensitive to the use of the word "slave" in a song written in 1831. Even so it would be more polite for her merely to refuse to sing it rather than to make a substitution without prior agreement.

Daniyal · Post by **Daniyal** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 1:55 pm

I See Your True Color's Are Showing Or Is That Your True Nature Showing ?

Post by **spot** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 1:58 pm

Daniyal;911159 wrote: I See Your True Color's Are Showing Or Is That Your True Nature Showing ?

Me?

I have true colours and you can distinguish them?

I have a true nature you can observe from such a distance?

You surprise me. What are my true colours? Can you put my true nature into words for us?

Daniyal · Post by **Daniyal** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 2:00 pm

I Have A Question ,

Can Any One Here Type Out The PledgeOf Allegiance , And Its' Overstanding / Meaning ?

Post by **spot** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 2:14 pm

Daniyal;911164 wrote: I Have A QuestionYou have far too many questions. Do you have no answers to questions put to you?

What are my true colours? Can you put my true nature into words for us?

K.Snyder · Post by **K.Snyder** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:05 pm

CARLA;910696 wrote: ...broke her contract. If she was getting paid they owe her nothing.

I agree with this...

However,..I think it's still important to understand what "freedom of speech" truly means and this incident shouldn't go down as anything other than her breach of contract...

It's far more concerning to allow a nation to demand what's said of it's people than someone who has admitted to her motives being primarily the emphasis of preference towards her singing "Lift Ev'ry Voice and Sing" as opposed to her obligation to her contract...Her intention was to voice her enthusiasm for what she believes means alot to her people as opposed to her feeling her people wish to conspire against their belief in what the true implications are behind the "Star Spangled Banner"...

I can see alot of people take offense to her preference to sing "Lift Ev'ry Voice and Sing" over the "Star Spangled Banner" but all I see is a woman singing a song that she knows full well means something great to those to whom she can relate to...

I see freedom of speech...

Daniyal · Post by **Daniyal** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:07 pm

spot;911171 wrote: You have far too many questions. Do you have no answers to questions put to you?

What are my true colours? Can you put my true nature into words for us?

You spoke them in the above post didn't you ! Stop acting like you don't know what you say and meant , One thing for sure to late to clean it up . Now your trying to flip it LOLOLOLOLOL Talking about tell US . The Us you were talking about already know what you said .

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:08 pm

Something trollish this way comes.

Daniyal · Post by **Daniyal** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 3:13 pm

spot;911171 wrote: You have far too many questions. Do you have no answers to questions put to you?

What are my true colours? Can you put my true nature into words for us?

Yes I can , can't help if the answer I give you or them , They don't accept them . Most people want you to tell them what they want to hear .

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:21 pm

Daniyal;911159 wrote: I See Your True Color's Are Showing Or Is That Your True Nature Showing ?

There you go again. Goosy goosy silly goosy.

You're fun ! :-6

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:53 pm

spot;910705 wrote: Doesn't the National Anthem accuse African Americans of cowardice? Perhaps I'm reading it wrongly but it might seem that way to those who are sensitive to the use of the word "slave" in a song written in 1831. Even so it would be more polite for her merely to refuse to sing it rather than to make a substitution without prior agreement.
This is our univerally-accepted and official National Anthem:

Oh, say can you see by the dawn's early light

What so proudly we hailed at the twilight's last gleaming?

Whose broad stripes and bright stars thru the perilous fight,

O'er the ramparts we watched were so gallantly streaming?

And the rocket's red glare, the bombs bursting in air,

Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there.

Oh, say does that star-spangled banner yet wave

O'er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

You're right about other lyrics "No refuge could save the hireling and slave

From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave" but the typical citizen isn't even aware of any lyrics beyond that first verse.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:55 pm

Why a Black Artist Replaced the National Anthem

southern yankee · Post by **southern yankee** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:00 pm

soon we'll have the Mexican, the Polish, the German and on and on. there is only one. Come on people!!:mad:

woppy71 · Post by **woppy71** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:04 pm

I have to say that I would find this a bit offensive, theres a time and place for everything.

The national anthem of any nation is a pretty personal thing held close to the heart of the nation concerned.

I suppose she achieved what she set out to do, which was to bring attention to the issue.

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:07 pm

Accountable;911324 wrote: Why a Black Artist Replaced the National Anthem

Very good link!

woppy71;911333 wrote: I have to say that I would find this a bit offensive, theres a time and place for everything.

The national anthem of any nation is a pretty personal thing held close to the heart of the nation concerned.

I suppose she achieved what she set out to do, which was to bring attention to the issue.

What issue would that be?

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:08 pm

southern yankee you are correct there is only one "National Anthem" she didn't sing it. Like I said if she was being paid they owe her nothing. For me its a matter of integerity. If I'm asked to do something for someone (pay or no pay) that is what I will do I will stand by that word not tricks involved ever.

[QUOTE]soon we'll have the Mexican, the Polish, the German and on and on. there is only one. Come on people!![/QUOTE]

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:10 pm

I like what she did.

I welcome something besides that tired refrain that every singer tries to make their own. Had this not been called "the black national anthem" this woman might not have even known it was anything but a spiritual. That spiritual may have been originally intended for black people but s what? Are there not downtrodden in every other color? Is there not uprising in every culture? I think it's too much about too little and everybody (including the writer in Acc's link) is putting their own morals on what the singer did. After all we pride ourselves on free expression but when someone actually does it, we flip out. I don't think the singer owes anybody any kind of apology.

Dewey2Me1MoThyme · Post by **Dewey2Me1MoThyme** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:15 pm

"I welcome something besides that tired refrain that every singer tries to make their own." I was just writing about this on another forum, I equate butchering the national anthem to burning the flag.

woppy71 · Post by **woppy71** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:16 pm

Sheryl;911337 wrote:

What issue would that be?

The piece in the original post where she was quoted as saying: "When I decided to sing my version, what was going on in my head was: 'I want to express how I feel about living in the United States, as a black woman, as a black person,'" tells me that she was trying to bring to the attention of the poeple the struggle of black women in amaerica.

That was my take on it

:o

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:19 pm

Woppy71 Howdy.!! Your right she didn't sing what she was asked to sing. I don't care what her reasons are. She broke her contract and lacks integerity.

[QUOTE]Quote:

Originally Posted by Sheryl

What issue would that be?

The piece in the original post where she was quoted as saying: "When I decided to sing my version, what was going on in my head was: 'I want to express how I feel about living in the United States, as a black woman, as a black person,'" tells me that she was trying to bring to the attention of the poeple the struggle of black women in amaerica.

That was my take on it [/QUOTE]

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:21 pm

RedGlitter;911343 wrote: I like what she did.

I welcome something besides that tired refrain that every singer tries to make their own. Had this not been called "the black national anthem" this woman might not have even known it was anything but a spiritual. That spiritual may have been originally intended for black people but s what? Are there not downtrodden in every other color? Is there not uprising in every culture? I think it's too much about too little and everybody (including the writer in Acc's link) is putting their own morals on what the singer did. After all we pride ourselves on free expression but when someone actually does it, we flip out. I don't think the singer owes anybody any kind of apology.
Ignoring the moral issue, she was hired to do a job. She did not do the job as requested. Equate it to you hiring someone to paint your house or trim a dog's coat. If the worker did something contrary to your wishes and the result was something you hated or something that embarassed you, regardless of how skillfully it was done, would you still be so glib?

Sheryl · Post by **Sheryl** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:25 pm

ahh ok..thanks Woppy!

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:25 pm

I beg to differ with you on this RG she owe everyone an apology. She has not one ounce of integerity. She was hired to sing the "National Anthem" that is what she should have sung. By not doing so she offended the people who hired her and embarassed herself and them as well. Not something anyone with integerity would do.

[QUOTE] I don't think the singer owes anybody any kind of apology.[/QUOTE]

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:26 pm

Accountable;911363 wrote: Ignoring the moral issue, she was hired to do a job. She did not do the job as requested. Equate it to you hiring someone to paint your house or trim a dog's coat. If the worker did something contrary to your wishes and the result was something you hated or something that embarassed you, regardless of how skillfully it was done, would you still be so glib?

Oh I'm not trying to be glib or flip Acc, I'm just saying I don't think it's this big moral issue that it's being made out to be and I don't think the woman lacks any integrity at all. As for the job aspect, I can't really disagree there.

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:29 pm

CARLA;911370 wrote: I beg to differ with you on this RG she owe everyone an apology. She has not one ounce of integerity. She was hired to sing the "National Anthem" that is what she should have sung. By not doing so she offended the people who hired her and embarassed herself and them as well. Not something anyone with integerity would do.

You can differ with me anytime, Carla, no worries. We can disagree sometimes. I *do* agree that perhaps she didn't perform the job the way she was expected to, same way as other singers mutilate the SSB when they try to make it sound like a new song and end up ruining it. But i don't think the lady embarrassed herself. At least she doesn't seem to be embarrassed.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:33 pm

RedGlitter;911372 wrote: Oh I'm not trying to be glib or flip Acc, I'm just saying I don't think it's this big moral issue that it's being made out to be and I don't think the woman lacks any integrity at all. As for the job aspect, I can't really disagree there.
Then you can't in good conscience say you like what she did. If she sponsors an event she can sing whatever she likes, but she signed a contract and should have honored it.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:34 pm

RedGlitter;911375 wrote: You can differ with me anytime, Carla, no worries. We can disagree sometimes. I *do* agree that perhaps she didn't perform the job the way she was expected to, same way as other singers mutilate the SSB when they try to make it sound like a new song and end up ruining it. But i don't think the lady embarrassed herself. At least she doesn't seem to be embarrassed.

If you hired a clown from an agency and instead they sent a Hitler impersonator would you pay for the service ?

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:39 pm

What if a lonely guy from Cincinatti ordered a hot Russian mail order bride and instead a drunken out of work plumber from Uruguay showed up at the airport ?

Whats the guy supposed to do about that, suck it up ?

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:42 pm

Or what if you buy a pair of shoes and when you get home theres a size 6 and a size 11 in the box ?

What about that ?

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:44 pm

Holy Crap !

Im really getting myself upset here.

I guess all Im trying to say is clowns get sad too.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:51 pm

Nomad;911380 wrote: If you hired a clown from an agency and instead they sent a Hitler impersonator would you pay for the service ?

Depends ..........

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:58 pm

:wah: !!! You guys! This is serious bizness!! :wah: Hee....

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 6:05 pm

:yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl He is screwed.

[QUOTE]What if a lonely guy from Cincinatti ordered a hot Russian mail order bride and instead a drunken out of work plumber from Uruguay showed up at the airport ?

Whats the guy supposed to do about that, suck it up ? [/QUOTE]

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 6:07 pm

CARLA;911409 wrote: :yh_rotfl:yh_rotfl He is screwed.
Ah well, at least the main goal was accomplished.

K.Snyder · Post by **K.Snyder** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 6:37 pm

Accountable;911321 wrote:

You're right about other lyrics "No refuge could save the hireling and slave

From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave" but the typical citizen isn't even aware of any lyrics beyone that first verse.

I've interpreted it as the simple knowledge that it's referring to those whom use their slaves to fight against the cause spoken by the sentiment of the writer...

Is that wrong to assume?...

What's wrong with killing someone trying to kill you?...

Post by **spot** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:14 pm

K.Snyder;911426 wrote: What's wrong with killing someone trying to kill you?...You get called a terrorist, Shirley.

Was she paid or was she invited to sing as an honour? I'd assumed she was invited to sing as an honour when I read the OP. I'd no idea National Anthem singers at events were given money for it, I thought it was an outpouring of nationalistic fervour and patriotism while grown men wept.

here we are...He said every year, a local vocalist is invited to sing the national anthem at the State of the City event and no compensation is ever attached to this invitation. Marie was not paid for her performance.

Given the volume of questions the city is receiving about Marie's decision to sing the Black National Anthem, the city said she invited those calling and e-mailing to contact her at 303-520-6705 or Rene@ReneMarie.com.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/16 ... etail.html

Not paid. All the talk in the thread about payment or hire or breach of contract - skip those posts as uninformed.

K.Snyder · Post by **K.Snyder** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:15 pm

spot;911539 wrote: You get called a terrorist, Shirley.

Not in a just war you don't...

You don't feel the American Revolution was a just war?...

Post by **spot** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:30 pm

K.Snyder;911540 wrote: You don't feel the American Revolution was a just war?...No, it's a perfect example of a just war. It would be hard to find a clearer instance. Would there were more like them.

We're agreed now, though, are we, that she chose not to sing something that referred to slaves as cowards, written at a time when African Americans in the USA were slaves?

K.Snyder · Post by **K.Snyder** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:40 pm

spot;911542 wrote:

We're agreed now, though, are we, that she chose not to sing something that referred to slaves as cowards, written at a time when African Americans in the USA were slaves?

I can't agree with that based on the nomenclature of "cowards"...I don't think it's right to assume that everyone who fleas in battle are cowards...

I simply see it as "slaves" being those bought as well as promised to their freedom to fight against a cause that harbored oppression...

As I've said before...I don't think her singing the "Lift Ev'ry Voice and Sing" was a statement to condemn the "Star-Spangled Banner" rather it was a statement of fortitude for the people she felt deserved a little more respect than the events from which ensued after the American Revolution chose to omit...

At the same time I think this can go as a simple matter of freedom of speech just as long as to whom each individual whom partakes in similar situations make damn sure their intent is targeted in the right direction...

Post by **spot** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 11:03 pm

K.Snyder;911547 wrote: I don't think it's right to assume that everyone who fleas in battle are cowards...

I'm glad we worked out where our misunderstanding came from.

K.Snyder · Post by **K.Snyder** » Tue Jul 08, 2008 11:46 pm

spot;911539 wrote: You get called a terrorist, Shirley.

Was she paid or was she invited to sing as an honour? I'd assumed she was invited to sing as an honour when I read the OP. I'd no idea National Anthem singers at events were given money for it, I thought it was an outpouring of nationalistic fervour and patriotism while grown men wept.

I'm quite sure many people have wept hearing the United States national anthem knowing their father or grandfather gave their life to ensure the freedom of Europe and the ending of immoral murder in the form of deliberate starvation and fire...

And I wouldn't limit the weeping of hearing their national anthem to only grown men...

Just as any of the Allies that were involved in World War 2...

Post by **spot** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 12:46 am

K.Snyder;911572 wrote: Just as any of the Allies that were involved in World War 2...The word you're looking for there is Soviets.

Why is it that Americans dig so far back into history when they try to justify the presence of their armed forces outside of their Homeland?

Daniyal · Post by **Daniyal** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:36 am

SOME of you people are really funny , What America hasn't taken my force / claim from other people country like land / oil Etc Etc . And your talking about a song .

LOLOLOLOLOL Now that's true DEMOCRACY FOR YAAAAAA , If you can't Take it / claim it you want to Dis-miss it . LOLOLOLOLOL And you wonder why people of the world hate America Duhhhhhh

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 4:28 am

spot;911539 wrote: Not paid. All the talk in the thread about payment or hire or breach of contract - skip those posts as uninformed.
Thank you for the clarification, and for being less lazy than I.

Her deception is still disgusting.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 7:19 am

Thanks ACC my take on it as well.

[QUOTE]Her deception is still disgusting.[/QUOTE]

YZGI · Post by **YZGI** » Wed Jul 09, 2008 8:07 am

spot;911539 wrote: You get called a terrorist, Shirley.

Was she paid or was she invited to sing as an honour? I'd assumed she was invited to sing as an honour when I read the OP. I'd no idea National Anthem singers at events were given money for it, I thought it was an outpouring of nationalistic fervour and patriotism while grown men wept.

here we are...

He said every year, a local vocalist is invited to sing the national anthem at the State of the City event and no compensation is ever attached to this invitation. Marie was not paid for her performance.

Given the volume of questions the city is receiving about Marie's decision to sing the Black National Anthem, the city said she invited those calling and e-mailing to contact her at 303-520-6705 or Rene@ReneMarie.com.

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/16 ... etail.html

Not paid. All the talk in the thread about payment or hire or breach of contract - skip those posts as uninformed.

She was invited to sing the National Anthem, not a song of her choice.

She was wrong..