How Much Are You Willing To Pay?

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Thu Sep 04, 2008 9:57 pm

For your health insurance---------------We hear all the time that some working people cannot afford to have health insurance. Well how much is fair for a family to pay for health care, as much as their car payment, as much as the payments on their wide screen TV, as much as they pay monthly on their credit card debt????Isn't the ability to pay for health care a matter of priorities? How about 3.5 % of your gross income paid via tax? What you say, how about free health care. There is no such thing. You pay one way or another.

So tell me------------how much are you willing to pay and what do you think would be a fair amount?

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:50 am

If insurance companies suddenly ceased to exist, I wonder how much medical costs would drop. :yh_think Not gonna happen because we Americans aren't willing to budget for emergencies, but it's a nice thought.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:12 am

we are fortunate in Ontario that it is paid for.

qsducks · Post by **qsducks** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:21 am

Accountable;973440 wrote: If insurance companies suddenly ceased to exist, I wonder how much medical costs would drop. :yh_think Not gonna happen because we Americans aren't willing to budget for emergencies, but it's a nice thought.

And it is a nice thought but Satan lives on.

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:53 am

Accountable;973440 wrote: If insurance companies suddenly ceased to exist, I wonder how much medical costs would drop. :yh_think Not gonna happen because we Americans aren't willing to budget for emergencies, but it's a nice thought.

Actually, insurance companies are responsible for keeping the cost of medical supplies and services DOWN, not up.

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:53 am

Odie;973459 wrote: we are fortunate in Ontario that it is paid for.

Paid for by whom and how much?

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 5:28 pm

Lon;973673 wrote: Actually, insurance companies are responsible for keeping the cost of medical supplies and services DOWN, not up.
It may be their responsibility, but not the reality, by my logic at least. Producers will never charge more than purchasers are willing to pay. Insurance gives most people more money to play with. Insurance sets limits to what providers can charge, which takes away any incentive to charge anything less. Insurance pays for it, so what do I care what they charge?

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:08 pm

Accountable;974227 wrote: It may be their responsibility, but not the reality, by my logic at least. Producers will never charge more than purchasers are willing to pay. Insurance gives most people more money to play with. Insurance sets limits to what providers can charge, which takes away any incentive to charge anything less. Insurance pays for it, so what do I care what they charge?

A hospital may bill someone $1,000 for a particular service, but if that someone happens to belong to a PPO the $1,000 may be negotiated down to $350 by prior agreement. The uninsured or those not belonging to the PPO would be responsible for the full $1,000. The higher price by the way goes to pay for those that are treated and don't or can't pay. That higher cost is not the insurance companies fault, but the hospital trying to recoup. There is no financial incentive for insurance carriers to drive up costs of services. I buy stock in medical equipment companies and pharmas, but I sure don't buy stock in insurance companies selling medical insurance.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 6:58 pm

Lon;973674 wrote: Paid for by whom and how much?

in Ontario our health benefits which means any doctors visits and hospital stays, tests etc. are free.....from the government......we all have health cards to show at doctors offices, hospitals etc...........issued by the government of Ontario.

Prescriptions and dental is different, some companies you work for pay this, some don't.

I am lucky, where Mike works (hubby) is covered 90% for this.

others have no coverage!

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:04 pm

JAB;974292 wrote: If it's free, why the health cards?

you have to prove you live in Ontario........otherwise anyone from anywhere can get it free.

and also, each visit is tracked and sent to the government to pay.

QUINNSCOMMENTARY · Post by **QUINNSCOMMENTARY** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:14 pm

Lon;973282 wrote: For your health insurance---------------We hear all the time that some working people cannot afford to have health insurance. Well how much is fair for a family to pay for health care, as much as their car payment, as much as the payments on their wide screen TV, as much as they pay monthly on their credit card debt????Isn't the ability to pay for health care a matter of priorities? How about 3.5 % of your gross income paid via tax? What you say, how about free health care. There is no such thing. You pay one way or another.

So tell me------------how much are you willing to pay and what do you think would be a fair amount?

I asked a similar question a few weeks back in the form of define what is "affordable" health care and no one answered the question.

I can tell you that many families in large companies that provide good health care benefits pay between $250 and $300 a month and those are similar costs for people in the federal health benefits system and sometimes quite a bit more. The obvious problem is that it may be reasonable if you are making $100,000 but not so much so if you are making $35,000 a year.

People pay 1.45% of their income into Medicare so we know that is not the limit. Good coverage in a large self insured employer group will cost between $8,000 and $13,000 a year depending on where you live, an insured program more, so now you can figure it out.

Somebody has to pay for it and until we figure out that the real problem in health care is the cost not coverage, somebody is going to pay one way or the other. What the government or your employer pays simply takes away from using that money for something else, like lower taxes or higher pay. :-5:-5

QUINNSCOMMENTARY · Post by **QUINNSCOMMENTARY** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:20 pm

Odie;974295 wrote: you have to prove you live in Ontario........otherwise anyone from anywhere can get it free.

and also, each visit is tracked and sent to the government to pay.

And where does the government get the money to pay the bill?

Why do people insist on using the word "free" when something is paid for by a government that takes taxes and pays someone else with what is left after spending what it does on the administation associated with taking it in the first place and then dispursing it again?

In order for the government to provide the same level of benefits enjoyed by hundreds of millions of Americans today the tax would have to be at least 8% of gross income which is about what an employer pays of its payroll.

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 7:21 pm

Odie;974288 wrote: in Ontario our health benefits which means any doctors visits and hospital stays, tests etc. are free.....from the government......we all have health cards to show at doctors offices, hospitals etc...........issued by the government of Ontario.

Prescriptions and dental is different, some companies you work for pay this, some don't.

I am lucky, where Mike works (hubby) is covered 90% for this.

others have no coverage!

Where does the government get the money to pay for these things that are free to all the citizens? Could it possibly be taxes?

Also, why do many Canadians flock to Seattle & Chicago for certain procedures?

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:03 pm

JAB;974313 wrote: Isn't it free in all provinces? Or is this a way to make sure only Ontario residents get free healthcare from Ontario?

not sure about the others..........it might be free?

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:06 pm

Lon;974322 wrote: Where does the government get the money to pay for these things that are free to all the citizens? Could it possibly be taxes?

Also, why do many Canadians flock to Seattle & Chicago for certain procedures?

some procedures here will take months to book!.........and some people cannot wait that long.................ex: an MRI might take up to 6 months to get in.

plus some facility's are better than what we have here.

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:09 pm

http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source=we ... dD0CqzAhDQ

The Ministry pays for our coverage, either way, its government funded.

This is what it pays for.

mrsK · Post by **mrsK** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:11 pm

We pay private health insurance $2500 + a year.

that means we get to choose our Dr & stay in a private hospital.

I think it should be like car insurance & have a no claim bonus attached.

Never going to happen but I can dream.:-6

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Fri Sep 05, 2008 8:13 pm

mrsK;974372 wrote: We pay private health insurance $2500 + a year.

that means we get to choose our Dr & stay in a private hospital.

I think it should be like car insurance & have a no claim bonus attached.

Never going to happen but I can dream.:-6

we can choose our own doctor, and if we want a private room, we then pay for the upgrade...........if its available.

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Sep 06, 2008 12:31 am

$17.00

Lon · Post by **Lon** » Sat Sep 06, 2008 8:35 am

Nomad;974555 wrote: $17.00

That's OK------------that will get you a band aide for brain tumor.

TheNewDG · Post by **TheNewDG** » Sat Sep 06, 2008 9:12 am

My husband is a business owner so in order for his employees to have affordable insurance, we pay $1800 per month for just he and I.

We also didnt get a stimulus check, homeowner credit of $7500 or any of the tax credits for adoptive parents...but that's another topic completley.

TheNewDG · Post by **TheNewDG** » Sat Sep 06, 2008 9:13 am

TheNewDG;975008 wrote: My husband is a business owner so in order for his employees to have affordable insurance, we pay $1800 per month for just he and I.

We also didnt get a stimulus check, homeowner credit of $7500 or any of the tax credits for adoptive parents...but that's another topic completley.

And I meant Eighteen hundred dollars per month, not eighteen dollars per month! Boo!

Odie · Post by **Odie** » Sat Sep 06, 2008 9:41 am

JAB;974427 wrote: See? Now this is the part I've never been able to understand. Why does it take that long to get an appointment? Aren't there enough facilities to accomodate the demand?

all depends, sometimes you can have it booked in 3 weeks, tons of facilities..............but also thousands of patients.