How far is acceptable?

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:14 am

Im not sure gerbil but its a fine test of character.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:17 am

Rightfully, anything said to discredit an argument based solely on characterising the other poster is inappropriate. Frankly, as someone who has received this type of attack on numerous occasions, I just take it as a good sign I'm winning.

Shweet tatersalad · Post by **Shweet tatersalad** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:26 am

Anything that is brought that is not on the direct subject matter of the debate is deemed not appropriate and is crossing line.

Then at that point it becomes childish and the point of debate is mute,Then it's on,bring your A game baby,we're gonna throw.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:29 am

Hamster;463004 wrote: As in they refer to your personality rather than your argument?

Yes. Absolutely. Whether to call me despicable or classify me as a bigot, you name it, I've heard it.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:33 am

I'd suggest just writing

"*(username) scores a point" in response, inserting your own user name at the time. I might try this next time...because there will always be a next time.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:35 am

Hamster;463011 wrote: See now I have an issue with that. How can people call you names for stating your opinion on an open forum?

Actually, there is a set line. When people break the TOS.

I've had personal private information posted about me in order to bully me down. It was subsequently removed.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:36 am

SnoozeControl;463013 wrote: Example 1: I disagree, I think the Harry Potter books contains Satanism and encourage devil worship. I try to monitor my child's reading material so he isn't exposed to this sort of thing at a young age.

Example 2: That just shows how stupid you are, the Harry Potter books are obviously Satanic and I hope you burn in hell! America doesn't need people like you, why don't you move somewhere that likes devil worshippers. You should never be allowed to have children, you're what's wrong with the world today.

:rolleyes:

I agree with both opinions.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:38 am

Hamster;462992 wrote: In a debate between two members what would you class as stating your opinion/picking holes in others arguments....or being downright nasty and abusive?
I don't debate, I discuss. Unfortunately, I often find myself in a discussion with a debater, some very good - master level.

Debate is a competition. It needs a winner and loser. Screw that. I look for the truth, as best I can define it. If I feel I have to shake a person to get them to think, such as by calling them a bigot based on previous posts, then I do. Debate is not a game I play well, so I don't.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:39 am

Hamster;463018 wrote: I bet that happens often for you? With people losing their arguement and resorting to "other" measures?

I try to take it as a compliment when it happens. lol

Nomad · Post by **Nomad** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:39 am

Hamster;463001 wrote: Explain please?

How we react to a given situation is an example of our inner goings on. Each of us choose how to be. If we're destructive in our heart that will show itself in how we interact. Not to be confused with an off day or two but eventually a pattern will develop for others to see. There are usually underlying reasons for defensive behavior that might not be readily visible. For example if as a child you were attacked and undermined theres a strong chance you will fiercely defend your damaged self later in life or even lash out preemptively in order to protect yourself.

But the test of a character is to recognize our faults and those areas that need to be nourished and to evolve. In other words, if what I do now isnt ok, then hopefully this time next year I'll have been able to correct that.

Some people just charge through life unaware that others exist and are as important as we are.

If we dont change over time then whats the point ?

Shweet tatersalad · Post by **Shweet tatersalad** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:45 am

I know you are, but what am I?

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:46 am

I view one of the problems of how to respond as thus:

I had a nasty boyfriend when I was a teen and when I tried to discuss why I was leaving him he didn't understand. When I then littered my side of the "conversation" with expletives ending with something like "I really don't need ****heads like you in my life" he got the point. At that point I realised that there are different languages in the world and you need to be fluent in all for communication to be effective.

theia · Post by **theia** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:47 am

Nomad;463023 wrote: How we react to a given situation is an example of our inner goings on. Each of us choose how to be. If we're destructive in our heart that will show itself in how we interact. Not to be confused with an off day or two but eventually a pattern will develop for others to see. There are usually underlying reasons for defensive behavior that might not be readily visible. For example if as a child you were attacked and undermined theres a strong chance you will fiercely defend your damaged self later in life or even lash out preemptively in order to protect yourself.

But the test of a character is to recognize our faults and those areas that need to be nourished and to evolve. In other words, if what I do now isnt ok, then hopefully this time next year I'll have been able to correct that.

Some people just charge through life unaware that others exist and are as important as we are.

If we dont change over time then whats the point ?

That just shows how insightful you are, Nomad :-6

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:49 am

Hamster;463032 wrote: Thats my point Snooze..there is nowhere here to have that kind of meltdown...
I disagree. Do you think we need a designated place for people to get het up about a subject they feel passionate about?

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 8:56 am

Hamster;463046 wrote: well maybe...but its hard to get into emotional areas when they keep on getting moved!

Not necessarily "fights" but maybe somewhere you can post if you want a no-holds barred arguement?

I have posted things the last few days and had offended some people-if there was an area we could go that was not for the easily offended (or faint hearted)?
We can't protect eveybody all the time. Readers have to take responsibility for what they choose to read.

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:00 am

I suppose what has been suggested is an "I call you out" section of the forum that is just for members. It has some value but tend to add to the trouble in some cases.

RedGlitter · Post by **RedGlitter** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:04 am

I think as long as you have many different people from all points in life, you will have risk of argument. Debate is a well intentioned idea but most people do not function in the manner required for it during a normal discussion. Discussion involves emotion by its nature. I'll take a passionate discussion any day over an actual debate. You can be passionate without being out of line. If you get out of line because you got carried away, then apologize. It's a human thing.

Accountable · Post by **Accountable** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:05 am

Some people are uncomfortable around open homosexual behavior.

Some of them might accidently walk into a gay bar and immediately walk out.

Some of them might start stridently expressing how offensive they find this place to be and demand that everyone else stop such shennanigans immediately so everyone can be comfortable there.

Some of them might not want to offend, and so will come on in, sit and drink, then go home and tell everyone how uncomfortable they were.

~~~~~~~~~~~

You'll find the same thing here with people that find various posts offensive. Nothing you can do about it. Nothing we should do about it.

Peg · Post by **Peg** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:05 am

Why not start a private group?

koan · Post by **koan** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:06 am

SnoozeControl;463056 wrote: Keep in mind that the person 'called out' doesn't have to respond. If they do, then it's a given that they accept the challenge, so to speak.

Exactly. And there have a few recently threads that would have been more comfortably posted in a forum area like the one proposed.

Post by **spot** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:12 am

Hamster;463046 wrote: Not necessarily "fights" but maybe somewhere you can post if you want a no-holds barred arguement?Emails, Hamster. The TOS is explicit on forbidding anyone to "engage in ... insulting, or generally disruptive behavior". Whether it's starting it or responding to it, do it off-site. I'd hate to see an area set aside for it, whether on public view or not.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:13 am

Nomie you always amaze me with your depth, and knowledge of the Human race. Well said and the reason I try to stay away from debates, discussions that I feel I must win. My competive nature is to strong and I have learned to temper it by just staying out of the converstations.

[QUOTE]How we react to a given situation is an example of our inner goings on. Each of us choose how to be. If we're destructive in our heart that will show itself in how we interact. Not to be confused with an off day or two but eventually a pattern will develop for others to see. There are usually underlying reasons for defensive behavior that might not be readily visible. For example if as a child you were attacked and undermined theres a strong chance you will fiercely defend your damaged self later in life or even lash out preemptively in order to protect yourself.

But the test of a character is to recognize our faults and those areas that need to be nourished and to evolve. In other words, if what I do now isnt ok, then hopefully this time next year I'll have been able to correct that.

Some people just charge through life unaware that others exist and are as important as we are.

If we dont change over time then whats the point ?[/QUOTE]

Post by **spot** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:16 am

SnoozeControl;463052 wrote: Of course it's up to admin, but there could be some type of moderator, such as Spot perhaps, that could keep things on an even keel.The absence of Moderation on FG is one of the benefits the place offers. Everyone here is equal, Tombstone excepted, and fortunately he's so laid back as to be practically a late sixties hippie prototype. We've seen Moderation in action, it's never ever moderate.

Shweet tatersalad · Post by **Shweet tatersalad** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:16 am

koan;463060 wrote: Exactly. And there have a few recently threads that would have been more comfortably posted in a forum area like the one proposed.

OK,but where does the segregation begin,and where are the lines?

And who deems the posts movable?

I for agree that if you post on something you face the possible recoil.

I for i one do not post on certain subjects because i feel i do not have any constructive too add or i know that my opine will not enhance the thread so i stay out of it.

CARLA · Post by **CARLA** » Sat Nov 18, 2006 9:17 am

I agree spot nothing to be gained by calling somone out on FG just will continue the insults.

[QUOTE]Emails, Hamster. The TOS is explicit on forbidding anyone to "engage in ... insulting, or generally disruptive behavior". Whether it's starting it or responding to it, do it off-site. I'd hate to see an area set aside for it, whether on public view or not.[/QUOTE]