Killing is Fun
Killing is Fun
Sorry if I have posted this already but I would be interested in your views on the statemnet of the US general who said the above, especially any ex service personnel.
"I have done my duty. I thank God for it!"
Killing is Fun
Bothwell wrote: Sorry if I have posted this already but I would be interested in your views on the statemnet of the US general who said the above, especially any ex service personnel.
“Actually, it’s quite a lot of fun to fight; you know, it’s a hell of a hoot. I like brawling; it’s fun to shoot some people,†claimed Lt. Gen. James Mattis of the U.S. Marine Corps, speaking about shooting people in Iraq.
Mattis was speaking about his experiences in Iraq at a recent panel discussion at the San Diego Convention Center in California, attended by about 200 people. Mattis went even further to state: “You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn’t wear a veil ... you know, guys like that ain’t got no manhood left anyway. So it’s a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them.â€
According to Gen. Mike Hagee, commandant of the Marine Corps, Mattis has been “counseled†about his statements, but it appears that he will face no disciplinary action.
“Actually, it’s quite a lot of fun to fight; you know, it’s a hell of a hoot. I like brawling; it’s fun to shoot some people,†claimed Lt. Gen. James Mattis of the U.S. Marine Corps, speaking about shooting people in Iraq.
Mattis was speaking about his experiences in Iraq at a recent panel discussion at the San Diego Convention Center in California, attended by about 200 people. Mattis went even further to state: “You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn’t wear a veil ... you know, guys like that ain’t got no manhood left anyway. So it’s a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them.â€
According to Gen. Mike Hagee, commandant of the Marine Corps, Mattis has been “counseled†about his statements, but it appears that he will face no disciplinary action.
Killing is Fun
LinasK wrote: I find it disgusting that he will face no disciplinary action! This guy ought to be stripped of his command and demoted for a leader to make such irresponsible comments in public!!!
So to make them in public is bad? What about making them in private? Personally, I can totally understand the desire to shoot a man that beats a woman. More power to 'em!
So to make them in public is bad? What about making them in private? Personally, I can totally understand the desire to shoot a man that beats a woman. More power to 'em!
[FONT=Arial Black]I hope you cherish this sweet way of life, and I hope you know that it comes with a price.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]
Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????
We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.
~Darrel Worley~
[/FONT]
Bullet's trial was a farce. Can I get an AMEN?????
We won't be punished for our sins, but BY them.
Killing is Fun
LinasK wrote: I find it disgusting that he will face no disciplinary action! This guy ought to be stripped of his command and demoted for a leader to make such irresponsible comments in public!!!
You would have to strip the majority of officers and enlisted men who though they don't publicly say so, feel exactly the same way. Personally, there are some guys on this earth that I think would be fun to kill.
You would have to strip the majority of officers and enlisted men who though they don't publicly say so, feel exactly the same way. Personally, there are some guys on this earth that I think would be fun to kill.
-
capt_buzzard
- Posts: 5557
- Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:00 pm
Killing is Fun
This Anti American again. 
Killing is Fun
this may not be a popular sentiment, and i certainly understand the mentality of soldiers in combat, (trained to kill) is not the same as the cops, but i will say this.....i am also trained to kill. not to wound. fire at center mass and kill. but do i think it would be fun? no. it's done in extremis, to save lives. i am fully prepared to do it. heck, i better do it in certain situations. i've drawn on people many times, and been prepared to fire. i would not think it was "fun" however. if i ever found it fun to kill people i would turn in my badge. :yh_star
-
capt_buzzard
- Posts: 5557
- Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:00 pm
Killing is Fun
lady cop wrote: this may not be a popular sentiment, and i certainly understand the mentality of soldiers in combat, (trained to kill) is not the same as the cops, but i will say this.....i am also trained to kill. not to wound. fire at center mass and kill. but do i think it would be fun? no. it's done in extremis, to save lives. i am fully prepared to do it. heck, i better do it in certain situations. i've drawn on people many times, and been prepared to fire. i would not think it was "fun" however. if i ever found it fun to kill people i would turn in my badge. :yh_starOh Lady Cop, it would sure be a arresting experience to meet you on a cold dark evening. :-6 Let the sunshine in.
Killing is Fun
capt_buzzard wrote: Oh Lady Cop, it would sure be a arresting experience to meet you on a cold dark evening. :-6 Let the sunshine in.
LOL ....thanks Captain! and happy valentines weekend to you!
LOL ....thanks Captain! and happy valentines weekend to you!
-
capt_buzzard
- Posts: 5557
- Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:00 pm
Killing is Fun
Those Brits, some of them are Real mean..................would not buy a round of drinks in a p1ssup
Killing is Fun
capt_buzzard wrote: Those Brits, some of them are Real mean..................would not buy a round of drinks in a p1ssup
ok, cut it out Capt.....you are trying to start trouble now!
BAD BAD Capt.!!!
ok, cut it out Capt.....you are trying to start trouble now!
BAD BAD Capt.!!!-
capt_buzzard
- Posts: 5557
- Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:00 pm
Killing is Fun
My two Brit mates spend all their money on the mots.
Killing is Fun
capt_buzzard wrote: My two Brit mates spend all their money on the mots.
yep...and the Irish spend it all on the pints! LOL :p
yep...and the Irish spend it all on the pints! LOL :p
-
capt_buzzard
- Posts: 5557
- Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:00 pm
Killing is Fun
No, we spent it on the birds.
Killing is Fun
posted by linask
Sorry if I have posted this already but I would be interested in your views on the statemnet of the US general who said the above, especially any ex service personnel.
What was the full context? I note the question he was responding to is not quoted. I would be curious as to what he was asked as out of context can make what he said mean something completely different. I'd be willing to bet none of the soldiers would treat prisoners badly once they had surrendered. Not kindly perhaps but with no gratuitous violence like happened at abu grahb.
It's an odd ambivalence, we fete the fighting prowess of our armies but think there is something wrong if a soldier says he likes soldiering.
Sorry if I have posted this already but I would be interested in your views on the statemnet of the US general who said the above, especially any ex service personnel.
What was the full context? I note the question he was responding to is not quoted. I would be curious as to what he was asked as out of context can make what he said mean something completely different. I'd be willing to bet none of the soldiers would treat prisoners badly once they had surrendered. Not kindly perhaps but with no gratuitous violence like happened at abu grahb.
It's an odd ambivalence, we fete the fighting prowess of our armies but think there is something wrong if a soldier says he likes soldiering.
Killing is Fun
Lon quoted the statement, but i don't know entire context either. i think the objection was not so much that one liked soldiering, but that one enjoyed killing for killings sake. for sport.
Killing is Fun
Very interesting editorial by Kathleen Parker of the Orlando Sentinel on this subject. If you are really interested I suggest you look it up.
If I can find it I will post it on this thread.
Found It
Kathleen Parker
The Marines: A few sensitive men
Feb 9, 2005
The cynicism that passeth all understanding
Feb 6, 2005
Kathleen Parker
In the 1998 movie Soldier, Sgt. Todd is talking to the woman who nursed him back to health when she asks: "What are you going to do?"
Todd replies: "I'm going to kill them all, sir."
Excellent. Just the sort of response we expect from a soldier and by which we understand that his spirit, if not his body, is intact. War is hell, but somebody has to prevail and preferably that somebody is "us."
Or maybe not. Given the breathless reaction to Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis of the U.S. Marine Corps, who had the audacity to speak candidly -- admitting that he sometimes enjoys his work -- maybe we'd be happier if Todd said something (cue violins) along these lines:
"Actually, Sandra -- may I call you Sandra? -- I've been thinking about that. As soon as I'm all patched up, I'm going to get some therapy and seek forgiveness from those who left me for dead."
Whereupon Sandra says, "Oopsey-daisy, we're fresh out of painkillers."
That's a joke, I hasten to add, lest the bow-tied brigades of humorless harrumphers unleash a Deeply Offended jeremiad my way.
That I have to say so ruins the joke, of course, but so it goes in the briar patch these days. I do not personally wish to inflict pain and suffering on anyone, but -- if I may speak candidly -- I don't mind if a few murdering Islamofascists cease contributing to depletion of Earth's precious oxygen supply.
Oh, chortle, chortle. If only Mattis had said some such, or thrown out some "attic humor," as humorist Christopher Buckley once put it. You know, the sort of bon mot that elicits precious titters from the studiously dowdy. Why, then, Mattis would be the darling of dyspeptic America instead of the barbarian anathema he's become.
But, alas, Mattis isn't a parlor boy; he's a kick-down-the-door Marine who, as a military friend defines the job, "takes human life on behalf of the nation." Mattis doesn't speak latte; he speaks spit. So instead of making some arch remark about how to conduct warfare against terrorists, he ignited a national snit by saying that he found killing the enemy, in so many words, not unpleasant.
His precise words were: "Actually, it's a lot of fun to fight. You know, it's a hell of a hoot. It's fun to shoot some people. I'll be right up front with you, I like brawling." Mattis told a San Diego gathering that included military personnel, many of whom reportedly laughed.
Then Mattis went on to clarify who "some people" are.
"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil. You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them."
Hear, hear. With all due respect to sensitive Talibanistas, who, in addition to routinely killing women for walking down a street unescorted by a male relative, also aided and abetted Osama bin Laden, I find Mattis' attitude neither too cold nor too hot, but just about right.
Nevertheless, his comments have provoked scathing editorials and calls for his resignation. His boss, Gen. Michael Hagee, commander of the Marine Corps, has declined to impose disciplinary action on Mattis but did counsel him about choosing his words more carefully.
Hagee also praised Mattis for his record as a warrior and leader. Mattis' resume is too long for this space, but suffice it to say he fought both in Afghanistan and Iraq. In Afghanistan, he commanded the 1st Marine Expeditionary Brigade during Operation Enduring Freedom; in Iraq, he commanded 1st Marine Division during the initial attack and subsequent stabilizing operations.
He did not accomplish these successful military operations by being nice. My guess is he spoke candidly to his men, who from all reports greatly admire their leader.
The crux of the Mattis problem, aside from the obvious exercising of antiwar sentiment whenever possible, is our discomfort with the warrior culture. We want Clint Eastwood in the trenches and David Niven home for dinner.
Parfait. As soon as we get World Peace straightened out, maybe we can send Mattis for a weekend with Prudence. In the meantime, it seems neither shocking nor offensive that a Marine general might find some pleasure -- whether moral reward or winning the battle for survival -- in taking out a particularly despicable enemy.
As a woman trying to imagine living under a Taliban regime, I'd be whole lot happier to see Mattis coming to my rescue than any of those whose tiny feathers got mussed by his blunt talk.
Kathleen Parker can be reached at kparker@orlandosentinel.com or 407-420-5202.
The rest of you can be politcally correct if you will, heck maybe your right. Me I'm glad there are guys like this between me and some of the people in this world.
If I can find it I will post it on this thread.
Found It
Kathleen Parker
The Marines: A few sensitive men
Feb 9, 2005
The cynicism that passeth all understanding
Feb 6, 2005
Kathleen Parker
In the 1998 movie Soldier, Sgt. Todd is talking to the woman who nursed him back to health when she asks: "What are you going to do?"
Todd replies: "I'm going to kill them all, sir."
Excellent. Just the sort of response we expect from a soldier and by which we understand that his spirit, if not his body, is intact. War is hell, but somebody has to prevail and preferably that somebody is "us."
Or maybe not. Given the breathless reaction to Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis of the U.S. Marine Corps, who had the audacity to speak candidly -- admitting that he sometimes enjoys his work -- maybe we'd be happier if Todd said something (cue violins) along these lines:
"Actually, Sandra -- may I call you Sandra? -- I've been thinking about that. As soon as I'm all patched up, I'm going to get some therapy and seek forgiveness from those who left me for dead."
Whereupon Sandra says, "Oopsey-daisy, we're fresh out of painkillers."
That's a joke, I hasten to add, lest the bow-tied brigades of humorless harrumphers unleash a Deeply Offended jeremiad my way.
That I have to say so ruins the joke, of course, but so it goes in the briar patch these days. I do not personally wish to inflict pain and suffering on anyone, but -- if I may speak candidly -- I don't mind if a few murdering Islamofascists cease contributing to depletion of Earth's precious oxygen supply.
Oh, chortle, chortle. If only Mattis had said some such, or thrown out some "attic humor," as humorist Christopher Buckley once put it. You know, the sort of bon mot that elicits precious titters from the studiously dowdy. Why, then, Mattis would be the darling of dyspeptic America instead of the barbarian anathema he's become.
But, alas, Mattis isn't a parlor boy; he's a kick-down-the-door Marine who, as a military friend defines the job, "takes human life on behalf of the nation." Mattis doesn't speak latte; he speaks spit. So instead of making some arch remark about how to conduct warfare against terrorists, he ignited a national snit by saying that he found killing the enemy, in so many words, not unpleasant.
His precise words were: "Actually, it's a lot of fun to fight. You know, it's a hell of a hoot. It's fun to shoot some people. I'll be right up front with you, I like brawling." Mattis told a San Diego gathering that included military personnel, many of whom reportedly laughed.
Then Mattis went on to clarify who "some people" are.
"You go into Afghanistan, you got guys who slap women around for five years because they didn't wear a veil. You know, guys like that ain't got no manhood left anyway. So it's a hell of a lot of fun to shoot them."
Hear, hear. With all due respect to sensitive Talibanistas, who, in addition to routinely killing women for walking down a street unescorted by a male relative, also aided and abetted Osama bin Laden, I find Mattis' attitude neither too cold nor too hot, but just about right.
Nevertheless, his comments have provoked scathing editorials and calls for his resignation. His boss, Gen. Michael Hagee, commander of the Marine Corps, has declined to impose disciplinary action on Mattis but did counsel him about choosing his words more carefully.
Hagee also praised Mattis for his record as a warrior and leader. Mattis' resume is too long for this space, but suffice it to say he fought both in Afghanistan and Iraq. In Afghanistan, he commanded the 1st Marine Expeditionary Brigade during Operation Enduring Freedom; in Iraq, he commanded 1st Marine Division during the initial attack and subsequent stabilizing operations.
He did not accomplish these successful military operations by being nice. My guess is he spoke candidly to his men, who from all reports greatly admire their leader.
The crux of the Mattis problem, aside from the obvious exercising of antiwar sentiment whenever possible, is our discomfort with the warrior culture. We want Clint Eastwood in the trenches and David Niven home for dinner.
Parfait. As soon as we get World Peace straightened out, maybe we can send Mattis for a weekend with Prudence. In the meantime, it seems neither shocking nor offensive that a Marine general might find some pleasure -- whether moral reward or winning the battle for survival -- in taking out a particularly despicable enemy.
As a woman trying to imagine living under a Taliban regime, I'd be whole lot happier to see Mattis coming to my rescue than any of those whose tiny feathers got mussed by his blunt talk.
Kathleen Parker can be reached at kparker@orlandosentinel.com or 407-420-5202.
The rest of you can be politcally correct if you will, heck maybe your right. Me I'm glad there are guys like this between me and some of the people in this world.
GOD CREATED MAN AND SAM COLT MADE THEM EQUAL
-
capt_buzzard
- Posts: 5557
- Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 12:00 pm
Killing is Fun
LinasK wrote: I find it disgusting that he will face no disciplinary action! This guy ought to be stripped of his command and demoted for a leader to make such irresponsible comments in public!!!SINN FEIN IRA and their supporters cheered when British soldiers were blown to bits by bombs in Northern Ireland in the 1970s/80s
Killing is Fun
capt_buzzard wrote: SINN FEIN IRA and their supporters cheered when British soldiers were blown to bits by bombs in Northern Ireland in the 1970s/80s:-1 :-1 :-1
Killing is Fun
jahamaa wrote:
The rest of you can be politcally correct if you will, heck maybe your right.
Me I'm glad there are guys like this between me and some of the people in this world.jahamaa:
You and me both
The rest of you can be politcally correct if you will, heck maybe your right.
Me I'm glad there are guys like this between me and some of the people in this world.jahamaa:
You and me both
"If America Was A Tree, The Left Would Root For The Termites...Greg Gutfeld."
Killing is Fun
Lieutenant General
James N. Mattis
Commanding General, Marine Corps Combat Development Command/Deputy Commandant for Combat Development
Lieutenant General James N. Mattis is currently serving as the Commanding General, Marine Corps Combat Development Command, Quantico, VA and Deputy Commandant for Combat Development, Headquarters, U.S. Marine Corps.
As a Lieutenant, he served as a rifle and weapons platoon commander in the 3d Marine Division. As a Captain, he commanded a rifle company and a weapons company in the 1st Marine Brigade. As a Major, he commanded RS Portland. As a Lieutenant Colonel, he commanded 1st Battalion, 7th Marines, one of Task Force Ripper's assault battalions in Operation Desert Shield and Desert Storm. As a Colonel, he commanded 7th Marines (Reinforced). As a Brigadier General, he commanded 1st Marine Expeditionary Brigade and then Task Force 58, during Operation Enduring Freedom in southern Afghanistan. As a Major General, he commanded 1st Marine Division during the initial attack and subsequent stability operations in Iraq during Operation Iraqi Freedom
He is a graduate of the Amphibious Warfare School, Marine Corps Command and Staff College, and the National War College.
James N. Mattis
Commanding General, Marine Corps Combat Development Command/Deputy Commandant for Combat Development
Lieutenant General James N. Mattis is currently serving as the Commanding General, Marine Corps Combat Development Command, Quantico, VA and Deputy Commandant for Combat Development, Headquarters, U.S. Marine Corps.
As a Lieutenant, he served as a rifle and weapons platoon commander in the 3d Marine Division. As a Captain, he commanded a rifle company and a weapons company in the 1st Marine Brigade. As a Major, he commanded RS Portland. As a Lieutenant Colonel, he commanded 1st Battalion, 7th Marines, one of Task Force Ripper's assault battalions in Operation Desert Shield and Desert Storm. As a Colonel, he commanded 7th Marines (Reinforced). As a Brigadier General, he commanded 1st Marine Expeditionary Brigade and then Task Force 58, during Operation Enduring Freedom in southern Afghanistan. As a Major General, he commanded 1st Marine Division during the initial attack and subsequent stability operations in Iraq during Operation Iraqi Freedom
He is a graduate of the Amphibious Warfare School, Marine Corps Command and Staff College, and the National War College.
"If America Was A Tree, The Left Would Root For The Termites...Greg Gutfeld."
Killing is Fun
Both the left and the right are wrong about Marine Corps Lt. Gen. James N. Mattis. He is neither the Jack Nicholson caricature of a Marine depicted in the 1992 movie A Few GoodMen nor the callous and mad eccentric depicted by George C. Scott in the 1970 movie Patton.
Instead, Gen. Mattis is a remarkably learned and thoughtful man who adheres to the old-fashioned Christian, chivalric warrior code. As such, he confounds modern-day screamers on both the left and the right for whom the warrior code is unintelligible. I know because I had the privilege of serving under Gen. Mattis as a Marine in Iraq.
Moreover, while we were both in-country the General graciously took the time to engage me in an exclusive half-hour conversation. At the time, I was trying to secure a commission as an officer. The General learned that my relatively advanced age (then 35) was posing a problem and offered to help. That a three-star general with a war on his hands would take the time to assist a lowly Lance Corporal speaks volumes about the heart and character of Gen. Mattis.
I SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN surprised. I had spent the spring and summer of 2003 with the First Battalion, Fourth Marine Regiment, at an abandoned pistol factory in Al Hillah, about 60 miles south of Baghdad. Gen. Mattis regularly showed up to speak with us. He would tell us colorful stories, offer tough-minded advice and counsel, and eagerly solicit our thoughts and questions. We loved him because we knew he loved us.
And Gen. Mattis didn't just talk the talk; he walked the walk. He led from the front. Indeed, on at least one occasion that I know of, the General was bloodied from a firefight or improvised explosive device while out on patrol with junior, enlisted Marines one-third his age. That's what makes Gen. Mattis such a great warrior: He truly respects and cares for his Marines.
"Guardiano," he told me, "I don't give a damn about the officers. If they don't like what they're doing, they can get on a plane and leave the Corps -- go back where they came from. But I do care deeply about those 18- and 19-year-old Lance Corporals out on the frontlines." The General was telling me that, as an officer, I better be concerned with helping younger, junior Marines, not advancing my own career.
That's why all the liberal talk about Mattis being some sort of "psychopathic killer" is so ludicrous. Nor is he, as the conservative talk-show set would have it, an inhumane "fighting machine." Psychopathic killers don't care for their men; and machines don't exhibit compassion for a liberated but frightened people.
Yet, I am absolutely convinced that whenever a Marine died or bled, a part of Gen. Mattis died and bled, too. And whenever an innocent Iraqi was intimidated, beaten or shot, Gen. Mattis was incensed and outraged. But because of our modern-day cultural depravity, we lack the basic vocabulary necessary to identify and understand, let alone appreciate and celebrate, warriors like Gen. Mattis.
HOW, THEN, TO EXPLAIN the General's comment that it is "fun to shoot some people"? Is not such a sentiment "indicative of an apparent indifference to the value of human life," as the Council on American Islamic Relations (CAIR) argues?
Unfortunately for the council and other professional grievance lobbies, context is everything, especially when it come to war and killing. Gen. Mattis clearly did not say he likes killing for killing's sake. Instead, like most Marines, he enjoys fighting for a righteous cause. He enjoys a good "brawl," especially when it involve shooting vermin who subjugate, beat, and abuse women.
Moreover, if the critics bothered actually to listen to Gen. Mattis's remarks -- which you can do online at NBC's San Diego affiliate website -- they would realize that he was calling for an investment in so-called soft-power resources that would help to avert combat. He was saying, in effect: "Look, I love a good fight and would enjoy shooting and killing these bastards; but we need to do the things that will make that unnecessary."
The General was speaking at a professional conference on military transformation; and he was urging the Pentagon to invest in efforts that would "diminish the conditions that drive people to sign up for these kinds of insurgencies."
None of the widely touted new technologies and weapons systems, he noted, "would have helped me in the last three years [in Iraq and Afghanistan]. But I could have used cultural training [and] language training. I could have used more products from American universities [who] understood the world does not revolve around America and [who] embrace coalitions and allies for all of the strengths that they bring us."
That sure doesn't sound like the fanatical Col. Kurtz of Apocalypse Now.
GEN. MATTIS ALSO IMPLICITLY took exception to conservative defense analysts like Weekly Standard contributor Thomas Donnelly, who seem to think that increasing the size of the Army and Marine Corps will solve most of our military challenges. But a larger -- and thus more bureaucratic -- force structure may be exactly what is not needed to win the war against Islamic fascism.
As the General explained, "We're seeing a re-criminalization of war. And that means we need to get small units, not big armies... Small units so capable that, as we close with the enemy, they're transformed into something that is as capable as our air units and sea units have been in shutting down the threats to this country over the last 30 years."
Some critics have alleged that Gen. Mattis's' comments reflect a dangerous military mindset that gave rise to the Abu Ghraib prison scandal. However, for any of the Marines who served under him, it is impossible to imagine a scandal like Abu Ghraib happening on the General's watch.
That's because Gen. Mattis always made it his business to know what was happening in his command; and he did not tolerate stupidity and abuse by his Marines. We all understood this because he communicated well and often his expectations. Those expectations included his demand to "keep your honor clean" and to treat the Iraqis "as you would your own family, with dignity and respect."
Let's hope this reality is included in the movie, destined to come, about Gen. Mattis, the Marine Corps, and Iraq. This would be a refreshing change from Hollywood's recent depictions of the U.S. military. And it would rightly honor a man and a warrior who is truly an American hero.
John R. Guardiano is an Arlington, Virginia-based journalist and proud (reserve) member of the United States military.
Instead, Gen. Mattis is a remarkably learned and thoughtful man who adheres to the old-fashioned Christian, chivalric warrior code. As such, he confounds modern-day screamers on both the left and the right for whom the warrior code is unintelligible. I know because I had the privilege of serving under Gen. Mattis as a Marine in Iraq.
Moreover, while we were both in-country the General graciously took the time to engage me in an exclusive half-hour conversation. At the time, I was trying to secure a commission as an officer. The General learned that my relatively advanced age (then 35) was posing a problem and offered to help. That a three-star general with a war on his hands would take the time to assist a lowly Lance Corporal speaks volumes about the heart and character of Gen. Mattis.
I SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN surprised. I had spent the spring and summer of 2003 with the First Battalion, Fourth Marine Regiment, at an abandoned pistol factory in Al Hillah, about 60 miles south of Baghdad. Gen. Mattis regularly showed up to speak with us. He would tell us colorful stories, offer tough-minded advice and counsel, and eagerly solicit our thoughts and questions. We loved him because we knew he loved us.
And Gen. Mattis didn't just talk the talk; he walked the walk. He led from the front. Indeed, on at least one occasion that I know of, the General was bloodied from a firefight or improvised explosive device while out on patrol with junior, enlisted Marines one-third his age. That's what makes Gen. Mattis such a great warrior: He truly respects and cares for his Marines.
"Guardiano," he told me, "I don't give a damn about the officers. If they don't like what they're doing, they can get on a plane and leave the Corps -- go back where they came from. But I do care deeply about those 18- and 19-year-old Lance Corporals out on the frontlines." The General was telling me that, as an officer, I better be concerned with helping younger, junior Marines, not advancing my own career.
That's why all the liberal talk about Mattis being some sort of "psychopathic killer" is so ludicrous. Nor is he, as the conservative talk-show set would have it, an inhumane "fighting machine." Psychopathic killers don't care for their men; and machines don't exhibit compassion for a liberated but frightened people.
Yet, I am absolutely convinced that whenever a Marine died or bled, a part of Gen. Mattis died and bled, too. And whenever an innocent Iraqi was intimidated, beaten or shot, Gen. Mattis was incensed and outraged. But because of our modern-day cultural depravity, we lack the basic vocabulary necessary to identify and understand, let alone appreciate and celebrate, warriors like Gen. Mattis.
HOW, THEN, TO EXPLAIN the General's comment that it is "fun to shoot some people"? Is not such a sentiment "indicative of an apparent indifference to the value of human life," as the Council on American Islamic Relations (CAIR) argues?
Unfortunately for the council and other professional grievance lobbies, context is everything, especially when it come to war and killing. Gen. Mattis clearly did not say he likes killing for killing's sake. Instead, like most Marines, he enjoys fighting for a righteous cause. He enjoys a good "brawl," especially when it involve shooting vermin who subjugate, beat, and abuse women.
Moreover, if the critics bothered actually to listen to Gen. Mattis's remarks -- which you can do online at NBC's San Diego affiliate website -- they would realize that he was calling for an investment in so-called soft-power resources that would help to avert combat. He was saying, in effect: "Look, I love a good fight and would enjoy shooting and killing these bastards; but we need to do the things that will make that unnecessary."
The General was speaking at a professional conference on military transformation; and he was urging the Pentagon to invest in efforts that would "diminish the conditions that drive people to sign up for these kinds of insurgencies."
None of the widely touted new technologies and weapons systems, he noted, "would have helped me in the last three years [in Iraq and Afghanistan]. But I could have used cultural training [and] language training. I could have used more products from American universities [who] understood the world does not revolve around America and [who] embrace coalitions and allies for all of the strengths that they bring us."
That sure doesn't sound like the fanatical Col. Kurtz of Apocalypse Now.
GEN. MATTIS ALSO IMPLICITLY took exception to conservative defense analysts like Weekly Standard contributor Thomas Donnelly, who seem to think that increasing the size of the Army and Marine Corps will solve most of our military challenges. But a larger -- and thus more bureaucratic -- force structure may be exactly what is not needed to win the war against Islamic fascism.
As the General explained, "We're seeing a re-criminalization of war. And that means we need to get small units, not big armies... Small units so capable that, as we close with the enemy, they're transformed into something that is as capable as our air units and sea units have been in shutting down the threats to this country over the last 30 years."
Some critics have alleged that Gen. Mattis's' comments reflect a dangerous military mindset that gave rise to the Abu Ghraib prison scandal. However, for any of the Marines who served under him, it is impossible to imagine a scandal like Abu Ghraib happening on the General's watch.
That's because Gen. Mattis always made it his business to know what was happening in his command; and he did not tolerate stupidity and abuse by his Marines. We all understood this because he communicated well and often his expectations. Those expectations included his demand to "keep your honor clean" and to treat the Iraqis "as you would your own family, with dignity and respect."
Let's hope this reality is included in the movie, destined to come, about Gen. Mattis, the Marine Corps, and Iraq. This would be a refreshing change from Hollywood's recent depictions of the U.S. military. And it would rightly honor a man and a warrior who is truly an American hero.
John R. Guardiano is an Arlington, Virginia-based journalist and proud (reserve) member of the United States military.
"If America Was A Tree, The Left Would Root For The Termites...Greg Gutfeld."
Killing is Fun
How do you get that many medals from just 2 desert campaigns ?
Was he in vietnam as well?
Was he in vietnam as well?
"I have done my duty. I thank God for it!"
Killing is Fun
By the grace of God, and the Air Force's decision that I would make a better instructor pilot than combat pilot, I never killed anyone in my 6 years of active duty and 8 years of reserve duty.
But I thought about it quite a lot. Could I have done it? Without a doubt. Would it have weighed as heavily on my conscience as it did on my father's who served in WWII? Yes, most likely.
Combat changes men. If a General said something like this, unless I had been in his shoes all his life, and seen the things he had seen, I would not presume to judge him.
But I thought about it quite a lot. Could I have done it? Without a doubt. Would it have weighed as heavily on my conscience as it did on my father's who served in WWII? Yes, most likely.
Combat changes men. If a General said something like this, unless I had been in his shoes all his life, and seen the things he had seen, I would not presume to judge him.
All the world's a stage and the men and women merely players...Shakespeare
-
greydeadhead
- Posts: 1045
- Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 8:52 am
Killing is Fun
Until you have walked in the shoes of a combat veteran.. no matter what branch of the service, you have no right to pass judgement on any of us. To begin calling for disciplinary actions without knowing the full story is totally out of line. Remember, your rights to say how you feel about an issue or a person usually have been defended by that person..
nuff said..
nuff said..
Feed your spirit by living near it -- Magic Hat Brewery bottle cap
Killing is Fun
Until you have walked in the shoes of a combat veteran
So I guess I get to comment then. Personally I was scared to death most of the time, I remember the camaraderie and some pf the training being fun but never the actual combat. I would however subscribe to the view that when in the military you do have a different mindset than when back on civvy street. I do not even remember having much of a sense of satisfaction on the occassions when we "Won", probably because of the casualties we took, I could never quite get over the fact that it was not me and why (still haven't really)
When I look back at how I was then it seems like a completely different person than who I am now.
So I guess I get to comment then. Personally I was scared to death most of the time, I remember the camaraderie and some pf the training being fun but never the actual combat. I would however subscribe to the view that when in the military you do have a different mindset than when back on civvy street. I do not even remember having much of a sense of satisfaction on the occassions when we "Won", probably because of the casualties we took, I could never quite get over the fact that it was not me and why (still haven't really)
When I look back at how I was then it seems like a completely different person than who I am now.
"I have done my duty. I thank God for it!"
Killing is Fun
Look, I was in the US navy myself. Military is exactly that. If anyone paid any attention to the recent war, then they would have noticed that NOONE could tell the difference between the US marines and the Royal marines. Both are the nitty gritty, face first, go in and gun 'em down branches of our militaries. I was a medical corpman. First persian gulf war, thank you very much. Thankfully, I never had to kill anyone, but by GOD I was glad the marines stood between me and a bunch of crazy arabs! I agree with Jack Nicholson......"you NEED me on that wall"!
~Quoth the Raven, Nevermore!~